July 21, 2015 ISI Radio Show with William J. Federer on “What Every American Needs to Know About the Qur’an” & David Wood on “How Safe is America Amid Modern Day Islamic Terror?”

The Purpose of Iron Sharpens Iron and the Day’s Focus on Islam

Live from the historic parsonage of 19th century gospel minister George Norcross in downtown Carlisle, Pennsylvania, it's Iron Sharpens Iron, a radio platform on which pastors, Christian scholars, and theologians address the burning issues facing the church and the world today.

Proverbs 27 verse 17 tells us, Iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another. Matthew Henry said that in this passage, we are cautioned to take heed whom we converse with and directed to have in view in conversation to make one another wiser and better.

It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next hour, and we hope to hear from you, the listener, with your own questions. Now here's our host, Chris Arnzen. Good afternoon, Cumberland County, Pennsylvania,.

And the rest of humanity living on the planet Earth, listening via live streaming. This is Chris Arnzen, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron, wishing you all a happy Tuesday on this 21st day of July 2015, and we have a very exciting and a very important program today.

I would say it's a vital program on Islam, and it will be examined by two different guests. The first guest coming up is Bill Federer. Many of you may recognize Bill Federer from theamericanminute .com.

He is also a prolific writer. He is also a television host. I've seen his television program on the NRB network, but perhaps it could be seen elsewhere in addition to that, and today we are talking about Bill Federer's book, What Every American Needs to Know About the Quran, and after that, at 5 p .m. for the second hour of Iron Sharpens Iron, we have my very dear friend David Wood, who is a Christian apologist.

He operates answeringmuslims .com, and he hosts the program Jesus or Muhammad on the Trinity Channel, and you can find out how and where you can watch the Trinity Channel at trinitychannel .com, and that's coming up, as I said, at 5 p .m., but right now we are honored to welcome back for the second time on Iron Sharpens Iron, Bill Federer.

It's great to be with you too, Bill, and Bill was on my program a number of years ago on the old Iron Sharpens Iron program. I think it may have even been a July 4th program or a day before July 4th in honor of Independence Day, but it's great to have you back.

I had the privilege of seeing Bill at a live public conference at the Long Island Baptist Church in Holtzville a number of years ago. Actually, that was probably only about a year ago. Do you remember when that was, Bill?

Yes, yeah.

Yeah, I can hear you perfectly, and the mystery behind this studio is that, for some reason, my guests very often complain that my voice sounds a little fuzzy, but when the recordings of the broadcast are posted on my website, my voice sounds crystal clear, so I'm never understanding why that is.

But anyway, when was that conference that you conducted on American history at the Long Island Baptist Church, Bill?

They don't remember who they are. They don't remember who you are. This is the first country that planet Earth has ever seen with more individual freedom and liberty and opportunity.

So you basically, in a nutshell, described the purpose of American Minute.

Book of Genesis.

And today we are going to be addressing what every American needs to know about the Quran, a history of Islam in the United States, and that's not to be confused with another excellent book by my friend Dr. James R. White of Alpha Omega Ministries, what every Christian needs to know about the Quran, which you can get as well, and I will be giving you information later on one of our sponsors, or actually two of our sponsors, that offers books such as these.

But Keith Ellison was the first Muslim elected to Congress in 2006, and he was sworn in using the Quran. Well, was that one of the motivations for you writing this book, to begin with, what every Christian needs to know about the Quran?

Yes, I'm sorry.

Superior to Tennessee. Life is actually called the Sunnah, which means the way or the example. And so if we can put through three stages in Mecca, they get pushy, confrontational, argumentative, and threatening.

Chased out of town to Mecca in retaliation for the Meccans chasing them out of town. Muhammad's attitude was, you see, the Meccans send a thousand soldiers to protect in 624 AD. This amazing victory, having been outnumbered three to one, convinces Muhammad to be a military leader eight years before he dies.

He even used smashing and killing innocent women and children because Muhammad and his life is the example, the way, the Sunnah. It was not just a religious leader, it was a political and a military leader.

Right. Going back to what we brought up, or I brought up, Keith Ellison, the first Muslim elected to Congress in 2006 when he was sworn in on the Quran. And you said that the Quran is believed by Muslims to be superior to the Constitution.

Well, we as Christians believe the Bible is superior to the Constitution. So how would that be a different scenario from a Christian or anybody else swearing on the Bible when Christians believe that is superior to the Constitution?

