My Response to Joshua Chavez Proverbs

Proverbs 18:17 and the Need to Examine the Case

Hello, ladies and gentlemen, my name is Justin Peters. I hope that you and your family are doing well. I want to thank you for watching this video. The first to plead his case seems right until another comes and examines him.

Proverbs 18, 17. I have certainly had my fair share of critics over the years, still do, most of whom I do not respond to, but on occasion when I think it is necessary to give a response, I will do that.

The morning of May 5th presented me such an opportunity because I got up that morning and after having some breakfast, opened up my email. One of the emails in my inbox was from Doreen Virtue. I read her email and she was profusely apologizing to me for the video that Joshua Chavez put up.

Honestly, I'm not sure if it's Chavez or Chavez, but I'll go with Chavez. Joshua, I'm sure you're watching this. If I got the wrong pronunciation, accept my sincere apologies. Anyway, she was profusely apologizing for this.

I didn't know anything about it. So I went to his YouTube channel and I looked and sure enough his video that he put up, the latest video anyway, that he's put up attacking me is entitled, Justin Peters believes and visions.

And so I looked at it. I did not watch any of it. I just read the description and then I started looking at some of the comments that people were putting down and I could tell by the description and the comments that people were making, he is trying to make some case that apparently I have changed my theology on God dispensing dreams and visions and extra biblical revelation.

I have taught very clearly on this. My theology on this is a is well known. I have not wavered on it. I've taught the same thing for years and so I really didn't initially give it a whole lot of attention.

I did put a comment or two where the comment section is and.

I.

Said that I'm not going to waste two hours of my life watching this and of course a lot of people thought that that was arrogant for me to say, but Joshua Chavez has a history of attacking me and and this is I believe anyway, the first time I've publicly engaged him.

But you know how you can take your cursor and put it on the timeline of a YouTube video and the little window pops up and you can kind of see without having to watch the whole thing, you can get this little window and you can kind of scroll through and see what the video is about.

And so I did that and I saw that he was he was taking.

I.

Assumed at first multiple clips, but then I found out later is just one One very brief clip of my interview that I did with Doreen Virtue back. I believe it was this past November 2019 and Basically, I gather that he was he was making the argument that because I said some kind things about Doreen Virtue, excuse me Doreen Virtue and Doreen Virtue claims to have had dreams and visions of Jesus and a number of other these these kind of things that seem to be incongruous with my theology that I Must have either I have changed my theology.

I must have changed my theology and if so Then I owe the entire charismatic movement an apology for teaching against the charismatic movement So strongly for so many years. If I have not changed my theology on that however, then I he thought that I am obligated to publicly rebuke Doreen Virtue.

Well, I initially wasn't going to give this response. I said I wasn't going to watch it. But then as the day went on My inbox started getting a number of emails from people some of them very angry some of them Blasting me undoubtedly some of Joshua Chavez's followers but others honestly were were people who were genuinely confused and I talked to my Friend David Hinckley who takes care of the ministry Facebook page Asked him what he was seeing and he told me the same thing.

He said a lot of people were genuinely confused. And so as the day went on I realized and I that I do need to answer this. So I watched most of the video I still don't think I've watched maybe all of it, but probably over 90 of it.

So anyway, I watched Joshua Chavez's video and I realized that I do indeed need to give a response to this because if all you knew was What he presented then indeed his video would would really make you scratch your head and would really make you wonder about me about my theology whether or not it's changed and even about my integrity because he does indeed call me a hypocrite hypocritical over and over and over in the video and Really throws down the gauntlet to me and challenges me.

And so I decided that I needed to do this video and so For the last day or so I've been getting together some research and some I'm gonna do this a whole video thing editing and I'm gonna show you some clips from the video that he put up and then I'm going to show you some clips of The interview the actual interview that I did with Doreen Virtue.

You might notice or might have noticed if you watched his video that he showed you but one Ten second or so clip out of the entire interview hour-long interview that I did with Doreen Took ten seconds out of that entire hour-long Interview and made that the center point the focal point of his entire two hour long attack against me so This is a response to that.

In fact, he wanted me to respond. He challenged me over and over to respond. So Joshua I am and I'm doing this for a number of reasons one I'm doing is to defend my own character and reputation That has been attacked unjustly.

