More on Shadid Lewis' Attempt to Deny the Crucifixion

Responding to the Swoon Theory and Joseph of Arimathea

I'm continuing with my response to Shadid Lewis and some of the claims he makes in regards to the death of Jesus. In this next clip, he starts going back to the old argument that Muslims use that Jesus died too quickly.

Despite the fact that we have the eyewitnesses, the direct statement of the text, the centurion, the spear thrust, that still somehow this indicates that Joseph was actually asking for a living body. Here's what he has to say.

So then he goes into the thing about Joseph of Arimathea when he comes to ask for the body. Did Joseph think that Jesus was a living body? Well, James says no, but I disagree. Because notice, obviously, according to the text, Joseph is asking for the body early.

Now, according to many sources, it is said that death by crucifixion usually took several days, from the minimum of three days to a maximum of about nine days it took for somebody to die.

Now, once again, if this story was in the Koran and someone were to present this kind of argument, I can guarantee you that what Shadid Lewis would be doing is be saying, look, you've got to allow this text to speak for itself.

And it is so very clear that the text in all the Gospels says that Jesus has died, that the reason Joseph of Arimathea is coming to ask for the body is because none of the Jews, even John mentions the Jews as a whole, did not want the bodies hanging upon the crosses on the Sabbath day, none of which has anything to support this idea of the swoon theory that is now being promoted by Shadid Lewis.

Jesus' Death, the Passover, and the Timing of His Hour

And so he'd also probably go back, and he'd remind us of Jesus' own words in John chapter 10, when he says, no one takes my life from me. I lay it down of my own accord. I have authority to lay my life down.

I have authority to take it back up again, this commandment I've received from my father. He'd probably point us to the text where it talks about the fact that his hour had not yet come, that even when people were sent to arrest him, they would not touch him.

Why? Because his hour had not yet come. Well, what was his hour? All the Gospels tell us that Jesus' death takes place at a specific time in regards to the Passover and the Lamb being sacrificed. And God has a purpose in this happening at this particular point in time.

And so this idea that, well, he couldn't have been dead yet, assumes that everything else in the New Testament, you can just simply dismiss it. Well, that conflicts with my theory, which once again demonstrates that while I can criticize what the Qur 'an says in the context and language of the Qur 'an as it was written, Islamic apologists simply refuse to deal with the New Testament as it's written for one simple reason.

They can't. It's not possible. That which was taught by Muhammad in the Qur 'an, he was ignorant of the New Testament and therefore contradicted it. It's just what happens.

The Crucifixion Scene, Pilate's Surprise, and the Roman Centurion

Well, Jesus is allegedly on the cross for a few hours. Notice that in the Gospel story, the two criminals that are supposed to be crucified with him, they are still alive. You see, they were still alive at the time.

And the Roman soldier comes, he breaks the other two's legs because they're still alive and still alive. And when he gets to Jesus, he looks and he assumes that Jesus is already dead. So he doesn't break his legs.

And I said in the debate, how convenient is that? The other two get their legs broken. He assumes Jesus is already dead and he leaves Jesus alone. Perfect, right? So you see that Joseph comes to ask for the body and Pilate is, it says he marveled or he wondered that Jesus was dead so soon.

Why? Because it was too early. It usually took a long time for somebody to die by crucifixion. So it is clear that Joseph is coming to ask for the body of Jesus too early. So yes, it is quite possible that he believed that Jesus was still alive and wanted to get him down as soon as possible.

Yeah, that's exactly what the text says. It is so hard to take this seriously. It truly is. Joseph of Arimathea knows Jesus is still alive. Evidence for this? None. Zero. Nothing there. And yet, so he wants to get Jesus down before he dies.

The text has already said that he's dead, but we don't need to worry about what the text says. We can just make things up as we go along. And so what you do is you lie to Pilate and Pilate then tells a centurion to verify this.

