Theology Quiz (Part 3)

Welcome to no compromise radio kind of intro is that that's my line.

My name is Mike Cavendroth How are you? My name is Steve Cooley. I'm the Tuesday guy sometimes known as the

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Which Spencer can you work on that for us the pressure? I don't need that pressure. Today is part three

Preaching discipleship theology quiz on the Atonement. I gave to some layman here in my preaching class a little

Please define Preaching discipleship quiz and I just wanted to see where they were at theologically so I could help them

Yeah, and don't use the word in your definition I mean that's gonna be in the instructions next year right right up at the top of the page

Do not use the word you are defining in your definition Do you think young people even have tests anymore that aren't do they even go to school?

I don't know But seriously this kind of stuff you have to correct because they write it in and I have to actually read it

If I just do a multiple -choice Or true -false I can do it all in the computer.

I never have to lift a finger to grade I never have to think Oh what student needs my help what students excelling

I just click I think that's one of the reasons they don't do this anymore See, I won't do that in my Trinity class because you know,

I don't want to scare people so, you know define the Trinity So in last and these these are all online on YouTube.

Well, we're trying to get a new website up It will be on the website. You don't have to go to YouTube What was like the cool thing that you learned or taught last

Sunday at Bethlehem Bible Church? Simply Trinity Steve Cooley Tuesday guys Sunday school.

I mean something you go Oh, that was cool Because just every time I teach I think oh I can't wait to get to that part of my teaching or my sermon because I'm fired up about it

Man, you know, I should go get my notebook Because I read off the top of my head

You know, you know mostly here's what I well I'll tell you the cool takeaway for me from Sunday was somebody was in the class for the first time on Sunday and they said

I Had no idea. Was that interactive? Right, because what

I mean, we're not in Sunday school. This is lecture. This is listen to Steve lecture mode for you know, 45 minutes and you know,

I Intentionally set up the class so that it's very interactive I use true false quizzes people complain about the questions and you know all that and which is great because the more

Interaction the better but people, you know, how do people learn? Well one way they can learn is by listening to me speak and listen to me, you know elucidated particular topic

But another way they learn is by being able to ask questions Which is usually more effective

Because people ask questions and then people and then I answer and then somebody else will answer and then we'll ask some more you know refining questions so that Everybody kind of gets hold of the topic.

In fact when I've kind of in my mind have My mindset is I don't want to leave any

Saint behind Right. I want them all to be able to Grasp what we're talking about.

I don't I don't want to speak in Or leave it in such lofty terms that nobody can get it. I want everybody to get it.

I Like it. Somebody just sent me some Twitter thing about obesity sinful If you're a

Christian and also obese you must confront and overcome well, yeah, you know we

I Can't even can't even do it. I just remember the guy every time

I hear about that I remember the guy who was like, well, have you ever disciplined anybody out of the church for being obese?

And I don't think people realize what a can of worms that is, you know Do you want to walk around everybody and go?

Hey, and hey tubby way overweight, you know, I Mean there are medical reasons.

Yeah, there could be sinful reasons But I mean, do you really is that really how you want to you know, expend yourself in ministry?

Checking up on everybody's weight putting them on some kind of program or I've talked to people who have been

Too large and they know it and they come in to study right here. They're sad. They cry they want help and But that's different than walking around, you know, like I I'm the inspector dude.

It was probably ten years ago There's this guy showed up had nothing to do with him being bald But he was a bald guy reformed

Baptist and he came for a few weeks Oh, I like it here and I was probably in a law section, you know

Blasting people and he came up to me. He said I talked to you after the service. I said sure, you know

This is what we do and I thought he was gonna say something like I don't know when when's the new membership class?

I could ask that regularly. Could I be baptized? Is there any way I could plug in and learn the Bible more when's your preaching class start?

Thank you for the sermon Something like that. Can I buy you lunch this week? He said there's a lot of fat people at Bethlehem Bible Church I Looked at him like what it would be the equivalent of somebody asking me.

