March 5, 2019 Show with Brian Kachelmeier on “Reading Isaiah With Luther”

Live from the historic parsonage of 19th century gospel minister George Norcross in downtown

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platform on which pastors, Christian scholars and theologians address the burning issues

facing the church and the world today.

Proverbs 27 verse 17 tells us, iron sharpens iron, so one

man sharpens another.

Matthew Henry said that in this passage, quote, we are cautioned to take heed whom we

converse with and directed to have in view in conversation to make one another

wiser and better.

It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next hour, and we hope to hear

from you, the listener, with your own questions.

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Good afternoon, Cumberland County,.

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This is Chris Arntzen, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, wishing you all a happy Tuesday on this fifth day

of March 2019.

I'm delighted to have as a first -time guest today Pastor Brian Ketchelmeyer.

He received his B .A. in religious studies from the University of New Mexico, his Master of

Divinity from Concordia Theological Seminary, and he is the first pastor of Redeemer Evangelical

Lutheran Church, a congregation in the Lutheran Church Missouri Synod in

Los Alamos, New Mexico.

He's a lecturer on the global broadcast Redeemer Theological Academy, a frequent guest on

issues, etc., and Old Testament teacher for the Wittenberg Academy.

Today he's going to be addressing his new book with Concordia Publishing House, Reading

Isaiah with Luther, and it's my honor and privilege to welcome you for the very first time ever to Iron Sharpens Iron

Radio, Pastor Brian Ketchelmeyer.

Well hey Chris, it's great to be here.

It's great to have you, and I'm going to give our email address out right away for anybody who wants to

ask a question either on Isaiah or Luther or something about Pastor

Ketchelmeyer's own testimony or whatever you want to ask on in those realms.

Our email address is ChrisArntzen at gmail .com, C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N -Z -E -N at

gmail .com.

Please give us your first name, your city and state, and your country of residence if you live outside the USA.

Only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter.

And Pastor Ketchelmeyer, before we go on to what I normally

have first -time guests do, which is give a summary of your

personal testimony of salvation and what religious atmosphere you were

raised in and what kind of providential circumstances our Sovereign Lord raised up in your life to

draw you to himself and save you.

And of course, if you were raised in a Christian home and some of our guests cannot

remember ever being an unbeliever, we will ask you to give an account

of what were the providential circumstances that a change in your passion for

Christ, his gospel, and even led you into the ministry.

But before we do that, why don't you tell our listeners something about Redeemer Evangelical Lutheran.

Church

in

Los

Alamos,

New

Mexico.

A little

bit

different than

what

Norma

proclaimed

in a

church.

Well, I think it might be wise because of the fact that I

have contact with people from all different backgrounds within the pale of

evangelicalism.

A number of folks, when I tell them I might be interviewing a

Lutheran Church, Missouri Synod guest, if they are unfamiliar with Lutheranism,

very often there are two responses.

They'll be like, what?

Those liberal churches that ordain women and homosexuals and believe in same -sex marriage and

pro -abortion and on and on and on.

Sometimes they deny the essentials of the faith, the Trinity, the deity of Christ, the bodily resurrection, and I'm like, no,

no, no, no, no.

And sometimes they'll say, oh, you mean those churches that are just like the Catholic Church?

And they may think because of the more liturgical appearance, the

vestments and things like that, they may think automatically, oh, it's just like the Church of Rome.

Well, if you could correct our listeners on those two very.

Wrong notions

that they

may have in their

head.

Well, yeah, we are not the ELCA.

That's the ELCA.

We

are

not of

the ELCA.

But we

don't

hold

to that

shenanigans.

Instead,

we hold

to something

that might be a little bit different to some of your listeners, though, is

that God is after

God for salvation.

He comes out

alive, or

he tells a person with the withered hand, stretch out your hand, and

we do hold to that.

But we also hold to terminology.

Well, I think that my Calvinist.

Listeners will be familiar with it, because Calvinists do believe in that as well.

We believe without question that the Word of God proclaimed has power,

and that God uses it not only to raise Lazarus from his tomb, but

dead sinners into life, eternal life.

And so I am, as a Calvinist, I'm 100 % on the same page with you there.

