Michael Coughlin Interview

Welcome to No Compromise Radio, a ministry coming to you from Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston.

No Compromise Radio is a program dedicated to the ongoing proclamation of Jesus Christ, based on the theme in Galatians 2, verse 5, where the

Apostle Paul said, �But we did not yield in subjection to them for even an hour, so that the truth of the gospel would remain with you.�

In short, if you like smooth, watered -down words to make you simply feel good, this show isn�t for you.

By purpose, we are first biblical, but we can also be controversial. Stay tuned for the next 25 minutes as we�re called by the

Divine Trumpet to summon the troops for the honor and glory of her King. Here�s our host, Pastor Mike Abendroth.

Welcome to No Compromise Radio, a ministry. My name is Mike Abendroth. I think I normally talk in a higher -pitched voice, but the second that red light goes on for the radio, we have to engage in a more low -bass

Jean -Luc Picard type of voice. Anyway, what we like to do on the show is talk about biblical issues.

Jesus, of course, never compromised, so we like to talk about Him a lot, and in light of His lack of compromise, we don�t want to.

I�m sure we do in a lot of areas, but it is our desire not to. On Wednesdays, I like to have guests on, theologians, pastors, authors, friends, evangelists, all different kinds of people, and it serves several purposes.

Number one, I need airtime filled. Number two, I get to hear from people who have been gifted by the

Lord, called, loved, set apart, and they are doing work for the

Lord�s kingdom where they are. That is to say, not everybody is some kind of, you know,

T4G speaker or some kind of huge platform person, but we all have a ministry because God has given us salvation and His Spirit and spiritual gifts, and then

I get encouraged when I know people are trying to faithfully exercise those. So today,

I have a special guest we met not that long ago, Michael Coghlan. Welcome to No Compromise Radio Ministry.

Thank you, Mike. So Michael, how did we meet? What was our first, I mean, if somebody ever meets you, they don't soon forget it, but how did we meet?

We were at the Judge Not Conference in Cleveland, Ohio, and you were there speaking, and I came up to say hello, and you said hello to me, and I started to introduce myself, and you said my name, and you said you recognized me from the

Internet, and I was instantly afraid that I had done something to offend you.

Well, so far you haven't, but just give it time. Yeah, sure. As one man said, there's always room for deprovement.

There you go. And so, Michael, as we got to know each other, I was encouraged by your desire to see

Christ's name exalted, not just at the conference, but also where the Lord has given you opportunity for ministry.

So before we talk about that and understand your ministry better,

I'm sure you weren't born a Christian, were you? What's your testimony? I was raised

Catholic, and I was actually sort of a good

Catholic when I was in my teens. I went to Catholic high school for a year, and I even went to a

Catholic university. And as I got into my 20s, the discrepancies between being a good

Catholic and what I wanted to do in this world were too great, and so I was really into partying.

I was a drunkard, and pretty much just about anything else that the world likes to be into,

I was really, really into. And for me, to try to deal with all the guilt that I felt knowing the truth from Catholic teaching about sin was just too much.

And I remember in my early 20s, I thought about my sin, and I thought about things like penance and the

Eucharist, and I remember thinking to myself, if I can do these little rituals and those things would appease a

God who's supposedly angry with me for my sin, then that was really no God at all in my mind.

And so I just walked away from Christian religion altogether, and spent the next decade of my life effectively as a,

I don't know, kind of an Oprah spiritualist. You know, I would sort of dive into anything anybody had going—yoga, you know, any religion somebody tried out,

I'd say, hey, I'll try it too. Now, Michael, I know I'm interrupting you, but for our listeners, since they can't see you, how tall are you?

About 5 '11". Okay. And would you say you're—how would you describe your build?

I would describe it as muscular. That's a compliment.

Well, since we're on radio, I'm athletic, and trim, and healthy -skinned.

