Episode 18: Christmas and the Lord's Day

the rural church podcast 2 .0 Wait a second.

It's December That's better Just a couple of pastors discussing life ministry theology the gospel from a local church perspective

Eddie What's it time for? the rural church podcast

Welcome to the rural church podcast my favorite month of the year episode 18

Happy December I'm your co -host Alan Nelson pastor of Prairieville Second Baptist Church with me is my jolly old friend

You're not that old Eddie Ragsdale. Say hello, Eddie Hello everybody, and I've got my

I've got red and white on to me It's razorback red and white but you know It can kind of be for Christmas to is the most wonderful time of the year

We're recording this in November. Actually, we're recording this. Did you say any the day after tell me what it was either yesterday or today?

That they estimate that the human population on planet Earth will for the first time pass eight billion people eight

Billion eight billion. Yeah, and You know, there are many secularists who believe that that's far too many people on the planet

However, we live in rural America and we know that there is space for people to inhabit and And I think that our view ought to be these are souls

That that God deserves the worship and the glory from their lives and we ought to preach the gospel to them

That they could be born again. Amen. That's right. Our mission field is Growing, that's right.

Well, it's December what we want to talk about the Lord's Day and Christmas Day so Christmas and New Year's fall on the

Lord's Day on Sunday this year And I think this is the last time for like a while because I think next time like leap year

I'll look it up real quick But I think next time leap year kind of pushes it so it's going to be a while before it falls on Sunday again

Yeah, I believe the last time was exactly six years ago. That's right 2016 because This last

Sunday was my six -year anniversary as the pastor here at Marshall on that exact Sunday was my first Sunday as the pastor which meant that everything that all the

Sundays would be the same as That year and we and I remember we had with Christmas that first year as the pastor here

We had Christmas on on Sunday that year. It won't happen again So think about this from 2005 to 2022 it happened in 2005 2011 2016 2022 so in 17 years, basically, it's happened four times in the next 17 years from 2022 to 2039

It'll only be three three times 2022 2033 and then 2039

So after this year you have like 11 years basically until it even gonna come up Can you think about that think about that with your family, bro?

How old are your kids gonna be in 11 years? They're like 27. Yeah Yeah, I mean may may have grandchildren.

Whoa the next time the Lord's Day falls on Christmas falls on the Lord's Day. You're going to be a grandfather good good and you could do

First on the real church podcast. Hey, listen, what we want to talk about is because we we kind of live

We're in rural churches people have traditions those sorts of things and we want to talk about Christmas in the

Lord's Day probably most people listening to this by this point December 7th

You've probably already made up your mind. Maybe we can persuade you on some things to think through Even now so tell us tell us why you're canceling your services on Christmas We would not be canceling our service on the

Lord's Day. Well, let's talk about first Let's talk about what you're doing. And when we'll talk about what we're doing and then then we'll go from there

So, what are you guys doing Christmas Day? Well, I'll be honest. We really haven't made any specific different plans than just our normal Lord's Day Worship, I have been thinking although like I said it like you said we're still pre

Thanksgiving right now There's a little time to think through these things. We I'm thinking about us doing and adjusting our

Sunday school I don't want to cancel it. I know there'll be a lot of churches that will cancel their

Sunday school They'll only do the Lord's Day worship service and and I'm not gonna say that that that's you know

Sunday school is not commanded, right? so okay, if they think that's better, but I actually am thinking what

I would like for us to do is maybe a like a Christmas morning a family style gathering for Sunday school instead of individually age

Segregated classes for Sunday school and then move into the you know, the regular worship gathering, but What would you do for Sunday school maybe maybe like a kind of like a reading of the

Christmas story and a and and Talking and doing some things kind of as a as a whole church family together with the kids maybe, you know hot chocolate and Christmas cookies for breakfast if more if Her something like that and then move into the regular worship gathering, you know

No, I don't think we would want to do a whole like a whole full -on breakfast because I'm sure

Most of our folks will still be gathering with family, you know in the afternoon and and they'll be having their big

Christmas dinner and things but but we might do some kind of an abbreviated breakfast with with a focus on on on The birth of the

Savior and y 'all don't do anything Sunday night, right? Well, we have we have a

Sunday evening prayer meeting at another facility that our church has And we probably won't have it that night, but we cancel it pretty regularly

So that's not a like we don't have it every Sunday. Anyway, so your

Your Sunday morning service. Will there be anything different? Probably not.

