Secular Marxists Appreciate Woke Evangelicals

Conversations That Matter

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Hey guys, welcome to the Conversations That Matter podcast. I'm your host, Jon Harris. Short podcast, hopefully here.

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I wanted to just bring to your attention something that is trending right this second and probably will be developing more as the evening goes on and into tomorrow to some extent.

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But the mainstream media, at least one mainstream media source, and then at least one very, very

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Marxist, social Marxist organization has picked up a story concerning a pastor named

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Kevin Smith in the Southern Baptist Convention. Now, this is all related to a video that someone made me, well, someone who was at the conference made me aware of at the

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Southern Baptist Convention. It was concerning a nine Marx event. For those who are conservative who went to the

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CBN event, you know how this works. You have a big convention, but surrounding that convention are other events.

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And apparently nine Marx ran in a room and had an event. And so, and that's fine. They did this, I don't know what day, but it was presumably during the convention.

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And so there was a lot of Southern Baptists there. And this particular pastor,

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Kevin Smith, made some very inflammatory remarks about pastors who supported voting for Donald Trump.

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Used some very descriptive language. We'll get into it. And I had not, I actually wasn't even planning on reviewing this footage until later in the week, but since it's making the rounds now in mainstream circles, mainstream media, or Marxist media, put it that way.

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Then I figured, well, I will, I'll talk about it because the significance is this in my mind.

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This is how, this is the symbiotic relationship that exists between the secular or the

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Marxists out there in the world, the political Marxists, social

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Marxists, and then the pastors and leaders in Christian denominations.

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And we've talked about this many times before, most notably when people like Ed Stetzer or Russell Moore write op -eds.

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And the intention is to, instead of speaking prophetically to the world about what they're doing wrong, how they need to repent, they take the opportunity to write from the

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New York Times about how, or Tim Keller for that matter, about what evangelicals are doing wrong.

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And so, and they run in the same circles. Their views are very adjacent to the views of the mainstream media, the

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Marxist media. And this is not a surprise to those of you who've listened to this podcast.

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I've given countless examples of this, but this is an interesting one to me just because it's, I doubt

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Kevin Smith was intending for this to ever go as big as it's going. And I'm sure if you probably asked him, hey,

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Kevin Smith, would you want the occupied Democrats using your quote to smear other

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Southern Baptist pastors, he probably would try to say no, or the occupied

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Democrats, I'm not political, I'm apolitical, or I don't know, this is hypothetical on my part, but I'm just drawing upon all the things

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I've heard from more elite progressive evangelicals and how they really try to go to great lengths to portray themselves as neutral politically and transcending the political spectrum to support the kingdom of God.

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And that's just all they're about. And it's this third way stuff. And we've talked about that too. And I just think, they don't wanna be closely aligned with a political party or one side or the other, but that's kind of the ruse because what they're actually doing is they're pushing left in a denomination that has been traditionally very conservative politically.

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And so that's the political angle. Of course, we know that there's much deeper theological assumptions that underlie these political philosophies.

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And so that's where we get the postmodern ideology and just the redistributive justice and the inappropriate or unchristian ways of looking at reality, that ideologically flatlining reality into this conflict theory, reducing it to conflict theory relationships, and all the rest of the things that we talk about.

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And so these are the things that underlie these political positions.

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And they couldn't be more different in this country at this point. Well, Kevin Smith steps right into it. And so here's,

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I'll show you a little bit of what's going on publicly here, and then I'll show you the video. And if you wanna see the full video in context and everything,

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I'm gonna just post it on another website. You can go check it out in the info section. The link will be there. And if you wanna listen to it, it's a little hard to listen to because it's on a cell phone camera, but you'll get the gist of,

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I think what's important for our purposes here. And you can see the kind of quote that the secular left would really likes to use.

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They like what Kevin Smith is saying. They think this is great. This is pushing the needle in their direction.

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It's gonna accomplish their goals. Kevin Smith is being used by them without even intending that.

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I mean, it just shows you though, how it's proof positive in my mind that there is a total leftward drift.

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And the ironic thing is in the panel that at the

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Neimark's event was, at least Danny Akin was very adamant there isn't a leftward drift and as the others are nodding along, right?

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That this isn't happening. And it's like, it just shows that that's totally not true.

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If you have the occupied Democrats using what you've said at an event and you say, there's no leftward drift.

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And then you got someone like Kevin Smith saying this, who's, by the way, I mean, he's got clout in the SBC. He's head of the

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Maryland -Delaware Convention, which has a reputation for being pretty woke friendly and really aggressively woke convention.