Well, you just admitted you used to be a drunkard, but now let's not do any kind of lying. Sure. Well, I'll tell you that I'm a bigger guy, and I've been able to pass for, like, a professional football player in the past when

I was younger. Well, see, that's what I thought of. I thought of middle linebacker. I thought of, you'll be a good bodyguard for me, that type of thing.

And so I just was putting together the pieces—Oprah, spiritualist, and yoga man as the middle linebacker.

How'd that work out for you? Yeah, well, I actually really liked yoga, and I really got into yoga.

And I was a member of Alcoholics Anonymous, where I was being taught that I could sort of make anything

I wanted my god, and I just floated along. And then, when

I was 30 years old, I got saved through reading the Word of God. I was going through a divorce.

I was hurting, and some Christian people reached out to me—a guy gave me a place to live, and basically they invited me to church and gave me the gospel.

And after several months of fighting that, I decided I'm just going to read the Bible myself, and through reading the

Bible for about a week, God saved me. And I remember in July of 2006,

I was taught at the time you had to pray a prayer to receive salvation. That was the type of people that had witnessed to me.

And so I prayed for the Lord to save me, and actually getting back to the yoga, to circle back around.

One of the things that was really interesting was I went to a church that was very—we'll call it liberal.

And so that church actually had yoga classes. And a few months after I got saved,

I was reading the Word, listening to things online at the time, and I actually started to become convicted inside this yoga class that I didn't want to be there anymore.

And the way I've always described it to people, it was like one day I liked cheeseburgers, and then the next day I just hated the taste of them.

And that's what it was like with yoga. I loved yoga, I was really into it, and then all of a sudden one day

I couldn't stand to be there anymore. And, you know, I credit the Holy Spirit with that. Amen.

Well, we're talking to Mike Coghlan today. Mike's a friend from the Midwest. Now when I was in Nebraska, I considered that Midwest.

Where are you technically? What state? Ohio? I'm in Columbus, Ohio. Okay. Is that Midwest too?

I am considered Midwest, I'm considered the—it's actually the top of the Bible belt, I think, when you're still in Columbus.

If you get any more north than me, it's no longer considered the Bible belt. All right, let's talk a little bit about Columbus as a city and kind of their spiritual temperature and the barometer of Columbus.

Would you say—I won't put words in your mouth. How would you describe, in general, the spiritual climate in Columbus?

Columbus is the epitome of pluralism and, like, postmodern tolerance.

And if there's one thing I would brag about Columbus is when they say they're tolerant of everything, they really are.

And because of that, I actually enjoy a lot of freedom and stuff when

I preach and when I evangelize in Columbus. But Columbus has, for a while, been one of the top few cities in the country for promoting homosexual agenda and having actual population of gay people.

There's a lot of people in Columbus who are Christian. There's some Catholics here.

It's not a real big Catholic place, but there are several Catholic schools and a lot of Catholics here.

But really, we have just about anything you'd want, and we're multicultural. I think we're about as multicultural as any place in our country, to be honest with you.

And we have a big university here, the Ohio State University, and they have a lot of people that come from all over the world to go to that university, and then, in many cases, they find a job somewhere near there, and so that might be one of the reasons we're like that.

Michael, that leads me to this question about evangelism and preaching. I know you like to do that. That's a real passion for you.

The stereotypical street evangelist, they give all law, you know, turn, burn, repent.

Maybe their blood vessels are about ready to burst on their forehead. Maybe a kind of a...what's

the name of that group that's, you know, angry all the time? West...what are they called?

Westboro? Yeah, Westboro. It's that kind of a stereotypical caricature that's often out there for evangelists, and some of them are like that.

One of the things on your website I was looking at was how I made my waterproof hymnals.

So before we talk about the content of your message when you preach, and how it has to be about Jesus too, and not just man's response, tell us a little bit about the waterproof hymnals, because I can just imagine if there's a bunch of men who are at a, you know, outside of an

Ohio State game, and you're preaching the gospel, but you're also singing, and what would make you want to get a bunch of waterproof hymnals or make them?

