February 18, 2025 Show with John Marshall Otis on “When Heaven Seems Silent: Trusting in God’s Unfailing Promises”

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February 19, 2025

February 18, 2025 John Marshall Otis,retired pastor & author who islaunching an open air evangelismministry on the campus of theUniversity of Georgia in Athens,called “Triumphant Ministries”,who will address: “WHEN HEAVEN SEEMS SILENT:TRUSTING in GOD’s UNFAILINGPROMISES” Subscribe: Listen:

00:03: Live from historic downtown Carlisle, Pennsylvania, home of founding father James Wilson, 19th century hymn writer
00:11: George Duffield, 19th century gospel minister George Norcross, and sports legend
00:16: Jim Thorpe, it's Iron Sharpens Iron. This is a radio platform in which pastors,
00:23: Christian scholars, and theologians address the burning issues facing the church and the world today.
00:31: Proverbs chapter 27 verse 17 tells us iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another.
00:38: Matthew Henry said that in this passage, we are cautioned to take heed with whom we converse and directed to have in view in conversation to make one another wiser and better.
00:50: It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next two hours, and we hope to hear from you, the listener, with your own questions.
00:57: And now, here's your host, Chris Arnzen. Good afternoon,
01:09: Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, Lake City, Florida, and the rest of humanity living on the planet
01:15: Earth, who are listening via live streaming at ironsharpensironradio .com.
01:23: This is Chris Arnzen, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, wishing you all a happy Tuesday on this 18th day of February 2025.
01:33: Before I introduce my guest and our topic for the day, I want to remind our listeners not only to continue praying for my sister
01:43: Mary, who is in her 70s and had her leg amputated last week.
01:51: She is recovering, as I've mentioned, on the air and in social media at a rehabilitation facility, learning how to spend the rest of her life with one leg.
02:07: So please continue to pray for her, not only physically, but mentally and spiritually, and that the
02:14: Lord would use this trial in her life to draw her closer to himself.
02:21: Also, I added to that prayer request something that's more urgent.
02:28: Yesterday, I announced this for the first time on the show, I believe.
02:36: Yes, I did announce it yesterday for the first time, because I only found out the day before, which was
02:43: Sunday. My brother, who has been living for years in a local nursing home ever since he was paralyzed on the entire left side of his body after a massive stroke, he was rushed to the hospital from his nursing home because of dangerously low oxygen levels.
03:07: He also has an aspiration problem, where debris collects in his lungs, which radically increases the chances of getting pneumonia, which could be fatal.
03:24: Well, my brother is on a ventilator right now. He is sedated and unconscious.
03:31: He was in a critical condition, but I was told he has since been brought to a stable condition, and they told me they were going to contact me the moment anything negative, if anything negative, were to develop.
03:53: So I hope I don't get a call even during this program today, because I'm going to have to take it, even if briefly, to return later to the live discussion.
04:05: But please pray for my brother Andy Arnzen, also in his 70s, and that this trial would also be used in his life to draw him closer to the
04:20: Lord. My brother has made a profession of faith for decades, but it's always been suspect.
04:28: The credibility of his profession never has sat well with me, due to the way that before he was hospitalized, the way that he was living, while at the same time professing to be a born -again believer.
04:46: So please pray that the Lord does a genuine work of salvation in his heart, and that I would see the fruits of that salvation, and be able to rest in the knowledge that no matter what happens to him, if the
05:06: Lord were to take him, that he would be in eternity with Christ. I appreciate those prayers, and of course, continue to pray for me as I continue to recuperate from congestive heart failure.
05:18: Right now, I am feeling no symptoms whatsoever, no longer out of breath easily as I was.
05:27: My appetite that had been destroyed by the congestive heart failure, almost completely removing my desire to eat, is gone.
05:39: I am eating normally now, and so I have everything to be thrilled about in this regard.
05:49: But my blood tests are not 100 % where they should be. I have a blood clot in my heart and in my lung, and the medication
05:59: I'm on is supposed to dissolve these clots, and my doctor is not 100 % pleased with the blood tests.
06:06: So, he keeps adjusting the dosages of medications I'm taking. So, please pray that I hear a much better praise report the next time
06:17: I'm in his office, and that we are on the right track with the medication, or that the
06:23: Lord just miraculously heals me. But I am thrilled to have an old friend of mine on the program.
06:30: I've been interviewing this dear brother ever since I launched Iron Sharpens Iron Radio in 2005 out of WNYG Radio in West Babylon, Long Island, New York.
06:45: His name is Dr. John M. Otis, and he has been a very important friend in my life.
06:56: I will never forget that he and his late wife,
07:01: Christine, made a very long drive to visit me in Boone, North Carolina, when
07:08: I was graduating, as they called it, from an alcohol rehab ministry that I had checked myself into during a backslidden state in my life when
07:22: I was sadly, after 18 years of sobriety, had returned to habitual and scandalous levels of drunkenness.
07:32: And, thank God, I have never even had an urge to drink ever since leaving that wonderful ministry in Boone, North Carolina.
07:42: Well, John and his lovely late wife, Christine, made the trip there to be present.
07:48: The only people that I know personally that were there, other than those that I got to know while being there, and that will always occupy a big place in my heart for this dear brother in Christ.
08:07: He is a retired pastor, and he's also a published author, and he is now involved in an open -air evangelism ministry called
08:20: Triumphant Ministries, and it's primarily going to be taking place on the campus of the
08:28: University of Georgia in Athens. And today we're going to be talking about the theme of John's new book,
08:37: When Heaven Seems Silent, Trusting in God's Unfailing Promises. And it's my honor and privilege to welcome you back to Iron Trip and Zion Radio, John Otis.
08:50: It is always great to be on your program, Chris. I will give a caveat. I'm not technically a doctor unless you conferred a doctorate on me just a few minutes ago.
09:03: Well, as soon as those words came out of my mouth, I realized I don't think John's a doctor.
09:10: I haven't written enough books to be a doctor. Yes. Technically. Yes. Well, that shows you the high esteem with which
09:18: I hold you, because you're certainly brilliant enough to be the recipient of a
09:25: Ph .D. or other doctorate. And I'm honored to know you and to have benefited richly from your own knowledge and wisdom and ministry.
09:37: Well, first of all, before we get into the theme, tell us more about your new open -air evangelism ministry,
09:45: Triumphant Ministries. Well, for the last several years, even before the
09:53: Lord took my precious wife to glory, I began to pray and to realize in the 40 -some years of my ministry, pastoral ministry, and in writing quite a few books where you can reach people, the
10:11: Lord was burdened me with the fact I've never really devoted myself to reaching those who reside in darkness under the shadow of death.
10:22: And that burden continued to grow, and I began to pray, Lord, I'm 73 years of age, and I said,
10:31: I don't know how many years that you have ordained for me on this earth, but I want to devote the rest of my life, whatever those years, to being used of you to be a fisher of men, to bring those out of darkness into light, to be that mechanism to the preaching of the gospel.
10:49: And after my wife died in May of this past year, 2024, that burden began to grow even more so.
11:01: And so I began to—the Lord saved me in a campus ministry when
11:07: I was 18 years of age, and then I was nurtured in a parish church organization called
11:15: The Navigators for four years that God immensely used in my life.
11:22: And so I've been attracted, I realized that college students are very malleable.
11:29: They can be easily manipulated, as we can bear testimony on our college campuses today.
11:41: So there's a great need, and at that point in your life, you make decisions oftentimes that will direct you the rest of your life as a vocation or whatever, future spouse and that.
11:55: So the Lord has laid on my heart to primarily, maybe not exclusively on that particular campus, but primarily on that campus.
12:04: So I just wanted to dedicate myself to that. We are just beginning this, and I have scouted out the campus, and there are places that you can do that where students are gathered.
12:22: So we're looking, we're excited about it. I've got a group of godly
12:29: Christian men and women who said they will pray for me. And I've always indicated
12:35: I'm a firm believer in the power of prayer. And let me just mention in that regard, one of the passages that changed my whole view years ago on missions is
12:47: Romans 15, verse 30, where Paul's writing there, and he says,
12:54: I urge you, brethren, to pray, to strive together with me in your prayers to God for me.
13:06: And he was getting ready to go to Jerusalem, and he was longing to come to Rome.