And also, I wanted to give a caveat here.

I don't want to unnecessarily insult some of my dear sisters

who I think are in serious error when it comes to the ordination of women.

But there are Bible -believing, evangelical, born -again Christians out there who accept the

ordination of women, and they may be women pastors themselves.

Although I am in serious disagreement, I don't want to lump you in the same block or bunch

with those who I would consider apostates in some of the mainline liberal denominations.

And I know that the United Methodist Church, although we heard some good news about

the liberals losing a vote in regard to biblical

morality when it comes to sexual ethics, and heterosexuality, and

monogamy, and an opposition to same -sex marriage, and all that kind of thing.

There are United Methodist pastors who actually deny the deity of Christ in the Trinity.

Has the evangelical Lutheran Church in America gone that far as well?

Again, just to clarify, which is

not Missouri Synod.

Right, right, right, right, yeah.

And I would say you definitely

see that in

some,

in the whole concept of

that you

want God's

message,

God's Word is powerful.

And so when God speaks law and gospel, I mean, these are

two

powerful

things.

If that law comes

in, the

idolatry, but

it was

claimed

as

God's

Word.

We have that written Word for a reason.

Amen.

And by the way, I was having a conversation with somebody just the other day.

One of the things that's confusing for us, and might even be confusing for Lutherans,

when you distinguish the different synods, you have the

notorious evangelical Lutheran Church in America that we were just talking about, the liberal, even

apostate denomination.

And then you have folks in solid, biblically faithful churches that are in the Missouri

Synod, or perhaps the Wisconsin Synod, or some of the other conservative

denominations within Lutheranism, that still will have in their name, such as your congregation,

Redeemer Evangelical Lutheran Church.

Now, people might automatically think, oh, that's an Elka Church, because you have three of the letters of Elka in there, you have

Evangelical Lutheran Church.

But if you want to comment, why is that very common, where Evangelical will be in the name, even knowing that there could be

confusion with Elka?

Right,

right.

We take

up

our

own

princes,

who

are the

evangelical,

that there is

no other

name under heaven, whereby we must be saved.

In His name alone, we have the forgiveness of.

Sins.

Amen.

And although I have, and you may have met Missouri Synod Lutheran ministers who do not

like to be called Protestants.

Yeah, right, right, right, right, right.

Historically, again, we were the

first.

We're kind of, when we come here in America,

these kind of, these names have already been staked out over here.

Like

when

we

see,

we were

Johnny

come

lately,

German

Lutherans,

the

scene,

they

constantly,

every time

you

merge

together,

has

a history going

back into free from...

By the way, I don't know if you've ever seen this hilarious episode of Cheers,

when Woody comes strolling into the bar all depressed, and he's supposed to be on his honeymoon,

and he is asked why he is so sad, and he said he just found out during his honeymoon that his

wife is of a different religion than he is, and Frazier

says to him, I thought you were both Lutheran, and he says, well, that's what I thought, but I'm Missouri Synod, and

she's Lutheran Church of America, and the whole episode was about this like huge difference.

It was hilarious, but anyway, I urge you folks to go on YouTube and Google that scene, and it's

very funny.

Before we go into your own testimony, what are the Lutheran Synods that you

recommend?

Of course you recommend the Missouri Synod, but other than that, so if our listeners are from a

Lutheran background, they say, I'm sick of this liberalism in the congregation that I'm in,

it's neither evangelical nor Lutheran, and they want to find a Lutheran church that's faithful to

the scriptures.

What are the denominations or the synods within Lutheranism that you could recommend with a good conscience?

How Lutheran are the Lutheran brethren?

I know they're not liberal, but they don't seem to be quite as liturgical, I

don't believe, as the Missouri Synod or the Wisconsin Synod and some of the other denominations you mentioned.

Yeah,

and so

some of

the battles

are like when

you

have a

historian,

he's

not

trying

to

that

glory

and

honor

are

important.

Number

one, it was a

very

doctrinal

reformation

in the sense

that it was

the

high

priest.

So you

have

Luther's

reform of the

mass that

started with

these songs that

are

coming.

Prince wants

to be

Lutheran.

