F4F | Ron Carpenter Teaches Gnosticism

Welcome to another installment of Fighting for the Faith. My name is Chris Roseborough. I'm your servant in Jesus Christ.

This is the channel that compares what people are saying in the name of God to the Word of God. Now, have you ever heard of the heresy known as Gnosticism?

You probably have run into Gnosticism even if you've never heard the name

Gnosticism actually spelled out before. I'll explain it as we go, but basic premise is matter is evil, spirit good.

The real you has nothing to do with your physical body. The real you is pure spirit.

You know, stuff like that. Yeah, that's Gnosticism. And this impacts their Christology, by the way, and this is the reason why

Gnosticism historically has been considered a heresy. Because, you know, it is.

So, case in point, we're going to be heading over to T .D. Jakes' church, yeah, the

Potter's House out there in Dallas, and we're gonna listen to Ron Carpenter, who we've actually demonstrated in the past he's openly admitted to being a

Gnostic and teaching Gnosticism is a good thing. Yeah, it's in the archives of our Fighting for the

Faith podcast if you haven't seen those yet. Actually, how can you see a podcast? Heard them, heard them, yeah.

Sorry, senior moment, you know, I'm getting old. So, anyway, we're gonna head over there and let's whirl this up and then get our desktop up.

We'll do some debunking along the way because, wow, does Ron Carpenter twist scripture here.

And this doesn't fall into the category, by the way, of like an error. This falls into the category of flat -out heresy.

It arises above error, you know. Yeah, it really does. So, let's let's whirl that up and here's

Ron Carpenter. There is a difference between when you were created and when you were made.

Now, that's not true, and I'll show it to you from the Hebrew, but just let him spin this out. So, there's a difference between when you were created and when you were made.

That's weird because the Hebrew uses made and created interchangeably.

Yeah, it does in Genesis 1 in particular, but we'll continue. The word made means to take from one substance.

Yeah, by the way, I forgot to tell you this. I should have braced you for this. Yeah, the name of the sermon is

The Power of Your Sound. Yeah, I'm not making that up.

And make into another substance. All right, gotta back that up. So, let me just back it up 10 seconds.

Listen again. And when you were made. Yeah. The word made means to take from one substance and make into another substance.

What? To take from one substance and make into another substance? You know, like when you make a house, you're taking lumber and, you know, drywall and nails and glue and, you know, and stucco and pipes and wires and thingies.

Does the wood turn into a different substance? No, it stays wood.

Yeah, so he's playing fast and loose with some definitions here. God made you a body.

He took from one thing and made it another thing. He took from the dust of the ground and He made,

He formed Adam a body. But your body is not the real you. Your body just houses the real you.

Your body is a temporary location while you fulfill an assignment in the earth. That is straight -up false.

That's, yeah, that's not true at all. Yeah, your body isn't a temporary place for an assignment that you need to accomplish on the earth.

Have you heard of the resurrection of the dead? Yeah, when Jesus returns in glory,

He's going to raise, you know, everyone from the dead bodily, the same way

Jesus was raised. But let's do a little debunking work, shall we? We'll start in Genesis chapter 1.

We will pay close attention to a particular verb in the first sentence of Scripture.

In the Hebrew, it reads Barashit Barah Elohim Eth ha -shamayim v 'eth ha -eretz.

And just translated in the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth. And the

Hebrew verb for created is Barah. Barah. So you'll note that's our first Hebrew word for the day,

Barah. And you're gonna note that Genesis 1 uses Barah and a different Hebrew word, the

Hebrew word for made, interchangeably. Yeah, so I have to scroll down here just a smudge and look for the day when

God created the cattle and the beasts of the earth and stuff like that. So let's see here.

All right, so Genesis 124, God said, let the earth bring forth living creatures according to their kinds, livestock, creeping things, and beasts of the earth according to their kinds.

And it was so. And God made, made, made, okay?

And so our Hebrew word here is Asah. So God made,

Asah. He made the beasts of the earth according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, everything that creeps on the ground according to its kind.