So as I think all of you will soon see and again, I'm not always real eager to do this, but even the Apostle Paul after his Character and integrity had come under attack. He even found a need finally to defend himself.

He did so in 2 Corinthians chapter 10 Galatians chapter 1 not at all to compare myself to the Apostle Paul. But there is a biblical precedent for defending oneself against an attack, but I'm doing it kind of For these reasons the least of which and honestly, I think I can say this little the least of which is to defend my own character and reputation then I also want to defend the character and reputation of Truly faithful servants of God like John MacArthur and Phil Johnson and Paul Washer are some names that repeatedly came up in his video.

He has attacked them as well. Not only in this video, but in many many other places as you will see I will tell you some of the vile things that Joshua Chavez has said about these men and in these are men that I love these are men that I respect I know and Honestly, it makes me more angry If I may say in a righteously indignant kind of way that he would attack them.

Then then the fact that he attacks me, but he kind of throws us all in the same Basket here and so I'm going to deal with that but so Those are two ranges defend my character and reputation defend the character and reputation of men that I know and love and respect.

Also to defend the reputation of the gospel now, what do I mean by that? Some of you may have heard me say this before from time to time in interviews I am asked How can we pray for you? How can I the interviewer whoever it may be pray for you our audience pray for you and you may have heard me say that honestly the best way you can pray for me and this is this is truly my heart's desire is Pray that not only in the content of what I teach But also the way in which I carry myself the way that I comport myself Will bring honor to Christ.

The content of what I teach and how I carry myself because I never want to do anything To bring reproach on the gospel I would I would rather be dead than to do anything to bring reproach on the gospel now.

If I were to suddenly drop dead, I don't think that that's any kind of a prophetic thing type going on there, but I'm not in the Necessarily in the best of health. I mean, I'm okay. But anyway, I'm getting off on a rabbit trail.

So at any rate I don't I don't want to bring reproach on the gospel that truly is my Greatest prayer request. I want to carry the name of Christ well, and so if Joshua Chavez is going to attack my character and reputation and other faithful men then by extension It does sully the gospel.

It does bring reproach on the gospel, and I do not want that. And also I want this to be a lesson for everyone for all of us me included Proverbs 18 17 the first To plead his case seems right seems right until Someone comes along and examines him.

I want this to be a lesson for all of the people who have Glibly jumped onto this bandwagon and have said horrific things horrific things ugly things. Not only about me but about MacArthur and Paul Washer and Phil Johnson and Also about Doreen Virtue.

I have seen in the comment section of And granted Joshua Chavez is not responsible For everyone who puts comments, I mean we all know there's some real wingnuts out there, and you can't control that but They they're people have said some really Horrific things about Doreen Virtue excuse me, and I and I want to set the record straight on that I think by the end of this video you'll see There's an awful lot that you are not being told and intentionally So you're gonna see that Joshua Chavez has been intentionally deceitful and We'll see this as we go along.

So that is where we're headed. I'm going to oh I'm also going to read you some of the email exchanges that Doreen Virtue and I have exchanged in the last couple of days. I want you to hear from herself.

I asked her permission if I could read some of the things that she wrote to me in her emails and she gave me permission to do so and so I think you're gonna be surprised. The first to plead his case seems right.

What Joshua Chavez put up boy, it seemed like an ironclad case boy. It seemed like he He really had me over a barrel and Doreen Virtue and boy It just seemed even got some of the people that have appreciated me over the years to question me the first to plead his case seems right until Someone comes along and examines him and so that's what we're gonna do.

We're going to examine him. So here we go. I'm going to show you a few clips from Joshua Chavez's you may know him better as service Christy. I'm not gonna call him that. If there was ever a misnomer for someone it would that would be it.

I'm gonna call him by his name Joshua. So here we go. Here's the first clip dear friends I wanted to put this in real quickly because I just finished the video just finished working on it. And so I'm putting this on the front end because kind of going back to the future type thing here this video turned out to be longer than what I thought it would because there were just More issues that I needed to engage more points and needed to be made.

But this is my final word everything that you're going to see everything I've presented is To the very best of my knowledge and ability the absolute truth. My conscience is clear before the Lord and the final analysis.

That's really all that matters. So I'm sure he's gonna have some response. I have no doubt about that. He's gonna try to goad me into making some kind of response and honestly, I'm not gonna do it. I have spent the last two full days working on this and so I'm not gonna I'm not gonna waste any more of my time.