What are my personal pronouns after the church service? And I said, excuse me, and he said yeah a lot of people that are overweight.

I said I said you Something's wrong with this question because you don't know if somebody has diabetes

You don't know if they have a thyroid problem You don't know if they're taking steroids because they're trying to suppress some some kind of cancer

You don't know anything You don't even know if some of the people that are overweight here don't like to be overweight and I've actually been in my office

In tears about their weight and they want help. You don't have any idea Yeah, just just the idea that we're going you know that we're going to confront people because they're

I mean No, just no. I said here's the question you need to ask sir

When I say sir usually in those matters, it doesn't mean I even think they should be called that it's the opposite, right

Do you see any leader here? That would you consider that you would consider obese or their wives obese are the elders or the elders wives obese?

I'm like, what are you talking about? And I just thought man what a home life that guy must live It's back to what it must be back to the

S Lewis Johnson thing If you live under law only or law extra outside of the

Bible and you don't hear a lot about Grace and Christ Jesus and who he is and how he'll never leave nor forsake you you're gonna be crabby

Law people are crabby show me the crabby people. I'll show you people just give me more law

Give me some law. That's all I want is some law Okay, so we've looked at these definitions the last two shows justification

Sanctification redemption Reconciliation propitiation and faith.

I was looking more for the subjective side of faith, but the ones for all deliberate faith That was a good take number seven.

Oh, this is fun. You and I have done this before many times the gospel I Didn't say a gospel.

I didn't say the gospel. Uh -huh the gospel All right We're gonna read what some of these students in my preaching class said and then we'll talk about it a little bit

All right. Let's go to Telling people number tip wait number seven.

Sorry The gospel from the Greek meaning good news It refers primarily to the birth life death resurrection an intercession of Christ done for us that we would be saved

Okay, I mean, you know very Christ centered. Uh -huh. Okay good God sent his son to live a perfect life and die for the sins of all who would believe

He was buried and the father raised him from the dead three days later and he ascended into heaven and is coming again

I like that one. Okay What is the gospel

Which which gospel are you talking about pastor I don't

I Want to be a preacher and I can't define the gospel if this question was what do people have to do to go to hell

And you just leave it blank Nothing empty set. No, I'd be fine

No answer required, right Here's a different one that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures and he was buried and raised on the third day for our justification

Hmm our sins in exchange for his righteousness, hmm Born of a virgin full

God full man Jesus being the promised Messiah lived a perfect life and dies for his people spent three days in the tomb and raised himself from the dead those who repent and believe this will be

Satisfied and raised on the last day. I think he meant Oh justified. Excuse me. I can't read his rights.

That's pretty good Okay is repentance part of the gospel or will we call it a gospel imperative answer?

Yeah repentance So strictly speaking what we're looking for is a description about who

Jesus is the one sent by the Father The one whose benefits are applied by the

Holy Spirit, right? You say the one person the Trinity you think of the three you think of the three you think of the one essence of nature

Strictly speaking the gospel is about Jesus and his person and his work Generally speaking gospel could be a genre

Matthew Mark Luke and John Yeah, generally speaking men like Calvin would call the

Old Testament law and the New Testament gospel And so generally speaking Go make disciples of every nation is in a gospel, right?

It's a command in the gospel. We're talking strictly I did like how I think it was this last one where he said, you know,

Jesus raised himself because I thought oh, yeah good So what's the difference between Jesus raising himself the

Spirit raising him and the Father raising him? What's the difference? The emphasis the particular writer wanted to make you know, because The operations there is no separate

Operation one for all in all for one is this a musketeer operations in there for me. Yeah the Trinity Inseparable operations.

Yeah, I love first Timothy 316 It says vindicated by the Spirit right everything that Jesus said was vindicated the

Spirit raised him The father raised the son in some passages because his work the son's work was done to perfection

Perfectly pleasing the father. He did what he was sent to do. So the father's Amen was to Jesus as it is finished as Lewis Johnson And he raised himself because he said he would and he has the power to do it

John chapter 10. That's awesome See, that's my favorite part of your Trinity class this last Sunday. Okay.

