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All right, all right. Well, this is the second installment. Can True Racial Reconciliation Happen Part 2? Now, I don't really remember. It's been a while since we did Part 1. I don't really remember exactly all that went down, but I'm sure it'll come to mind.
And after all, who cares? Who cares about racial reconciliation and can it happen, can it not, that kind of thing? I think we'll just jump right into it. All right, I believe this man over here was saying something about how the gospel is all about how you behave.
Or something like that. The major part of the gospel is about how you do the law, I guess is how it goes. But we're going to leave that aside, as serious as that could be. We're going to listen to this guy now, who I'm sure has a very, very different opinion.
I'm sure that there's no possible way that they picked people that basically agree on everything. Just a few minor, nuanced details. And maybe he's a little more concerned about this or that. Or maybe he's very troubled or fearful or worried or something like that.
Or thinks something's very dangerous. Maybe that's what's going on here. I'm sure that he's very, very concerned. We'll find out.
All right, Dr. Yancey, can we hear your perspective on Dr. Yancey?
Thanks for having me. It's nice to meet you, Daryl. I don't know if we're going to have a lot of debate because I agree with almost everything he said.
I called it. I promise you I have not seen this. I do not watch these before I do the video. I called it. Did I not call that? Of course they have nothing to debate about. Of course. I'm sure he's got a couple of concerns.
He has a little bit of pause maybe or something like that. But basically he's agreeing with everything that this guy is saying. It's definitely not by design. No, no, no, no. This was supposed to be a debate.
We wanted to really debate the issues. That's why we brought these two guys who agree about basically everything. This stuff is pretty bad. Everyone thinks it's bad. If you look here, this video has a little over 3 ,000 views.
Part one of my review of it has a little over 2 ,000 views. I've got very few subscribers compared to their 183 ,000 subscribers. You've got to figure, the people that are subscribed to the Gospel Coalition, they're pretty milquetoast.
They're not going to be your hardcore conservative. They're not going to be very based at all. Even they don't care. Nobody cares about this topic. It's a ridiculous topic. Racial reconciliation. Nobody knows what it is.
Nobody cares what it is. Nobody wants to hear two black guys with a white guy moderating what their thoughts are on this. Nobody freaking cares. That's the bottom line. But man, did I call that? This is why nobody cares because it's just so derivative.
Everything is exactly like the last time we talked about racial reconciliation. Nothing's ever changed. It's always the same nonsense. Nobody freaking cares. There's never any progress. There's never any pushing forward.
There's never any clarity. It's always just this huge, muddy mess of nonsense words. It's the same thing every single time. The first hundred times we talked about this, it was the same nonsense. It's still the same nonsense.
This is the proof that nobody cares. Only 3 ,000 views out of 183 ,000 subscribers. For comparison, I have less than 20 ,000 subscribers and two-thirds the amount of views on my first episode. I've got to be honest.
I think I get throttled a lot of the time on YouTube because I'm a little spicy. I guess we'll listen to it. It's just ridiculous. It's just ridiculous. I called it. I knew it. You're not going to disagree on basically anything.
The first words out of this dude's mouth, I don't know how to kind of debate this guy. I agree with everything. And they really yuck it up.
Man. I may come at it from a little bit different angle. Maybe I'll have a little more concern. Maybe I'll be a little more troubled.
I agree with almost everything you said. So let me just go ahead and give you some of my remarks. You probably remember the famous first scene from the movie The Godfather. That's the scene with Bonsera where he comes to the Godfather seeking justice.
How could you forget that scene?
I'm interested, actually. I'm pleasantly surprised by how this has started. Well, maybe not how it started but how he continued because I like The Godfather. I like the Sopranos and I just kind of like mafia-type stuff.
So maybe I'll like this.
Correct me. A big part of that scene was The Godfather said, well, you're not my friend. And that is a part of it. But another part was when The Godfather teaches us about justice. You see, Bonsera had his daughter who refused to have sex with her boyfriend beaten.
She was beaten by her boyfriend and a friend. Bonsera wanted the men killed. The Godfather, a criminal overlord, That is not justice. Stated, that is not justice. Your daughter, though violated, is a lie.
And even when he agrees to take justice, he talks about having careful men to make sure that they are not killed.
I've never hated The Godfather more than I do right now. Why is he doing this to The Godfather? If you're going to be talking about this, that is not justice. You've got to at least attempt to do the voice.
At least an attempt. I mean, that one's terrible. My Godfather voice is terrible. But you've got to at least attempt. You've got to make this interesting. Have you ever heard anyone make The Godfather sound more boring than this?
That is not justice.
But justice can be corrupted. If we're not careful, justice can lead to revenge. You know, The Godfather is a fictional movie, and we know this. But as Christians, we know that there's a truth here. That justice can turn into revenge.