13:14: And we can see the edge of that prayer. He will go to Jerusalem. He'll be arrested by the
13:20: Romans who scared his life. And he'll petition to go to Caesar since he was a
13:28: Roman citizen. And he ended up going to Rome in a way that he had never imagined.
13:35: But God was orchestrating that whole thing because we know from the
13:41: Scriptures he was under house arrest for at least two years. And can you imagine what would be the impact of those
13:49: Roman soldiers who had close contact with the apostle Paul? Well, we know from Philippians chapter 1 that Paul says the gospel has even reached the household of Caesar.
14:02: So God, they answered those prayers. So I'm excited about what the
14:08: Lord has in mind. And I believe that I'm in the process. I've got several men.
14:15: I can always use benefactors to help in this ministry. And so those who feel a letter of the
14:24: Lord to want to contribute to this ministry would be more than welcome. But I'm excited about the
14:31: Lord's prospects. I believe that the Lord, if we believe in him to do great things, he will do so.
14:40: Let me just mention in that regard to evangelism, my favorite preacher probably in history is George Whitefield, which you're probably familiar with as well.
14:48: Oh, yeah. I came to the doctrines of grace when I was a new believer.
14:54: I was vehemently opposed to everything I was hearing about Calvinism.
15:02: In this Reformed Baptist church where I had newly become a member, and they agreed to tolerate me.
15:13: They didn't say it that way, but they welcomed me joyfully into membership as long as I had promised that I wouldn't seek to undermine the teaching there and that I was willing to be patient and God -willing grow in my understanding of the scriptures in these areas.
15:35: And someone in the church, Nigel Stone from England, who's now in heaven, he approached me and said,
15:44: I understand you're having difficulty understanding the doctrines of sovereign grace and election.
15:51: Well, read this. And he gave me a booklet, George Whitefield's Letter to John Wesley on Election, published by Chapel Library.
16:00: I read it. My first reaction was, oh, no, this is true. But I still hate it.
16:07: But then within, I think, less than two months, I fell in love, madly in love with these doctrines and have been joyfully proclaiming them ever since.
16:20: But I didn't even know who George Whitefield was at the time.
16:26: So it wasn't George Whitefield that really the
16:31: Lord used to convert me. It was the scriptures that Whitefield presented to John Wesley.
16:39: And I didn't know who John Wesley was either at that time. But I later would do research on Whitefield and read more of what he wrote and more of what people wrote about him, like Dallimore and so forth, and I just fell in love with him as a hero of the faith.
17:02: Yeah, the thing that I was going to mention there is, in terms of prayer, it was
17:09: January the 1st, 1739, and there was a meeting with the Wesleys, and there was a
17:16: Moravian love feast. Whitefield talks about how the presence of God was overwhelming that evening, and they prayed to three o 'clock in the morning, and he said, we went out believing that God was going to do something wonderful.
17:36: And then on February the 15th, 1739, in Bristol, England, on the coldest day in known history of England, he began his open air preaching, and the world has never been the same.
17:51: But it began with prayer, and another—so
17:57: I'm always in the process of getting people who've—well, we'll pray for you, John. So I'm looking for people who take it very seriously.
18:07: So that happens in Romans 15 .30 that I mentioned, that word there in English, strive together, the
18:16: Greek word is sun agonizomai. It's a combination of the preposition sun, meaning with, and agonizomai, and I said, does anybody know an
18:28: English word that's similar to agonize? Agonize. Agonize. That is actually—that
18:35: Greek word is where our English word agonize comes from. It's a word used with prevailing.
18:43: So what Paul—the reason that changed my life—Paul says, I want you to agonize together with me in your prayers to God for me.
18:53: So that sometimes people, Chris, think, well, nothing else
18:58: I can do but pray. That's the most important thing to begin with.
19:04: And what Paul is saying is those who agonize with him in his ministry are really and truly in a spiritual sense, they're on that field of battle, helping those to come out of darkness into light.
19:20: So I've got people praying. I have a godly sister -in -law,
19:26: Motis Brothers' wife, who is a great woman of faith.
19:32: She says, John, I'm going to believe that God is going to bring about a revival.
19:38: I said, well, you keep praying that way. And so in another passage real quick, and then we'll get into the topic of the day, is
19:46: Isaiah 62, 6 and 7, where it says, On your walls, O Jerusalem, I'm appointed watchman who cry all day and all night, and you who remind the
20:05: Lord, give yourselves no rest and give him, that is
20:10: God, no rest until he makes Jerusalem a praise in the earth.
20:15: And he talked about persevering a prayer. What God is saying, he's inviting us, see if you can wear me out by praying for the victory on earth.
20:27: So I want people who will say, we will pray for you,
20:34: John. And I believe as they pray, we're going to see wonderful things happen.
20:40: Yeah. My pastor, Simon O'Maney, at Trinity Reformed Baptist Church of Carlisle, Pennsylvania, just preached recently on persevering in prayer.
20:52: But the common thing that we may hear from our brethren who do not share our
21:01: Reformed faith, if they were hearing you today, they might say something like, well, this guy certainly doesn't sound like a
21:10: Calvinist. But this comes from a false and slanderous stereotype of what
21:19: Calvinism actually is and what it always has been in its authentic form, which is another thing proven by the fact of the very ministry that you have launched, the
21:37: Triumphant Ministries, this open air evangelism ministry, there are who knows how many countless deceived people who just don't believe
21:50: Calvinists are ever engaged in that kind of thing. And of course, many Calvinists aren't, but many
21:56: Arminians aren't either. There are multitudes of Arminians or non -Calvinists who, through sheer laziness or apprehension and fear of being embarrassed or being hated, do not involve themselves in evangelism.
22:18: So for them to point the finger at Reformed folk as if we corner the market on apathy in evangelism is ridiculous.
22:28: But we should have every more reason to be zealous in evangelism because we know for certain that the
22:38: Word of God shall not return void, and we know that He has an elect people out there.
22:46: His sheep will hear His voice because He knows them, and they will follow
22:52: Him. We know that as a fact, a promised fact. You know, one of the great verses in the
22:58: Scripture that I've always referred to is Acts 13, 48, when Paul told the apostate
23:04: Jews, all right, we're leaving you, we're going to go to the Gentiles, who gladly were willing there in Acts 13 to hear him preach.
23:12: Paul says, as many as were ordained to eternal life believed. Yup. And the gospel,
23:20: Whitefield referred to himself, even though he stayed in the Church of England, he referred to himself as a
23:25: Calvinistic Methodist. And as you said, it was clearly in his preaching that one of my favorite heroes in the 19th century in America is
23:38: Daniel Baker. I don't know if you're familiar with him. There's a wonderful book, a biography by his son.
23:46: It's partly biographical, autobiographical. He was from the mid -19th century.
23:57: He was a tremendous preacher, tremendous evangelist as well.
24:04: And he was a thoroughgoing Calvinist. I've got to look him up because I've never heard of him. Daniel Barker?
24:11: No, Daniel Baker. Oh, Baker. Baker, B -A -K -E.
24:16: Yeah, never heard of him. And look him up. One of the greatest revivals at the
24:22: College of New Jersey happened. I won't go into that. It'll thrill you. The book,
24:29: I think, is Making Hearts Glad. I think something like that. You got to read that book,
24:35: Chris. It's magnificent. Did the College of New Jersey eventually become Princeton? Yes.
24:41: Okay. But one of the great revivals in American history began, and I'll just say this briefly.
24:50: By the time he was a student there, he said it was about 130 students.
24:56: He said that there was only four of us that took the faith seriously, and they were praying for their student body for a year.
25:05: And in this book he talks about, he says, we were about to throw in the towel because nothing was happening.
25:13: Wow. And then in 1814, President James Madison called for a national day of fasting and repentance because they were right in the midst of the
25:25: War of 1812. And so they called the classes off that day.
25:31: So Baker and his buddies said, well, let's go talk to our students. And boom, that's when it happened.
25:40: One notable student came to Christ, and it led to another and to another. The president of the college says it was an amazing thing.
25:51: Baker says, I believe that one -third of the student body was soundly converted and all the preachers that came out of it.