God saw that it was good. So two Hebrew words, verbs so far, and they are Barah, to create, and Asah, to make.

Okay, so you got the idea here. Now we're gonna pay close attention to how the words work here in Genesis 1.

So then God said, let us make man in our image. And if you were paying attention, you would know that the

Hebrew verb here for make would be Asah, right? So God said, let us make man in our image after our likeness, and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the heaven, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.

So God created Barah. God created man in his own image.

In the image of God, he created Barah. Them male and female, he created them,

Barah. So note, God says, let us make, and let us create, and make are just used interchangeably.

Now, the details then of we came to be are quite important, because what

Mr. Carpenter, my apologies, senior moment there, but what

Mr. Ron Carpenter is saying here is also contradicted by Scripture. So listen to the creation of man.

So when no bush of the field, this is Genesis 2, was yet in the land, no small plant of the field had yet sprung up.

For Yahweh Elohim had not caused it to rain on the land, and there was no man to work the ground.

A mist was going up from the land that was watering the whole face of the ground. Then Yahweh Elohim, and here's our third verb,

Yatsar, Yatsar, God formed the man of the dust from the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living creature.

And you'll note here that prior to his becoming a living creature, he wasn't a living creature.

So here's the idea. Humanity, human beings, have a physical body, and they have an intelligent soul, a soul that was put together, you know, put into them by God himself.

And so human beings are, you know, are cut into two, if you would, body and soul.

To take the soul out of the body is to cause death, and that does not mean that your soul is the real you, while your body is something, well, just dispensable, it's not the real you, it's just your your earth suit.

No, you are comprised of body and soul, and Christ physically bled and died on the cross to save not merely your soul, but also your body as well, because the two go together to make the one person who is you.

There's not two of you, there's only one of you, all right? There's not the body part of me and then the soul part of me.

No, I am comprised of both a body and soul, so are you, and there's only one of you, there ain't two of you, and your body is not the, like, the dispensable part, and you would be, you know, your soul being the real thing or whatever.

No, your body and soul together. And when Jesus returns in glory to judge the living and the dead, he's gonna raise you from the grave bodily, that Jesus himself was bodily raised from the grave.

This is important stuff. So we'll note here that the things that Ron Carpenter are saying here, this is heresy.

This puts him outside the Christian faith. The things that he's saying here are from Gnosticism.

We'll talk about the dangers of Gnosticism more in a minute, but let's return and hear a little bit more of him spinning this heresy out, shall we?

The Bible says that you were created in Christ Jesus before the foundations of the earth were ever laid.

The word... Now I'm gonna note he's taking a particular text out of context and not going to Genesis 1.

The text in particular that he's using is from Ephesians chapter 2 that says, "...for

we are God's workmanship created in Christ Jesus for good works."

Yeah, yeah. So we're created in Christ Jesus for good works, and we're gonna note something here.

The created in Christ Jesus for good works part is not referring to our creation or our birth.

It's talking about our new birth. Uh -huh. Yeah, so that's note here what's going on here.

In Ephesians... In fact, sorry, my apologies. I went a little too far. Ephesians chapter 2 verse 1 says, "...and

you were dead in trespasses in sins in which you once walked following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience among whom we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body and the mind.

We were by nature children of wrath like the rest of mankind." So you'll note that Ephesians 2 begins with our state after the fall, and this has to do with post -creation.

This is as this post -Genesis. This is actually... this occurred... the fall occurred in Genesis in Genesis chapter 3, and so you'll note as a result of it all of humanity then is born dead in trespasses and sins, but watch how this continues, "...but

God being rich in mercy because of the great love with which he loved us even when we were dead in our trespasses,

God made us alive together with Christ. And by grace you have been saved, and God raised us up with him and seated us up with him in heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness towards us in Christ Jesus.

For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not your own doing, it is the gift of God.

It is not the result of works, so that no one may boast." And then here we go, "...for we are God's workmanship, we

Christians, created in Christ Jesus." In Christ Jesus talking about our regeneration, "...created

in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them."