Well, I You know to be fair. I don't think we've gotten there yet. So But we will

I mean it's you know, it is just fun The gospel good news Christ took our place of sin died on the cross

Buried and rose on the third day and lives exclamation point. That's pretty good. Okay. Remember dear listeners the gospel means good news

Yeah, we're not the good news that's why you can't live the gospel you can adorn the gospel Paul says live in light of it

But we're not the good news. But what about when the Bible says obey obey the gospel? Okay, good point

And so what are the works that we're supposed to be doing? The work is to believe and so when you obey the gospel you obey the call to the response of the gospel and that is to believe

What are you gonna do? What's the other option Steve obey the gospel? Okay. Here's the gospel Jesus the

Eternal Son Lives dies buried raised ascended session and return now

You need to obey that obey that Jesus died on the cross some commands. Otherwise, you couldn't know bad No, no, listen obey that Jesus died on the cross

Well, I just think you know the gospel the gospel also has to include righteous living

That's why it says to obey the gospel And that's such good news Steve because when you look at my life behind the scenes and few people have seen me behind the scenes

Like you've seen me behind the scenes. Isn't that good news when you're around me? Don't you just like I walk around here

Mike Epitomizes good. Well, you know, one of the things I do when I preach now is I'm like look the gospel is so transforming

I would invite you each to take a tour of my mind I Mean can you imagine that?

I'm just gonna put you into a little bit of a coma so you can tour my mind. What a nightmare that would be.

Oh It's so sad to think of that was like that old chick track, you know, this is your life, right?

The guy dies unexpectedly and then it's got the date of every one of his sins and everything else.

That's actually true Right if you're gonna die as an unbeliever every one of those sins God will not forget and thankfully as believers

God since he's punished Jesus The language is even he'll remember our sins no more

He won't hold it against the gospel according to chick was you had to go back in a time machine and erase every one of those sins, so Do you know they still hand out chick tracks in Manhattan several times?

I've walked outside down the street and Broadway's on Broadway and there'll be a whole they there will be a whole table of chick tracks

And a little evangelist sitting right there. I give him props for trying to for trying more than I'm doing

I'm on my way to the next Banana pudding shop or something Magnolia's so I don't go to New York.

I'd like to be sponsored by Magnolia's They have that banana bread pudding stuff.

People just line up for and you can get online now if you'd like Okay Let's go to the next one.

I'm having fun with this Steve and and this spot is sponsored by Magnolia's They weren't the company that sent me their free stuff.

They weren't no All right. Number eight. What's the difference between the law and the gospel?

Oh see because in light of the gospel I wanted to get the students to go. Hmm. Maybe I should change my answer on the gospel now that I see the

Following question. Well, the one guy apparently skipped the gospel question and was so stumped by that one that he never went back to it

What Do you think they're gonna say what would be your guess is knowing our group the difference between the law and the gospel

Well, I would hope they'd get it, right You know I think they're gonna get it, right?

Okay, the law points to the sin penalty The gospel points to our cure do and done.

Okay, do and done. I think you could just leave it at that Wow, what a great answer the Gospels do right laws done.

We've done the law. Oh, no. No didn't Moses do the law Went when he threw the tablets against the side of the mountain.

What weren't they done and he threw him away That's when they lost the extra five commandments. Moses said it is finished.

He threw the law down and broke it But isn't it interesting when Israel would say like we've probably said all that you've commanded to do oh we will do it

And in the future we'll do it we'll stand at this mountain we will do it we're gonna be so obedient I mean, it's just like little kids, you know, sorry mom.

I'm never gonna never gonna disobey you again. Oh, right Until like an hour later.

Well, then how can you call yourself a Christian? I mean it this is a sin Steve that you've never gotten over right something.

You're gonna be called a Christian ever if everybody knew I I Mean think about it.