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I mean, he's on the stage at the SBC. He's not just in the audience, he's on the stage. And I'm gonna show actually another clip,

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Lord willing, later in the week from him talking about the culpability of mothers in abortion so you'll see he's got some authority.

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Anyhoo, so here's what he says. He says, and this is after I believe

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Protestia published an article where they said Kevin Smith said some inflammatory things you're about to hear about Trump voters or pastors who would support

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Trump in the Southern Baptist Convention. And so his reaction to it is, I don't know about hit dogs, but it's strange that some guys always get their panties in a wad whenever race is discussed even if it's a discussion among friends of which they weren't involved.

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A blessing of the SBC is its size. You can have a hundred friends for every one.

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And there's, okay, and that's it, I guess. So it's interesting because when I saw this earlier today, this advertisement you're seeing now was not here.

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And it was just, I saw this and then I looked up and saw his pin tweet, the tweet from 2018 that he wants everyone to read.

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And it says that saints, when discussing tense matters with fellow Christ followers, it can be helpful to use biblical language and paradigms, avoid secular combat rhetoric, and engage as a family member seeking to persuade rather than a lobbyist or activist seeking to maneuver an opponent.

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Let me read this to you again because this is gonna be so ironic. There's just, this whole thing is such an example.

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I couldn't pass it up. I had to record this because it's such an example of the move that's constantly made to make you really think that you're crazy.

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Or that's the effect it at least has. So many people think, I'm like, am I nuts? You know, no, you're not nuts. This is what's happening.

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You have a guy like Kevin Smith having his pin tweet this. Saints, when discussing tense matters with fellow

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Christ followers, it can be helpful to use biblical language and paradigms, avoid secular combat rhetoric, and engage as family members seeking to persuade rather than as lobbyists or activists seeking to maneuver an opponent.

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So that's what he wants to project that he's about. Yet at the same time, he makes this tweet that I just showed you that there's these guys that get their panties in water whenever race is discussed.

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I mean, what's he insinuating? They're just, oh my goodness, we can't talk about race. No, that's not the issue. It never was. I mean, it's just, it's juvenile.

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I don't know what word to use about this. It's beneath someone like Kevin Smith to use this kind of language.

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It should be. Really, you're gonna frame it like that?

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Like they're just afraid of discussing race? No, it's not about discussing race. Conservatives in the

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Southern Baptist Convention are more than happy to discuss race, but the topic is not race.

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The topic, it's critical race theory. It's social justice. It's Black Lives Matter.

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It's the whole narrative. They're CRT -infused racial reconciling narrative, which has assumptions attached to it that are in conflict with biblical

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Christianity. And even that, conservatives will discuss, but they just disagree. So it's just such,

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I have heard this so many times. Conservatives, you know, they get their panties in a while. They get upset when race is discussed.

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They don't wanna talk about race. No, it has nothing to do with it. I've never met one conservative who is really afraid to talk about race.

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Oh my goodness. There's different people out there, different kinds of people. Oh my goodness,

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I'm so afraid of that. I mean, come on. But anyway, he's saying, even if it's a discussion among friends of which they weren't involved.

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So they weren't at this public meeting. It was a public meeting, as far as I know, at this. I mean, I think you could go to it if you were at the

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Southern Baptist Convention. I don't know if you had to register or anything, but it was a meeting that took place in a room full of a lot of people, and it was very participatory.

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I mean, Kevin Smith wasn't even on the stage. He was asking a question, and it said something inflammatory, which you're about to hear.

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And so Protestia writes an article. Kevin Smith has a response. And so I just wanna start off with saying, look how out of step even his response is with his pinned tweet.

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It's just, on the one hand, it's, you know, we're peacemakers. We're just trying to be biblical here.

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We're just, we transcend party politics, and we're not trying to be lobbyists or activists.

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We're engaging a family member. On the other hand, here's the hypocrisy coming right out.

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So here is, let's look at, well, let me just look real quick.

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I'll show you what the news story at MSN is saying right now. It says, pastor at Southern Baptist meeting called out

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Trump political horrors. Yeah, that's the language used.

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Pastor Kevin Smith called out some Southern Baptists for being political horrors to former President Donald Trump while speaking at the recent meeting at the

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Southern Baptist Convention at the Anaheim, California event, which was held earlier this month. Smith spoke about how he has seen the

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Southern Baptist nomination change in the past decade, and he called out particular attention to the racism, he said, he has seen from some of its members.

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According to the pastor, some Southern Baptists lost their minds when a black man was elected president, referring to Barack Obama.

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I don't mean agree about politics or policy or nothing, said Smith, who is black. I just mean giving a darn that somebody else is hurting who is supposed to be your brother, sister in Christ, and I think some

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Southern Baptist just bent over and became political horrors with his whole Trump stuff.