So again, he's just at this point really striving to twist up the biblical text is the best way

I can put it, because he's trying to create this idea that you pre -existed, the real you is pre -existed, pre -existed, and that the important thing about you is your spirit, the body, and yeah, who cares about that?

I mean, it's just your earth suit and stuff like that. The Bible don't teach that, and the verses he's referencing don't teach that either.

"...Christ means anointing, the anointed one..." Now let me back this up so you can hear how his argument apparently goes, and I'll back this up 10 seconds.

"...Christ Jesus before the foundations of the earth were ever laid. The word

Christ means anointing, the anointed one, the anointing..."

So now there's a difference between an anointing and the anointed one. One is a participle, you know, a verbal noun.

The other is noun. Christ is the anointed one.

Jesus is the Christ. That's noun. Jesus isn't the anointing.

That's a participle, all right? So that's a verbal noun, but you can't say

Jesus is both the anointed one and the anointing. Yeah, we got a big problem here.

So he's playing fast and loose and changing, and basically interchanging a participle with a noun.

This is super slick Bible twisting on his part. Let me back it up just a little bit again. Listen again. "...before the foundations of the earth were ever laid.

The word Christ means anointing, the anointed one, the anointing.

So I was created in the anointing..." No, you were not. You were not created in the anointing.

See what he's doing here? If we were created in Christ Jesus for good works, well, that means we were created in the anointing.

No, it doesn't. I mean, so grammar really helps in discernment.

I'm just saying. "...before God ever said, let there be light. The word created means to take from nothing.

So the real you didn't show up when your mother and father biologically hooked up and conception took place.

The real you was created in the anointing sometime in heaven before God ever laid the foundations of the world."

No text says this. In fact, Genesis 1 and 2 explicitly rule this out.

This is Gnosticism mixed with Mormonism at this point. "...and what God did is he took the real you and then formed you a body."

No, that's not true at all either. "...and the real you is living inside this house.

This is not your real house. This is not who you really are. Some of us, we have a tall house, a short house, a big house, a small house, a black house, a white house.

My wife's a brick house. All kind of houses. Don't matter what kind of house you got. You just got to understand this is just a house.

Tell your neighbor this is just a house." Just tell your neighbor that your body's just a house.

No, it's not. Jesus Christ bled and died for that body, and Jesus Christ is gonna raise that body from the dead.

Yes, sirree. "...the house. Difference between when you were created and when you were made. By the way, if I sound a little nasally,

I battled in a cold before I got here, and when we were descending in the plane, there was a big pop in this ear, and I can't hear a thing out of it, so I'm believing before I..."

So he's got a broken house. Okay. "...believe. Somebody gonna agree with me. This ear is gonna open back up.

Amen? All right. So there's a, there's a difference between when you were created and when you were made."

No, there isn't. No, there is not. "...Colossians 3, 1 through 3.

I'm a teacher, so let me, let me roll this out. Says that you have died, and your life is hidden with God in Christ."

Right. Yeah. So I've died, and my life is hidden in God in Christ. Okay. Yes, I have.

When did that take place? Oh, I know. Scripture's clear. When did we die? So let me, let me throw another text in here, which some of you may not even be familiar with at all.

We Christians are already dead, and the Apostle Paul explains when that death took place.

In fact, it's quite important that we recognize this and embrace the concept. And here's what it says, "'What shall we say then?

Are we to continue in sin so that grace may abound?' Well, by no means. How can we who died to sin still live in it?

Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ, we were baptized into his death?

We were buried, therefore, with him by baptism into death, in order that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the

Father, we too might walk in newness of life." So Romans 6 makes it clear that if you are a baptized believer in Jesus, well, then you died and rose again with Christ already.

By the way, this then becomes the primary weapon then you use against the devil, because you no longer enslaved to sin, because one who has died has been set free from sin.