Not that this time was wasted, but I've said everything I know to say and so short of an apology short of Repentance to me and other people you will know Doreen and other people that you will hear named in this video.

This is my final word. Okay, please do watch the entire video. I know it's long but Watch it the whole thing I'll ask you this before you comment before you make a judgment one way or the other watch the entire thing okay, and that's It let's proceed.

Joshua Chavez’s Opening Claims About Doreen Virtue and Dreams

Welcome, but my name is Joshua and. Prepare to be offended. I suspect many people will have already been offended at the mere implication of the title of this video. But indeed the question is warranted.

Does Justin Peters now embrace dreams and visions of Jesus. If so, is he prepared to retract and repudiate many years of teaching to the contrary. And if not, is he prepared to correct publicly his friend Doreen virtue?

Who has had one such fantastic dream or vision actually as she puts it.

So this is the opening of his video and basically the the premise has been set here. That he's gonna he's gonna go on and he's gonna show you a number of clips from Doreen virtue. That show her talking about getting visions of Jesus and talk about her even going into an Episcopal Church.

And her saying some very nice things about some very liberal churches are very liberal an Episcopal Church. It was pastored by a female priestess. I guess That was very welcoming of homosexuals. All you're gonna you're gonna hear some really Bad stuff from Doreen virtue.

You're gonna hear some things that really gonna make you scratch your head and wonder What in the world is going on and how could Justin Peters? possibly Endorse this that is his premise. He is he is saying that by me going on a program.

I Have either changed my theology on dreams and visions or I am Endorsing dreams and visions and by extension according to Joshua I am endorsing the the content of the dreams and visions and and where the dreams and visions have led her.

And so this is at face value this is going to be problematic but remember Proverbs 18 17 okay, so back to the video.

What's going to happen. And for those of you who Have gravitated toward either Justin Peters or Doreen virtue What's happening right now internally is some kind of deep-seated visceral hatred toward me without even having heard.

What's going to be said or showcased here? Do not answer a matter before you've heard it. Lest it be shame and folly to you. Don't even answer it internally. Just wait. Just wait.

You just heard Joshua quote Proverbs 18 13 do not answer a matter before you've heard it lest it be shame and folly to you. That was I'm not sure which translation from which he was reading. But anyway, this is Proverbs 18 30 there 18 13 Very good proverb very very true.

But as you will soon see that is Shockingly hypocritical of him To quote that verse. I am quite literally stunned that he did because He is doing the exact thing that that verse Tells us not to do he is doing that very thing and he is about to He's really about to condemn himself.

I am absolutely stunned because as you'll see you might notice if you've watched his video if you've already seen it you might notice that the only clip that he shows of the interview the hour-long interview that I did with Doreen virtue is Right at the beginning right when we're just doing our introduction kind of things.

Doreen Thanks me for coming on the program da da da and I thank her for inviting me to come on and I tell her That I am grateful for the work that the Lord has done in her life about a 10-second clip out of an hour-long interview and That in yet that 10 seconds is the only clip that he shows you out of that entire interview.

You will see how problematic that is and you will see that Joshua Chavez Has just condemned himself by quoting that proverb. Because he is doing the very thing that that proverb says not to do how ironic and he not he quotes it Not only here.

He quotes that proverb two or three times throughout the course of his video. But you'll see how that is going to be a problem for him. Let us continue.

There is a loyalty as if somebody rescued a dog from a pound. There's that kind of loyalty when somebody helps another out of a Deep-seated deception. The same might be true of some of you that perhaps were wrapped up in the in New Age and perhaps you heard Doreen virtues testimony and started second-guessing that.

Maybe that led you to Christianity. If that is the case there is going to be a tendency to want to dismiss everything. I'm saying immediately look for whatever superficial objection you can possibly find.

To attack the messenger again, I say do not answer a matter before you've heard it. It will be shame and folly to you. I am only going to present Justin Peters theology and Compare it with Doreen virtues own words.

You will hear their words against their own words.

So the point that Joshua was making there is he's trying to Buffer himself against some of the criticisms of criticisms of people who may follow me or Doreen virtue to whatever degree and Basically, what he's saying is this and in and of itself.

