F4F | Che Ahn Explains Who The Apostles Are

Fighting for the Faith

Subscribe

Download

Share

00

00:00

Welcome to another installment of Fighting for the

00:15

Faith here on YouTube. If you've listened to Michael Brown talk about the so -called

00:22

NAR, as if somehow the NAR is a figment of the imagination of conspiracy wingnuts and types like that, consider this installment of Fighting for the

00:35

Faith an ongoing example of stuff that we keep finding on the internet that just seems to say, well, you know, maybe, just maybe that NAR is for real.

00:50

And the reason I say maybe, just maybe that NAR is for real is because it is.

00:55

And so what we're going to do here is we're going to go back in time to the year 2010 when

01:02

Shayon traveled over to the United Kingdom and was the guest of Trevor Baker of Revival Fires at a conference that they were holding there, and did a little four -minute interview and it ended up on the

01:14

Revival Fires YouTube channel, and it's titled, Who are the Apostles? And we're going to note that at this time, you know, back in 2010,

01:25

Shayon was talking quite openly about the restoration of apostles.

01:30

We'll talk about that. We'll talk about marketplace apostles taking, getting to the top of different cultural mountains, taking dominion over them, and once they get there, they can decree and declare stuff.

01:44

Yeah, this is a short little interview, but quite the thing. I'd love to find out what

01:50

Michael Brown thinks of what Shayon says in this thing, but I seriously doubt he'll even give it the time of day.

01:57

But let's go ahead and get the desktop up and running, and let's listen in as Trevor Baker and Shayon discuss,

02:07

Who are the Apostles? Here we go. You've been here at the conference, Aligning Ourselves with the

02:14

Kingdom, or Kingdom Alignment, as we call the conference. And I love the title, by the way. That's a great title for a conference.

02:20

And it's just some of those things of how the church at this moment can align with heaven.

02:28

We hear lots of teachings about how the church at this moment can align with heaven.

02:36

Your kingdom come on earth as it is in heaven, and some of the things you've been talking about in terms of, you know, we've had whole lots of teaching on the prophetic, and now there's this re -emergence of the apostolic.

02:54

And just talk about... Now, I'm going to point that out. That might seem like a minor detail, but there's nothing minor about it.

03:02

In fact, that's quite an important detail. Notice he talked about the re -emergence of the apostolic.

03:09

Now, Michael Brown, one of the reasons why he talks about why, well, there's always been apostles, and I mean by apostles, small a apostles.

03:17

The reason he's saying that is because he knows just how duplicitous it would be to say that, well, apostles disappeared and then re -emerged, because that means that the church has been literally for almost 2 ,000 years, 1 ,900 years to be exact, been without any living apostles until they've just recently re -emerged.

03:47

And so the NAR teaches the re -emergence, the restoration of apostles, and not little a apostles, big a apostles.

03:56

We've covered this on previous installments of Fighting for the Faith. So, yeah, you're going to note that Trevor Baker had no problem talking about the re -emergence of apostles.

04:08

That's kind of an important thing. And back then, Cheyenne didn't even blink an eyelash at it.

04:13

He totally agreed. Let me back this up just a little bit and listen in. You know, we've had whole lots of teaching on the prophetic, and now there's this re -emergence of the apostolic.

04:25

Yes. And just talk to us about that, Chey, with regard to kingdom alignment and where the apostolic fits into that.

04:32

Well, I love the word alignment. Yeah, where does the apostolic fit into alignment with the heavenlies, you know?

04:40

There's a scriptural term, and the Greek word is katatismos, which you see in Ephesians 4 .11,

04:47

that's in the context that when he ascended, he gave some to be apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors, and teachers to equip the saints for the work of ministry.

04:56

That word equip there is alignment. It's allowing the saints. Yeah. Now, that's not exactly correct.

05:03

Let's take a look at it. And it's Ephesians chapter 4. I'll start at verse 11.

