How not to Choose a Church (Part 1)

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Welcome to No Compromise Radio, a ministry coming to you from Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston.

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No Compromise Radio is a program dedicated to the ongoing proclamation of Jesus Christ based on the theme in Galatians 2 verse 5 where the

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Apostle Paul said, "'But we did not yield in subjection to them "'for even an hour, so that the truth of the gospel "'would remain with you.'"

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In short, if you like smooth, watered down words to make you simply feel good, this show isn't for you.

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By purpose, we are first biblical, but we can also be controversial. Stay tuned for the next 25 minutes as we're called by the divine trumpet to summon the troops for the honor and glory of her king.

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We're here to take your calls as well. Here's our host, Pastor Mike Abendroth. Welcome to No Compromise Radio.

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This is Mike Abendroth, your host. It's Tuesday, September 1st, and in my studio

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I have a special guest, Steve Cooley. But before I talk to Steve, I just wanna let you know what the

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No Compromise Radio ministry is and what it's all about. Yesterday at WV &E,

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I think they were so worried about what I might say, they had to give two disclaimers at the end of the show. So I don't know if they'll do that again today or not.

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I'm not sure. But Manny afterwards said, that was a good job, you know, good show, so I think

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I'm covered for at least one day. We'll see what today brings though. Basically what happens is this.

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Most Mondays there will be a taped sermon from Bethlehem Bible Church. A sermon that I preached, it seemed like it was biblical and God blessed it.

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I think God always blesses anything biblical. Tuesday is a call -in counseling, talking about church issues.

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Maybe I'll have a guest in the studio. Wednesday we'll deal with books and interviews of authors, looking at books so we can understand

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God's word better. Tomorrow, by the way, just to give you a little hint, tomorrow we're going to look at books that you have at your house that you need to burn.

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So stay tuned for that tomorrow at 3 .30. Thursday we'll look at current issues in evangelicalism. And then

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Friday, it'll be Mystery Friday, kind of the Riddler Friday, Riddle Me This. Who knows, you'll have to tune in to figure out what we're going to talk about.

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But today it's Tuesday, and so we're going to look at issues in the local church. My guest today is

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Pastor Steve Cooley, my associate pastor and friend. Steve, how are you today? I'm doing great, thanks for asking.

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Well, you know what I'm going to call you today, Steve? You are my special guest foil. F -O -I -L,

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Pastor Steve Foil Cooley. I have several definitions of foil, by the way.

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And the first one is to prevent from being successful, or to thwart. I'll give it a shot.

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That is not the right definition on No Compromise Radio Ministry. Number two, to obscure or confuse so as to evade pursuers.

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I might be able to do that. O for two, that is not what we're talking about. Number three, a setback or a repulse.

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Number four, the trail or scent of an animal. Our new copy at church makes our copy smell like skunk, but that's another question or issue.

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Very much so. Number five, a thin, flexible leaf or sheet of metal, aluminum foil.

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To wrap things up with, very nice. That's very nice. I'll be the wrapper. Don't bite that though, if you've got some fillings, because it will make you scream for No Compromise Radio at night.

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And then I'll give you one other one. A thin layer, Steve's giving me the look. A thin layer of polished metal placed under a displayed gem to lend its brilliance.

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So you're to lend to my brilliance? Is that what it is? I think I'll choose that one.

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Okay. And then finally, the correct one, foil,

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F -O -I -L. Dictionary says, one that by contrast underscores or enhances the distinctive characteristics of another.

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Very nice. How about that? Very good. Charlotte Brone said, I am resolved. My husband shall not be my rival, but a foil to me.

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Okay. All right, here's what we're going to do. So my foil today is

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Steve Cooley. And what we're going to do since it's Tuesday in No Compromise Radio, we try to have some themes for each day of the week.

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And the theme today is going to be what? How to choose or how not to choose a local church.

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How not to choose a local church. When I met with the management here at WV &E, they said to me, one of the goals we have for No Compromise Radio Ministry is that people in the

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Worcester area who do not have a local church, they're not a member of a local church, they don't attend a local church, but that they would get to know ministries here, a representative of WV &E,

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Tom Krause or myself, and that they would get involved with a local church. And so this is not necessarily an ad for Bethlehem Bible Church, although we'd love to have you come on a

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Sunday. But what do you do when you pick a church? People are listening in California, Nebraska podcast.

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How do you find a church? What not to look for? And we're going to do it in No Compromise Radio style.

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And that is both biblical, and what's the second word, Steve? Non -compromising? Uncompromising?