I mean, if he's

Lutheran,

his territory

becomes a

Lutheran

confession,

and

so he goes

to

the

Augsburg

Confession.

It

was

a very,

which

is not

saying,

finds

different

numbers of

Lutheran

brethren.

It

was a

kind of a

patriotism,

the idea.

And just to wrap this up, as far as the differences between

liberals and Romanists, we haven't really, well, you have mentioned some of the

major elements of why you're different from Romanism, but to just set it here in stone and the understanding of our listeners is

very important.

The gospel of the conservative, biblically faithful Lutheran synods like the

Missouri Synod is not the gospel of the Roman Catholic Church.

You believe in the pillars of the Reformation, the watchwords, salvation by grace alone,

through faith alone, in Christ alone, the glory of God alone, and you're under the

authority of the scriptures alone.

And

to just clarify,

when I

said

under

the authority

of the scriptures alone,

obviously there are other authorities that we have, but the scriptures are our only infallible and inerrant authority.

And so the idea is, and the,

your

mind is, I mean,

so the holy, the

scripture

alone,

in the scripture, that

God has revealed what

you say, he says,

it's in a word,

I'm not

going to

listen

to you because it's not of the Holy Spirit.

By the way, I want to let you know something.

I don't know if you're familiar with my very dear friend of many years, going back to 1995, Dr. James R.

White of Alpha Omega Ministries.

He is a Reformed Baptist, a theologian, Calvinist, and Baptist.

But he, during the 500th anniversary of the nailing of the 95 Theses on the

door of the Castle Church in Wittenberg, he preached from

Luther's pulpit.

You can see it on YouTube.

And it was such a profound sight to see my friend up there.

Oh, wow.

Yeah, I know him.

Yeah, just thought I'd let you know that.

And you should check it out on YouTube.

We're going to our first break right now, and when we return, we're going to have a summary of our guest's

salvation testimony, and then we'll move right into his book, which is the main theme today.

The book that we are addressing today, published by Concordia Publishing House, Reading

Isaiah with Luther.

And if you'd like to join us on the air with a question of your own, send us an email to chrisarnsen at gmail .com.

That's C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N -Z -E -N at gmail .com.

Please give us your first name at least, your city and state of residence, and your country of residence if you live

outside the USA.

Only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal or private matter.

Don't go away.

We'll be right back with Pastor Brian Keschelmeyer and Reading Isaiah with Luther.

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We are now back with Brian Kutchelmeier, who is the pastor of Redeemer

Evangelical Lutheran Church in Los Alamos, New Mexico, lecturer on the global broadcast Redeemer

Theological Academy and a very frequent guest on Issues Etc. and

also the Old Testament teacher for the Wittenberg Academy.

We are addressing his book, Reading Isaiah with Luther, a new publication or recent

publication of Concordia Publishing House.

Our email address, if you have a question, is chrisarnzen at gmail .com, c -h -r -i -s -a -r -n -z -e -n at gmail .com.

Please give us your first name, city and state, and country of residence if you live outside the USA and only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal or

private matter.

Before we go to any of our listener questions, Pastor Brian, if you could now give us a summary of your

salvation testimony, what kind of providential circumstances were raised in your

life by our Sovereign God that drew you to Himself and saved you?

Even before that, what kind of religious atmosphere, if any, were you raised in?

And what led you into the Lutheran ministry?

This is a great question.

I grew up in a

high

grad school.

And

he

goes,

and

I found

out that

God is

real.

And it's about this time that all these things were happening

at colleges.

That goes on there.

So this

individual made me think.

Another individual, my wife.

Now, of

course,

she

came

before

me.

Yeah, why not?

And I said, well, you know, not 100, maybe 90

-something, for sure.

And he said, well, for sure.

And I said, well, yeah.

If you just

tell them there's nothing

that can

happen in high school, now I'm

at college, and now this guy at my door says I don't ever have to go to church again,

we deal in Savior.

And I said, Jesus is my Lord and Savior.

He says, all right.

He goes, told me so.

And then he walked away, and I never saw the guy again.

Now it

may

be

baptized.

Because you never see that in a Roman Catholic church, right?