So Colossians 3, then, the text that he's using out of context and mangling here, says, "'If then you have been raised with Christ,' again,

I have, yeah, I'm baptized, "'seek the things that are above, where Christ is seated at the right hand of the

Father. Set your minds on things that are above, not on the things of the earth. For you have died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God.'"

This is most certainly true, but the way he's using it is not the way

Paul is using it at all. The meanings are very different, and again, I would remind you,

Ron Carpenter is publicly on record as saying that he's a

Gnostic. So we continue. Here again, Christ means anointing.

Let me tell you something about the anointing. His name is Jesus. No, Christ does not mean anointing.

Ha Christos means the anointed one.

Yeah, not the anointing. So yeah, sorry I had to correct this guy, but he's like, you know, a heresy every, you know, ten seconds at this rate.

We'll never get through this teaching, but we continue. Christ, I don't want to insult your intelligence, but I don't want to assume anything.

Jesus Christ. Christ is not his last name. Christ is his function.

He is Jesus the anointing, Jesus the anointed one. He is, again, those two concepts are not interchangeable.

He's not the anointing and the anointed one. Jesus the man came, died on the cross, rose again.

Jesus the man? Jesus is the God man.

Again, note Gnosticism always causes you to go into a heretical Christology.

Let me back this up just a smidge again. His function. He is Jesus the anointing,

Jesus the anointed one. Jesus the man came, died on the cross, rose again, and then went and sat at the right hand of the

Father, and there he ever makes intercession for you and me. The man Jesus came, and he's back with the

Father. Christ never left the earth. What?

I told you this was heresy, man. So Christ never left the earth. The Christ, the anointing.

So notice that he is making a distinction between Christ and Jesus.

That's exactly what the Scriptures warn us about, by the way. I would note that Gnosticism really, really got up and running during the life of the

Apostle John. He had to hit it head -on, and the epistle of 1st John is written against the

Gnostics. So listen to what John says. 1st John chapter 4. Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God.

For many false prophets have gone out into the world. By this you know the Spirit of God.

Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God.

Note, Jesus Christ has come in the flesh, is from God. Every spirit that does not confess

Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of Antichrist, which you heard was coming and is now in the world already.

Mm -hmm. So you're gonna note here, Ron Carpenter is embracing the very theology that 1st

John 4 says is from the Antichrist. Yeah, no, no joke there.

I mean, and I'm not engaging in hyperbole either. This is for real Antichrist doctrine.

Hear it again. I'll back this up just a smidge. Here we go. At the right hand of the Father, and there he ever makes intercession for you and me.

The man Jesus came, and he's back with the Father. Christ never left the earth.

Unbelievable. This is Antichrist blasphemy. That's what this is.

And there's the people at T .D. Jakes' Potter house going, yeah, way to go.

He's sending all these people to hell. Going somewhere with this. Yeah, you're going to go to the

Lake of Fire. That's where you're going with this. For those of you don't know me, it seems like I'm gonna open up a bunch of random loose sins, but at the end, we'll tie them all together.

I promise you, okay. Christ never left the earth. He just waited in the earth for another body to descend upon.

So note, he makes a distinction between Jesus and the

Christ. Again, that's exactly what 1st John 4 says is the doctrine of Antichrist.

And so in the upper room, he found the body, the new body of Christ, and then he descended upon that new body, and now we make up the body of Christ.

We make up the body of the anointing. Come on, somebody. No, this is absolute

Antichrist blasphemy that you're spewing here. I'm not a full expression of the anointing.

You're not a full expression of the... I'm not an expression of the anointing. ...the anointing, but God gives us apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors, evangelists, teachers, until we all reach the full stature of the measure of Christ.

So God gives us leaders till we all come into unity in the faith. And I may not be like Christ all by myself, but when

I hook up with you, and you, and you, and you, and you, then we begin to be the full expression of the body of the anointing.

Somebody shout... Wow. Wow. Again, I don't even have words at this point.

Blasphemy, heresy, this is flat -out rebellion against God. This doctrine comes from the pit of hell.

The God, I'm anointed. Now, the Bible says my life is hidden with Christ.