It's it's actually right that if you have been helped out of the word of faith movement by Some of my teaching just the the truth that I have been granted by God to present over the years If that has been of help to you over the years you would be very reluctant to think ill of me you're gonna Your tendency would be to overlook this and rather direct your anger at Joshua, so what he's saying is basically is don't shoot the messenger kind of thing and he's saying we shouldn't have an undue loyalty to Men and women in and of itself.

I agree with that. I actually do agree with the general point but as you will see it this what he is saying is Very hypocritical because he goes on to probably quote Proverbs 18 13 yet again He should have looked down a few more verses at verse 17 and camped out on that a little bit more.

As we will see so let us and then he says I'm going to show you their own words and then he goes on to show the rest of the video basically is Contrasting things that I have said with things of adoring virtue has said so go we'll go back to his video.

Listen. What am I saying or presenting that is not true a lot actually a.

Lot that you are presenting is not true and we shall soon see that. Now Joshua is about to play you. The 10-second video the only one only clip of the entire Hour-long interview that I did with Doreen virtue that he's going to use.

He's about to play right now. So let's let's watch it.

So.

Without further ado. Let's just get a baseline here. Just so you understand people like Justin Peters and Phil Johnson of grace to you. Have embraced Doreen virtue and we'll learn more about her as this goes.

But just so you understand they are Friendly with her and promote her and are proud of what she's doing.

Thank you so much Doreen. I appreciate that very much and you know rejoicing the work that the Lord has done in your life. It's been it's very encouraging to me to hear as well. So that's an honor to be with you.

Hi everyone, it's Doreen. I'm here with my good friend Lauren Hereford. And we are so blessed to be joined today by Pastor Phil Johnson, you know him you love him. You've seen him on grace to you. I listen to his voice every day on ref net Christian radio.

Thank you for being with us today Pastor Phil. We really appreciate it. Thanks for having me.

So there you have it all 10 seconds of what I said to Doreen virtues saying that I'm Grateful for the work that the Lord has done in her life took all of 10 seconds and out of the entire hour. Maybe even a little bit over now, maybe a 62 or 63 minutes something like that.

But at least a full hour interview I did with Doreen virtue. He hinges his entire thing over that 10 seconds that he claims is my full endorsement of Everything that she teaches her full testimony claims of dreams and visions and all this stuff and it's that 10 seconds That he shows out of the hour-long interview and then of Phil's interview.

I don't know how long his was with Doreen's I'm assuming about an hour. So he has all of four words from Phil thanks for having me and those four words from Phil apparently are a full endorsement of everything that Doreen virtue has Said and so we are left with a conundrum according to Joshua Chavez that Phil Johnson and I and others I guess have either changed our theology or We need to publicly repudiate Doreen virtue.

Okay, so that's where we are at this point. Now. We're going to go in and Joshua is going to show you another video clip of me teaching against dreams and visions and he's going to contrast that with Clip of Doreen virtue talking about getting a vision of Jesus.

So that's what's coming up. Here we go.

Here we go. Let's listen to Justin. We're going to compare Justin's Theology Justin's teachings to Doreen virtue. I'm really facilitating this. All right. I know you're gonna be Well poised to attack me.

But what you're going to have to do is you're going to have to deal with Justin's own words his own teachings and Doreen virtues own words and own teachings or they're gonna have to work this out. I Don't know.

I'm gonna show you the problem that I didn't create. These are their words not mine.

I hear this so many times people ask me about this all the time that Jesus is appearing to Muslims and dreams and visions. What do you make of that? Well right off the bat I think of Hebrews 1 1 and 2 and Romans 10 14.

Hebrews 1 1 and 2. God Long ago spoke to the fathers and the prophets in many portions and in many ways in these last days he has spoken to us through his son and. So God is not speaking today through dreams and visions.

Hebrews 1 1 and 2 makes that very clear. He has spoken to us today through his son and Romans 10 14 also puts the brakes on this notion. Paul says how are they here without a preacher. Not without a dream not without a vision.

How are they here without a preacher?

So the baseline is Justin says God is not speaking to Anybody through dreams and visions and he gives a scriptural reason and his estimation why this is impossible. Let's compare Justin's own reasoning with Doreen virtues testimony.

And I believe this is probably the first testimony that she posted as you're going to see. We're gonna go through at least four. I believe four different video clips of her giving this testimony.