And I think it was

like Fourth

of July

weekend, or Hunger

for God.

I want to know what he

tells somebody what

I've learned.

Teaching, I'm

telling them.

And, of course, there is more than one Baptist perspective.

We have a wide spectrum.

I mean, for crying out loud, Bill Clinton was a Baptist, or is a Baptist.

So far cry from a Reformed Baptist.

But anyway, I'm sorry.

Lord's Supper.

Okay, so we start to talk about the Lord's Supper.

And I had been going there week after week, and the mantra was

time out.

To me, it was, you take God's Word at

face value.

Why is

it

not at

this

value?

And

say,

yeah,

the idea

was

the

different

churches.

It seems so simple.

When this preacher was telling,

how did

they get

to where

he was

really

intrigued

with looking?

In the

idea

that I am to

eat

the

bones

on the

Scripture.

And it was in this study of the history where I come

back to

not

the emphasis on

what you Lord

of the

world.

By the enemy.

He brings you back to his kingdom.

That's the idea of a Lord.

The one who's out there

to mask all

of these gifts.

I did

have

kind

of a

conservative

ELCA

embraces

the gay and

lesbian

agenda.

Not looking through

this and this

book are the

documents that

you want to

personally confess because you like them.

And then you go back to this.

You like to hear it.

You say,

that's what God

sent it in trying to be

really different.

Unconditional subscription to that book.

We like to hold sure

of your salvation.

The book of Jesus.

And that work of Jesus, of course, is giving.

Who died for all of your sins.

Even that one sin that's troubling you.

Cause of Jesus.

Because we're justified.

Well, one of these days perhaps we can have some kind of a friendly debate on the Lord's Supper.

In fact, you might not be aware of this.

But there are differences even amongst very conservative and reformed Baptists.

Some who take a more memorialist view.

But there are those that take more of a view and align with Calvin.

Of a real presence.

A spiritual presence.

That still would probably disagree with the historic Lutheran view.

Which I know that not all Lutherans like the term consubstantiation.

Because they like to leave more of it to the realm of mystery.

If I'm getting this right.

But when we come back from the break.

We have to go to our elongated break right now.

Because Grace Life Radio in Lake City, Florida.

Requires of us a longer break in the middle.

Because they run their own commercials and public service announcements.

To localize Iron Sherpens Iron Radio to Lake City, Florida.

So during this elongated break.

Please use it wisely.

Use this time wisely.

Not only by writing down questions for Brian Ketchelmeyer.

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is God in the flesh who came to save sinners by his life, death, and resurrection, and that the task of the Church is to

honor and serve the Triune God in all things.

IRVS Theological Seminary is dedicated by God's grace to preparing godly ministers who will be committed to

these doctrines.

Do you sense a call to serve Jesus Christ and his Church as a pastor?

Why not consider IRVS Theological Seminary?

You'll find more information at irvsseminary .org.

That's irvsseminary .org, two S's in the middle.

I hope to hear from you soon.

God bless you.

Chris Sorensen, host of Iron Sherpins Iron Radio here.

I want to tell you about a man I have personally known for many years.

His name is Dan Buttafuoco.

Dan is a personal injury and medical malpractice lawyer, but not the type that typically comes to mind.

Dan cares about people and is a theologian himself.

Recently, he wrote a book titled Consider the Evidence for the Bible.

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Dan also has a master's degree in theology.

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Dan is an exceptional trial lawyer.

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Welcome back.

This is Chris Arnson.

If you just tuned to Synn today, our guest for the full two hours with a little less than an hour to go is

Brian Ketchelmeyer, who is the pastor of Redeemer Evangelical Lutheran Church, a congregation within

the Lutheran Church Missouri Synod in Los Alamos, New Mexico.

And we are discussing his book, Reading Isaiah with Luther.

And if you'd like to join us on the air with a question of your own, our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com.

Chrisarnson at gmail .com.

And please give us your first name, city and state, and country of residence if you live outside the USA.

Please only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter.

Before I return to Pastor Brian, I just have some announcements for special events that I have to make.