26:00: And then he mentioned that the British press said that the greatest divine living was at the
26:16: College of New Jersey. That got my interest up. So I did some research, and I believe about 99 %—Charles
26:26: Hodge. You know Charles Hodge? Yes. Systematic theology. He was there during that time, and I believe that's who that greatest divine.
26:37: So it started in a prayer meeting, and it led to one of the great revival stories in American history.
26:48: And Baker, I'm telling you, was familiar art. So, yeah. Praise God.
26:54: I want to go to my first commercial break right now before we dive into the actual theme at hand, which is the theme of your new book,
27:06: When Heaven Seems Silent, Trusting in God's Unfailing Promises. And if anybody has any questions, you can submit them to ChrisArnzen at gmail .com,
27:20: C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N -Z -E -N at gmail .com.
27:26: As always, give us your first name at least, your city and state of residence, and your country of residence if you live outside the
27:33: USA. And please only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal or private matter.
27:40: And this is the kind of topic that lends itself to personal and private questions because the book, obviously, as the title reveals, is an effort to bring encouragement and comfort to those agonizing over people in all kinds of trials in life, coming to the wrong conclusion that God does not hear them because heaven seems silent.
28:17: And so, obviously, there may be folks out there with private questions and you want to remain anonymous.
28:24: That is completely fine. But if it's just a general question on what the scriptures have to say about this issue, please give us your first name at least, city and state, and country of residence.
28:40: And by the way, I am going to email to you, John, so you can have it during the break, a question that has already come in from Anthony in Hoshton, Georgia.
28:58: It is so long of a question that I thought that it might be best for you to have it in writing right in front of you.
29:08: So I'm going to email this to you and you can look it over during the station break.
29:15: By the way, Hoshton is six miles from me.
29:20: Really? Well, that may be why this listener wants to be involved in your open air evangelism ministry.
29:28: How did you pronounce it? Because I've been calling it Hoshton for years and nobody's corrected me.
29:37: They pronounce it Hoshton, like hush. Hoshton. Hoshton.
29:42: Okay. Well, now I know. And Anthony, you have never corrected me, so shame on you.
29:54: But he's been listening to this program and has submitted many questions over the years.
30:03: And so I'm going to be sending this to you. Also, I want to give everybody listening, since I mentioned the
30:11: Christian addiction recovery ministry, since I mentioned that as a part of my own testimony of coming to sobriety,
30:24: I want to make sure that our listeners know the name of that wonderful ministry.
30:32: It is Hebron Colony. And the website is hebroncolony .org.
30:39: It's in Boone, North Carolina. And it is absolutely free of charge. It's the oldest continuously running addiction recovery ministry for men in the
30:50: United States. And I have nothing but praise reports about that wonderful place.
30:57: And they do have a sister ministry in Santee, South Carolina for women called
31:04: Grace Home. But you can find out about both of those ministries at hebroncolony .org.
31:11: H -E -B -R -O -N colony .org. So once again, if you have a question for John Otis, our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com.
31:22: Give us your first name at least, city and state of residence, and country of residence. If you live outside the
31:27: U .S .A. and you may remain anonymous for personal and private questions. Now we're going to hear a word from our newest sponsor of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, Lebanon Federal Credit Union in Carlisle, Pennsylvania.
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33:45: Doug McMasters of New High Park Baptist Church on Long Island.
33:54: Doug McMasters here, former director of pastoral correspondence at Grace to You, the radio ministry of John MacArthur.
34:01: In the film, Chariots of Fire, Olympic gold medalist runner Eric Liddell remarked that he felt
34:07: God's pleasure when he ran. He knew his efforts sprang from the gifts and calling of God.
34:13: I sensed that same God -given pleasure when ministering the Word and helping others gain a deeper knowledge and love for God.
34:21: That love starts with the wonderful news that the Lord Jesus Christ is a Savior who died for sinners, and that God forgives all who come to Him in repentance, trusting solely in Christ to deliver them.
34:33: I would be delighted to have the honor and privilege of ministering to you if you live in the Long Island area, or Queens, or Brooklyn, or the
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34:59: That's 516 -352 -9672. That's New High Park Baptist Church, a congregation in love with each other, passionate for Christ, committed to learning and being shaped by God's Word, and delighting in the gospel of God's sovereign grace.
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38:16: We're now back with John Otis, an old friend of mine who is a retired pastor, and he is also a published author, and who has just launched an open -air evangelism ministry called
38:35: Triumphant Ministries, which is primarily going to be taking place on the campus of the
38:41: University of Georgia in Athens. And if you have a question about his book,
38:48: When Heaven Seems Silent, Trusting in God's Unfailing Promises, a very important word there
38:56: I looked up, you can send an email to chrisarnson at gmail .com.
39:02: chrisarnson at gmail .com. Give us your first name at least, city and state and country of residence, and you may remain anonymous if the question is personal and private.
39:10: Before we go to Anthony in Houston, Georgia, I'd like you to go into the background of this book and what were the compelling factors that led you to write it.
39:34: I'm wondering if it had anything to do with the illness of your precious late wife,
39:40: Christine. Well, a major part of the reason for the book is that back in 2022, my wife was fine, and she all of a sudden began to experience leg issues that began to get worse and worse, and went to doctors.
40:08: And no one could figure out what was going on. This went on for about eight or nine months.
40:17: After 14 MRIs, two neurologists, two neurosurgeons, no one could ever figure out, we don't know why you're having difficulty walking.
40:30: She'll end up in a wheelchair, tried rehab, and then in October of 2023, we were praying, and simultaneously,
40:53: I mean, just to mention, with her illness, I began to experience, for many years, the work that I've been engaged in,
41:02: I've often had to do supplement, like tent making, but not tents like Paul, but painting houses.
41:11: And that has been a major part of my income for my family for many years.
41:18: Well, all of a sudden, I went from the best year ever in 35 years to a seven -month lull, which
41:28: I cannot explain. I did nothing different. So here my wife ends up in a wheelchair.
41:35: I'm experiencing a real downturn of my painting business, and then simultaneous with that, and I don't need to go into the detail, some ministerial issues that basically broke my heart.
41:50: And so all of this was coming at the same time, and my wife and I, we felt like Job, but as nothing of the magnitude, of course, of Job, but it was one successive affliction upon another.
42:05: And then in January of this past year, 2024, she was diagnosed with cervical cancer, and everything we tried to do, we had some alternative ways to try to deal with that.
42:17: It was very aggressive, and then the Lord took her the day before my birthday, my 73rd birthday, the day after Mother's Day, and took her to glory.
42:30: And Chris, the Lord was very gracious to us, and my wife has always been a great godly woman, greatly instrumental in my ministry.
42:46: She's the one that learned to typeset professional back in the early 2000s.
42:53: She's the one that typeset all my books. She's the one that created all my websites for triumphant publications and the
43:02: Good News Bible series that we have going. And she was the one that figured out how to take these free
43:10: Bible courses online to the world. So she did all of that, and back in October, before she was diagnosed with cancer, and we always have devotions, and one day
43:27: I said to her, I said, My dear, one of the precious verses in all of Scripture is
43:34: Romans 8, 28. All things work together for good to those who love God and are called according to His purpose.
43:41: I said, My dear, I wish I could tell you what the good is going to come from all this, but I can't because I don't know.
43:51: But I will tell you this, there is a great good coming because God has promised it, and that's all we need to know.
44:00: And she had this big smile on her face and nodded in agreement. Chris, anybody?
44:07: Yeah, she was—it bothered her of all these afflictions, but she never complained spiritually, okay?
44:19: Anybody that came to visit us, and the pastor of our church, he was a wonderful pastor, Chris Strevel, may have been on your program before, but he said,
44:29: If you go see Christine Otis, you're always going to find a smiling face. And that was true.
44:37: Godly women that came over to visit her, one elder's wife says, We didn't know what—after she was diagnosed with cancer, we didn't know what condition we were going to find her in, if she was going to be upset.
44:50: He said, That's not what we saw. We saw a great woman of faith who trusted in the
44:55: Lord. And so after the
45:02: Lord took her, I thought, I didn't complain either.
45:08: I understood. And one of the things about afflictions, Chris, is that it's not a matter of if they're going to come, it's just when they're going to come.
45:21: And we're all going to experience something, just as you've experienced with your brother and your sister and others.