05:10

This is the standard text for now the people who are five folders. Michael Brown, he's not

05:16

N .A .R., he's a five folder. He believes that there have always been apostles, but Cheyenne and Trevor Baker, there's been a re -emergence of apostles, which means, and I mean this,

05:29

I want you to consider the implications. The five folders say, well, the church has always needed apostles, but the

05:36

N .A .R. guys like Cheyenne say, no, no, no, the apostles recently re -emerged, which means that for 1 ,900 years, the church has been unable to properly equip the saints.

05:48

So the word in question is how in the ESV gets translated as equip.

05:54

So he gave the apostles, the prophets, evangelists, and shepherds and teachers to equip, and katartismos is the

06:04

Greek word. And let's go ahead and pull it up in BDAG, and boy, is that small. I'm going to make that a little bit bigger.

06:11

Now, important thing, definitions of a word are based upon the context.

06:18

So many words have multiple definitions, and the context will tell you what the word means. Always, and again,

06:24

I go to the word up because it's kind of simple. If I were to say somebody threw up, up in that sentence means one thing, but if I said somebody went up the escalator, well, up in that sense means something different than throwing up.

06:37

You get the idea. The context will tell you what definition is appropriate. So katartismos is the

06:45

Greek word, and it's a classical Greek word, by the way.

06:51

This comes from classical Greek, and it means the setting of a bone historically.

06:56

Okay, so if you broke a bone, you would katartismos it, which is not exactly the right way of putting it because this is actually a noun, but it's not a verb.

07:06

But you'd get the idea. And so in this sense, then, what's being discussed is the second understanding, the equipment or equipping, and this falls under the idea of training or discipline to equip

07:24

God's people for service. That's what it means. Although historically, in classical

07:29

Greek, it meant the setting of a bone. Now, all of that being said, then, what

07:35

Shayon is engaging in is classic charismatic NAR wordplay where he's blurring definitions.

07:45

And so this does not mean, by the way, alignment. It literally means equipping.

07:52

That's what's going on. And in this particular case, I want to see something here.

07:57

Masculine, singular, accusative. Yeah, no, that's just the noun form. Okay. So you get the idea of what's going on here.

08:04

And so he's going to be engaging in wordplay. And so since it means the setting of a bone, it means alignment.

08:10

No, it doesn't. And he's engaging in some weird wordplay, but we go on.

08:16

And it's a medical term that simply means to set a broken bone into place.

08:23

So something that's out of alignment, you set it so that it could heal properly. No, that may have been how it was originally used in classical

08:31

Greek, but that's not how it was used in Koine. And especially in this context, it has to do with equipping, not aligning.

08:41

Stronger. And so I really feel this is a prophetic word for the church because a lot of us are talking about kingdom assignment.

08:51

Okay. The seven mountains of culture. What do you call to, how can you take arts and entertainment mountain or the media mountain or the government mountain?

09:00

Yeah. How do you take the media mountain, the government? Notice he said, take, this is classic NAR dominionist talk and strategy.

09:08

But I feel what's more important for us is alignment before the assignment, because what we have to do is recognize who are the ones who really are the called as apostles to those various mountains.

09:22

So apparently apostles are called to those various mountains to quote, unquote, take them.

09:29

That's what he said. As far as spiritual authority goes, the Bible says in first Corinthians chapter 12, 28, it's first apostles, second prophets, third teachers.

09:39

And in my observation, the ones that are really bringing about transformation in society are people who are the marketplace apostles, marketplace prophets.

09:49

Okay. Marketplace apostles. And notice he's talking about transforming society.

09:57

This is much different than making disciples. Very different altogether.

10:03

And apparently there's this new category with the reemergence, as Trevor Baker talked about it, the reemergence of apostles, which have been gone for 1900 years.

10:14

With the reemergence of the apostles, now there's a new type of apostle. The marketplace apostle, which is nowhere spoken of anywhere in scripture.

10:25

That's the invention of C. Peter Wagner. Just a nuclear church. Obviously the religion mountain, you have the nuclear church apostle.

10:38

But when you begin to realize the business people who are really making a lot of money are marketplace apostles and they are just,

10:46

God's given them tremendous authority or the government mountain. I just had the privilege of meeting with the president of Korea, South Korea, and he is an apostle on the government mountain.