All of a sudden the scene changed. She disappeared. The church disappeared all the people disappeared and there. Was Jesus right in front of me? Standing there will floating really. And He was glowing and he was glowing so brightly That I don't even know how I could explain it.

But it was this glow all around him and especially from his heart. And the glow was this. This candlelight colors. This white white color like you'd see eggshell color or candlelight color. And this smile on his face.

And and so God is not speaking today through dreams and visions. Hebrews 1 1 2 makes that very clear very clear.

The wind might have obscured that. She said. Everything changed for me on January 7th 2017. Important epiphanies. Sounds like divine revelation and it is which Justin Peters does not believe in. Or does he.

Maybe he's changed his mind, this is my question.

So there you see Doreen virtue talking about a vision that she got from Jesus and when you watch full clips a very dramatic vision. She saw Jesus in a bodily form three-dimensional. This was a very real vision and Joshua Chavez says does Justin believe in this that's my question.

Well, it need not have been a question for him had he just been intellectually honest enough to play some more of that Interview that I did with Doreen virtue as we shall see but we'll get to that in just a little bit.

But I don't want to take anything away. I don't want to I don't want it the charge to be made against me. Oh, you're you're you're not showing all of what Joshua Chavez said you're not playing all of the clips.

Of course, I'm not because it's two hour long video and I don't think you want to be here for any longer than you have to so at any rate Doreen virtue goes on to Say that in one of her visions Jesus told her that she did not have to stop using tarot cards.

Which is a big part of the New Age movement. Basically is just said you don't have to stop using them. It's just how you use them. So that's that's in there that's that was part of her vision and Now what you're about to see is Joshua Chavez playing a clip of me.

Addressing this claim of Muslims getting dreams and visions and that's gonna be one of my next videos I think I'm gonna do but at any rate this is a very short clip of me talking about that and one of the objections I have to Jesus appearing to Muslims and dreams and visions is that this Jesus that appears to them often.

Sends them to bad churches, that's one of my objections and then you're going to see Doreen virtue talking about how shortly after her alleged conversion she went right into a Bad church as a result of this vision of Jesus.

So let's watch this.

You that is remarkable can't.

Evaluate.

Scripture by your experiences and so after that experience I was Blown away. I mean, there's no other way to say it but blown away. I'm blown away too, and I don't even know how I got home from church.

I don't even know who was with me. It was a blur and I got home and I went on the internet and I typed in Jesus lights heart. And and all that and what popped up was pictures of this painting Done from a vision of a saint named st. Maria Faustina and So I know it's a real Jesus because I was led down this this path That is scriptural and is loving and non-judgmental.

This that's how she knows. It was the real Jesus.

Quote unquote. Jesus that appears to Muslims and dreams and visions. He usually sends them to bad churches. He will send them to a Roman Catholic Church or to a word-of-faith Church or and that's not the real Jesus.

Jesus would not send someone to a bad church.

And one of the reasons we like Episcopal is that it is traditional Bible centered Jesus centered and open-minded. They welcome people of all different backgrounds. They welcome people of the gay community.

They ordain women as priests. They ordain openly gay people as priests. They They say we love as Jesus loved. Jesus loved everyone. And it's true. So If you're looking for a non-judgmental church, let me just put in a plug for Episcopal.

Also known as Anglican because almost all of them are that way.

That's troubling isn't it, you know what it is. Doreen Virtue said in one of her visions. This Jesus this not even a Wispy kind of a vision a tangible three-dimensional bodily type. Jesus six feet tall by the way appeared to her and and that was her impetus to leave the New Age movement and embrace Christianity.

And Right after this vision she went right into the Episcopal Church. And so Joshua is saying how can I say what I do about Jesus appearing to Muslims and dreams and visions when he sends them into bad churches.

And yet here is Doreen Virtue. She also got a vision of Jesus and she went right into a bad church and you know what she did. This was a bad church.

This.

Episcopal Church that's led by a woman then you just heard Doreen Virtue give this glowing Endorsement of the Episcopal Church because they're so warm and in affirming they welcome everyone even homosexuals gays they welcome them and and.

So Joshua is saying how can you teach that Justin Peters and affirm Doreen Virtue at the same time? And another part of her visions, I haven't shown you this clip again just for time's sake. But I don't want to be accused of leaving this out but in another one of her visions Doreen says that somehow she felt the weight of the Sins of the world that were placed on Jesus.