My life is hidden with God in the anointing. No, it doesn't say that. You're playing word games.

Everything about me, my past, my present, my future, is in my anointing.

The anointing is the word that is descriptive of the residency of the Holy Ghost. No, it's not.

You're just making this up. Everything that I will ever be is already in me.

So God doing something in my life is not coming out the air conditioning vent and coming externally and entering my life.

It's already in me, and I've got to learn how to push it out. No biblical text says this either.

Everything that you will ever do and ever be is already on the inside of you. Touch your neighbor and say, it's already in there.

It's already in there. No, it's not, and I'm not going to touch my neighbor either. I've got to learn how do

I grab a hold of the potential that is resting inside of my anointing and then live up to the potential of my anointing.

Then in the next verse, he says, therefore set your mind on things above where Christ is.

So in other words, I've got to... Where's Christ, by the way? Note that the text that he's quoting totally contradicts him.

Okay, because remember he said that the anointing never left, but that Jesus the man sits at the right hand of the

Father, right? Let's see. This is just unbelievable. Let's see if he quoted this correctly.

Yeah, your life is hidden with Christ. When Christ who is your life appears, then you will also appear with him in glory.

So set your minds on things that are above. Yeah, for that's where Christ is. Yeah, so I mean the text that he's quoting just flat -out contradicts him.

Wow! Take my anointing where my whole potential is and then set my mind on things above where the anointing is.

It's not a matter of are you anointed. You said the anointing never left the earth and you just now said it's in heaven where the anointing is.

You're contradicting yourself in your false doctrine. It's can you think on the level of your anointing?

When you can get your mind in the same place with you? What if you're anointed to be wealthy but you think like a pauper?

What if you're anointed to be great but you think like a weakling? What if you are anointed to be successful but you think like a failure?

We do not arrive at the place of our anointing. We arrive at the place of our thoughts because as a man thinketh in his heart so is he.

Yeah, so he's kind of mixed Gnosticism now with one of the major proof texts out of context of the

Word of Faith heresy. As a man thinketh in his heart so is he. So are you thinketh thinking?

Thinkething? Are you thinkething correctly? You know so that you can... Are you thinkething like you're poor when your potential is to be rich?

Yeah, I know that's not really how the words work but let me show you this from the text.

We're gonna be over in Proverbs. Proverbs 23. Proverbs 23 and here's the

King James version of it because this is how they take it out of context and it's

Proverbs 23 7, for as he thinketh in his heart so is he. See, there it is!

See, you got to think right. You don't want to be engaging in stinking thinking. No, that's not what's going on here.

So here's what it is. Three rules, by the way, for sound biblical exegesis are context, context, and context.

So eat thou not the bread of him that hath an evil eye, neither desire thou his dainty meats.

For as he thinketh in his heart so is he. Eat and drink saith he to thee, but his heart is not with thee.

The morsel which thou hast eaten shalt thou vomit up and lose thy sweet words.

And he's sitting there going, okay, that's not saying that our thoughts create reality. No, it's not at all.

In fact, let's go with the ESV translation and let me get this a little bit bigger and here's what it says in the

ESV. Do not eat the bread of a man who is stingy.

Do not desire his delicacy, for he is like one who is inwardly calculating.

Eat and drink he says to you, but his heart is not with you. You will vomit up the morsels that you have eaten and waste your pleasant words.

See, this is a proverb about if you know somebody who's really stingy, if they seem like they're being generous and say, here, eat this.

They don't really want you to eat it because it costs money, you know. So, you know, his heart's not with you.

That's the point here. So you'll note that Ron Carpenter here, as you, as a man thinketh in his heart, so is he.

So yeah, no, that's not what that text says at all. This guy's wrong on every count. He hasn't said anything that's biblically solid at all.

My thinking defines my ears and if I'm going to show up where my anointing is,

I'm going to have to learn to think on the level of my anointing. Somebody that's going to take your thinking higher today, shout hallelujah.