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Southern Baptist denomination has historically been one of the most conservative evangelical branches of the United States, according to Pew Research Poll.

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Now, this is the significance of this, and this is what's missed on so many of these guys, unfortunately, in the convention who are saying,

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I'm a third -way guy, I transcend the political rift, and I'm just about Jesus, and look,

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I have conservative things I believe. Well, it's like, well, yeah, you do, according to a standard of the secular left, perhaps, but you're in the

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Southern Baptist Convention, so you're pushing the needle left within a denomination that's super, well, at one time, was on the right.

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That's the whole point. That's the effect of what you're doing. The left is perfectly happy with that, and what they think is significant is the fact that, hey, he's saying this in a denomination that's on the right.

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Smith, the teaching pastor at Family Church in Palm Breach was previously on the executive director, let's see, for the

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Maryland Baptist Delaware Convention, da -da -da -da. All right, so that's pretty much the significance of this.

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Okay, so let's just, let's go to the source here after.

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Let me just show you this. The Occupy Democrats, that's right, the Occupy Democrats, right now, and this tweet has been out there now for, well, let's see, they posted it at 2 .06,

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it says. So it's been out there about eight hours almost, I guess, something like that, and it's already got,

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I mean, over 11 ,000 retweets, it's got over 39 ,000 likes. It says, breaking.

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Minister Kevin Smith slams MAGA pastors as whores for Donald Trump and losing minds when a black man was elected president during his remarks at Southern Baptist Conference, causing many of them to erupt in outrage.

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Retweet to thank him for calling them out. If you're thrilled that Minister Kevin Smith slammed

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MAGA pastors as whores for Trump and losing their minds when a black man was elected president during his remarks at the Southern Baptist Convention, causing many of them to erupt in outrage, please retweet and follow us.

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Yes, that's right. So that is how the Occupy Democrats, and just for those who don't know, the

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Occupy Democrats, they fancy themselves a grassroots political organization and news website supporting progressive

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Democrats. New York Times reported that our reach dominated Trump on Facebook before his ban.

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All right, so that's the Occupy Democrats. I mean, these guys are as left as you can possibly get. You just have to look at some of their retweets and see, man, how far left these guys are.

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So that's who was really appreciating what Kevin Smith had to say and wants to support him. I mean, this is so, this is,

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I shouldn't laugh, but it's just proof positive of what so many of us have been saying, that yeah, of course you're carrying the water for the

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Democrat Party. Of course you're helping these people when you push the needle left in that denomination, because they know what's going on.

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They realize the denomination is known to be conservative, that a lot of Trump voters are Southern Baptists, and if you can, within that denomination, push the needle left and really say things like that, like people who supported

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Donald Trump were political whores, oh my goodness. That, that just makes their day.

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And so here's the clip, let's play it. Of Kevin Smith, and then

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I want also to attach to this is Matt Chandler. Matt Chandler answers the question that Kevin Smith asked.

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So let's start here with Kevin Smith and go from there.

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That's it, Thomas, yep, Kevin. Fuck.

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I mentioned 10 years is a window, and I'm less hopeful 10 years later.

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I think some Southern Baptists lost their minds in the black bands.

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I think some Southern Baptists were unloving to black people beginning in 2012 with the killing of Trayvon Martin.

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I don't need to agree about politics or policy. I think somebody else turned, who's supposed to be a brother or sister of Christ.

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And I think some Southern Baptists just bent over and became. And if black inheritance like Ronald West was the only thing, if black inheritance like John Coltrane was the only thing, if black inheritance like Charlie Dacey was the only thing,

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I just wonder if white brothers think this is kind of crazy, black, white, and stuff going on in Asians, Hispanics, just people aren't white, feeling like they're tolerated, but not really embraced.

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I'm not talking about me. I've been here 30 years, so I got true friendships with people in their 20s that have been here 30 years.

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So I just wonder what white brothers think about where the racism is in this city.

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I don't know about the SBC, but I know pastoring in Atlanta is more discouraging today than it was when

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I arrived 14 years ago. All right, let's stop there real quick and just, here's what's going on.

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Let's set the stage, set the scene. So Kevin Smith comes up to ask this question and he's specifically addressing the white people on stage.

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That's who he wants to hear from and why they could be optimistic about the last 10 years.

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And so that gives you insight into the previous. And if you read or watch the video that is in the info section, you'll see what was discussed previously.

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So that's what they're talking about, how they're hopeful for, and they think things are actually moving in a good direction in the

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Southern Baptist Convention, if you can believe that. And so Kevin Smith is just, how can you say that?