Yeah, probably not this year in the past We have done some some different things, but I'll be honest

We don't have any of those in the works yet, and it's probably too late for us to get You know, we've done some we've done we done a shadow kind of a shadow play thing one year for Christmas and then

I preached the gospel after the that and so we have done things like that which

But probably probably this year it'll be pretty pretty much our normal. I mean, it'll be it'll be

It'll be incarnation focus. We will be singing songs about the incarnation preaching on it, but We might add some extra scripture reading

So, let me tell you where we're at and then also I also want to talk to you about January 1st I asked you about that.

Well, let me tell you where we're at. So I've talked to some guys I was actually floated out the idea. But like you said about Sunday school, what do we do about Sunday school?

It's going to no matter what we do. I feel like it's going to be different. Maybe we use Sunday school

You know, I figure it'll be a little bit lower obviously non -negotiable. I'm gonna talk about wine just a minute But non -negotiable that we meet that we gather that we worship.

Yeah. Yeah, if you're why would we not? Yeah, if your church cancels You're in sin,

I'd go so far to say that like you can't do it so so let me say this not only that but I would even say this your worship needs to It needs to functionally not really be

Any different I'm teaching right now through the regulative principle and So I'm okay.

Like for example, we might add some scripture readings, you know And we might do something like that just because it's so on everybody's minds

I understand we are not by the way commanded to celebrate Christmas And there are faithful brothers who do not and sisters who do not celebrate

Christmas. That's their right I think either way you could go wrong. Like if you're gonna demand everybody celebrate

Christmas, you're wrong I think if you're going to demand everybody not celebrate Christmas, you're wrong. And so I but but there are faithful Believers who don't so we're not commanded to celebrate

Christmas However, look if you if you're just gonna preach you're like so not gonna celebrate

Christmas like you're just gonna preach whatever on that day I think you're missing opportunity for some rich theology to teach your people the hypostatic

Union and and and these glorious truths of the incarnation Anyway, so I'm I'm pretty

Firm that we have to have we still have to follow the regulative principle Like we're not going to do any kind like we don't ever do any kind of skits or plays or anything like that on our

Sunday morning main corporate gathering because we believe that we have to you know, our position is that we have to worship

God as he has Instructed us to worship him. And so we're not going to change anything, but Sunday school

Like you say that could be a little bit different Haven't fully decided how we're going to approach that and then we we meet

Sunday night, which sometimes we dismiss Sunday night So, I don't know what I'm gonna do yet for that Like I think

I'm going to I sing about doing like a hymn sing or something Just basically we'll you know, we'll gather still and sing and and and and chat look

There might be other things going on Where people are committed to other things in the evening a little bit different, you know

But that's really I haven't really fully decided but but the main gathering you have to do the main gathering you have to preach

You can't by the way substitute preaching that day for you know, a choir cantata or or a that's right

You know a five -minute Christmas devotion or something. You need to preach the word. I actually use the opportunity perhaps you have a

Great number of visitors depending on your location and such use the opportunity to preach Christ The glorious realities of the incarnation and and why

Jesus came and I'd also say this You don't have to get creative just preach the old story brother

You know, look there are different texts that we can think about For example,

I was reading through John recently in in John 18 Jesus talks about for this reason I was born to bear witness to the truth, you know, and I was like I'll be a good

Christmas text there and yeah, I'm 18 at you my so you can think Create creatively about you know

Which text and looking at so but but look just preach the incarnation God became man God has visited his people.

He came to redeem us from our sins Matthew 121. There's a text I was thinking of that same text from From John, you know for this reason

I was born, you know Yeah, as you mentioned, you know, not not all Christians celebrate

Christmas, you know the the Puritans weren't fans of the Christmas celebration

They thought that it had had problems that it could actually lead them away from worshiping the

Lord But I think what we want to remember is that yeah, we

I mean would you want to only deal with the incarnation? When you came to those birth narratives

I mean you I think there is wisdom in us going back On a regular basis.

So for us, it's yearly to make sure Hey this year we are gonna we are gonna at least at this time of year.