You've struggled with self -righteousness for 30 years 20 some years as a Christian And so I think probably you ought to have overcome that by now kind of like this obesity issue

You have to over have to overcome it and confront it. Mm -hmm well Every time

Steve says well, you know, something's coming Well in truth,

I'm I'm too humble to brag about my victory over self -righteousness, so Okay.

Okay. I had I can I can deal with that Law condemns gospel saves

True. Yeah. Yeah, I mean he probably could have I mean the next question is gonna be about first and third use but the gospel

Is something that does say because we're talking about Jesus when I hear the word gospel Steve I pretty much in my mind every time think of Jesus.

Yeah, me too. It's not some something floating around there It's not although I did like the do -and -done thing, right?

You know, that's the easiest. Yeah, it's a quick quiz This is not taking two hours. You got ten minutes to do it do done

All right, so far so good. The law says do gospel says done like it

The law demands the gospel is that the demands of the law have been met by another on my behalf good, right?

So I would agree with this man strictly speaking the gospel never demands

Right. The law always demands. Okay good What's the difference between first and third use this guy said

I'm not sure but I'd like to learn Do you actually think that you're gonna get credit for that well just maybe

We are Christians after all law is works and provides no hope for the sinner Gospel provides hope in another's work in the sinners place.

Okay All right. Now this young man. He should he should know this for sure The difference between law and gospel refers to imperative versus indicative respectively

Law says do gospel says done. All right. Yeah The old scholars would say law

Gospel not indicative imperative or an imperative indicative to keep it consistent because there are some things that are in the

Subjective subjunctive tense rather and so they just said law gospel instead of imperative indicative, but especially for biblicists, especially for like authorial intent human author only

Imperative indicative will do for me. I I can work with that. I can work with those guys when they do that Okay law tells us to do a set of rules gospel says it's done

To believe in Christ does the gospel I mean this could be a huge episode But typically the

Reformers have called the response to the good news of Christ Jesus belief They call it a gospel imperative because it's receiving its resting.

It's not part of the gospel But it's how you receive the gospel and you are commanded to believe Okay, you're still silent in any cats got my tongue

All right, what's the difference between the third use of the law and the first use Here Joey said don't know.

I can't believe I just said you named him. Yeah, I can't believe you named him and shamed him Huh? No, but also now

I see something good. If you don't know it's kind of nice just to not try to figure it out Plus we've got 19

Joey's here. So who are they gonna know? Who's the Joey? We do have a lot of Joey's First Use drive sinners to Christ by convicting

Third use the law is used as a guide for Christians to live. Holy Yeah, the law for the unbeliever says

See your sin and misery. You're gonna need a Savior The law for a believer since God doesn't change his law doesn't change but your relationship to the lawgiver changes

And now he's your father and your father says Here's what I want you to do son for your good in my glory Yeah, some things are better for you than others

Some girls are bigger than other girls That was gonna get me in trouble but I was quoting a song

Here I'm not sure but I'd like to learn so, you know what this tells me I need to have a little session in class about that Even though I preach on it every single

Sunday, but you know what first use second use third use I mean those things kind of go into my head and out of my head

I I think I always remember the first use and then I'm like, oh, yeah, that's what the third use is, you know

Well, the second use is, you know The restraining element of the Ten Commandments in society at large for believers and unbelievers

But if you just remember God has laws and how do I relate to the lawgiver? I don't care if it's first use or third use.

I just don't want Christians to hear God's law Don't look at a woman with lust and then have them say and I did therefore

I'm not saved God's going to condemn me if you do that You need to repent because the father will certainly discipline you but it's out of love as a child

But but now that raises an interesting question. At least it's interesting to me. You know, how long?

Should one mourn over you know your sin? You know at what point do you say to somebody enough of your mourning over your sin

Well, let's just use a human illustration some son or daughter has sinned against you they come to you

They're obviously mourning. It's not just I got caught tears and they're asking you for forgiveness And I don't know how you could ever forgive me.