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I mean, look what happened with Trayvon Martin and how white people reacted and they were not acknowledging or being sympathetic to the hurt that black people felt.

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And look at how they treated Obama versus Trump and they became political whores for Trump.

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And so this is what he says. And then you have these pastors, some of them trying to address this.

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And I don't actually know who this first guy is, to be honest with you. Maybe I should, but I think it's a new guy at Nine Marks or maybe if he's not,

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I don't know. He's just not as well known. I'm not sure who he is. But anyway, he's a pastor who just essentially starts agreeing more or less with a lot of what

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Kevin Smith is saying in his analysis. And it doesn't really push back on anything

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Kevin Smith says. But let's get to Matt Chandler because that's, I think, the more, he's more of a well -known in that.

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Let's see if I can skip ahead here. All right, let's do this. One, thank you for the question. I needed to shift about three years ago to start worrying about this at the

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Village Church in Acts 29 and to stop trying to solve it everywhere else because I was losing everywhere.

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I was losing white people. I was losing black. It just kept, it was never enough in this direction or never enough in this direction.

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Taking shots over here, taking, and I'm willing to believe that you signed up to believe. I mean, you got this going.

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You ain't, I mean, there's a reason why Jesus is blessed, you know, saved.

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They slandered you when they, it's the job. So I tried to kind of just double down in my neighborhood, in the place that I'm pastoring, and make sure we're doing the best we can to be a place where there's real conversation.

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I'm trying to explain that kind of network where there's, where the power is let loose, if you will, not given to, but let loose.

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And there's a real home and a real place to be heard and to build towards. Because I've been for a while there.

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I was like, let's get it, let's get it. And man, it just, things went bad, bro, in every direction.

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So I think the best I can do is boldly lead the church that I gave to in faithfulness, and then to boldly lead into the network

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He's asked me to lead. And it's a mess. And I don't, I'm super hopeful that, like, if I think about my daughter and my son, and then my youngest daughter, like,

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I think they're seeing a difference, and maybe, maybe we got a shot. And I sound jaded in my heart.

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Have I gotten, have I gotten jaded? You're in your relationship. Oh, is that what it is? It's more exciting. I'm almost, I'm almost,

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I'm thinking something. I love the relationships

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I have with genuine African American friends that are over a decade old now, where I've got a safe place to process, and I feel like I've been a safe place for them to process, we've lamented together.

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Like, I know every man you just named. I've had meals with every man you just named. We've lamented together, been frustrated together.

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So that's the best, it's a frustrating place. It feels unwinnable. But I've got more hope in my local congregation right now than I've had.

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I've got more hope in X19 than I've had. But if I look nationally, it just feels too big.

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So like, faithful at home, faithful to my neighbor, faithful to my debtor, faithful with our dollars, and then trust the

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Lord. What you heard Matt Chandler say, essentially, was he affirms Kevin Smith's frustration.

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So no pushback on this language of, they became political whores, they didn't care about African Americans because they didn't accept the narrative on Trayvon Martin and didn't, and opposed

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Obama. Things went from, went in a bad direction. Bad in every direction, actually, is what

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Matt Chandler said. And it's interesting to me that three years ago, he shifted his focus to focus more on his local church, and he feels frustrated.

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He feels like, really, that, this is the thing, broadly speaking here, Kevin Smith says it,

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Matt Chandler says it, they feel like they're not winning. That's the interesting thing to me.

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They feel like they're not winning when they are totally winning. On, like, as far as gaining the levers of institutional control in this country for that particular, that critical race theory adjacent narrative, of course they're winning that.

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But they feel discouraged all the time. This is a common thing I see with social justice activists. They can win all the elections, they can do all kinds of things, and they always feel, like, discouraged.

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Like, they're gotta keep pressing and push harder, and it's never enough. I think that's just a feature of it.

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I think it's, you know, the expectation is for this immediate, drastic action that's going to change, revolutionize everything overnight.

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And when it doesn't happen, it's just discouragement on their part. But it's just interesting because the conservatives feel like, we just lost everything at this convention.

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Like, we didn't win one thing at this convention. And yet, that being said, you have progressives there thinking that they're political progressives, that they're the ones actually losing.

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It's just interesting. So why don't you put in the comment section, those who think they have figured out why that is, why that dynamic exists, put your explanation for it.

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I'd be curious to read it, because it's weird to me. I've seen that for a long time. There's this expectation of perfection or something that they're gonna win, and when they don't win to the, even though they do win, but when it, things don't turn out the way they want them to turn out, they just get,

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I don't know what they expect. So it's interesting admission, though, of Matt Chandler when he says things went bad in every direction,

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I think, just because he's saying that when he went woke, bad stuff happened, because Matt Chandler went woke.