Can you and your family get to the royal family? I said there is no respect of persons and judgment. Rich or poor, everyone's to be treated the same. You should not show short partiality to the poor because they're poor, and you should not show the concept of equality on what you see is equal to you.

There's, again, no royal family to flutter up next to. When a stranger is a non-Muslim, it's a demise of the inheritance that a man gets.

Different roles, but equal in God's sight. Well, going back to the spread of Islam over the world, how much of the world has been conquered by Islam, and how soon did that happen after the lifetime of their prophet Muhammad?

So it happened. Al-Baghdadi conquered Syria, evangelized by the Apostle Paul, and Antioch, Syria, Luke, and John, until Amir ibn al-Ali, the son of Jonah. People forget all of North Africa, all the way up through the 7th century, until the Umayyad Muslims wiped them out.

St. Augustine of Hippo, in the year 711, 80 ,000 Muslims, with heavy metal swords, conquered all the Pyrenees Mountains.

Conquered.

But back then, they were lined up in the field, and in one pan annihilated the Frankish army. I mean, they literally could slice someone in half while riding a ranch just outside of Paris, and the Muslim cavalry charges, charge into the square, 30 ,000 men in one square, into it, thinking that it's a line, they're going to come out the other side.

Well, they get stuck. Martel had arranged for some of his men to sneak into the Muslim camp and free the captives, because they fought for religion, but they also fought for plunder. You could come away from battle with extra women.

Muhammad said you can have four wives plus as many extra women as your right hand possesses. And of course, if you die in battle, you get 72 virgins. So it's a strong sexual motivation to fight and die in jihad.

Anyway, as these warriors, these Muslim warriors at the Battle of Tours, and let go from the camp, they would leave the fighting to go back and reclaim their camp. Rahman sees them leaving. He tries to rally his men back.

He gets distracted and killed. And the Muslim warriors start bickering amongst themselves. They can't decide who their next commander is going to be. And so they pick up and go back to Spain. That was the Battle of Tours in 732 A .D., exactly 100 years after the death of their Islamic state.

They world into submission to Allah. If Charles Martel not stopped them at the Battle of Tours, we would be speaking Arabic right now, because German, French, English, and Spanish would have never developed his languages.

Largest army, if he was not successful in stopping. And so we see that it took 700 years to draw Spain. They finally did in 1492. We see the second spring, and it starts in the year 1071. And they invade into what is today Turkey, and then into Eastern Europe.

Now, in any of these countries where Islam is the theocracy, do people of other religions really have any freedoms at all? In countries where there is a Muslim majority or a theocracy, how much freedom do people like Christians and people of other religions really have?

Democrats treated in the 1960s. Democrats not wanting to have integration. And so they asked in the South to vote to find out who did the lynching. Citizen walking down the sidewalk and walks into a room.

They have to stand up. If they do, they'll retaliate. It's a second-class citizen. And so it's all dependent on...

What percentage of the world would you say is currently under Sharia law specifically?

Stop people from insulting Islam. They're saying they want global Sharia law. Hillary Clinton meets with them, promises to help them. Shortly after that charity out of Benghazi, when the ambassadors killed, Hillary immediately says, we got to stop people from insulting Islam.

A religious leader to a political leader to a military leader. And this is so important because into a country...

Interesting. Wow.

Wow.

Being transplanted into cities all across America.

Yeah. In fact, in Dearborn, Illinois, it's kind of getting frightening from what I've seen through my friend David Wood, who's been evangelizing there. It's almost like a little Islamic state there. But we're going to be going to our first break right now.

If you'd like to join us on the air with a question for Bill Federer on what every American needs to know about the Quran, a history of Islam in the United States, our email address is chrisarnsen at gmail .com.

C-H-R-I-S-A-R-N-Z-E-N at gmail .com. Don't go away. We'll be right back with Bill Federer.

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Tired of box store Christianity? Of doing church in a warehouse with all the trappings of a rock concert? Do you long for a more traditional and reverent style of worship? And how about the preaching?

Perhaps you've begun to think that in-depth biblical exposition has vanished from Long Island. Well, there's good news. Wedding River Baptist Church exists to provide believers with a meaningful and reverent worship experience featuring the systematic exposition of God's Word.

And this loving congregation looks forward to meeting you. Call them at 631 -929 -3512 for service times. 631 -929 -3512. Or check out their website at wrbc .us. That's wrbc .us. Welcome back. This is Chris Arms.