10:58

He was a former. South Korean president is a, is an apostle on the government mountain.

11:04

Who knew? CEO of Hyundai motor cars. And it would be like the

11:11

CEO of a Mercedes Benz or is the number one car for Korea. And he rose from the very bottom to the very top and then he became mayor of Seoul.

11:23

And when he became mayor of Seoul, he dedicated the city to Jesus Christ. And he got a lot of criticism by the

11:30

Buddha. How do you dedicate a city to Jesus? And what does that mean exactly?

11:35

Do you give Jesus the key to the city? I mean, and does that mean everybody there is now Christian?

11:41

I mean, what does that mean? Said, you know, this is my faith and I did what

11:46

I did and I'm not going to take it back. When you get to the top, you can start doing some radical things for the

11:53

Lord. If you get to the top, take, take that mountain.

12:00

Then you can do some radical things for the Lord. Says no biblical text anywhere.

12:07

Where is he getting this? Again, this is classic NAR dominionism, which of course,

12:13

Michael Brown even denies exists, but it's right here. You know, it's strange that I could find examples like this of the thing that he says doesn't exist.

12:23

The problem is, is that unfortunately many of us are not at the top. See, if you're not at the top, you can't do those radical things.

12:31

So you got to take those mountains. You got to get to the top. So then you can do the radical stuff as a marketplace apostle, apparently.

12:40

And so, you know, Deuteronomy 28, 13 says we're to be the head and not the tail. But unfortunately, many of us are just behind.

12:46

And so if we share something. So if you're not the head, you're doing it wrong. If you're the tail, pull.

12:53

Yeah, you've got things really backwards. Talk about a twisting of Deuteronomy 28. About, you know, something concerning a

13:01

Christian value. We get persecuted because we're not at the head. But once we do. So the reason why

13:06

Christians get persecuted is because they haven't taken the mountain.

13:12

And so they're not at the head. They're still in the tails. That's why they get persecuted. Wow, that's absurd.

13:21

To the head, then all of a sudden we can make decrees and declarations and we can shift and influence that whole mountain.

13:27

Hang on, I got to back that up. Yeah. So what's the point of getting to the top? Well, you know, there's certain things you could do at the top.

13:34

You can't do when you're not at the top. Listen to him again. But unfortunately, many of us are just behind.

13:40

And so if we share something about, you know, something concerning a

13:46

Christian value, we get persecuted because we're not at the head. But once we do get to the head, then all of a sudden we can make decrees and declarations and we can shift and influence that whole mountain.

13:58

Yeah. See, you can't make decrees and declarations unless you actually get to the top of that particular mountain, you know, of the seven mountains of culture.

14:09

Once you get to the top of it, whoa, man, then you can do like, I decree and declare and da da da da da da.

14:17

And no biblical text teaches that. This is straight up mythology. And wow.

14:23

And not only is it mythology, this is the kind of stuff that Michael Brown says doesn't exist. Huh? Weird.

14:29

It's right, you know, and we always seem to stumble on these things that Michael Brown says just aren't there.

14:36

But then again, I mean, clearly I've got to be some kind of weird wingnut conspiracy theorist because I actually believe the

14:44

New Apostolic Reformation is a thing. Because it is. Anyway, you get the idea.

14:51

So if you found this helpful, please share this below. If you're not already a subscriber to our channel, please subscribe below.

14:59

Ring the little bell and you'll get notified when we post new videos.

15:04

And if you'd like to know how you can support us financially, we definitely need that help. All the information on how to support us is down below by either becoming a crew member, signing up to be a patron on Patreon, all of that information is below.

15:17

And if you don't already listen to my podcast, you need to go to fightingforthefaith .com and subscribe to the podcast because then you get like two hours a day of this type of discernment work so that you can not be deceived, so that you can be trained in properly handling

15:33

God's Word and learn how to spot false teachers and people who manipulate God's Word. So until next time, may

15:40

God richly bless you in the grace and mercy won by Jesus Christ and His vicarious death on the cross for all of your sins.