And even people who are victimized can become victimizers themselves. Research has shown that kids who grew up in abused families, their parents abused them, grew up to abuse their parents when their parents were elderly.
So we know that just because someone's victimized does not mean that what they want is justice, because sometimes what they want is revenge.
You come to me on the day of my daughter's wedding. It's a fictional movie. Does this happen in real life?
Yes, it does. Yes, there is a mafia in real life. For sure, there's a mafia in real life. That's true. Although, this is what I've heard. I don't know. I mean, I don't have any mafia connections or anything.
What I've heard is it's not what it used to be. It's a lot smaller enterprise, different kinds of things. I don't know. But, yeah, there's mafia in real life.
In response to Pastistas, who had an oppressed regime. But that movement, what Castro created was a movement of reprisals and taking away of rights. And even though the Cuban people had been oppressed, it did not justify the movement that came after that.
I think of the family of Nicolas Romanoff, who his family, him, his wife, and his kids were killed because he supported autocratic rule. That movement was seeking justice, and what they got was revenge.
So how do we make sure that instead of justice, instead of revenge, we get justice? Well, the answer, some people may not like, but it comes down to the instruments of justice cannot remain in the hands of a single group, even the group that is victimized.
As Christians, we understand this because we understand the nature of human depravity. And if we want justice, then we have to find ways in which everyone has a seat at the table.
That's not correct. That's not correct. The way you get justice is to have everyone have a seat at the table? What in the world are you freaking talking about? That's not how you know you have justice.
What are you talking about? One person can't be in charge. That's how you know you're going to go into revenge. What? That's not true. Oh, man. I've come to terms with the fact that I hate talking about this because I feel like it makes it seem like I'm tooting my own horn here, but a lot of the people that have found their way into evangelical leadership have tremendously low, I don't want to say IQs, but I think that's part of it.
But they have a low grasp of the material that they present. They might be very good communicators, and I think a lot of times they're really not that good communicators either. They're just very good.
So they're not stupid. That's why it's not really low IQ because it's not really, they're not stupid. They understand certain things. I think a lot of these people understand how to do the back office schmoozing, the sucking up, the kissing up that you have to do in corporate environments and stuff like that.
I was never really cut out for corporate environments. I did well in them. I was always a top producer when I worked for another corporation, like a large corporation, and I was promoted a couple of times.
But I always knew that there was a cap for me because I was never the kind to just go through the motions. And so a lot of these guys, this guy doesn't have a freaking clue what he's talking about. Everyone having a seat at the table does nothing to guarantee that you have justice.
You could have a tyrant of a rainbow coalition. You could have a tyrannical rainbow coalition, obviously. It just doesn't make any sense at all. You can't be sure to have justice if you have one Christian, a white Christian, maybe a white Christian, I don't know.
We don't really need white people anymore. You've got a Christian. You've got a Muslim. You've got a Buddhist. You've got a Satanist. And then now we know because we've covered all our bases. We've got justice.
No, no, that's not how you know that. You don't have a freaking clue what you're talking about. One has nothing to do with the other. In fact, when you have that kind of a diverse sort of coalition deciding what's just and what's right, they're coming from different planets.
They're coming from different worldviews. And so it's not just if you have an amalgamation of everything making the decisions. That doesn't make any sense because God is real. Sometimes I wonder if these people even think God is real.
God is there and he's not been silent. He's told us exactly what's what. This is why Christian nationalism is necessary. It's necessary for us to have a nation and have an identity in Christ, and as a local kind of group of people, we're self-consciously Christian.
And we do Christian things and have Christian traditions and have Christian institutions. That's necessary because people say, Oh, the United States is a melting pot. And by the way, being a melting pot is not necessarily a good thing because you could put a lot of ingredients that don't have a lot to do with one another and they're totally different.
They don't mesh well together and you can get a melting pot of disgusting filth. Diversity is not necessarily a good thing. It would not be good if every city had a council and it had one Christian representative and one Muslim representative and we were all deciding.
We're kind of picking and choosing and combining. We have a Christlamic regime or something like that. That wouldn't be good. That wouldn't be good. And people say, Well, what about the Muslims that live in your culture?
They don't want a Christian view of justice. Too freaking bad because that's what justice is. That's what justice is. And the thing is, as far as he's talking about the movie The Godfather, how did The Godfather know that that wasn't justice?
How did he know? Well, because he's got some kind of a worldview that dictates what justice is and what it isn't. Now, it's a skewed worldview, obviously, but he's got a worldview and everyone brings that kind of a worldview together.
And so justice isn't a combination and somehow we figure out what's right in the middle and we get the melting pot of worldviews and we put them all together, we make this disgusting stew and out pops justice.
That has nothing to do with what justice is. I don't care what a Muslim thinks justice is. I don't. I don't care what a Buddhist thinks. I don't care what a Jew thinks justice is. I simply do not care.
