Phil Howard General Q & A (Part 2)

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Welcome to No Compromise Radio Ministry. My name is Mike Ebendroth. This is part two,

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Phil Howard question and answers at Bethlehem Bible Church Adult Sunny School. General topics,

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I think you'll find them encouraging. I love Pastor Phil, my pastor, and I think you will like him too.

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Pastor Emeritus, retired. Valley Bible Church, Hercules, California. Speaking of Pentecostals, Phil, and your background, what do you think we, specifically

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Bethlehem Bible Church, what can we learn from Pentecostals? And you know, we could divide lines between Pentecostals and Charismatics and all that, but just with your background of old -school

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Pentecostals, Bible believing, Bible preaching, what can we learn? Well, with truly born -again ones,

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I mean, when they went Charismatic, I mean, it spread over everything, just painted over Catholicism, and this, it lost all distinctions.

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I grew up with people that believed you needed to be born again and were strict.

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I grew up in stricter groups because, you know, when you're old and was born as the earth's crust was hardening, you, you're back there.

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If they're genuinely saying it's just some of the most wonderful people in the world, but they labor under the legalism that most of them have grown up with.

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And of course, so many, they had assurance, but they lacked the, they couldn't defend their, we were not taught.

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We were evangelized. We had great prayer meetings, great music, but we had few

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Bible teachers, and that's the heartbreak.

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And I, I still, I mean, much of my family died in Pentecostal circles, loved the

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Lord, would give, tithe, knock on doors on Saturday Street evangelism.

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I mean, oh, the enthusiasm, the devotion, it's unreal.

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I wanted to stay among them and try to teach them the doctrines of grace and to tell them how, how saved they really were.

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And I always say God loves to choose our minions. He saves millions of us.

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I mean, what did you believe when God saved you? Could you pass the doctrinal test?

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Are you kidding? How to rob banks in two easy lessons and God saves you.

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I mean, most people I've been around were sinners when God got them. They weren't thinking about Tulip.

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They weren't thinking about John Calvin. John Calvin didn't save me, but he sure helped me to understand what

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I got. See, and just the ignorance, and ignorance destroys the soul.

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A sincere Catholic that sincerely believed that he needed to go through Mary.

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When I was in Mexico City, I went to the main Catholic Cathedral there and stood in line for a good while with the rest of the people.

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All the while, we were passing a statue where you kiss the feet of Mary, of which

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Jesus was subject to her. He was beneath her feet. And to see all these sincere

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Mexican Catholics waiting by the hour just to kiss a statue.

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Heart, heartbreaking, heart -rending. We all would have been in satanic blindness, you know.

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The veils over our eyes, and the Pentecostals. I know many don't, don't, they're not all

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Benny Hinn's. Yeah, there's really, I knew Assembly of God pastors. They disdained the

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Kenneth Hagin's, the Benny Hinn's, all these false guys, false don't be taken in.

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But I was raised by people that would give you their last dollar to feed you, clothe you, and keep you up all night singing about Jesus.

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So they were genuinely saved, but genuinely ignorant of so much grace teaching that you could take for granted.

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Speaking of singing, how could you encourage the congregation to sing? To sing, number one.

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Number two, to sing well. I know you love to sing, and we'll see what you think about our singing here in about an hour, but how would you encourage us to sing?

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Well, one thing, don't have three throat surgeries. Like me,

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I, God, God has a way of dropping a hint. I'm tired of hearing you, so you're going in for throat surgery.

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And so I had three throat surgeries. They thought I had throat cancer, and so she took away part of my vocal cord.

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But I'm telling you, it's, how can you explain it?

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Because most churches I go to now, I can't sing the music because there's so much new coming that anything

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I know was written in 1901. You can't keep this so much, and a lot of great music.

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But I don't know, I would, I mean, we're in the house, and here he and Kim started singing

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Psalms 118 .1. I thought, good night. I'm going back in time. Let's come over them.

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Refreshing. I have seldom hear people bust out singing, but I think being around people that sing, why don't you sing?

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The Spirit produces a song. If you're Spirit -filled, you sing to one another.

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And by the way, here, oh, get this. I'm telling you, I'm getting mad now. The real

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Phil is coming out right now. Here we go. But it's, your reformed tradition would always have you, you got to sing everything vertical.

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You know, to God be the glory. The doxology. Wonderful. And can it be superb?

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Can't beat it. Love it. But did you know, music, as you read in the New Testament, you also sing to one another.

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You're saying horizontally, and it was basically exhortation or warning.

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We sing to one another by, what, like, we sing a song,

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Hold to God's unchanging hand. Time is filled with swift transition. Not of earth unmoved shall stand.

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Build your hopes on things eternal. Hold to God's unchanging hand. Or we sing a song,

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Where would I be, had the Lord not rescued me? And a lot of stuff said, well, they didn't even get up really vertical.