45:30: And with this, we've got to recognize that God is the ultimate source.
45:36: If we really understand the sovereignty of God, then He's brought these things.
45:42: He's brought them into our lives for a purpose. And so there's a great passage, which is the thesis of my book.
45:52: And that passage is in 2 Corinthians 1, verses 3 through 5. It says, Blessed be the
45:58: Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies and the God of all comfort, who comforts us in all of our afflictions so that we will be able to comfort others in all of their afflictions with the comfort by which we have been comforted.
46:18: And so it is on that basis that the Lord saw us through this.
46:24: We gained the victory in the sense that we knew that God was behind all of it.
46:31: It was for His glory. It was for our benefit. It was to build character in us.
46:40: And if I ever—I told the pastor one day, I said, if I ever catch myself wanting to complain about something,
46:49: I immediately stop myself and say, hold on, John can't complain, because if I complain, who am
46:58: I really complaining against? A sovereign God, and who am I to complain against my
47:04: Lord? So that puts me back in place real fast. And so in the sense that we know there are a lot of people that go through things like this, and they have a real difficult time handling it.
47:21: And we want to be able to convey in this book how you can have the victory.
47:29: You know— You can have the victory—go ahead. Well, you could finish your thought if you'd like. Well, I gave you the main thesis, and that the victory ultimately is in the subtitle, trusting in God's unfailing promises.
47:46: And when we believe the Word of God at face value, and you look at all the promises that are even associated with affliction, then we come to understand
47:57: God's purpose in it. And when you trust in His promises, you can get through any affliction.
48:06: I mean, any affliction. And that's what we want to convey, those biblical principles.
48:14: I just recently got the book, so I haven't had time to read it. But I'm assuming you did not delve heavily, or perhaps at all, into the heresies of the
48:26: Word of Faith movement. But I think that it is important to bring up, because it is such a rampant heresy, where people are being taught that if your faith is strong enough, you will have the prayers of your heart answered in the way that you want them to be answered, no matter what.
48:52: And if they aren't answered, if you're not healed physically, and if you're not restored financially and enriched financially, it's because you have something lacking within your faith.
49:08: I can even remember when I worked for a Salem media affiliate,
49:16: WMCA, in New York. I was there for 15 years as an account executive.
49:23: And there was a couple, Clinton and Sarah Utterbach, who were
49:28: Word of Faith heretics on the show, on the station. And the aforementioned
49:35: Nigel Stone, that British gentleman who gave me the booklet, George Whitfield's letter to John Wesley on election, he used to call them the
49:44: UtterRots, instead of the UtterBachs. But I can remember
49:51: Sarah Utterbach having the audacity to state that when
49:59: Job, after having all the calamities that God allowed Satan to bring into his life, the loss of not only property, but also the boils, and all these calamities, the loss of children, the loss of everything, and then having his wife curse him.
50:25: Why don't you just curse God and die? When Job said,
50:34: The Lord gave and the Lord has taken away. Blessed be the name of the Lord. Sarah Utterbach said,
50:40: Now that was heresy. And in fact, which is insane, because the
50:52: Scriptures say, And all this Job did not sin. Well, to answer that,
50:59: I do not delve in depth at all with that. But you're correct.
51:05: That mentality is theologically wanting. And we have no guarantee in the
51:13: Scriptures with regard to physical ailments. I've seen some amazing things happen, but there's no guarantee in that way.
51:23: The guarantee that we have is that he will see us through it.
51:29: He will give us the peace that passes all understanding through the afflictions. And that's one of the main purposes of affliction.
51:42: For example, building character is one of the great purposes of God's bringing these afflictions in our life.
51:52: And one of the passages that is central in that is James 1, verses 2 through 4.
52:00: And I've used the New American Standard Bible. And it says,
52:06: Consider it all joy, my brethren, when you encounter various trials, knowing that the testing of your faith produces patience.
52:17: And let patience have its perfect result, that you may be perfect and complete, lacking in nothing.
52:23: And so God will bring these things into our lives for that purpose.
52:31: And yes, Job is a great, great example of someone.
52:37: We know that, as you rightly said, God is the source.
52:43: Even Job understood that. He says, Thine arrows are in me. Job understood that God had brought those.
52:51: He had no idea behind the scenes the interaction between God and Satan. And so he rightly said,
53:00: God has given and has taken away. And all of those afflictions were brought for a purpose in his life.
53:10: And somebody might say, You mean to tell me, no matter what the affliction,
53:16: John, that we are to be joyful in it as a Christian? I go, Absolutely, because that's exactly what the
53:21: Word of God says. Well, how can I be joyful under intense suffering?
53:29: In fact, we've got to pick up at that poignant point. How can we be joyful amidst intense suffering?
53:38: We have to go to our midway break. And if anybody wants to join us, our email address is
53:44: ChrisArnson at gmail .com. ChrisArnson at gmail .com. Don't go away.
53:49: We'll be right back. I'm Dr.
53:57: Joseph Piper, President Emeritus and Professor of Systematic and Applied Theology at Greenville Presbyterian Theological Seminary.
54:05: Every Christian who's serious about the Deformed Faith and the Westminster Standards should have and use the eight -volume commentary on the theology and ethics of the
54:15: Westminster Larger Catechism titled Authentic Christianity by Dr. Joseph Moorcraft.
54:22: It is much more than an exposition of the Larger Catechism. It is a thoroughly researched work that utilizes biblical exegesis as well as historical and systematic theology.
54:33: Dr. Moorcraft is pastor of Heritage Presbyterian Church of Cumming, Georgia, and I urge everyone looking for a biblically faithful church in that area to visit that fine congregation.
54:44: For details on the eight -volume commentary, go to westminstercommentary .com. westminstercommentary .com.
54:53: For details on Heritage Presbyterian Church of Cumming, Georgia, visit heritagepresbyterianchurch .com.
55:02: heritagepresbyterianchurch .com. Please tell Dr. Moorcraft and the saints at Heritage Presbyterian Church of Cumming, Georgia, that Dr.
55:09: Joseph Piper of Greenville Presbyterian Theological Seminary sends you. Hello, my name is
55:16: Anthony Uvinio, and I'm one of the pastors at Hope Reform Baptist Church in Corum, New York, and also the host of the reformrookie .com
55:23: website. I want you to know that if you enjoy listening to the Iron Sharpens Iron radio show like I do, you can now find it on the
55:30: Apple's iTunes app by typing Iron Sharpens Iron radio in the search bar. You no longer have to worry about missing a show or a special guest because you're in your car or still at work.
55:41: Just subscribe on the iTunes app and listen to the Iron Sharpens Iron radio show at any time, day or night.
55:47: Please be sure to also give it a good review and pass it along to anyone who would benefit from the teaching and the many solidly reformed guests that Chris Arnzen has on the show.
55:57: Truth is so hard to come by these days, so don't waste your time with fluff or fake news. Subscribe to the
56:03: Iron Sharpens Iron radio podcast right now. And while you're at it, you can also sign up for the reformrookie .com
56:09: podcast and visit our website and the YouTube page. We are dedicated to teaching Christian theology from a
56:15: Reformed Baptist perspective to beginners in the faith as well as seasoned believers. From Keach's Catechism and the
56:22: Doctrines of Grace to the Olivet Discourse and the Book of Leviticus, the Reform Rookie podcast and YouTube channel is sure to have something to offer everyone seeking biblical truth.
56:32: And finally, if you're looking to worship in a Reformed church that holds to the 1689 London Baptist Confession of Faith, please join us at Hope Reformed Baptist Church in Coram, New York.
56:42: Again, I'm Pastor Anthony Invinio, and thanks for listening. They use the belief in the credibility of Scripture as the written
57:23: Word of God. They go to various churches, schools, and institutions to publicly display a rare collection of biblical texts, along with a fascinating presentation by Mr.
57:34: Butterfuco demonstrating the reliability of Scripture. To advance the cause of the gospel, they created a beautiful, perfect facsimile of the genealogy of Jesus Christ from the original engravings contained in a
57:49: First Edition 1611 King James Bible. This 17th century hand -engraved chart shows the family tree of Jesus Christ going back to Adam and Eve.