Give me the story behind that, because to me that lends itself to you being the non -stereotypical screamer.

When I was in New Orleans in 2000, I think it was 2013, for the

Super Bowl, I was leading a team of about nine or ten guys, and if there was ever a

Bad News Bears group of evangelists, this was it. And I was a new leader at the time, there was really no qualification for being a leader other than the guy who's the big leader asks you to do it, and so I'm out on the street with these guys, and they were all over the place with anxiety, and everybody, you know, one guy wanted to go to the next corner, and the other guy said, no, let's go left, and this guy's saying go right, and people aren't staying with the group, and it was really just, it was just chaotic, and I had this group of guys that the maturity level was just not where it needed to be, and what we found is

I said, guys, let's just sing a song together just to sort of ground ourselves, and we started singing

Amazing Grace, because everybody pretty much knows Amazing Grace, and what we found is that it really got us all in the spirit of worshiping

Christ, and it got us all together as a team rather than kind of thinking differently, you know, there's so much in the

Bible about being of one mind and of one spirit, and then the other thing that we noticed was it really attracted attention from people that were walking by, even people who admittedly, you know, weren't

Christians, and so I thought of all of the gimmicks people use to try to draw a crowd, singing worship songs to God on the street is certainly one that I wouldn't exclude from my toolbox, and then after doing that,

I just found I really, I like doing it, I believe that it's a good part of being with a group of Christians while you're out evangelizing, so we don't necessarily do it to draw a crowd, but it does seem to get people's attention, and when you sing a lot of hymns, you're proclaiming the gospel in so many words, so I appreciate doing it, and I find that it's good for all of our hearts.

Michael, just yesterday I received an email from a No Compromise radio listener, and she asked the question, dear

Pastor Mike, this is just out of memory, I'm putting together some songs for a funeral and the worship service, and I want to have the most gospel -centered hymns to sing there because I want the unbelievers, who will be many, to hear the message in the song, and to me it's almost the same thing.

She's thinking evangelism in her hymnody, and of course it strengthens Christians as well, but it's the same thing.

You're proclaiming attributes of God, whether that's amazing grace or, I don't know, how great thou art, or immortal, invisible, the attributes of God, and these days, in my opinion, most people don't know about God specifically.

They know Him generally, right? Romans chapter 1, and He's wise, and He's powerful in creation, that's enough to damn them, but they don't know particulars, and so if you're singing songs about the attributes of God and then you're telling the people, this is the

God with whom you have to do, that seems to be beneficial. Do you think?

Absolutely. We believe God's Word is the power, and whether I'm proclaiming

God's Word through preaching, or whether I'm handing somebody a gospel tract, or even if we're singing truths that are derived from God's Word, we believe there's power for God to work in people's hearts, right?

Absolutely. It performs its work in those who believe, and it also is a powerful sword to cut through any type of Oprah spirituality yoga.

All right, Michael, I want to talk to you about the message that you proclaim. I have seen street evangelists who've done a wonderful job, even if they got up and they started reading the

Gospel of John, and I've also heard them talk about the beauties of Christ and who

Jesus is as the God -man, and why He came to save sinners as substitute and was the risen

Savior. I've heard some great street preaching, but I've also just heard a bunch of law, this is, you know, repent, repent, repent, and of course, people should repent, and we should proclaim repentance when it comes to sin.

But we also have to proclaim faith in Christ Jesus, you must believe in this Jesus. What have you found to be wise strategy to talk about who

Jesus is as you preach, instead of just telling people to run from sin only?

For me, the easiest thing to do when I'm street preaching is not entirely different from what

I think a guy like you tries to do in the pulpit, and that's stick to some biblical text as much as I can.

And when I'm street preaching, I'm not necessarily going to try to go as deep or get into as much teaching about some of the concepts in a little verse, in a little section of a text or in a verse.