And if you've just tuned us in on Iron Sharpens Iron, our guest today is Bill Federer of American Minute .com. And we are discussing one of his many books, What Every American Needs to Know About the Quran, A History of Islam in the United States.

We do have a listener in Stryker, Ohio, who has a question for you, Bill. How would you answer someone of the Islamic faith who says that a Christian or anyone else cannot properly read the Quran unless it is in the original language, Arabic, which will discourage many from even trying to read the Quran?

So, in other words, there are Muslims who will take your assessment of what the Quran teaches and say, you don't know what you're talking about because you have to read it in Arabic, if you want to respond to that.

Yes, exactly. That's a very good answer. Even historically, this is not... And by the way, Scott in Stryker, Ohio, please email us your mailing address because thanks to the generosity of Bill Federer, you are going to receive a free copy of his book, What Every American Needs to Know About the Quran, A History of Islam in the United States.

And we do have another listener in Fort Myers, Florida. Oh, I'm sorry. I'm looking at the wrong question here. We have a question from Tom in West Islet, New York. What do we do when an ideology's tenants are to cause others to submit?

I'm assuming what he means by that is that if people who are such as Muslims coming to the United States and they are trying to teach others that their ultimate goal is that we, who are non-Muslims, submit to them.

I assume that's what Tom means. Maybe Tom wants to email us back. He can clarify that. But do you have a response to that, Bill? Well, maybe Tom, if he wants to email us back. Tom in West Islet, New York.

And by the way, you'll be getting a free copy of Bill's book, What Every American Needs to Know About the Quran.

Muslims have their Sharia law or the Ottoman Empire or Germany or in Persia.

That's right. And we have been speaking a lot about the global threat of Islam and the conquering of lands all over the world. Let's focus our attention more to America now. President Obama stated in Cairo, Egypt in 2009 that Islam has always been a part of American history.

Well, that's true, but that's not such a wonderful thing, is it? If you could tell us something about Islam and its connection to American history with the Barbary pirates and other things, that has obviously been not a wonderful thing, as Barack Obama seemed to intend to convey by that statement.

...literature into all the Greek scholars...conquered Never see him again. Catholic orders in Europe called the Trinitarians, the head of the order was called the Ransomer, and they would collect alms and donations and go under a white flag to northern Greece, Ireland or an Italian attacking our ships.

We were sinners and it was the right and we won. The history conquers...

Well, what happened to over 1 .5 million Armenian Christians when Woodrow Wilson failed to convince the United States Senate to adopt Armenia as a protectorate similar to Puerto Rico?

...time in a millennium involved in the military. Once he gets them all in there, that had let them down. After the Ottoman Empire was disbanded after World War I, the Muslim world viewed itself as defeated.

So the Muslim leaders decided they wanted to be friends with the West. For two centuries, America wins World War I, World War II, and so the Muslims see us with airplanes, telephones, television, and it just so happens that Saudi Arabia was the most fundamental...

Practicing their Wahhabi version of Islam, cutting off arms and legs, and they still do it every week in Riyadh, they cut off arms and legs. And so we need to see it for the spreading of fundamental Islam.

Of course, from there, Jimmy Carter pulls the rug out from the shawl of Iran, lets the Ayatollah take over in Iran, and then we see our president fires our ally Mubarak, uses our military assets to take out the leader of a country.

Why?

So the Muslim brotherhood could take over Libya. And then we're moving the guns from Libya through Benghazi to Turkey and Syria to arm the Muslim brotherhood over there to take out Assad in Syria. And when Russia comes to Assad's rescue, these Muslim brotherhood people, armed by America, trained by America, go into Iraq and Afghanistan, call themselves ISIS, paying.

For this.

We've trained them.

Yeah, let me ask you a question about Barack Obama, because you have a lot of people on the right saying things like they believe Barack Obama is really a Muslim and that kind of a thing. And as much as I despise his beliefs and his policies and his leadership, it seems like a real contradiction in lifestyle and ideology to say that he's a Muslim when he is one of the most liberal presidents, in fact, the most liberal president we've ever had, and believes in things that he would be executed for under Sharia law.

So why would people think that he's a Muslim? Why is he soft on Muslim, in your opinion? Obviously, you don't know his mind and heart like the Lord does, but what's your opinion on that?

We see the pride of the infidels, and so we see that his agenda clearly, in theory, all the way back to the...

Yes, and we urge you all to go to americanminute .com. And also, I want to announce a couple of our sponsors who you may be able to get some of Bill's books and DVDs from, and that's Cumberland Valley Bible Book Service, who are sponsors of Iron Sharpens Iron.