58:01: This book is complete with gorgeous full -size illustrations of Noah's Ark and the
58:08: Tower of Babel, and an explanation of why the genealogy of Jesus is so important for his claims to the throne of the universe.
58:17: Originals of this work are in museums, and nobody has ever made it accessible to the public in a large book form before.
58:25: You can have your own copy of this 44 -page genealogy book for a donation of $35 or more.
58:33: Visit historicalbiblesociety .org. That's historicalbiblesociety .org.
58:40: Thanks for helping to keep Iron Sharpen's Iron Radio on the air. I'm Simon O'Mahony, pastor of Trinity Reformed Baptist Church in Carlisle, Pennsylvania.
58:55: Originally from Cork, Ireland, the Lord in his sovereign providence has called me to shepherd this new and growing congregation here in Cumberland County.
59:04: At TRBC, we joyfully uphold the Second London Baptist Confession, we embrace congregational church government, and we are committed to preaching the full counsel of God's Word for the edification of believers, the salvation of the lost, and the glory of our
59:19: Triune God. We are also devoted to living out the one another commands of scripture, loving, encouraging, and serving each other as the body of Christ.
59:28: In our worship, we sing psalms and the great hymns of the faith, and we gather around the Lord's table every
59:33: Sunday. We would love for you to visit and worship with us. You can find our details at trbccarlisle .org.
59:42: That's trbccarlisle .org. God willing, we'll see you soon.
59:52: This is
01:00:00: Pastor Bill Souser, Grace Church at Franklin, here in the beautiful state of Tennessee.
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01:00:27: Lord Jesus Christ. And, of course, the end for which we strive is the glory of God.
01:00:34: If you live near Franklin, Tennessee, and Franklin is just south of Nashville, maybe 10 minutes, or you are visiting this area, or you have friends and loved ones nearby, we hope you will join us some
01:00:47: Lord's Day in worshiping our God and Savior. Please feel free to contact me if you have more questions about Grace Church at Franklin.
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01:01:05: This is Pastor Bill Souser wishing you all the richest blessings of our
01:01:10: Sovereign Lord, God, Savior, and King Jesus Christ, today and always.
01:01:20: When Iron Sharpens Iron Radio first launched in 2005, the publishers of the
01:01:34: New American Standard Bible were among my very first sponsors. It gives me joy knowing that many scholars and pastors in the
01:01:42: Iron Sharpens Iron Radio audience have been sticking with or switching to the
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01:01:58: And the NASB is my Bible of choice. I'm Pastor Chuck White of the
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01:03:37: We teach families to worship together as families. Puritan is committed to teaching the whole counsel of God so that the earth will be filled with the knowledge of God as the waters cover the sea.
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01:04:34: I hold the Iron Sharpens Iron Radio program hosted by my longtime friend and brother,
01:04:41: Chris Arnzen, in the highest esteem. And I'm thrilled that you're listening today. I'm also delighted that Iron Sharpens Iron is partnering with one of my favorite resources for Reformed Christian literature for decades now,
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01:05:57: Oh, and make sure that you tell them you heard about them on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio. Welcome back.
01:06:07: Before I return to John M. Otis and our discussion on his book,
01:06:13: When Heaven Seems Silent, Trusting in God's Unfailing Promises, I have some important reminders for my listeners.
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01:08:38: click Support, then click Click to Donate Now. Last but not least, if you're not a member of a
01:08:45: Christ -honoring, biblically faithful, theologically sound, doctrinally solid church, no matter where in the world you live,
01:08:53: I may have some recommendations for you near you. And I have helped many people all over the planet
01:09:00: Earth find churches that are sound, sometimes even within just a two -minute drive from where they live.
01:09:09: So I may be able to help you too, no matter where on the planet Earth you live. Send me an email to chrisarnson at gmail .com
01:09:16: and put, I need a church in the subject line. That's also the email address where you can submit your question to John Otis about his book,
01:09:26: When Heaven Seems Silent, Trusting in God's Unfailing Promises. It's chrisarnson at gmail .com,
01:09:34: gives his first name at least, city and state, and country of residence. And before we go to Anthony and Huston George's question,
01:09:42: I wanted you to wrap up what you were saying before the break. Yes, Chris, I was talking about that central passage in James, where it talks about that we are to consider it all joy, my brethren, when you encounter various trials, knowing that the testing of your faith produces patience and let patience have its perfect result, that you may be perfect and complete, lacking in nothing.
01:10:12: So what we see in this text is that we are commanded to be joyful when we encounter afflictions.
01:10:20: And that word there, consider, in the Greek language is what we call a present imperative.
01:10:26: In other words, it is a command. And being a present tense means we are to always, we are commanded by God to continually be joyful in the midst of afflictions.
01:10:41: Now, with regard to what joy is there, fundamentally,
01:10:49: Christian joy is abiding in the Lord Jesus in the power of the indwelling
01:10:54: Holy Spirit. And biblical joy is a contentment with our present circumstances and a peace that all is well.
01:11:03: And so the joyful person focuses upon who Jesus is, what
01:11:08: He has done and what He is doing for us. And biblical joy is rooted in the faith in God's precious promises.
01:11:18: And so that Christian hope creates joy in our lives.
01:11:26: So we may not, it may be hard for us to understand.
01:11:33: You mean to tell me that we're, no matter what I'm experiencing. Well, that's what the Word of God says.
01:11:39: And when we understand what its purpose, notice it produces patience.
01:11:46: Well, the first thing it does, Chris, it drives you to your knees to pray. I don't think anybody's ever had any afflictions.
01:11:52: What does it do? It causes them to pray more. Well, that's what God wants. He wants us to seek
01:11:57: His face. And then when we seek His face, then we understand, well,
01:12:04: His purpose is that we might be perfect. Well, that word perfect can be misleading. It doesn't mean that we're without sin.
01:12:10: The word perfect oftentimes is used in the Scripture. It means it's the word teleos. It means it's reached its goal.
01:12:19: So that God's afflictions and the joyfulness accepting that, what that does, we recognize that that is building character.
01:12:32: And what God wants is us to grow into the image of Christ.
01:12:40: And so if we're a serious Christian, we should want to glorify the
01:12:47: Lord Jesus Christ. We should want to be sanctified as much as possible by the power of the
01:12:53: Holy Spirit. And God will send those trials for that purpose.
01:12:58: I refer to it in the book in several places, that God is the master sculptor.
01:13:06: And through trials, He's chiseling away at us, taking away that part that needs to be repented of, an attitude where we're not exercising the faith that we ought to have, and that He's chipping away till He gets that masterpiece.
01:13:21: And what is that masterpiece? But growing into the image of Christ. Hallelujah.
01:13:29: Okay, we have a very long question, series of questions is a better way of putting it.
01:13:36: Questions and comments by our longtime faithful listener,
01:13:43: Anthony in Houston, Georgia, who's been listening since we first launched this program in 2005.
01:13:50: He's submitted many questions over the years. And I say that as a preface, because I don't want to encourage other listeners to write in very lengthy questions like this.
01:14:05: But I trust Anthony, since I know him very well, having been given the pleasure of his loyal listenership and friendship over the years, that I know that he's going to be submitting something very vital to introduce into the subject matter we are discussing.
01:14:26: Okay, and I'm going to have to break this up, obviously, in segments, because it's too long for you to answer all at once.
01:14:35: And you do have a printed copy in front of you, because I emailed it to you. Really?
01:14:40: Would you say that it would be proper to include the certainty of the gospel of the kingdom going worldwide, that when we make a gospel presentation such as that which you will be doing at the
01:14:56: University of Georgia campus, that we hold out the promises for everyone believing?
01:15:03: And I'm going to stop there, and you can respond, and then I'll move on when you finish. Right. I think his question more goes into my ministry at UGA rather than the book.
01:15:17: Well, he follows right on the tail of that with bringing in the book. Right. Well, how
01:15:25: I would respond to that is this, that when we make a gospel presentation, he says, that you'll be doing, that we hold out the promises for everyone believing.
01:15:35: I'll try to be succinct in that part, and just say John 3, 36. Everyone who believes in the
01:15:43: Son has eternal life. Everyone who does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides upon him.
01:15:54: That when a person repents of their sins, you got to repent. I mean, you got to confess your sins, but repentance is more than simply acknowledging it.