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No, I'm singing to you to encourage you. I'm exhorting you. And I'm singing songs that you can harmonize with, and not so many

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Sovereign Grace songs with the world's best verbiage and the worst tunes in the world. Because you can't catch harmony.

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But the verbiage is, I mean, it's a systematic theology work.

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It's, it's, they can't be better than Sovereign Grace. But where's the harm?

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Because I grew up with Okies. They harmonize. They actually sell records.

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They catch parts. All my daughters sing parts. They, and what

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I used to do is play guitar when I started the church, and as my girls kept growing up, I can get up to start.

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I mean, I had a sister to play anything by ear. We don't need the sheet. Says, if you can hem it and hum it, we can chord it.

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We'll play it. Go. And no 150 songs by heart.

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Never without a song. I mean, and we sung to our dying.

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We, we would sing at their graveside. When my father's buried, my sister, they bring out tape player.

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We play the music they played. We would sing, my dad and my sister, both dead.

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We're playing the music at the funeral. Because we learned them from him. It's just a way, it's a culture.

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And it's an expressive culture. Man, some places, I think everybody in the place is an introvert or a mute.

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Don't you ever express anything? Well, you sure do when you watch a game. Don't tell me about it,

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Mr. Introvert. You're screaming when the guy didn't catch the ball. No, no, it's what you scream about.

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It's what you get excited about. See, we, Maryland, we used to go to church.

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I, I was in meetings before that, met every night for 13 weeks. We couldn't get enough.

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We were in church all the time. Singing all the time. Praying all the time. I mean, it's like you think

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I was saved during the Great Awakening. No, I was saved in the 50s.

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Couldn't get enough. But as the age gets colder and colder, and you feel like you're on a floating sepulcher with a frozen crew, nobody sings.

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What's there to sing about? Sing. Sing your faith. Sing your faith.

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And it's marvelous. It's why the Pentecostals grew so much.

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Calvary Chapel. They, they can get you in the door. Just people love music.

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But we're not all classically trained. But I can play a guitar.

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I can do three chords. I can catch harmony. It's, it's playing folks music.

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Now, if you're all Bach, and you're all Beethoven and Mozart, so be it. Bless your heart.

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I hope you enjoy yourself. You know, it's the world's finest music.

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But just common man would give me something I can sing. I don't know how profound that is, but at least

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I invented. Sometimes I notice, Phil, that the men don't sing, the dads don't sing, and then of course the children sometimes don't sing as well.

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What would you tell to a dad who doesn't really sing, because he says, well, I don't have a good voice.

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Who said you have to have a good voice? Sing and make melody in your heart. Starts in your heart.

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What fills the heart will fill the mouth. McGee says the mouth is the bucket, and the heart is the well.

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Put the bucket down in the heart. Carol and I, we've been married so long, we know all the same songs.

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So we get to sing to each other around the house. And if you came to it, you said, the poor folks, they're just one step from being institutionalized.

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Because as we know, you know, we're singing, oh say but I'm glad, I'm glad.

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Jesus has come and my cup's overrun. Oh say, but I'm glad. You know, that's an interesting thing.

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I grew up around Christians that were glad. Do you have any of them?

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I mean, most folks, I mean, they need to notify their face if they're glad.

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Because man, it looks like the introduction to the book of Lamentations. You just go to church, and you just, yeah,

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I'm saved, bless his name. Come down to our church, you'll be depressed in a month.

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There's joy there. Being stiff and correct, I never thought that's what

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Christianity was. See, it wasn't until I went to Bible college that I learned to be suspicious of Christians.

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Up to that time, I just loved them. The more I knew, the fewer

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I could love, because they didn't, can you love anybody you don't agree with? Right, I pray about that, that's just everywhere.

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Can you love anybody, I mean, what if, I had a black sister, we got ahold of me in our church.

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She said, can I attend this church if I'm a Democrat? I said, sit with Carolyn and I, we'll protect you.

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Because, man, we got people in our church, if you're not voting for Trump, you're Antichrist.

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Can you love anybody that doesn't agree with you? Could you love the Samaritan woman? And that's her like, can you love a homosexual?

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It's amazing. My wife's brother became a homosexual, and he turned on her, because she was this evangelical

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Christian girl. And he wanted to bring his lover to our house to stay.

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We wouldn't let him. He hated us for that. He comes down with a brain tumor.

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None of the gay friends wanted to take care of him. Guess who took care of him until he died?

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Wiped up the blood on the floor from his hemorrhaging. Changed his sheets.

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Prayed over him. Are we homosexuals?

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No. Do we think they're right? No. Can we love them? Jesus could, without endorsing.

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I don't have to endorse, and I'm not here telling you to endorse. I'm asking, can you love someone you don't agree with?