We're gonna focus on Like you said the hypostatic Union Christ coming in the flesh that God came

Jesus being the one mediator between God and man because he was 100 % God and 100 % man

I think that that is good I think it's good that we have a time of year when we focus exclusively on Remembering the death burial and resurrection of Christ and that we don't and we don't just say well

Well, we'll preach on that when we get to it in the text. Well, yes, we will do that But I think it is good that we that we have these

Commemorations that help us to think through that which of course We're always preaching the the death barrel and resurrection of Christ because it's a gospel but I think there is value in Taking this approach that that we want to use this

To teach this theology church. You're trying to become liturgical on me so Let me say this.

I think there is some wisdom and value in the liturgical calendar, by the way, you know, I Just I just hold it.

Obviously. I'm a Baptist. I hold it a lot more loosely Right then yeah, then some of our brothers and sisters.

Anyway, what were you gonna say? well, and I was gonna say, you know, I I was listening to a video and a

Reformed pastor. He made this reference. So I didn't read this in Calvin, but he made this reference that actually

Calvin Wanted the celebration in the reformed calendar He wanted it to be on the nearest

Sunday to December the 25th not on December the 25th He wanted the observance to always be on Sunday.

So here we are Discussing what are we going to do? Because it happens to fall on Sunday When if you to talk to Calvin and maybe all the reformers they would have said well, well, of course

What else are you going to do as a matter of fact? They probably the argument would have been from them that when it doesn't fall on a

Sunday They would have been discussing the type of church meeting that they would have had if it fell out of Tuesday Me personally,

I love You know what happened in 2016 I loved it I loved it, you know

I love it on a Sunday and and here's what I was going to get to so Are y 'all still technically

Southern Baptist? Well, we we do not contribute to the cooperative program but Let me we're trying to figure out the logistics for lack of better terms

Because a lot of our brothers we may get off on this but I don't want to but a lot of our brothers who have left the

Southern Baptist Convention as I've called them up to say. Hey, how did you guys do that? They said well we just decided we aren't anymore and stopped giving and I'm like Well that I don't think you actually left because I bet they still count you.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, here's here's where I'm going with it. So Believe it or not the bad.

There's more that I would want to say about this But This on its surface is not a bad statement in the battles faith and message 2000.

This is from Article 8 on the Lord's Day But this so so what the what

I'm saying is many Southern Baptist churches out there at least say they believe this

Which is the first day of the week is the Lord's Day. This is paragraph article 8

The first day of the week is the Lord's Day. It is a Christian institution for regular observance

It commemorates the resurrection of Christ from the dead and should include exercises of worship and spiritual devotion both public and private

Activities on the Lord's Day should be commensurate with the Christians conscience under the Lordship of Jesus Christ Now that's changed a little bit.

Let me read to you the 1925 and 1963 those didn't change But pretty similar the first day of the week is the

Lord's Day it is a Christian institution for regular observance it commemorates the resurrection of Christ from the dead and should be employed and exercises of worship and spiritual devotion both public and private and Then it says this which the 2000 didn't and by refraining from worldly amusements and resting from secular

Employments work of necessity and mercy only being accepted and then let me say this that comes from That comes all the way back from the

New Hampshire Confession the New Hampshire Confession says this article 15 we believe that the first day of the week is the

Lord's Day or Christian Sabbath and it is to be kept sacred to religious purposes by abstaining from all secular labor and Sinful recreations by the devout observance of all the means of grace both private and public and by preparation for the rest

That remaineth for the people of God now this comes from and I won't read this because it's so long

But this you keep which track in our ancestry you go all the way back to the Philadelphia Confession Which is you know, the 1689 with a couple right thing

So which really hammers the Christians have the point is though if you're listening to this and you're a

Baptist at all if you're a Southern Baptist or a Baptist at all, I like you really come from a long line of godly men that Understood at the very least

Sunday as the Lord's Day Which I usually called the Lord's Day, but the

Christian Sabbath as well And and I understand we get all like what you can do what you can't do all those things

That'll be a different episode, but I'm just saying for this episode We understand that God has given us as it were 52 holidays

Yeah, yes a year in Celebrating Christ.

Yes. So how in the world could you even begin to think of?

Minimizing The worship of our great and holy God on Christmas, right?