Now centurions, like I said, are professional killers. They've killed many. And the centurion, notice what he just said there. He sort of forgot the spear thrust. He mentions the breaking of the legs of the other two, but there's a spear thrust thing, which I guess he just survived that too.

And so the centurion gets fooled too and comes back and tells Pilate. And so he tells Joseph of Arimathea, remember, you can't be driving cars around here. You've got to be running through streets. So there's a lot of time going on here.

And so Joseph hurries to the cross. There's still Roman soldiers around. I guess we have to theorize they went someplace else. And somehow, without any modern medical intervention, you somehow manage to get the body off of the cross, which would be not only excruciating, but would cause even more damage.

You manage to get the body off the cross and you revive the body by wrapping it in cloths and sticking it in a tomb, which is the burial, the text says it's the burial tradition of the Jews, sticking it in a tomb in the dark without water and air.

There you go. That's, I'm sorry, but how does anyone come up with this stuff? This is what happens when you have a text written 600 years later by someone who didn't know what they were talking about.

They had no contact with the New Testament. And they write one verse that says Jews didn't die on the cross. Well, we don't know what it says. Judea Lewis doesn't know what it says. He has one tradition, but the fact of the matter is, it isn't clear.

We don't even know what it's talking about. But that one verse, you take that and now you go back and you make mincemeat out of the New Testament text in your effort to try to substantiate this. It is amazing the lengths that people will go to.

It truly is.

The Meaning of Surah 4:157 and the Limits of Islamic Apologetics

And so Pilate wonders, Pilate is wondering that he was dead so soon. That lets you know something's not right right there. Right there, Pilate's like, he's dead already? It's too soon. You see? Now, he calls in the Roman soldier and asks the Roman soldier, or the centurion, is Jesus dead?

The Roman soldier says yes, based on what he thought he saw. Remember what Allah said in the Quran, that it was made to appear that Jesus was such. So then it is quite clear that...

Really, is it quite clear, or is it quite possible? I mean, look at the citation. Surah 4, verse 157. It was made to appear to them. Who's the them, Shadid? I don't think you read Arabic, but look at the wording, find someone who does, and ask them, tell me what, who is them?

Who is the only antecedent for this pronoun in the Roman centurion? It's the Jews. They're the only them you can find. It was made to appear to them. Now, if you want to extend that out to say, well, it was made to appear to everybody, it was made to appear to the Romans and the Roman soldiers and everything else, if you want to say that, fine, but you don't really have any support for that in the text.

You're just reading that into it to try to make this work. Roman centurions knew when people were dead. You skipped over the spear thrust, and you know why. Because the text said he was dead. There is absolutely no reason for the first half millennium after the time of the writing of the Gospel text for anyone to think that Joseph was asking for a living body.

The Gnostics want to come up with that for their reasons. The Muslims for their reasons. But don't call them historical, because they're not. They're only theological.

Okay? Now, again, I said this in the debate. I brought this up in the debate. Because James says that, you know, the Romans were very skillful at making sure the person was dead. Yes, that's true. But what did Jesus tell you?

He said, with God, all things are possible.

But how does Shadid know that Jesus ever said, with God, all things are possible? This picking, I'll take this text, but I won't take this text. We see Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John all say Jesus was dead.

We can reject that because of one verse in the Quran. But we can go over here and take from the same authors, the same manuscripts. We don't have to show you any manuscripts that support our doing this, but we can pick this out here and say, with God, all things are possible.

Well, you could use that to explain space aliens or the Arizona Cardinals winning the Super Bowl. Both about equal miracles. But the double standard here is incredible. I will ignore what is right in the text here, but I will go a few chapters back here and grab this out and apply it in a completely different context.

And this, somehow, is accurately dealing with the New Testament text. This is why I'm saying to Shadid Lewis and to Sami Zatari and all of these young Islamic apologists, who are you debating for? If all you're doing is trying to impress your folks, well, okay.

But if you're really trying, if you really believe what you believe is the truth and you're trying to demonstrate that to people who don't believe what you believe, using double standards like this that are so easily documented destroys your case.