Their website is cvbbs .com, C-V for Cumberland Valley, B-B-S for biblebookservice .com. And also, the Solid Ground Christian Books, their website is solid-ground-books .com, solid-ground-books .com.

And by the way, Bill, I have had a couple of former military men who confirmed with me years ago the bizarre affinity that Islam has with homosexuality, and that's one of the reasons even why many of the American soldiers in Afghanistan wear beards, because of the wanting to stand apart from the homosexuals who are attracted to men without facial hair and that kind of thing.

Very strange circumstances.

And there is a movie called The Kite Runner, which I believe it may have even won an academy.

Award for, I don't know if it was Best Picture or something of that nature, but a really fascinating look into Sharia law and even the pedophilia that goes on in an Islamic state. Pretty disturbing aspect of the film.

But we thank you so much for being on our program today, Bill Federer. In fact, I'm going to conclude the program in about a minute and a half, if you could. One of our callers, or should I say one of our listeners who emailed us a question said, what are we supposed to do as a country when people are coming here who have a desire to overthrow our nation?

People always talk about the melting pot of America and that we have freedom of religion and freedom of speech, and we shouldn't discriminate against those of other beliefs and so on. But does that mean that even if somebody who has an ideology that wants to overthrow everything we stand for and who hates everything that we stand for, they should be permitted to live on our soil?

That's excellent, excellent point. I love the way you concluded this segment of the program today, and we look forward to having you back on, Bill Federer. You are definitely a fountain of knowledge, and that is not an exaggeration.

And once again, Bill Federer's website is americanminute .com, americanminute .com. Don't go away because the program is not over. As many of you know, we're two hours long now, and so we are going to be speaking with David Wood of answeringmuslims .com, and who is the host of Jesus or Muhammad on the Trinity Channel, and we're going to be continuing our discussion on the Islamic threat to the United States.

So don't go away. We'll be right back after these messages.

I'm James White of Alpha Omega Ministries. The New American Standard Bible is perfect for daily reading or in-depth study. Used by pastors, scholars, and everyday readers, the NASB is widely embraced and trusted as a literal and readable Bible translation.

The NASB offers clarity and readability while maintaining high accuracy to the original languages which the NASB is known for. The NASB is available in many editions like a topical reference Bible. Researched and prepared by biblical scholars devoted to accuracy, the new topical reference Bible includes contemporary topics relevant to today's issues.

From compact to giant print Bibles, find an NASB that fits your needs very affordably at nasbible .com. Trust, discover, and enjoy the NASB for yourself today. Go to nasbible .com. That's nasbible .com.

Tired of box store Christianity? Of doing church in a warehouse with all the trappings of a rock concert? Do you long for a more traditional and reverent style of worship? And how about the preaching?

Perhaps you've begun to think that in-depth biblical exposition has vanished from Long Island. Well, there's good news. Wedding River Baptist Church exists to provide believers with a meaningful and reverent worship experience featuring the systematic exposition of God's Word.

And this loving congregation looks forward to meeting you. Call them at 631 -929 -3512 for service times. 631 -929 -3512. Or check out their website at wrbc .us. That's wrbc .us.

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Thriving. Welcome back. This is Chris Arnzen, and this is our second hour on Iron Sharpens Iron. We've been discussing Islam. We started off with Bill Federer of AmericanMinute .com, discussing his book on Islam, What Every American Needs to Know About the Quran.

And now we have for our second hour, David Wood, a very dear friend of mine, who is a Christian apologist, a former atheist who converted by the mercy of Christ to Christianity. And he is well known for debating both atheists and Muslims.

And he is the host of Jesus or Muhammad on the Trinity Channel, which you can learn more about at TrinityChannel .com. And he is also the operator of AnsweringMuslims .com. It's my honor and privilege to welcome you back once again to Iron Sharpens Iron, David Wood.

Hey, how's it going, Chris?

It's going great. And let's start off the program by talking about the very recent horrific event in Chattanooga, Tennessee, an assassination that occurred resulting in the deaths of five U .S. servicemen, and others were wounded.

If you could tell us about the perpetrator, as much as you know about the perpetrator of this horrific assassination on our own soil, and if you know whether or not this was just the work of a lone madman, Muhammad Yusuf Abdul Aziz, or was he working in cooperation with ISIS, to your knowledge, etc.

If you could let us listeners know about this event, which actually occurred on Thursday, July 16th.