Right? Yeah So the Lord's Day, so whether we take the Lord's Day view or the Christian Sabbath view the the the most important thing

I think to notice for this discussion is that yes what we're talking about is the Lord's Day worship as we're as as we see it in the

New Testament and Yes, what was the church supposed to do? They're supposed to sing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs

There's both the elders are supposed to teach God's Word the Apostles doctrine to the people

They're supposed to pray they're supposed to have fellowship with one another, you know

So in our church what's going to happen on Sunday is the same on Sunday? Christmas Day is the same thing that happens every

Sunday. We're gonna have public reading of Scripture We're gonna sing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs.

We're gonna have the Word of God preached and taught We're gonna have opportunities for people to share prayer needs and for people to share praise reports and testimonies

Of what God has done in their life and we're going to celebrate the Lord's Supper. That's what we do every

Sunday and like pinky in the brain That's what we're gonna do.

What are you gonna do? Well, I try to do every day take over the world actually Eddie Respond to this what you just described sounds very very very

Ordinary you know what we have found in our church and you know, I don't want to get off onto the issue of How often churches to do the

Lord's Supper? I'm not making a law here. We do it every week and I've always heard people say oh man, that'll get so Rote and it won't have any meaning and we've even had some pushback here with people thinking that but I've also had people come here

Who have actually joined our church since we've been doing it this way so they've never known our church to not do the

Lord's Supper every week and and they've come to me and said Wow, this is we we you know when we first came we thought this is kind of strange but they've actually come to love it because It is so ordinary

Because it is so ordinary Because there is a way that we participate and and the way

I look at it is, you know So often we talk about the means of grace What's not a means in which we receive new grace because we already have all the grace in Christ But I would say the means of grace that is given for the for the worship of the

Lord on the Lord's Day in the Church gathering are a means by which we participate together in God's grace.

So that is fellowship meals That's the Lord's Supper that singing that's the preaching and teaching of God's Word All of these are means by which we all participate together

In the grace that we have in Jesus Christ And the grace of assurance the grace of Growing in Christ the grace of growing together.

This all happens through the ordinary means of grace and And to say ordinary isn't minimizing

But it is saying this we've got to stop being so event -driven in our churches.

Yes, like Let's gather and the ordinary things that we're doing are actually the extraordinary things

They actually are the supernatural things. We're preaching from God's book. We're singing praises to God We're participating in the ordinances.

We're we're praying we're giving we're we're doing all of these things son

Sunday after Sunday after Sunday why because we need it like we're creatures of Habit as it were and we need to be taught we need you know, we need we need this every single

Lord's Day we need it every single Christian Sabbath as it were this this corporate gathering and and honoring the

Lord together and so it's like how could we even like Like the answers are like the answers already

Give it like we already we don't have to wonder like what are we gonna do Sunday?

I don't care what the Sunday is. I don't care. You know, yeah, we're going to meet we're gonna preach

And I think it's kind of neat when these holidays fall on these Sundays like this particularly with Christmas I mean, that's really the only one right?

I mean Yeah, I mean Easter's always on Sunday Sunday Thanksgiving's always

Thursday, you know, yeah. Yeah, so it's kind of neat when when Christmas falls on Sunday and it all kind of all kind of comes together and I would just say

Keep the Lord the priority And and that's that doesn't matter

That's every Sunday and that should be every day as well. But go ahead well, and and like for us,

I don't want to just keep harping on the on the Lord's Supper thing, but You know every

Sunday we don't go to first Corinthians 11 every Sunday So, I think that part that would get monotonous if every

Sunday we said exactly the same thing in taking Lord's Supper so every Sunday basically, we we highlight

How the The Lord's Supper is representing

Christ's body and blood as we partake together as a church From different passages of Scripture usually and this has been amazing

But I found almost always there's a way to tie to get it from even the text that's being preached that morning

It's just amazing how that it God is has woven it into the scriptures that being said

So on these Sundays even leading up to Christmas Day and then on the

Sunday of Christmas Day The focus of our even our Lord's Supper we will be able to be thinking about the body

You know, it says in Hebrews the body that he is prepared You know the the body that made our salvation possible was the body of Christ born and Laid in the manger on Christmas Day.