She somehow felt Those sins upon herself and all of a sudden she came to this understanding that Jesus bore the sins of the world. And she said she had not even read that in the Bible and and yet somehow she she had this weird experience in one of their visions and and you know what that is weird and Joshua Chavez points it out rightly so as being Bizarre and weird and it is you know what?

In fact, it's worse than that. It's not just bizarre. It's not just weird. It's heresy. Straight-up heresy that is undiluted Heresy to say something like that. I'll take it a notch further. Not only is it heresy.

It's blasphemy to teach something like that.

So.

What are we to do with this and this the whole? The whole video if you watch this thing if you can stomach it the whole video the whole two hours is basically Joshua just playing this game of gotcha. You know showing clips of me and what I teach.

Contrasting them with clips of Doreen Virtue and what she appears to be teaching and you know what? It seems absolutely Irreconcilable so something's got to give. I've got to either admit that I changed my theology on all these issues or I need to publicly denounce and repudiate Doreen Virtue.

Gotcha the first. To plead his case seems right until another comes along and examines him.

God's Word Describes people that embrace those ideas as such. Those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of heaven. Read Romans 1. They not only do the same the same But they approve of those who do.

This is indicative of being given over to a reprobate mind. Not a good sign whatsoever. Does Justin Peters not know or does he not care. Does Justin not know about this. Does he not care. Has he changed his stance.

Is he going to retract and repudiate so many of His teachings. I'm so curious.

Thank you for being with us today pastor Phil. We really appreciate it. Thanks for having me.

You know I got a dream. I got a vision. Every form of theological mischief stems from that so. Yeah, it just Does it holds no water. It goes against scripture, and it goes against plain common sense. So just thank you so much Doreen.

I appreciate that very much and you know rejoice in the work that the Lord has done in Your life. It's been it's very encouraging to me to hear as well.

So that's an honor to be with you. Would that include the work that he did through this fantastic vision of Jesus that comes with a painting. Would it include that as well Justin, or do you not know about her testimony?

Do you care so little about her that you didn't even read her testimony before accepting an invitation to go speak with her and tell Her tell her how proud you are of her that the work of work that God's doing in her.

You obviously know something about her. Surely you must have read her testimony, right I? Assume you did it's a reasonable assumption. In fact it would be unreasonable for me not to assume that. So I'd love to hear Justin's newfound teaching that sometimes visions of Jesus Real three-dimensional visions of Jesus where the veil is lifted are acceptable and okay.

Not okay for Muslims. But okay for non-muslims. I'd love to hear Justin's new teaching and his hermeneutic whereby he discerns this. I'd love to hear it because I haven't heard it yet. This is new breaking news right here.

Or. Am I confused I maybe somebody can help unconfused me because I don't. I can't reconcile these things. Does Justin still believe this. Is he okay that Doreen is teaching that ongoing revelation is true.

So she did not get this knowledge from the Bible. She got it from somewhere else. Ongoing revelation.

What do you think Justin and I had not read that part of the crucifixion story at that moment? I had not read that the sin was put on him.

So that was remarkable it is remarkable. What's more remarkable is that Justin Peters is sanctioning this? While he's dedicated seemingly his entire life to railing against anybody again, who's even middling charismatic.

As Justin Peters changed his mind.

So yeah, it just Does it holds no water. It goes against scripture and it goes against plain common sense.

Do you really believe that Justin? Does Doreen virtues testimony go against scripture and plain common sense, or is it just the Muslims?

You know rejoice in the work that the Lord has done in your life. It's been it's very encouraging to me to hear as well. So that's an honor to be with you.

Thank you for being with us today. Pastor Phil. We really appreciate it. Thanks for having me. Thank you again for your time. I hope you'll come back and be with us again. Anytime, thank you.

How about Phil Johnson? He didn't read that testimony either. Is the John MacArthur camp now embracing some visions of Jesus? Because John MacArthur is on record saying he doesn't believe this either.

He doesn't believe that Muslims are having visions of Jesus. We'll get to that in just a moment. Did Justin Peters and Phil Johnson not know about this or do they not care? And if they don't care about her testimony When can we anticipate an formal apology to the entire charismatic movement?

I'll be asking this question several times. What does it mean to receive a knowingness from his presence? And if that's possible, when can we expect your apology to the entire charismatic movement all of them?