We find very often as people tell thoughts, well, why is it that somehow reacts to those things by going and killing a bunch of, sending out plenty of Islamic passages. He was explaining that Muslims are called to jihad.

One of his parents was once on the, and if you are at some point not living as a good Muslim, right? So if you have a drug problem, or if you, if you're doing anything you're not supposed to do, your response is to try to get in paradise.

Because if you're at all concerned, you know, whether this guy, once his mind is all cleared, dedicate his life to jihad. So it's possible that any of the things, but granting that this guy is a solution in Islam, a solution there, is still jihad.

Sorry about that. I've had my mic on mute because your voice comes in much clearer when I have my mic on mute for some reason. But I wanted to announce our email address for those of you listening to send in your own questions for David Wood.

It's ChrisArnzen at gmail .com. That's C-H-R-I-S-A-R-N-Z-E-N at gmail .com. Please include at least your first name, the city and state where you live, and the country where you live if outside of the U .S.

And we look forward to hearing from you and your questions. How comfortable do you feel, David, being an American citizen in regard to the threat of Islamic terrorism? A lot of people, even when we hear about isolated events such as what occurred in Chattanooga, Tennessee, a lot of us who are spoiled by the safety and peace and protection of the United States and our massive military, we really take for granted where we live.

And I know that you have spoken even with people in Homeland Security and so on, and perhaps know more than the average person. Well, you definitely know more than the average person about the religion of Islam.

But if you could comment on that, about the peace and safety that we should expect here in Islam. I mean, in the United States, amidst the threat of Islam.

The question is, you know, years in the past, remarkably, Al-Qaeda and terrorist networks, but you didn't, you know, blame, claim to be. Many Muslims believe that. Now that I've read, am I doing the wrong thing?

Many of them, it catches on to this, right? They've made a mindset, you know, that they go like 9 -11. You can do a massacre thing. On the one hand, there's a number of people who are willing to carry out attacks.

On the other hand, there are smaller scale attacks than what we find, you know, with people are going to catch something like that, military or something like that. And the justification for attacking the military is there's a command in the Quran, chapter 5, verse 33 of the Quran, says that if someone makes mischief in a Muslim land, you know, the penalty is death.

And so in Muslim lands, and therefore, you can kill them. That was the Fort Hood massacre for this shooting in Chattanooga. But there's a deeper problem. And this is why in bringing down and the justification in Islam, anyone is under the exact same penalty for the Marines applies to anyone who financially, any taxpayer who pays the government, which then pays the military is under the exact same.

Right now, the attacks are tending to focus on military and police. But since they're increasing, I don't want mall shooting.

Now, you have personal experience in Dearborn, Illinois. Why don't you let our listeners know something about the climate in Dearborn, Illinois, where there are many Muslims, and where you yourself had your religious freedoms violated and were arrested at one point.

But tell our listeners something about that. And do your beliefs on whether or not you think that the Islamic power over there is going to escalate? And how prevalent is that type of situation here in the United States to your knowledges in regard to a miniature Islamic state like Dearborn, Illinois?

I'm sorry, Dearborn, Michigan. I'm sorry.

Well, Dearborn, Michigan is Muslim. It's predominantly Shia. It's predominantly Shia Muslim. So these guys aren't taking any orders from and similar to what you'll find in a lot of Dearborn who are nice people.

I mean, I've actually had conversations about Christianity and Islam. So there are plenty of, you know, there are plenty of great people there. But at the same time, the effect that Islam has on populations, it isn't that it just turns every single person.

And what they find is not that every side bombings or something like that, wherever you have, you know, a large population higher than they are among non-Muslim populations. And that's the problem. If you have a, you know, a Muslim, yeah, you can point, you don't need one person.

After 9 -11, things like that, right after 9 -11, there's all, you can't find any of the footage from the team because all of the news networks eventually sanitized. You can't find any of this online.

And as someone who's been there, as someone who's been threatened repeatedly from there, so bad is, is you have, you have, you know, a lot of nice people who are more sincere and that's not going to end well.

Yeah. And my apologies to the dear folks in Dearborn, Illinois for my faux pas there by mixing you up with Dearborn, Michigan. I knew it was a suburb of Detroit and it was just a mishap because I know that there is a Dearborn, Illinois, but obviously a totally different situation in Dearborn, Illinois.

Why don't you tell our listeners, because you did speak about this a number of times on the old Iron Sharpens Iron, but tell our listeners who are unfamiliar with you and what happened in Dearborn, Michigan, involving your arrest and so on.