01:16:03: It is a serious determination to turn away from that sin. So we have to repent, and then we have to embrace the promise held out that you'll have eternal life.
01:16:15: You believe in him. John 10, 9 and 10 says, everyone who confesses that Jesus is
01:16:23: Christ and believes that God has raised him from the dead shall be saved.
01:16:29: And so the promise held out for belief is that we will have eternal life.
01:16:37: We got to obey that offer of the gospel to us. So that's how
01:16:42: I respond to the first part of that, Chris. Okay, we move on to where he picks up from there.
01:16:52: Let's see. That the heavens are not silent, but in fact
01:17:00: God has ordained whatsoever comes to pass, in light of that truth, that those who are savingly and effectually called are indeed called for such a time as this.
01:17:12: They need to be discipled and help local churches engage in standing for truth and regaining a voice here and now, as indicated in Hebrews 12, 25, 28 through 29.
01:17:27: Do you care to comment on any of that before I move on? Well, I think one thing when he says the heavens are not silent, the main emphasis when
01:17:36: I said that the heavens are not silent is there's the tendency. I first came across that many years ago when
01:17:44: I was a college student. I read a book, and the only thing I remember out of that great book by Dr. Martin Lloyd -Jones called
01:17:50: Spiritual Depression, Its Causes and Cures. It wasn't because I was depressed at the time.
01:17:56: I was getting... Are you still there, John? John, are you still there?
01:18:09: John, you're breaking up for some reason. You may have to repeat everything you just said. Hello, John.
01:18:17: Are you there? Well, we've lost
01:18:24: John, so I'm going to...
01:18:29: Are you there, John? I am here. Okay. Repeat everything you said because we lost you.
01:18:39: Okay. He mentioned that heavens are not silent. He mentioned heavens are not silent.
01:18:50: I wrote a book called Its Causes and Cures, and trials coming into our life are like the clouds that upset the sun, and we thought there that He has forsaken us, when in reality, no, the one who's called us,
01:19:13: He's there, and He loves us. Tribulation are obscuring.
01:19:21: And so by that, I think you're the one who wrote that, a little bit different take on that.
01:19:33: So the authority person believes in the Lord Jesus, they need to be savingly and affectionately called.
01:19:44: John, can I ask you a question? Are you doing anything different? Are you doing anything different?
01:19:51: No, I'm not. And is your phone dying? Is there a phone call coming in?
01:19:57: You keep breaking up. No. All right. Well, just pick up... No, there isn't. Okay.
01:20:02: Just pick up where you left off. Sorry. Well, yes, you keep breaking up.
01:20:18: Hello, John. I don't know why I'm breaking up. Should I reenter?
01:20:24: Yeah, rejoin the discussion. I'm going to go to our final break early, and when you rejoin, we'll have an uninterrupted discussion until the end of the program.
01:20:39: It may be interrupted by technical problems, but we won't air any ads after that. So you could log out, log back in.
01:20:48: Let's see if it improves anything. All right, folks. As I said, we're going into our break early, and don't go away.
01:20:58: We'll be right back. Armored Republic exists to equip free men with tools of liberty to defend
01:21:04: God -given rights against the twin threats of tyranny and chaos. If you own a rifle to resist tyrants and criminals, then you should own body armor and a med kit for the same reasons.
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01:21:52: Arm yourself with tools of liberty at armoredrepublic .com. It's such a blessing to hear from Iron Sharpens Iron radio listeners from all over the world.
01:22:14: Here's Joe Riley, a listener in Ireland, who wants you to know about a guest on the show he really loves hearing interviewed,
01:22:22: Dr. Joe Moorcraft. I'm Joe Riley, a faithful Iron Sharpens Iron radio listener here in Atai in County Kildare, Ireland.
01:22:30: Going back to 2005, one of my very favorite guests on Iron Sharpens Iron is
01:22:36: Dr. Joe Moorcraft. If you've been blessed by Iron Sharpens Iron radio, Dr. Moorcraft and Heritage Presbyterian Church of Plumbing, Georgia, are largely to thank since they are one of the program's largest financial supporters.
01:22:48: Heritage Presbyterian Church of Plumbing is in Forsyth County, a part of the Atlanta metropolitan area.
01:22:55: Heritage is a thoroughly biblical church, unwaveringly committed to Westminster standards, and Dr.
01:23:00: Joe Moorcraft is the author of an eight -volume commentary on the larger catechism. Heritage is a member of the
01:23:05: Hanover Presbytery, built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief cornerstone, and tracing its roots and heritage back to the great
01:23:15: Protestant Reformation of the 16th century. Heritage maintains and follows the biblical truth and principles proclaimed by the reformers, scripture alone, grace alone, faith alone,
01:23:26: Christ alone, and God's glory alone. Their primary goal is the worship of the triune God that continues in eternity.
01:23:32: For more details on Heritage Presbyterian Church of Plumbing, Georgia, visit heritagepresbyterianchurch .com.
01:23:39: That's heritagepresbyterianchurch .com. Or call 678 -954 -7831.
01:23:45: That's 678 -954 -7831. If you visit, tell them
01:23:51: Joe Roiligan, Iron Sharpens Iron radio listener, from Ottawa in County Kildare, Ireland, sends you.
01:24:07: I'm Dr. Tony Costa, Professor of Apologetics and Islam at Toronto Baptist Seminary.
01:24:13: I'm thrilled to introduce to you a church where I've been invited to speak and have grown to love,
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01:24:26: It's such a joy to witness and experience fellowship with people of God like the dear saints at Hope Reform Baptist Church in Coram, who have an intensely passionate desire to continue digging deeper and deeper into the unfathomable riches of Christ in His Holy Word, and to enthusiastically proclaim
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01:24:50: I hope you also have the privilege of discovering this precious congregation and receive the blessing of being showered by their love, as I have.
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01:28:57: Welcome back. Also, folks, please never forget that this program is paid for in part by the law firm of Buttafuoco &
01:29:04: Associates. If you are the victim of a very serious personal injury or medical malpractice anywhere in the
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01:29:30: Buttafuoco & Associates, from Chris Arnzen of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio. We're now back with John Otis.
01:29:38: John, can you hear me? Yes, I've been hearing everything.
01:29:44: How about now? Oh, you sound crystal clear now. If you could, just in summary form, you have
01:29:49: Anthony from Houston, Georgia's questions and comments.
01:29:56: Just summarize a response to him so we can move on right now. Well, like I said, what he was taking, it seemed silent.
01:30:07: It was a little different than what I intended in the book. So I mentioned to him that we offer the gospel and the promises are held out.
01:30:17: That's how I would respond, and I think we probably ought to move on. Okay. Well, thank you,
01:30:22: Anthony, and you have won, by virtue of submitting a question, a free copy of When Heaven Seems Silent by our guest,
01:30:33: John Otis. I almost said the wrong name there.
01:30:39: There is a listener in Findlay, Ohio, named Cindy, who has become priceless to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.
01:30:48: She has become such a loyal and faithful encourager and supporter of this broadcast.
01:30:57: And I just thank God for her. She has become a precious and dear friend of mine as well.
01:31:04: And I just can't say enough about her faithfulness to doing everything that she can do to make sure that this program is heard and appreciated by as many people as possible.
01:31:18: Thank you again. But she submitted something that I think perfectly reflects the conversation today from the
01:31:29: Johann Sebastian Bach page on Facebook. And it says, this is an article on that Facebook page.
01:31:38: Did you know Johann Sebastian Bach lost his little daughter and then three sons and then his wife?
01:31:48: Then he remarried, and then he and his second wife,
01:31:54: Anna Magdalena, lost four more daughters and three sons, 11 beloved children.
01:32:02: Many researchers have wondered how Bach managed to handle these losses.
01:32:08: How did he not stop breathing? How did his heart not stop?
01:32:14: And most importantly, how could he continue to write music? Cantatas, cellos, suites, masses, concerts, the most beautiful music in the world, the most beautiful music the world has heard.
01:32:31: Do you know how he did it? At the end of his music, he always wrote,
01:32:39: Soli Deo Gloria, glory to God alone.
01:32:44: And in the beginning, Lord help. Therefore, you can pray during Bach's music because the music itself is a prayer.