And so I yeah, I just I think there are so many opportunities Where we can we can enhance in some way

Ordinary means that we're doing the Lord's Day, but we don't have to we don't have to change

From what God has given us to be doing on the Lord's Day And we certainly shouldn't cancel what

God has given us to be doing on the Lord's Day. Yeah, I think I Think this is more reason for churches to be confessional

Because you already think through these things, you know, well, let's talk about January 1st

I know it's a little bit different, but you know, the the the 25th and 1st or a week apart always, you know

Falling on the same day. So what about January 1st? What about New Year's anything different on that day?

I don't think so. What what are you playing? Are you planning on doing anything different? You want to be then are you gonna be in the next passage in Ephesians?

Are you have you got something planned different for January 1st? well,

I actually I Will probably pre you'll be finished with Ephesians by then

Maybe by the time January 1st falls on the Sunday again In Ephesians 5

Paul talks about try to discern what is pleasing to the Lord. I Actually think that might kind of line up and I think that would be a good you know

I think the first Sunday of the year and maybe you don't want to do it on the first But the first Sunday of the year or maybe

January 8th, like I think those are good. I think it's a good Sunday for sort of Where your churches state of the church

Yeah, where is your church at where you go? I mean, you know what I'm trying to be careful here if you don't want to break your exposition.

Certainly you don't have to But but just think I'm not saying your church makes resolutions where but just just think about the reality that Your church is kind of in a natural time one years ended your you're starting a new year

And it's in its time sometimes to to address some things, but I don't know what we're gonna do

We might do a New Year's Eve fellowship If we do that and then maybe kind of like pray in the new year or something if we end up doing that We we might end up canceling

Sunday school, you know Because people being out late and all that and and we'll have gathered, you know something

But then we'll we'll do our again just like Christmas. We'll do our service normal Now I was thinking our evening service that night we actually might spend 45 minutes or So of our service just reading scripture, you know to start the new year reading scripture

And I was looking up some things like Romans. I think you can read in 57 minutes

That might be a little long I don't know we'll see or or I was thinking about first second and second Timothy and Titus those three you can read together and Maybe like 40 minutes

That would be good. You know the pastoral pistols and thinking about being a healthy church and all that So we might do that on Sunday night you know, but but I want to be careful here family time is important and Spending time your family.

I'm not minimizing that at all. It's strange that people have this idea That I can't have family time in the corporate worship of God, yeah, yes.

Yes That doesn't make sense. I think it's a misunderstanding a Family time.

I think it's a misunderstanding of corporate worship. Yes It's it's really problematic the way that we think, you know

I had this thought in the New Testament like we tend to especially in the rural South We tend to think of Christianity as something you add like I've got this life

I've got these goals. I've got these dreams and I'm just gonna add Christianity onto that and everything's hectic And now that's why you have people writing books and stuff about all don't be so hectic at the church

And I understand I do understand that, you know, don't add things to the church calendar Just just to be busy at the same time.

We need to understand this reality that in the New Testament They didn't add Christianity to their lives rather Christianity reoriented their lives around the kingship of Christ Which is which is really only manifested in the scriptures in the local church

What I mean is not that the Christ reign is not manifest everywhere I mean is if you're gonna live as Christ as your king, you can't do that separately from active

Involvement not just involvement in the local church as though the local church is like like the

Rotary Club or something But but like where your life is reoriented now Around the local church not just on Sundays, but even beyond that.

Yeah, you know thinking again about the Probably what will happen for us with the

January 1st is I Recently kind of preached through a series that was kind of the state of our church

So we kind of don't need that. I don't feel like and I'm about to finish

Jonah, probably this Sunday and so I think what's going to happen for us is so the next

Sunday after I'm done with Jonah will be Starting the Sundays leading up to Christmas Day So I believe what

I'm gonna do and we don't do you guys you guys do the Advent candles? I believe y 'all do right in your church.

No. No, we don't do them in the old guy Did we do as part as family worship, okay, we we don't do the

Advent candles but I I think what I'm gonna do is preach a series through the the meanings of the

Advent Sundays Yeah leading up to Christmas because I'm not in the middle of a book because I'm just finishing one and I don't want to start another

One and then take a break for Christmas Day, you know So I think I'm gonna do that and then we will probably be starting our next book of the

Bible on January the 1st which I haven't settled exactly on what that's going to be which we discussed that Yeah, you know last week we in one of those podcasts

We discussed the idea of how you pick the next book But I'm right now looking at probably picking one of the

Pauline epistles Ephesians Galatians Philippians one of those probably and so I'm praying through that looking at those and But we'll probably start that on January 1st, but but I don't think that we'll change anything

I do think that we will probably have a Saturday night meeting and I'm just gonna tell them to suck it up.