And I don't want to make any accommodations for their view of justice because oftentimes Jews have a horrendous view of justice. People are making this argument right now. Look, you're making me go against my religion as a Jew because I want to murder my kid and my religion wants me to murder my kids.
People are making this argument right now. That's why I don't care what Jews have to say about justice because I've got a book from the Lord. I don't need the Talmud. Anyway, this guy's clueless. I mean, he just doesn't know what he's talking about.
The way we find real justice is that we bring everyone in there. No. No. I can already hear the arguments.
He can barely put two sentences together. The way we find justice is that we get everyone in there. He doesn't even know what he's freaking talking about. It reminds me of that scene in No Country for Old Men where the villain is in that convenience store and the guy is babbling because he's terrified of the villain.
The villain's a terrifying villain. A very scary villain, by the way. Weird movie, weird movie, but a very scary villain. He's just mumbling and tripping over his words. He thinks he's got to close, but it's the middle of the day.
He doesn't have to close, but he's terrified. He can't figure out what to say. The villain just looks at him. He's chewing like he's eating something. He just looks at him and he's like, You don't know what you're talking about, do you?
It's just terrifying. He doesn't know what he's talking about.
Who is this guy? How can I acknowledge depravity when the group that benefited from the injustice has a say at the table? How is that acknowledging? How is that? Because are they not going to maintain their injustice with a given seat at the table?
And the detractors are correct. If we keep the same polarizing conversations we have, individuals who have gained from the injustice of the past will continue to fight justice. Subtle and overt ways. They have no reason not to.
I am actually stupefied by how dumb this person sounds. I have to assume he's not dumb because otherwise he wouldn't have been invited here. He sounds like a complete idiot. I'm not joking. He sounds very much like out of his depth.
How could you be out of your depth in such a lame conversation like this? There's nothing terrifying about this. He agrees with everything he said. He's not making any sense. None.
What is he talking about? Does anybody know? If you really want to have justice, sustaining justice, let's bring them into the conversation. We must have reconciliation. We must have unity. Unity and justice have to happen together.
Another argument I hear. Why did they bring these two? They're the same person.
They have the same opinions. Why is this? Why did they do this? Did they do it because they want to show there really is no debate? They're trying to be a little sneaky? I just don't get it. At least this guy's position I found extremely awful and abhorrent, and I hated every single thing that he said.
Maybe not every single thing, but I hated the whole thing. At least he could put two sentences together. This guy can't put two sentences? I don't even know what the freak he's talking about.
How can I ask people of color to enter into a conversation with others given the emotional toll that it's had on them?
How can I ask people of color to come into this conversation.
And come to the conversation in a way when it's not a fair conversation because they bring this emotional baggage? I understand this critique because I, too, understand what it's like to pour my heart out on racial issues to a majority group member and have them swatted away as if it was nothing.
This conversation's going to be costly for all of us, but it's probably going to be more costly for people of color.
There's no doubt about that. Of course, because everything is more costly for people of color. People of color are always a victim, literally no matter what, and so if you invite me to this conversation and then you don't agree with me, you're just dismissing me, and it hurts me in my heart and my soul because I'm an emotional being, and if you don't agree with me, then it's going to cost me a lot, and you're just perpetuating the injustice.
If you don't agree with me, you're just perpetuating the injustice.
What is the alternative? To not have the conversation? To tell people, go read a book and then come back and do what I want you to do? Unfortunately, a lot of what's happened in our society under anti-racism has to tell whites, go and do what people of color tell you to do.
Yeah, that's what you're saying. And that's not going to do it. That's what you're saying. That's not going to get us to justice. Even though it's uncomfortable, we have to have these conversations and they have to be important conversations.
I have to put myself out there. I want to hear from the person who has emotional pain, and I want to be there for them. But I have to know that because they have emotional pain does not mean that I have to agree with them if they head towards revenge instead of justice.
So we have to have those sort of conversations. Also, we don't have to agree with you.
If you think you're heading towards justice because we just don't have to agree with you. You're a freaking adult. You're a grown man. And just because you're coming to me and you're crying because, I don't know, your grandpappy had to suffer through Jim Crow or something like that doesn't mean that I have to agree with it and I feel bad for you that you're crying, of course.
It doesn't mean I have to agree with your cockamamie plans today. Okay? It doesn't mean I'm dismissing you. It doesn't mean I'm dismissing your emotions. It means that your plans are stupid and just any amount of crying doesn't make them not stupid.
Right? It doesn't make them not stupid. So your little idea about how everyone needs to get a seat at the table, that's how you have justice, that's a stupid idea. It's a stupid plan. It doesn't make any sense.
And it doesn't matter how often you cry about it, it doesn't make it a smart plan. I might feel bad for you and I might say they're there and I might not tell you to your face that it's stupid at the time, but I'm not going to go along with it just because you're crying.