And first of all, this Friday, March 8th, from 4 to 6 p .m., our guest, once again on Iron Sharpens

Iron Radio, will be Dr. James R. White of Alpha and Omega Ministry, who returns after a long absence.

I'm so looking forward to this interview with my dear friend and brother, Dr. James R. White.

He is going to be addressing the recent document signed by both Pope

Francis and a world -renowned Muslim imam.

And we're going to be discussing the real meaning behind this, what the ramifications truly are,

does this really have any bearing on either the Church of Rome or Islam, and

so on.

So we hope that you tune in for that conversation this Friday, March 8th, 4 to 6 p .m. Eastern Time,

with Dr. James R. White of Alpha and Omega Ministries.

Coming up March 15th and 16th, the Sanctification Through Suffering Conference is

being held.

This is a conference of striving for eternity ministries.

The speakers include Justin Peters, Frank Mullis, Joe Suozzo, and Colleen Sharp.

This is going to be held in Freehold, New Jersey.

And if you'd like to attend this Sanctification Through Suffering conference, you can go to

strivingforeternity .org, strivingforeternity .org.

I hope that my listeners in the Freehold, New Jersey area, even if you have to take a train, plane, or automobile to get

there, we hope that you attend, if at all possible, to the Sanctification Through Suffering conference,

March 15th through the 16th, in Freehold, New Jersey.

Please make sure you tell the folks at Striving for Eternity Ministries that you heard about the event from Chris Arns in an

Iron Sharpens Iron radio.

Also, coming up, May 28th through the 30th, God

willing, I will be in Elizabethtown, Pennsylvania, for the Banner of Truth East Coast Ministers Conference

on the theme, I Believe in the Holy Spirit.

The speakers include Jeff Kingswood, Terry Johnston, David Vaughn, who is a

Reformed Baptist missionary in France, Dr. Stephen J. Nichols, who is the president

of Reformation Bible College, the college founded by the late R .C. Sproul and Ligonier Ministries, Michael Morales,

and Chad Vegas.

That's the East Coast Ministers Conference of the Banner of Truth, May 28th through the 30th in Elizabethtown,

Pennsylvania, at the Elizabethtown College.

If you'd like to register for this conference, go to BannerofTruth .org, BannerofTruth .org, click on Events,

and then click on East Coast Ministers Conference.

Of course, you can click on any of the conferences that they are having because some of them are

on the West Coast of the United States, some of them are in the United Kingdom.

So wherever you are, because we do have a global audience, if you'd rather go to one of the events that's closer to you, by

all means, go to the event that is closest to you.

But I will be personally, God willing, at the East Coast Ministers Conference in Elizabethtown, Pennsylvania.

That's BannerofTruth .org, BannerofTruth .org.

Then we have the Foundations Conference coming up December 19th and 20th in New York City.

I love this conference.

The speakers are always phenomenal.

And this year, we have Dr. Stephen J. Lawson, whose voice you heard earlier promoting

New Covenant Church, NYC, one of the sponsors of Iron Trumpets Iron Radio, a Calvinistic Baptist

church in Manhattan.

Dr. Stephen J. Lawson of One Passion Ministries will be speaking.

Rev. Jeff Thomas, who is a phenomenal retired pastor from Wales.

He is really extraordinary.

I really urge you to go hear him wherever he may be speaking.

Richard Caldwell Jr., Rev. Armin Tomasian, who I think is going to be a household name within the

next 10 years globally amongst Christians, especially theologically

Reformed Christians.

Andrew Quigley, and Paul Washer has just recently been added to the roster, which makes this event even

more exciting and something that you should attend if you can.

And remember, this is a small venue in Manhattan.

It only seats about 200 people.

So, please, if you want to go, I would register as quickly as you can at

thefoundationsconference .com and that's December 19th and 20th in Manhattan.

And then, lastly, if you love Iron Trumpets Iron Radio, you don't want us to disappear from the airwaves, you love

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And now we are back with our guest, Brian Kitchelmeyer, and our discussion on reading

Isaiah with Luther.

The email address, again, for your questions is chrisarnsen at gmail .com.

And Brian, I think that it would be wise for you, just before you go into the theme of the book,

to compare and contrast what you were saying about the Eucharist, about the Lord's Supper, about Communion,

about it being really Jesus.