Yeah Yeah, so suck it up and be here at 9 o 'clock on Sunday morning Yeah, right.

Well, I don't care like yeah, I'll be up and ready, you know so They can sleep

Sunday afternoon, I Preached a message one time is funny.

I was preaching through Jonah. I was preaching through Jonah close to Christmastime and I preached a message called a

Christmas card from Jonah and I just talked about four things Jonah Would put on his

Christmas card to remind us, you know, I kind of use that loosely, you know Before things that Jonah reminds us that you know,

God remembers runaways God rescues resistors I had to look

God redeems rebels and God receives repenters and I just kind of you know

I kind of preached a top a kind of a topical a thematic sort of message from that kind of went with The season, you know, so I know that there are some guys out there and and you know

Lord bless them that that they refuse to Budge at all, you know,

I don't care where you know, if I'm wherever I'm preaching. I'm not moving on this Sunday, you know But I think that there's also some wisdom in the calendar to think through what what we're preaching and people's heart like well this could be a different episode, but People don't become less dead in their sins around the

Christmas season. Yeah, but but the reality is there are Opportunities that seem to be more prevalent

You know the guy the guy's going to the hardware store, he's going to his local hardware store to get a rake and He hates

God But as he's buying the rake blaring over the speakers are you know heart the herald angels sink?

Yeah, right I'm just I'm not saying he's less dead in his sins, but there's opportunities that we have during this time of year to Proclaim the gospel especially in the

South maybe maybe easier avenues if that makes sense and Let's let's let's point out something else.

That's just a reality no matter how healthy your church is On Christmas Day, there are going to be some people in your church that are not there

Because they're traveling their family lives three hours away, and they're going to be at their in their family meeting

They still may be in church but but they won't be in your church gathering because they're not going to be in town and That's just going to be the reality and you know in almost every church and then

The flip side will be true in a lot of churches too there will be people in your gathering

That aren't normally there because maybe they're in town Because their family is in town.

So I have one deacon. I have no doubt that Christmas morning He and his wife who usually are the only two in their family here because all their kids are grown and have moved away

They'll probably have you know Two rows of chairs filled up with their children and grandchildren because they'll all be here that Sunday morning so we will have people he we will have some people not here because they'll be traveling to be with family that day and we will have other people who will be here because they've traveled to be with family that day and that is a

Reality and if you try to say why I'm not worried about that. That doesn't matter. Well, it's reality

It's what's gonna happen preach Christ be ordinary sing pray worship

Honor the Lord. It's really an easy decision what we're going to do this Sunday is what we're going to do every

Sunday That's right. That's right Well brothers, it's been a good a good episode talking with you as always

Can't believe we have already made it to decide. I can't believe we're so far scheduled out praise God Yeah, so hopefully as the as the holiday season and the end of the year and all this kind of stuff shakes up We'll still be having an episode every week

Hey, I did want to mention this before we sign off the podcast today. I think it was yesterday

No, it's probably Monday. I binge listened to several episodes of the things above us roundtable and Everybody should go over there and listen to that.

There's a couple guys. Who are those guys? Thanks for mentioning that yeah my me and my friend

Michael Coughlin from Pickerington around Columbus, Ohio do that one and I have that Mark to mention and I appreciate that might have slipped my mind.

So yeah, we knew you guys mentioned you guys mentioned us Michael brought it up and you guys mentioned us and one of the podcasts that I listen to so we record at 515 in the morning on Wednesday, so oh wow, you should jump in one a

Wednesday Well, I I have I have a prayer meeting before we record this one on Wednesdays.

So well Okay, then All right, brother. This has been a

Good word. We'll we'll catch you guys next week on the real church podcast

Say goodbye, Eddie You guys have a Merry Christmas This isn't gonna be the last episode before Christmas.

Oh They might be the last one they listen to I don't know. No keep listening all the way to Christmas This isn't on your