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I hope so. I sure hope so. You know,

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I taught my children the ideal, but we had to live with the real.

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Don't have sex till you get married. What did you get pregnant for while you were at Bible College?

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Why? Because I'm human, because I'm frail, because I'm temptable.

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Well now, we don't have any place for you. I taught my girls from the youngest age, if you're ever in trouble, you call here first.

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We don't disown pregnant daughters. The light will always be on, whether you're right or wrong.

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Do we endorse your choice? No. But we will weep with you over your choice.

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Can you love anybody that's broken? If you don't, you ought to sell the building and get out of the church business, you hypocrites.

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I had some men not want to let my daughter still attend our church, because she failed, and they had all failed miserably.

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And two of my elders spoke up, we're going to sell the building and give the money to missions, rather than to propagate such a hypocritical gospel.

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Jesus died for sinners. Jesus died for sinners. That's why you're welcome on these chairs.

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We all qualify. Does anyone say amen? Where does this crowd say amen?

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If you don't say amen, I'm going to scream louder. This is our gospel.

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It takes in the worst of us. He did not choose the mighty, the unfallen.

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God chose the weak things so that no flesh, no flesh, would boast in his presence.

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Our whole boast in heaven is the Lamb was slain for me. For me.

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It's enough to make even a conservative -looking bunch of New Englanders want to shout and say hallelujah to the

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Lamb. Amen. I go into fits every once in a while.

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Phil, along the same lines, you're not going to kick out a child when they sin. Turn that to a lot of modern evangelical pastors and preachers and theologians.

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It's like we're on a treadmill, even as Christians. If we sin, we lose our salvation, or how can you call yourself a

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Christian and live like that? Always question your salvation when you sin. Obviously, you don't want to sin, but should the pastor hammer over and over and over?

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How can you live like that and call yourself a Christian? I mean, obviously, first Corinthians 6 exists. There are some people that we ask that question to, but what's the general tenor and meal that we give to our congregation when it comes to when they sin?

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Well, I think it's that I use this paradigm, ideal, real, redemption.

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That do the ideal. Obey. You know, you're raising children.

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Don't do it. This is God's will. While we all ate of the fruit, we did it.

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So, that's the real. And so, the people coming to our churches, they they've all sinned.

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We've all sinned. And so, our message is, is there any hope if you did it anyway?

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Redemption and in redemption will be in the power of regeneration and bestowing of this divine nature.

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We've become partakers of God's nature, Peter said, which I think is eternal life.

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He will break the patterns of sin that we've been used to. First John 3 verses 6 through 9.

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We discontinue our practice of sin. We've been living with our girlfriend.

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When I first started Valley, all I did the first two or three years was do weddings because everybody was living with their chick.

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They were all on drugs. They weren't going to get married. Why get married?

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They told me if we had an American flag in the building, they wouldn't attend. This is Vietnam era.

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We're not going to Vietnam. We hate McNamara. We hate Westmoreland.

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They're lying through their teeth. More of our boys are being killed than they're telling us. So, this is the kind of, these kids are 10 miles from Berkeley.

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They're strung out on drugs. Jimi Hendrix is their hero. And so, wow, and my wife said, none of these kids are saved.

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I said, we'll find out. We'll find out, but I'm not going to put them under any rules because they're rebels anyway.

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We'll see if the grace of God will change them. And the grace of God did.

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And the pattern's broken pretty soon. Pastor, would you marry us? Well, how long you been with her?

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We've been going together five years. I've been sleeping with her for five years. I would never get married until I heard about the truth of God's Word.

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Christ tells me to marry her. Still married, by the way. I just was at a funeral with a bunch of them.

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Been married 45 years. That because, and by the way,

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I had never seen church discipline practice until I started this church. I'd never been a part of it.

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We just gossiped a lot. We never did discipline. In the churches

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I was in, known as holiness churches, I had a guy take me to lunch.

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And when we went to lunch, on the way back, he said, could you use an answering service?

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Well, I'm just starting at a church, and I don't have a secretary or anything.

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I said, yeah, that'd be handy. And then he just, right there, he says, I just want you to know

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I got it hot. And I said, now where I grew up, enrichment, hot means you got it stolen.

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He said, yeah, I got a good deal on it. I said, I can't take it now.

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Why didn't you shut up? I could have taken it. He said, well,

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I didn't. I said, well, I didn't know. And then he goes on a little bit further. He started talking about this woman.

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He said, we've been living together. And I said, well, you're married, right? He said, oh, no.

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I said, you know what? You're putting me in a dilemma. He said, what's that?

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I said, if you're doing, he's big, I had to get my brothers to stand with me. That Sunday night, because he told me, he just thought it was all a joke.

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And I called out his name, and there he is. He's living in adultery with this woman.