But I can still read, like, Psalm 103, or I can read Romans 1,

I can read Psalm 14, Philippians 2, verses 1 to 12,

I love reading that section of scripture in the open air. And then what I do is I'll read that, and then

I'll just sort of start preaching what it means. And usually what it is is it's a launching point to just explain to people who

Jesus Christ is. And I try to talk about His attribute, in particular His sinlessness.

And when I talk about His sinlessness, it's a natural transition to explain, well, what is sin, and how are we manifesting our sinfulness in our lives?

And so I try not to avoid preaching about the law and about people's sin, and at the same time,

I'm always trying to be mindful to lead them back to who the Savior is. And it's vitally important to me that I mention the resurrection repeatedly.

But one of the things that I...there's really a couple kinds of open air ministry, and the one that I most commonly have engaged in lately is when

I'm at events where people are moving. So if you imagine I'm standing at a street corner, there's 200 people standing there at a red light.

They're waiting for the light to change and for the police officer to tell them they can cross so they can walk closer to the stadium, like in an

Ohio State game. And I have about three or four minutes to basically tell them all of it, what sin is, what

Jesus did, and what their response ought to be. And then the police officer lets them go, and then there's about a 30 -second break where everyone's moving, and then there's a whole new crowd.

And so I end up repeating the same message over and over, and I've told other people, the only reason I change it is to entertain myself a little.

But the focus is, who is Jesus? These people need to know who Jesus is. I was going to let you go.

I think people would be shocked if they did some street evangelism. How many people today, the average person on the street you meet, that really can't tell you a few facts about Jesus Christ, just historical facts anybody would know that studied world religions?

It's astounding to me. Well, I'm encouraged to hear your desire to talk about the Lord Jesus, and in case anyone misheard me,

I'm not saying we shouldn't talk about the law, because that's going to set the standard, right? If we summarize everything, perfectly love

God and perfectly love your neighbor, and anything short of that, of course, is sin, and then we have to talk about Jesus as the sin bearer, and why would

Jesus come if sin wasn't the issue? If it was education, He would just talk, but it's sin.

And we have to talk about the law, but we also have to give them the good news. The good news is, even though you're sinful, even though you deserve hell, even though, etc.,

Jesus Christ has demonstrated conspicuously that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

So, I'm also encouraged, Michael, with your talk about the resurrection, because the gospel isn't the gospel without the resurrection.

That is an essential part. I mean, you can imagine, and you know well, if Jesus didn't rise from the dead,

A, what He said in Mark 8 and 9 and 10 was a lie, so now He's not the

Messiah, or He had to die for His own sins, and then He couldn't be raised, or the Father didn't accept the sacrifice, and the list goes on.

So the resurrection is important. Michael, I'm looking at your website, MichaelCoghlan .net,

M -I -C -H -A -E -L -C -O -U -G -H -L -I -N .net, and there's a picture,

I assume it's outside of, I don't know if it's the Ohio State University, but there's a street named

The Undisputed Way, and there's somebody, one of your friends there, preaching underneath it, and your caption is,

The Undisputed Way, Jesus Christ. What kind of street is The Undisputed Way? Is that a

Columbus deal? That was when we won the first college football playoff national championship, the football team in Ohio State, and so we were the undisputed champions.

Oh, okay. And see, to tie it in with the resurrection, Jesus is the undisputed champion over sin and death and hell and everything else, amen?

Absolutely. Michael, what are you working on these days when it comes to, whether it's a waterproof hymnal or now that Ohio State isn't around for football games, what's on your agenda ministry -wise?

Well, a few days ago, I don't know when this was published, but April 14, Ohio State football actually had their spring football game, which is an inter -squad scrimmage, and that attracts maybe 60 ,000 to 100 ,000 people to attend.

And so actually, just a few days ago, I and about,

I think there was about seven or eight of us were down there passing out tracks, and I open -air preached to the people as they were leaving the stadium, and these people went down to watch the

Buckeyes practice, and it was just a downpour. We were just drenched.