01:32:54: You could then consider Bach's music a conversation between man and God. How do you deal with pain?
01:33:01: Worship is the best solace. And that was written by Carl Bastian on the
01:33:07: Johann Sebastian Bach Facebook page. And by the way, for those of you who don't know, Bach was a faithful Lutheran Christian.
01:33:15: Any comments on that? I thought that was a perfect addition to our discussion. Bach understood that God was the source.
01:33:27: And when our Lord chooses to take something precious like that, then he understood that he has a right to do it.
01:33:36: Just like Job said, the Lord has given and the Lord can take away. In my book,
01:33:43: I got this little quote. John Calvin lost his dear wife.
01:33:49: And it's a short statement. It's a wonderful testimony that I have in the book of the last days on the deathbed of Adelette, his wife.
01:34:01: Calvin said this. May the Lord Jesus Christ support me also under this heavy affliction, which would certainly overcome me, had not he who raises up the prostrate, strengthens the weak, and refreshes the weary, dredge forth his hand from heaven to me.
01:34:23: And he wrote, Thou, O Lord, that bruises me, it is enough for me to know it is thy hand.
01:34:33: Hallelujah. What's that? I said hallelujah. That's right.
01:34:39: They understood that God has a right to take it, and they accepted that.
01:34:47: And, you know, another. Are you familiar with the hymn, All Holy Jesus? I might.
01:34:53: If I heard it, I don't know. I don't recognize it by the title. It is one of my favorite hymns of all time.
01:35:02: We'll go into the Johann. I forget who the author is.
01:35:09: His testimony, he went through much affliction. And through all the affliction, that great hymn came out of all the afflictions.
01:35:23: Physical affliction, lost all his children, lost his wife, all of this.
01:35:30: And he sits down and writes this magnificent hymn. You got to look it up.
01:35:36: You can do it online. And if you put in All Holy Jesus, there's a video of a man telling the story, and then he has a beautiful voice.
01:35:49: And the whole hymn reflects our attitude towards affliction. Yes. And let's not forget about that other hymn writer.
01:36:02: I believe it was William Kalper, wasn't it, who lost his children in a shipwreck?
01:36:11: Was that William Kalper? Yes. I don't know if it was Kalper. Yeah, that's another wonderful story.
01:36:21: The hymn is When Peace Like a River, I think, flows.
01:36:28: His wife and daughters were traveling to England, and a storm came up, and the children were washed overboard, and she gets there and says,
01:36:39: Only I survived. Horatio Spafford, I'm sorry, not William Kalper. Yes, that's right,
01:36:44: Spafford. So when he comes, they knew where the storm, where the ship had the problem where people lost their lives.
01:36:54: And he had the captain, when you come to the spot where it happened, please wake me up.
01:37:00: The captain says, Sir, we're at the spot. And he writes that magnificent hymn in remembering that great loss.
01:37:14: And he had other losses, too. So we have these wonderful testimonies of men who walked with the
01:37:22: Lord, and like Job, they understood that God had his purposes.
01:37:30: And you see, that's the key. You know, just the other day, the
01:37:36: Lord was impressing upon me a passage in Psalm 37, in verse 7.
01:37:42: And the first part of the verse says, it talks about rest in him, wait patiently for him.
01:37:57: See, one of the things that happens when God brings us afflictions is that we may wonder, what does he have in mind?
01:38:06: What is he doing? And this is where the promises of God. Chapter 4 in my book,
01:38:15: I believe, was one of the most crucial parts of the entire book. And I set forth examples of those who live by faith and those who didn't.
01:38:29: And I have a saying that I have preached for many years, Chris, and I've told people when
01:38:36: I've preached on this, if this is the only thing that you remember, the sermon, then it's worth it.
01:38:42: I said, where there is faith, there is no fear. The Bible portrays faith as courage.
01:38:55: The world has a misunderstanding that says, well, men that go into battle, they're afraid about dying, but they do it nonetheless.
01:39:02: That's not how the Bible presents it. That's not how the Old Testament nor how the New Testament or Jesus.
01:39:10: And so, and I've got some personal stories in the book of how
01:39:16: God taught me, where there is faith, there is no fear.
01:39:22: You know, in the Bible commands us in Philippians 4, 6, and 7, it says, do not be anxious for anything, but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving, let your requests be made known to God, and the peace of God, which passes all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds in Christ Jesus.
01:39:45: And then another great passage is in 1 Peter 5, it talks about where to humble yourself under the mighty hand of God that he may exalt you in due time, casting all your cares or all your anxieties upon him for he cares for you.
01:40:08: I got a personal testimony of how, when we're going through things, and in trials, one of the things that trials does, it causes us to be anxious.
01:40:19: It causes us to worry, causes us to be fearful. And when we understand the promises of God, we don't have to be fearful.
01:40:28: And one time I was in the process of losing a house, and I couldn't stop that foreclosure.
01:40:35: And even though God had taught me years before that wonderful truth about faith, and I remember one night that passage
01:40:43: God brought to my mind, and I said, Jesus, I am tired of carrying around this bag of worries.
01:40:51: And I'm now, like you said, you said, cast it to me because I care for you.
01:40:56: I said, Jesus, I'm just giving you the whole works. I'm giving you the whole bag of worries.
01:41:02: And I said, I'm not going to worry about it anymore. It's in your court. And you know what happened?
01:41:08: The peace of God came over me. Did I still lose the house? Yes. But in losing that house,
01:41:16: God opened the door for me to end up going to Texas for a mission work.
01:41:23: God had his greater purposes. But I was able to go through that severe trial and have the peace that passes all understanding.
01:41:33: And the key is trusting in all his promises. So anybody that gets a free copy of the book or anybody that orders the book, chapter 3 deals with the purpose of afflictions, but chapter 4 deals with trusting in his unfailing promises.
01:41:52: And let me say this. You know, Abraham is considered the father of faith.
01:41:58: And there's a good reason why he said that. Romans 4, verses 18 through 23 mentions this.
01:42:08: It says, In hope against hope, he believed that God, that he would be the father of many nations.
01:42:16: And as it was said, so shall your seed be. And without becoming weak in faith, he contemplated in his own body, as good as dead, seeing that he was 100 years old, and the barrenness of his wife
01:42:32: Sarah, he did not waver in unbelief with respect to the promises of God, but gave glory to God, and being fully assured of what he had promised, he was able also to perform.
01:42:49: And we know the story there, Chris, is that when he was nearly 100 years old, and God says,
01:43:00: I'm going to make you an heir. When he tried to take it in his own hands with Hagar, that didn't work out well.
01:43:06: But he says, no, from your own loins it's going to come, Abraham. And he says, I want you to go outside and take a look at the stars,
01:43:13: Abraham. And in the desert, I understand that the sky is just unbelievable.
01:43:19: He says, your seed is going to be as numerous as these stars.
01:43:26: Now, nothing has happened yet. And it says he believed God, and it was credited to him for righteousness.
01:43:33: And Paul picks up on that in Romans 4. So he did not question the promise of God.
01:43:40: And you see, faith, the greatness of faith is seen in Hebrews 11.
01:43:47: This is a great definition of faith. Faith is the assurance of things hoped for, and the conviction of things not seen.
01:44:02: And you see, I don't have to see it. And I make a big point in my book.
01:44:08: All that faith needs is a divine promise.
01:44:14: That's all it needs. And so to all my listeners, whatever you're going through, and I mean whatever it is, you can get through it.
01:44:25: If you go and you look at all these precious promises and you accept it, it says,
01:44:31: I believe it. I believe it. And so when God makes that promise, you can count on it.
01:44:40: Hallelujah, again. We do have Bobby in Hartsdale, New York, who has a question.
01:44:48: Oh, by the way, I forgot to tell Cynthia that you, of course, have also won when heaven seems silent, trusting in God's unfailing promises.
01:45:00: And by the way, this is for both Anthony in Houston, Georgia, and for Cynthia.
01:45:08: Keep an eye out for a package from Cumberland Valley Bible Book Service, CVBBS .com.
01:45:15: They are the ones shipping the book out to you at no charge to us or to you.