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I just want you to know, church, we mark him. He doesn't take this serious.

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And so, put the fear of God and all these hippie kids they've never seen, you know.

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They're going to have a Salem witch burning here pretty soon. But, we started practicing church discipline, gossips.

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We would take them to the elders and serious about discipline.

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We're serious about sin. And at the same time, we refused to put them under law.

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And so, the grace of God is what they've grown up Catholic, pagan, street kids, drugs culture.

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I mean, some of you have never been around first -generation Christians. So, you're so critical.

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The more Christians you run with, the more critical you're going to become. Because you haven't been around the real item so long, you don't know how to show mercy and compassion.

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You're just critical of the deacons, because they don't do their job good enough. You ought to get out there where the pagans are.

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And then, that deacon will look glorious. Phil, we've only got a few minutes left, but maybe

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I could ask you to talk about personal Bible reading. And even in particular, what areas of the scriptures have you found really compelling lately as you've gotten older, or dear as you've aged?

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Romans has been the life -changing book in my life. I was changed when

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I was teaching at a Pentecostal college. It painted me in the corner to believe in election and eternal security.

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And I had to leave the denomination over it. So, Romans is the life changer for me.

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I don't think you understand Christianity unless you understand Romans. It's the whole package.

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That, Carolyn and I just finished Ephesians. My wife and I read a couple of psalms every morning, a chapter of Proverbs for the day, and then a

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New Testament book. And we pray together. I would encourage all you men, pray with your wife daily.

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Have a morning time if you could, or maybe it's evening because of your work schedule. But it's one of the richest blessings in the world to pray with your wife or your husband.

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I'm all, I'm reading, I'm just now finishing the book of Chronicles in my own Bible reading.

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I love the Old Testament. And of course, I usually preach the

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New Testament. I've got something like 45 years of sermons on tape, and they've got it now in a master file in our church.

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Electronically kept, and you know, when people are in the tribulation, they'll be able to hear one of my tapes.

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They'll think it is the tribulation. But I just, I love,

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I love the Bible. Some guys want to talk theology. They can't talk Bible.

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They want to say, well, are you Arminian? Are you, are you limited, unlimited? I said, hey, would you tell me what

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Hebrews is about? I grew up on folks that loved the Bible, that knew little theology, that sure loved their

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Bible. They're Bible readers. They weren't theologically trained.

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And every one of you, just thank God for William Tyndale.

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And you've got some of the best. I brought my wife to church. I'm a New American, because my eyes are getting,

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I got glaucoma, and so I'm looking for a big, but it looks like I brought the family Bible. And then

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I had an NIV that I read, and that would nearly be a heresy to read that here.

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So I brought a New American standards, you know. I wanted to stay in good graces, and I can't wait until I get that plane ticket and get home.

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Then I can read it again. But I would just say, be in the

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Bible. I used to read a Bible book every day for 30 days. When I first started church,

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I translated it from the Greek and parsed the verbs. And oh my, now

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I just use my inner linear and a good linguistic key to the

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New Testament. Have you seen that tool? Yeah, Rogers and Reinecker. And he's had such a better education.

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Your pastor is amazing. Just his library, the education, and the grasp he has on theology is,

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I'm only, let's see, I'm 16 years older. Much more mature.

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But the grasp of theology and history, it's just amazing to me, his grasp.

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I could take classes from him. I really could, because he just, he bleeds it.

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He just, it's what he is. He talks about the reason my voice is so bad. Him and Kim never stop when we go home.

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It's a perpetual conference. And he just bleeds. He bleeds this stuff.

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It fills his heart. You have an outstanding man in this couple.

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Okay, time's up. Yeah. It seriously is. Pastor Phil, thank you so much.

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I hope you were encouraged today, dear congregation. Let's just pretend Phil's not here for just a second.

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When he's preaching, I don't care if you say amen or smile. And when you sing, we better sing like we mean it, because we're redeemed saints.

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So let's be careful we're not chosen, frozen chosen in front of Pastor Phil. Okay? All right.

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Let's pray. Thank you, Father, for your goodness and kindness. And your goodness and mercy.

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They certainly follow us all the days of our lives. And as we think about safe and secure in the arms of Jesus, never losing our salvation, we're thankful for that.

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And that's all because of you. Yes. And your sovereign grace. And we would ask today now, as we worship the

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Lord Jesus, would you give us hearts and minds and souls that are consumed by the

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Lord Jesus, like those in heaven now, who are around the throne singing with all their hearts, Worthy is the

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Lamb who was slain. We ask it by the power of the Holy Spirit alone, in Jesus name alone.

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Amen. Well, that wraps up Q &A Bethlehem Bible Church Adult Sunday School in May.

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Pastor Phil Howard with myself, Mike Abendroth. Glad you listened today. Tell your friends. Tell your millionaire friends.