At the festival where they're, to Islam, there are Christians dating people, you know, explaining the gospel. And so there are Christians who will go, I went there, it was a Christianity or something, 2009, big sidewalks around passing out any pamphlets or Bibles or anything like that, which was very disturbing.

It actually took years. Government, US, big sidewalks. We have free speech in the United States. And so you can stand on public sidewalks. I can't walk into your home or walk into your private establishment and do whatever I want or hand out, you know, Bibles.

But on public sidewalks, that's protected. But the police there said, you know, no handing out Bibles or anything on the public sidewalks. And so this was very disturbing. And so people weren't allowed to hand things out.

And what happened was, who were just there, put them in trouble. What they would do is they would go and someone would jump out with a camera, take the picture, then run to run to police and say, you see, we caught this person distributing a Bible.

And so they were doing that. And my friend Nabil and I were there and people that Islam they can ask there. Nabil started asking them about Surah 9, verse 29 of the Quran, those who do not believe man's Muslims to violently subjugate Christians and Jews.

So Nabil was asking about that question. And long story short, security started flapping us around because Nabil was asking a question.

There.

We got run out of we got run out of the festival that next year that we're walking around walking out of the festival. He's a former Muslim. And they're asking, asking him exactly the sort of questions we would want to hear from young Muslims.

You know, they're asking, how can you believe God came out of a woman? How can you believe in the Bible when it's corrupted? These are the questions that apologists want to answer because Muslims have been fed total nonsense about what we believe.

And so we want to answer these questions. Nabil is answering those questions for for a few minutes. And police show up and put all of us in handcuffs, not not the Muslims. And they charge us with breach of peace.

And they actually put us on a through a five day trial trying to convince who came up there. They were saying that we were a disturbance and there was there's problems when it was Nabil calmingly, calmly answering questions of young Muslims, answering their questions, praising them for their great questions, telling them how much he's enjoying this conversation with them.

And then police coming up and found not guilty. And then we won that.

The Gospel of Jesus Christ, obviously, is the answer to all conflicts. There are other measures that people need to be involved in, obviously, to live in a peaceful and orderly society and so on. But what is what is your main?

What is the main reaction you have been getting in the years that you have been evangelizing the Muslims? Is it all or is the majority, I should say, just reactions of anger and hate? Or do you have some pensive reflection, real thoughtful responses from many Muslims that you encounter?

And in fact, we know that from your previous interviews that one of these Muslims, at least, has come to Christ, Nabil Qureshi, who you just mentioned before, through your evangelism that God used in his heart in your college days.

But what is the dominant kind of reaction that you get?

It's an accurate, I don't think that people care that much or they're not really that dedicated. People who are getting involved in this have to be so much. And you get, they're going to kill me and they're going to turn my wife into a sex slave and they're going to kill my kids.

Well, you keep hearing this and you start, you know, you can get kind of angry. And, you know, but, you know, that is a minority of people who are responding to you. Lots of people, they're not paying attention.

With that said, so you're going to get a lot of hostile reactions. With that said, I also get that they're in kind of three different categories. And one is, you know, the former Muslim who actually becomes, he even had a little while back where someone sent Islam.

He came back a couple years later and said, hey, I don't know if you remember me, I used to comment on your blog, but I've left Islam now. So you have people who leave Islam and become Christians. People who leave Islam, but they don't become Christians, right?

So some of them leave Islam and they become agnostics. Agree with my criticisms of Islam. They agree there's no way Mohammed can be speaking for God. But they still hold on to a lot of their criticisms of Christianity.

And now they just don't know what to believe. So on the one hand, you've got people who leave Islam and become Christians. On the other, you have people who leave Islam and don't become Christians. They just leave Islam.

But actually, the most common, as far as, you know, the changes of mind, more common than those are people who work very regularly. And my friends were Muslims. I grew up in an area with a lot of Muslims.

And my friends were telling me about Islam, and I was thinking about converting. But when I started looking into it, I started to become a Muslim. Now, thank you for, thank you for to see what Islam really is.

And so, and that's an aspect that really gets ignored in a ministry, right? You think of ministry, we're going out, we're going to go preach the gospel to Muslims and see who converts. Not really paying lots of attention to the wrong foundation and why they believe what they believe.

And then they go out, and they've got Muslim friends who are blasting the deity of Christ, the reliability of the Bible, and so on. And they have no foundation. Convert. And guess what? Some of these guys become terrorists.