01:45:23: Bobby in Hartsdale, New York, says,
01:45:28: I agree 100 % with every single word you're saying, but when it comes to ministering to those in pain, must we not be very careful not to sound like Job's comforters who often spoke the truth to him, but did so in a heartless way, even if that was not their intention?
01:45:52: We can tell people to rejoice and to be of good cheer in the midst of their tragedy and throw
01:46:02: Bible verses at them like placards, but this is not the way we deliver the truth of God's promises to those in pain, is it?
01:46:13: Yeah, when people are going through, let's say they've lost someone like I did.
01:46:22: My wife, we were married 46 years. And so when you lose someone like that, and having been in the pastoral ministry for many years, oftentimes at first, you go there, you put your arm around them,
01:46:40: I love you, and you sit and listen to them and maybe come back and you let them open up and see how they're answering questions.
01:46:50: I don't go in there busting with all of these Bible verses as such.
01:46:57: And you didn't have to be sensitive of their loss.
01:47:04: The last part of that question, I was trying to think, there was something else I wanted to say. What was the last thing his question was?
01:47:11: That we're not supposed to deliver to people that are in pain the truth of God's promises in a flippant way, he was basically saying, in a heartless way, where in reality, instead of comforting people, we're rebuking them.
01:47:29: Like, cheer up! Well, I know what I remember about Job.
01:47:35: Here's the problem with Job. The problem with the three counselors.
01:47:43: It is interesting in the Scriptures that when his three friends came from a distance, they saw him in all these boils and everything.
01:47:54: And it says they threw up dust on them and wept. And it says they went and sat with Job in the ashes for seven days, saying nothing.
01:48:10: But when they did speak, here's where the problem came in. And yes, they had a lot of things that they say about God is true.
01:48:21: The great problem with those men was that they assumed that if you're suffering, you had to have done something sinful.
01:48:33: And if you read the entire book, you're going to see them just saying, just repent,
01:48:42: Job. And they would say something true about God, but they were tired of him.
01:48:49: And Job knew he didn't do anything. God said, he says, he is holding fast his integrity.
01:48:56: He is not sinning with his mouth. And the problem they ended up with Job is that his counselor, his friends made everything worse because they made the false theological assumption.
01:49:13: And this is what we have to avoid. And if someone is sinning, I mean, if someone is enduring severe affliction, that they must have done something.
01:49:24: Well, maybe so, but most of the time it isn't. And the theology that says, oh, you're experiencing these afflictions because of God's judgment.
01:49:37: And it got to the point Job couldn't stand it anymore. He says, you guys are worthless. And Job said, he knew he was a man of integrity.
01:49:51: He says, I want to argue my case with God. And what bothered Job the most was the fact of God seemingly silent.
01:50:00: He didn't understand what Job's problem was. He didn't understand why he had to suffer because he was a righteous man.
01:50:09: And he says, when God before me, and I'll argue my case with him.
01:50:15: And so I love it in chapters 38 through 40. God says, so you want to talk to me,
01:50:24: Job? So he shows up in a whirlwind. And God says, who is this before me that speaks into the wind?
01:50:35: And for four chapters, he just berates Job over his sovereignty.
01:50:43: And to the point that Job in the end says, I put my hand over my mouth.
01:50:52: I repent in ashes. And what
01:50:58: God said to the friends of Job, he says, you know what? Job was right.
01:51:04: You were wrong in how you dealt with Job. And Job is going to offer sacrifices in your behalf so that your sin will be atoned for.
01:51:19: And so that was the main problem with Job's friends.
01:51:25: They assumed that he suffered because he was to sin. Okay, we have
01:51:34: Carl in Denton, Texas. And I've been to Denton for a
01:51:40: Bible conference. And also have a very dear pastor friend in Denton, who
01:51:50: I cherish so much. Who ministered to my brother while he was—my oldest brother,
01:51:58: John, when he was on his deathbed. But anyway, we have
01:52:07: Carl in Denton, Texas, who says, you accidentally brought up William Cooper earlier.
01:52:15: And by the way, that's how it's pronounced, not Cowper. Yes, I know that, Carl. I just—that was a slip of the tongue.
01:52:22: And by the way, there was also Ted in Moundville, Alabama, who emailed me saying I mispronounced it.
01:52:28: But he says you brought up that—accidentally brought up William Cowper.
01:52:34: Why don't you have John tell the story of William Cooper, who attempted suicide and was rescued from that act by God and went on to write glorious hymns.
01:52:50: Do you know the full story there about William Cooper? No, I don't. So I'm not in a position to help him out there.
01:52:57: I'll have to look that up. I just remember that William Cooper had a buggy driver take him to the
01:53:12: River Thames to—and he didn't tell the buggy driver this, but his intention was to drown himself.
01:53:23: And that night, a heavy, heavy fog descended from the sky all around where the buggy driver had been riding to the
01:53:38: Thames. And he had to stop the buggy after a while because he couldn't see where he was going.
01:53:46: And they waited for the fog to lift. And when the fog lifted, the buggy was right in front of Cooper's house.
01:53:59: So William Cooper, you know, attributed this obviously to God as a divine act of rescuing him.
01:54:13: Was he a believer at the time or no? Well, he was certainly a professing believer, and I believe he was a believer.
01:54:25: But I just remember that very fondly, being somebody who battles depression, although I've never, thankfully, contemplated suicide.
01:54:37: It's good to know that God has even mightily used someone like Cooper to write glorious hymns of the faith, even though he had contemplated and attempted such a dastardly act.
01:54:54: And remember, folks, we can never romanticize suicide. It is an act of murder.
01:55:01: It's self -murder. But it is still a vile and selfish act.
01:55:10: But, by the way, he also wrote the hymn, God Moves in a Mysterious Way.
01:55:16: It's one of his most famous hymns. And Carl, please give us your mailing address in Denton, Texas, where CVBBS .com,
01:55:31: Cumberland Valley Bible Book Service, can mail to you a copy of John Otis' book,
01:55:40: When Heaven Seems Silent. And that's no expense to you or to Iron Sherpa and Zion Radio.
01:55:53: And, by the way, the pastor in Denton, Texas, Carl, in case you don't have a biblically faithful church home, is
01:56:00: Mack Tomlinson. He's my friend, a minister to my brother, and he is pastor of Providence Chapel in Denton, Texas.
01:56:09: Well, if you could, John, summarize what you most want etched in the hearts and minds of our listeners today before we go off the air.
01:56:19: All right. Just understand that God is the source of all afflictions, and he brings that into our lives for the purpose of drawing us closer to him to build
01:56:40: Christian character. And when we go through these trials, and when we are trusting in his glorious promises, and we come through it, we can learn to endure, and we can actually have joy.
01:56:59: The joy is, well, I can't be happy during this thing. Well, the happiness or the joy is the realization that God is making me into the image of Christ.
01:57:13: That is what we should all, as Christians, that is what we should all want is to be like Jesus.
01:57:21: And one of the, you know, Job said this, when he had tested me, I shall come forth as gold.
01:57:29: And so when God puts you through some serious afflictions, and when you're trusting those wonderful promises, and he gets them through, it's magnificent.
01:57:43: Let me just close with one passage in James 1 .12.
01:57:50: It says, And blessed is the man who perseveres under trial, and once approved, he shall receive the crown of life that God has promised to all those who love him.
01:58:08: Hallelujah. That's how I'd like to conclude it, Chris. Well, I know that When Heaven Seems Silent by John Otis is available on Amazon.
01:58:19: Do you care to give any other contact information where people can order the book and also where they can find out more about Triumphant Ministries, your open -air evangelism ministry?
01:58:31: I can't say where you can find out about the ministry that I'm launching.
01:58:38: To get the book, to go to Amazon, and you can get the paperback there, and there's a
01:58:48: Kindle version. I will say this. Let me just say this by passing. If anybody wants a free electronic version of the book,
01:59:00: I will give that to you free. All you have to do is email me and say, Pastor Otis, I want the electronic copy of your book.
01:59:12: And I'll be glad to send out the electronic format to anybody that emails me.
01:59:19: Want me to give the email address? Of course, of course. jmotis51 at gmail .com.
01:59:38: Okay, well, thanks to you so much, John, for being such a delightful guest as you always are.
01:59:43: And I want you all to always remember for the rest of your lives that Jesus Christ is a far greater