How would that be different from the concept of the Roman Catholic Mass that involves

transubstantiation, where the elements are actually, in their minds and in their belief system,

transformed into the physical body and blood of Christ?

And also, in regard to the perpetuatory sacrifice of the Mass, which they believe

is a repetition, every time it's performed, of Christ's sacrifice in an unbloody manner.

And also, in regard to the worship of the elements that the Church of Rome is involved in.

Those three things, if you could compare and contrast that with the historic Lutheran understanding of that.

Yeah, and when you go back to history, I

mean, this

is to make

sense,

which

is the

word that's

spoken that gives to us this wonderful gift,

trying to make it

look like bread.

By the way, I just want to let you know that when I was raised Roman Catholic, as were you, you would probably agree with me that

the substance they used for the Lord's Supper did not look or taste or feel like bread.

LAUGHTER.

Or even unleavened bread.

It looks like something totally foreign to anything edible.

But anyway, I'm sorry.

Right, right.

You have the substance,

no

matter

if it's plain.

God's Word,

is one for you.

So he won it for you.

He distributes it to you.

Even preaching, the preaching of the Gospel, is a means of grace.

Yeah, and

now it's

being

transubstantial.

The priest

to do the

leftover.

And genuflecting when you go into the Church is because of the fact that Christ is physically present on the altar.

Well, yeah, it would depend if there's a tabernacle and the light's on.

So if the light's on, it tells you that the

remains can't be changed back.

The thing that Jesus is

doing

for you, that he's

giving you, are

saying it.

...priest, rather than on the work of Jesus.

So

it's

not

focused

on the work

of

the

Church.

...between a Eucharistic sacrifice is

a...

On the other hand, you have the...

We have an advocate with the Father, and he is the righteous one.

He alone earned...

Amen.

And although the term perpetuatory sacrifice might be foreign to many of our listeners,

certainly not to those who are Calvinists for any reasonable period of time,

because one of the reasons we believe in definite atonement is because we believe Christ's death on the cross was a

perpetuatory sacrifice.

Therefore, no one for whom Christ died will be in hell.

But obviously, that's one of the differences that we have with our Lutheran friends.

But that will be a subject for a different time, because we only have less than a half hour left, and we want to get into your

book.

We are going into the final break right now.

This will be a shorter break than the last one.

And if you have questions, and I apologize to those who have been waiting to have their questions asked and answered, we will get to you as quickly

as possible.

But if you have a question and you haven't written it in yet, send it in immediately, because we're running out of time.

ChrisArnson at gmail .com.

ChrisArnson at gmail .com.

Don't go away.

We'll be right back.

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Hi, I'm Stephan Lindblad, Assistant Professor of Systematic Theology at IRBS

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I accepted this call to teach at the seminary because I'm firmly convinced that the people of

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Welcome back.

This is Chris Arnzen, and this is the last 20 minutes or so of our show today with Brian

Ketchelmeyer.

We are discussing his book, Reading Isaiah with Luther, and if you'd like to join us now is the time to

do it before we run out of time with an email at chrisarnzen at gmail .com.

C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N -Z -E -N at gmail .com.

Give us your first name, city, and state and country of residence.

If you live outside of the USA, only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter.

Pastor Brian, this book, Reading Isaiah with Luther, I know that you take a different approach

than most of that which has been written about the book of Isaiah and about

Isaiah himself and regarding to commentaries and so on.

This has to do with the conscience, and tell us about this unique perspective

and also how it has a relationship with Martin Luther, the great reformer.

Yeah, I

think

that

what

seems

like

it's

a

comfort,

this whole language of the understanding

of

feeling

right

with you think

you're going to

walk in

the room,

the idea that this child has done something,

this idea of a society, we are being fed,

breaking our conscience, it's numbing our conscience, it's not working properly.

The gay and

lesbian agenda, their consciences, because they know in their heart of hearts that this is wrong, but if you keep

saying the mantra that it's okay and you're okay,

the whole topic of the gospel once again,

Luther in particular, he's going

to be a lawyer,

but he gets caught in that

lightning sportal,

and he's going to be judged, and he's going to die, and

if you're

with God,

you fall short

of the

glory of

God.