And we preached the gospel, and so that's really kind of the end of the season for me is early

April. And for the next few months, usually what's going on in my evangelism is a little bit of a break while I'm planning for the fall because I do a lot of Buckeyes games evangelism.

Not that that's the only way to evangelize, but it's a nice way to go see a big crowd all at once and get the gospel to a lot of people.

And one thing that I noticed Saturday that was really sweet, again, was people standing at the stoplight with their children.

And if there was 300 people at the stoplight, they were all facing the other direction, but then there'd be about five to seven children always looking at me.

I'm just a spectacle to a little kid. And they're listening to me preach Christ, and they're hearing the story of Jesus Christ, and I'm suspecting that a lot of kids nowadays aren't hearing that at home.

And so it gives me great joy to think that somebody's hearing about Jesus Christ who otherwise wouldn't, just because they went to a football game with their dad.

Amen. And not just to children, but to me, you're a spectacle. You are as wide as you are tall, and I appreciate that about you.

There's a tender side of Michael, and I like that. Michael, tell me, have people tried to hit you or anything when you're outside telling them about who

Jesus is? Have you been accosted physically? Once or twice, somebody was mildly physical.

It was never enough that you would call it assault or anything like that.

I was astounded, though, by how small the one guy was who did that.

I thought that was kind of odd for a guy that little to attack someone as big as I am, to be honest with you.

But he probably figured I would turn the other cheek. Right. How about police? Have police ever told you you can't do that?

There's been a lot of encounters with police, and actually on my website, if you click on the link that says—I think it says, like, 2017

Big Championship Outreach Report—I had a really good encounter with police there that I recorded, and that was something that I got a lot of help from some lawyers in preparing to talk to police about what our rights were.

You can really foul things up with police quickly, and you can also get the police on your side.

One thing is Columbus, Ohio, is so friendly to street preaching. They are ready for us to be at big events.

They have someone that prepares them for the fact that we will be there. I've never had a problem in Columbus except for if I was warned about how loud

I was, which there are some laws about that. Now, I hear a dog in the background.

You're kind of a big linebacker kind of guy. Do you have a great day or what?

No. This guy's huge. He's 85 pounds. He's strong. He's a big guy. Excellent.

Well, I am so encouraged to talk to you today, Michael. Tell our listeners your Twitter handle and your website again so they can click on it if they'd prefer.

Oh, well, my Twitter would be abereanone, A -B -E -R -E -A -N -O -N -E, all spelled out.

And then my website, I've got a personal one, it's michaelcoughlin .net, where I've published for years.

And then just recently, I joined a group of brothers, and we've been publishing blog posts at Things Above Us, we call it.

Thingsabove .us is our website where we publish a lot of blog posts about theology and evangelism, and we even write a little bit about sports.

All right. Well, thanks, Michael, for being on the show. One of these days, I hope to be back to Cleveland area, or Columbus, and I'm sure our paths will cross again.

Who's that Steven guy? How do you even pronounce his last name? Bald Calvinist. Melanson? Yeah, I know.

So funny with Steven, because, you know, I like it on his website, he's got the melon, like, you know,

M -E -L -O -N, and then you can do melons. So anyway, that's excellent.

How do you know Steven? I know Steven from just online, talking about Christian things, and just eventually started gathering more people that were like -minded.

All right, well, thanks for asking me. Yeah, well, I enjoy talking to you.

So Garrett is on there, I recognize Garrett, I recognize Kofi, I recognize

Jason. Quite the team there. So people can go to thingsabove .us,

right? Yes. All right, Michael, thanks for being on No Compromise Radio. Hey, thanks for having me,

Mike. No Compromise Radio with Pastor Mike Abendroth is a production of Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston.

Bethlehem Bible Church is a Bible -teaching church firmly committed to unleashing the life -transforming power of God's Word through verse -by -verse exposition of the sacred text.

Please come and join us. Our service times are Sunday morning at 10 .15 and in the evening at 6. We're right on Route 110 in West Boylston.

You can check us out online at bbchurch .org or by phone at 508 -835 -3400.