This was so big it's such a big issue and of course I'm thinking about the prodigal son in Luke 15 and the response of a father to a son with a repentant child

Repentant son, excuse me Maybe there's a time to sit and talk through it, but I think after the father

Has been asked will you please forgive me and the father said son? I love you He might not even say

I forgive you. He might just say I love you, which includes that I think once you're forgiven, I think you need to move forward.

I So you would say that some kind of mournful retrospective

You know, well Repetition of my guilt over and over and over again. Is that offensive to the

Lord? That's a great question Steve. What if God says you're forgiven if God says you're redeemed, but I don't feel forgiven

I know and neither do I and by the way part of this is The the judgment that's built into sin and I don't mean eternal judgment

Here's what I mean, if you sin as an unbeliever some of those sins, they still haunt me

Mmm, they're completely forgiven, but I'm told that they're done and it's over I just listened to the the gift of forgetting by James Boyce and I thought you know what what a good

Reminder that I need to do exactly what you're alluding to Steve. I need to believe what God says it's done it's over if Luke sins against me and I he asked for forgiveness and I grant it and he keeps coming up to me over and over and over are walking around sad and mourning and beside himself and Wondering if our relationship is still right.

I'm gonna say son actually now you're sinning more Because you're thinking that my words not true.

I said, I love you. I forgive you and now you're doubting the forgiveness of God. Hmm I mean, it's almost like people say well,

I know God has forgiven me, but I can't forgive myself. I Know which now leads us to talk more about stop looking at yourself so much

Right this morbid introspection that you alluded to looking in looking in looking in there's not a whole lot of good there no wonder

Horacious bone are and Robert Murray McShane would say every time you look at yourself Make sure you keep looking and that is then you look to the

Lord who forgave you those sins quit looking at your own sins Over and over and over. I mean if you want to know how people

I mean even Christians Can commit suicide? You know,

I think I think it's something like this You know, I know I'm forgiven but I can't forgive myself and what

I did was so heinous. I can't get over it You know, maybe maybe I need some substance to help me, you know deal with this

Maybe I need you know, I all these kind of things and what are they ultimately saying? They're ultimately saying, you know,

I believe in the Lord Jesus, but that's not enough So hard and I think if you said to the

Lord Could you give me mercy? Would you help me? I Think he's gonna help. I think that's the first thing

I'd want to do besides looking at self You know that old slogan Steve go to the throne before you go to the phone

You know go to the throne before you look inwardly and start to moan or something

I don't know what kind of What kind of slogan we can come up with but it's it's it's it's another reason why every single

Sunday You're neat your pastor needs to talk to you about the grace of God in Christ Jesus the means of grace to sit and listen to gospel preaching so but what if what if the grace of God isn't in the text

Are you are you gonna force the grace of God into the text? I'm gonna force it into the sermon because I'm a

Christian. Oh You know some of our friends that don't want Jesus preached in certain sermons or in certain ways.

I just think hmm Paul doesn't even have a New Testament and he says to the Church of Colossae Him we proclaim

The people at Corinth didn't have a New Testament But when I when I got to town, I already knew what

I was gonna talk about Christ in him crucified Yeah, but I mean, yeah if you come on a

Sunday morning and you don't hear about Jesus sometimes it's fine Sometimes you just need to get beat about the head and shoulders of over your sin

Well, as we said earlier self -righteous people love self -righteous preaching and people want law for lots of reasons

It's built in but also Steve with law if I give you a few little principles and you do them you feel good about yourself

Versus joy and the fruit of the Spirit. Did you know Steve that the fruit of the Spirit is the fruit of the Spirit? What does that mean?

I used to preach the fruit of the Spirit. These are all the things you should do Well, it's true. Yeah, I mean taking the taking the work of God and turning it into an imperative for you

Now certainly it says elsewhere love it says elsewhere rejoice

It says elsewhere to be self -controlled but that passage 522 in Galatians is the fruit of the

Spirit it's like It's like the triune God is at work in you and he actually does something right?

Oh Brother well today on no compromise radio Steve and Mike right here talking in the first person.

We talked about theological preaching discipleship Tests Steve. Thanks for being on the show today.