Even to the point of torturing himself and flagellating himself and also going to

receive the sacrament of penance, so -called, and spending long hours until the priest said to

chase him out of the confessional booth.

Well, and see, this has to do with the conscience, right?

Right.

The idea at that time was that you have

to articulate,

trying to, all

this time

that he's

done, then he would, he still wouldn't feel okay.

He could never appease the conscience that just always,

and I'm giving you these dates on purpose because this all works, it's

in 1517 where he knells those 95 theses on the door, and we know that last year.

I want you to understand that this issue, this is an issue of passion.

He's concerned because he has

disciplinary

indulgence.

And again, I'm good with

a piece of paper.

I mean, there's no promise from God.

This is a man -made right in your own conscience.

Tricking the people in, I

would argue, is a 21.

Right.

My conscience is captive

to conscience.

Any other way, it's

1521, 1527, talking about the

conscience and about this conscience

that can, because of

the speaking out against all,

by the thing

which

is

God.

Isaiah 53, of St. Isaiah,

the Lamb of

God who

takes us to

give all

his

message,

and these

men are being

re -emperor at that time.

Well, we have a listener, Gordy in Mechanicsburg, Pennsylvania, who has a question for you.

Martin Luther once said of the book of Isaiah, ought to be written on

parchment of gold and lettered in diamonds.

Please share your thoughts on why Luther would make such a bold statement about this particular book of the Old Testament.

This idea of writing in gold.

The idea that these words are golden nuggets.

I mean, we'll even use that language in our own idiom.

These

nuggets

of writing these words on your heart

and in your certainty.

So when Isaiah sees, Luther sees Isaiah the other way around.

When Luther sees Isaiah, he sees Isaiah as a preacher, as a man

who's working with people who have been tricked.

They've been deluded and they've been deceived by the religious teachers of his day.

I mean, not just ones who are supposed to be

the professors, the pastors, the preachers, the ones that are supposed to be

teaching God's word.

The whole epitome of the entire old,

the devil himself is the

father of lies.

Passages about Jesus.

I mean, these wonderful passages.

You have the voice crying out in the wilderness.

Servant, this is the one I'm well pleased in.

This is my chosen one.

Or 61, where Jesus says, or you get into 60.

The

totality

of the...

Well, Gordy, you have won a free copy of the book that we have been discussing.

Reading Isaiah with Luther.

Please make sure we have your full mailing address in Mechanicsburg, Pennsylvania.

And I'm going to give you, Pastor Brian, about one and a half minutes to summarize what you most want

etched in the hearts and minds of our listeners right now.

The image of Jesus.

The image of...

We still are

sinners that have this inclination to sin.

We still want to rebel against God, and the Holy Spirit is working to renew our minds.

But it's always that assurance that...

Amen.

And we will have, God willing, Pastor Brian Ketchelmeyer back on the program

to continue on his discussion on his book, Reading Isaiah with Luther.

And we'll spend the majority of the two hours next time highlighting that book and the

contents of that book.

So everybody who is waiting, that has been waiting patiently to have your questions asked and answered, I will bring up

your questions the next time that Pastor Ketchelmeyer is on the show, God willing.

And I want to make sure that you all have his website for Redeemer Evangelical Lutheran Church of Los Alamos,

New Mexico.

It is RedeemerLosAlamos .org.

RedeemerLosAlamos .org.

If you want more information about the book, Reading Isaiah with Luther, you can go to

Concordia Publishing House's website, CPH .org.

CPH .org.

And Pastor Ketchelmeyer, if you could hang on the line there just for a moment so I can give you a proper goodbye

when we go off the air.

And I want to thank everybody who listened today.

I want to thank, obviously, Pastor Ketchelmeyer for being our guest today.

I want to thank those of you who were patiently waiting with questions, and especially those who didn't have the chance to have

your questions heard on the air.

As I said, the next time our guest returns, we'll bring up your questions.

And I want all of you to always remember for the rest of your lives that Jesus Christ is a far greater

Savior than you are a sinner.