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I mean, totally woke, on the race stuff, at least. I mean, he just, on the

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BLM kind of narrative. I mean, it's the same George Floyd who framed George Floyd's death, same

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Matt Chandler who framed George Floyd's death as a demonic evil that characterized the entire United States.

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He posted the black square on his Instagram. In order to uproot racism, he asked his followers on Instagram to reject a truncated understanding of the gospel, that's right, which failed to expose injustice, because apparently that's the gospel, is you need to do a work of exposing injustice.

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And if you don't, then you don't have the full gospel. So there you go with the false teaching Matt Chandler's peddling. And then when addressing violent riots,

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Chandler scolded the people who pointed out all the flaws in the BLM movement, while abandoning the church's responsibility to protest against injustice.

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So the George Floyd, you can see the George Floyd thing, demonic evil, gotta post the black square, gotta uproot racism, that's part of the gospel.

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And yet the looting and the burning and the murders and all that associated with the BLM riots that took place, oh, that's terrible that anyone would call that out.

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He scolds people that they shouldn't be pointing out the flaws in the movement. I mean, if this guy's not woke,

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I mean, this is a guy who said he had an invisible bag of privilege that he was born with because he was white.

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This is a guy who drove a bunch of policemen out of his church because he kept insinuating that the police in this country are racist.

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I mean, I don't even remember all the things that Matt Chandler has said or done, but there's been a lot.

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He's definitely gone down the woke path. And he's reaping the consequences.

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Things went bad in every direction. Yeah, because his church, people left. I mean, he abandoned the core teaching of what he should be putting out there.

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And he shifts his emphasis. And of course it's damaging. Of course it's not good.

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Of course it's going to cause problems. And he says he's hopeful now about where his church is. I don't know what that means. I don't know why he's hopeful for it.

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But certainly the direction he's taken the last few years has not been good.

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And I know that too, just from people who've reached out to me from the church. So this is

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Matt Chandler. This is Matt Chandler's reaction to a guy who's asking him, how can you be hopeful when you got all these

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Southern Baptist political whores out there because they're supporting Donald Trump?

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They lose their minds when a black man was elected president as if that's why they were upset with Obama. Oh, he's a black.

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No, it had nothing to do with his policies. Look, I was at Southeastern. I remember in fall semester of 2017, three statements heavily supported by the professors and faculty there, two of them partially originating on campus against Donald Trump or the alt -right.

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In eight years of Obama, nothing, nothing. This is just, the sense of proportion is so off.

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And it makes me wonder why, how do they live in this fantasy? You're looking around you, you're seeing that it's going pretty left and yet you have

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Danny Akin, no, it's not. No, it's not. You have Matt Chandler and Kevin Smith.

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Hey, we're discouraged, we're losing or something. It's like you're pretty much, you have the momentum. And of course, with all this talk of we're being persecuted, we're being slammed or names are being, we're being called names, look at the halls of institutional power in this country.

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Look at the places that would feature Kevin Smith and his statement.

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And I mean, they have the momentum right now, politically. I mean, the media. I mean, I'm curious to see what happens in the next few days with this.

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But we're the deplorables. The people who Kevin Smith is describing incorrectly, those are the people that actually really get a lot of heat in the mainstream.

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I mean, from the halls of power, we get heat. It may feel like in the

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Southern Baptist Convention, oh, it's so conservative, but it's always been. This isn't, you join the Southern Baptist Convention, you're joining a denomination, at least at one time, that even today, it still is primarily, it's gonna be

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Republicans. This hasn't changed. I mean, they voted to rebuke Bill Clinton and boycott

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Disney. Now they're going to Disney and giving discount tickets at the convention. Anyway, I thought this was a great example of how the mainstream or the progressive left really is just applauding for the progressive pastors in the denomination and what they're doing.

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And I don't know to what extent these pastors are aware of how much they're helping the secular

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Marxist left, but they totally are. And this is just proof positive that that's exactly what's going on.

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Anyway, I'd be curious to see the reactions in the next couple of days, but yeah, this is a vindication for those of us who have been saying this kind of thing.

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Go to the info section if you wanna see more from that Nine Marks event. More coming later in the week, God bless.

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And yeah, I mean, I hope that was somewhat helpful for some of you. I hope at least it was an illustration that you can remember perhaps in your minds when you hear this objection that some of the really people who are on the social justice bandwagon transcend the political divide and are somehow just forwarding the kingdom of God.

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No, they're not. They're totally on a side and the side knows them. A side that is benefiting from what they're doing knows exactly what they're doing and really appreciates it.