Yeah, I'm not going to shout hallelujah. I'm going to shout, run, flee the building. This guy's a flat -out heretic.

He's a gnostic. Everything that he's teaching here is flat -out false and he's going to have to give an accounting to God for this.

Yeah, let me throw this in as like a bonus, shall I? So if we were to go to, let's say, the book of Job, all right?

We'll go to Job, and let's see here. The text in particular

I want to go to is at the end, where God and Job have a conversation.

God talks to Job out of the whirlwind, and Job ends up repenting, because Job basically claimed that God was in the wrong to punish him because it's the evildoers, the unrighteous, who are punished, not the righteous, and he considered himself to be among the righteous.

That's not true at all. In fact, there's none righteous, no not one, the scripture says, and so God had to have a little conversation with him, and Job repents.

Job repents, but remember Job's three comforters? Yeah, those guys. Their theology was completely wackerdoodle.

They totally said false things about God, and I want you to consider

God's reaction to them. But we'll start with Job's repentance, so after Job was confronted by God, where were you when

I laid the foundations of the earth? You know, all that great dialogue, that discourse you can read in the chapters that precede chapter 42.

So Job will repent, he says, I know that you can do all things that no purpose of yours can be thwarted, so who is this that hides counsel without knowledge?

Therefore I have uttered what I did not understand, things that are too wonderful for me which I did not know.

So hear, and I will speak, and I will question you, and you make it known to me. I have heard of you by the hearing of the ear, but now my eye sees you, therefore

I despise myself, and I repent in dust and ashes. So Job ended up having to repent, because he found fault with God, and not rightly so, he didn't know what he was talking about, so he repented.

God, you're right, I'm wrong. Now, consider what follows next is what

God says in judgment with Job's three comforters, whose theology was completely wack.

I mean, one guy was like a Joel Osteen prosperity guy, another guy was like a complete self -righteous pietist, and another guy was kind of like some weird

Gnostic, weird Morphine...anyway, all their theology was wack, and the things they said about God were way off the mark.

And watch God's reaction to them. So after Yahweh had spoken these words to Job, Yahweh said to Eliphaz the

Temanite, my anger burns against you and against your two friends, for you have not spoken of me what is right, as my servant

Job has. So note here, God's anger burned hot against Job's three comforters, because they didn't speak correctly about God at all.

So that being the case, all the false teachers out there, you might want to pay attention to this,

Ron Carpenter, you might want to pay attention to this, God's anger burns hot against those who take his name in vain and do not teach the truth about him.

So now therefore, take seven bulls, seven rams, go to my servant Job, and offer up a burnt offering yourselves, and my servant

Job, he'll pray for you. Now note, God isn't going to listen to their prayers, he'll listen to Job's, but not theirs.

God will only deal with them through a mediator. So my servant Job, he shall pray for you,

I will accept his prayer not to deal with you according to your folly, for you have not spoken of me what is right, as my servant

Job has. So Eliphaz the Temanite, Bildad the Shuhite, and Zophar the

Naamathite went and did what the Lord told them, and the Lord accepted Job's prayer.

So yeah, Job prayed that God would not deal with them according to their folly. I think we need to pray the same then for Ron Carpenter, that he would repent and recognize that God's anger is burning hot against him, because what he is teaching regarding God isn't right at all.

The things he's putting forward and spewing and people are applauding, these are doctrines of demons, and the

Apostle John identifies his Christology as being from the Antichrist, that's how serious this is.

So pray that they would repent, and pray if you know anybody who listens to Ron Carpenter and is believing this theology of this man, that you need to rescue them from the pit, man, because they're on their way to hell.

This is not a small error that he teaches. This is flat -out rank heresy.

It is the Gnostic heresy on steroids, in the flesh, pun intended, in the 21st century, and it's as deadly today as it was in the first century when the

Apostle John penned 1 John, which was written against the Gnostics. Keep that in mind.

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So until next time, may God richly bless you in the grace and mercy won by Jesus Christ and His vicarious death on the cross for all of your sins.