This is the thing. And this is why social justice, I just saw John today mention a video I did in the past. Social justice often worms its way into churches through women, through women's ministries, through women...
This is why the set looks the way it does, a very effeminate set. This is why they choose the men that they choose to engage in these debates and often they choose women because the gospel coalition is trying to appeal to women here.
This is why he's talking about emotions and things like that because that appeals to women. And so women are often swayed by this kind of thing, you know? And a man starts saying, I'm so emotional, I feel really sad, they might just go along with it.
They want to nurture them. They want to make it right, you know what I mean? So they'll go with their cockamamie plan. But you see, we're men, right? And so if your plan is stupid and it won't work and it's unbiblical and all of this kind of stuff, no amount of crying is going to work on us.
At least it shouldn't. That's the way it should be.
How do we bring everyone on board? We have to create a place for everyone to be involved in this conversation. A space, maybe? A place and a table. A space? I don't have the right to dismiss anyone's concerns because I don't understand them.
Just like they don't have the right to dismiss my concerns because they don't understand my concern. We must hear from everyone's concerns. People of color have an interest in receiving justice, but whites have an interest in not experiencing revenge.
We have to understand all those concerns if we really want to get to where we want to get to. Justice will occur when we begin to work together. Here's what research says about how we really convince people to work with us.
We build rapport. We admit when they have a good point. We try to understand where they're coming from. We do those things that build community instead of polarization. Polarization works against justice.
We should want a less polarized society if we want justice because what polarization does is it creates the need to have enemies. That's not true either. Polarization does not necessarily tend towards injustice.
Not at all. That's a nice talking point and it probably feels good.
When you're not that smart. It probably sounds very intelligent when you're not that intelligent, but it's not true. It's not true. The abortion issue is such an easy one to use. It's like, no, we need more polarization on that.
The people that want to kill babies with impunity are our enemies. We need more polarization there. We don't need to have... The pro-choice people, the people that think it's potentially okay to kill babies for whatever reason, that kind of thing, they don't need a seat at the table.
All of these premises, they're nice talking points and they might convince stupid people, but none of this is actually accurate. Research has shown if you have a conversation, then people will work with you.
I don't want pro-choice people to be working with me. They don't need a seat at the table. They don't have the first clue what justice is. It's evidenced by the fact that they think you can kill little babies with impunity.
More polarization is actually good in that instance, and there's many instances like that. That's not the only one. It's just the easy one. So a lot of this is just talking points and rhetoric, but this is empty.
This guy's presentation is just so empty and again, I just can't overstate this. He can't put two sentences together. What is with this guy? Is this how he normally is? Has anyone ever heard this guy speak before?
Because he sounds like an idiot. I have to assume he's not and it's just he's an off day or something. He sounds really stupid. Fight against,.
And therefore you have people who see justice as their enemy rather than as something that they should want. If we want true justice, balanced justice, then we have to have racial reconciliation. We have to bring unity along with that.
Some feel that entering into such conversations lets the whites off the hook. I would say that our desire to keep them on the hook can prevent us from finding true, balanced justice because we're so eager to keep them on the hook that we don't.
There's been no thought process here. See, if we believe in human depravity, everyone has. This is just like random thoughts. It's almost like he didn't do any preparation whatsoever, but I see him looking at an iPad or something, so obviously he's prepared for this.
It sounds like it's off the cuff and he's never spoken in public before. What is the deal with this guy?
It has to be held in check to some degree because human depravity knows no race. It manifests itself in different races in different ways, perhaps, but it knows no race. Therefore, we must find ways in which we must have this conversation.
If we are honest, we're honest. There are whites who don't want to, who don't care what we have to say, but we're also honest. There are people of color who really want revenge and really aren't seeking honest justice.
For this reason, I believe we will not have justice until we have some sort of racial and racial reconciliation and unity. This is not to say that justice is not something that we strive for. I'm saying that this is the best way to achieve it, is to work together.
The process of working together to find unity is a process of finding justice as well. You cannot divorce one without the other. You cannot give justice first because justice first usually is a group deciding what justice is for everyone.
Our human experience has shown how awfully wrong that can go. Thank you. A conversation like this,.
It's always helpful to start by defining our terms. That was so hard to follow. I'll put it on myself. Maybe I'm just the idiot. Because that sounded like a bunch of nonsense. Very difficult to follow.
He could barely speak, his bottom line. So I don't even really know what to say. What's the deal with this guy? I've heard the name before and I've heard it in a positive light. Being thoughtful and things like that.
Maybe he is, but this was not his best moment, I guess. Anyway, we're going to continue this at some point. I guess they're going to define shalom. Wow, that's interesting. And we're going to learn more about justice and racial reconciliation.
I'm sure you're excited about it. Can you tell I'm excited about it? Hope you found this video helpful. God bless.