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Edgy, edgy is the word. Biblical and edgy, always in that order, never to be reversed. I was looking at my notes.

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That's okay. And so what we're going to do is we're going to talk today, we won't take any calls today, but we'd like to talk about what should you look for in a local church?

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Lots of people tell us lots of different things. And so Steve has come up with a top 10 list.

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It might be eight we'll get through today, it might be 800, but we'll just try to get through a few, and then we'll say a few things about each one.

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So the top 10 list, is this in a negative fashion, what not to look for? What not to look for.

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All right, let's have the first one. Okay, the pastor is nice, cool, and hip.

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He doesn't sweat the small stuff, doesn't wear a tie, and he might even cuss once in a while. Wow, is that how you find a church?

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That is amazing. Basically, you kind of like the pastor. He's a cool guy, maybe you'd like a friend.

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I've noticed as a pastor that some people come to the church and when they tell me this, I know I'm in trouble.

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Well, at the last church I was at, I was the pastor's best friend. We got together for lunch once a week, we had a special prayer time on Fridays together, and we really could share things that were very intimate with one another.

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Steve, when somebody tells me that, I think my friends are in ministry, and as we serve together, the local body,

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I don't have time for another friend. Well, and that is the key, is to get plugged in.

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It's not a matter of liking him. In fact, what does the Bible say?

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That's always the issue, and that's what we want to drive everything back to. What does the Bible say about what you should be looking for in a pastor or in church leadership?

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And so you're saying that the personality issues, while we should not be repulsed by the pastor or somehow think he's some kind of ogre personality, or that he wears a leotard or something like that, but there's a reason.

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You don't even have to laugh, this is no -compromise radio. We can push the envelope here. We are known for what we're against, and we're known for what we're for, right?

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I am against pastors and leotards. That's a bad image. That's very bad. That would be very bad, some kind of tutu ministry or something, but based on some of the churches

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I've been to with the dance ministry, I think the only qualifications that the dance team has is that you have to be 17 and wear a tight dress, and it's just shameful.

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Back to the subject at hand. Where in the Bible, Pastor Steve, should we go to find out what a pastor should look like specifically?

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Well, I think 1 Timothy 3 would be an excellent place to start. And overall, that gives us qualifications for?

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For pastors, for elders. And so it's not how he looks, what kind of accent he might have, although I'd love to have a

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Scottish accent. I think the church would double in size if I could speak like Alistair Begg. But what are you gonna do?

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It's not what he likes to do for hobbies, whether he's married or has a bunch of kids.

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It's about what? What's at the top of the list? Well, he has to be above reproach.

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He has to be the husband of one wife if he has a wife. He has to be devoted to one woman. Has to be temperate, prudent, respectable, hospitable, able to teach, which means exceptionally skilled at teaching.

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These are spiritual qualifications. And so it's not even, let's find a church that has a kind of Marlboro man pastor, some kind of natural born leader, some kind of person who is good at business and management in their company, they're a good athlete.

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These are, just like you said, spiritual qualifications granted by God. That's right. What happens when people say,

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I pick a pastor for the other reasons? What's eventually gonna happen? Well, what's gonna happen is you're going to start hearing things that you can't believe coming from the pulpit.

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Things that are just not right and you can't square them with scripture. The most important thing about a pastor besides his qualifications, as Pastor Steve just said, is he is able to teach.

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And if he is skilled in teaching, then he'll do that very thing. He'll teach the word.

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A pastor who preaches the Bible. Frankly, when the people bury me at Bethlehem Bible Church, and it might be in a day, or it might be in 15 years, 30 years, who knows?

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I hope they say something like this. Well, there are a few things about his personality that we thought were idiosyncratic and we wish he would do this more or that more.

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But at the end of the day, Sunday morning, Sunday night, Wednesday night, funerals, weddings,

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Awana, baptisms, that man preached the word of God. Isn't that what we're looking for?

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Well, that's exactly right. In fact, even while you were saying that, I was just reminded, all these things that we discuss, the hip, cool pastor, completely undermines the solemn charge that Paul gave

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Timothy in 2 Timothy 4, which was to preach the word. That is what pastors are called to, and it's that and, well,

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I mean, if they do nothing else, that that's all they're called to do.

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I would say, and I think you'll agree with me, if the pastor is a nice guy, if he likes the

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Patriots, if he likes the Celtics, he's a good sports friend or anything like that, that's just gravy.

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That's right. You could have some pastor who doesn't do any of those things, but if he fed you the

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Bible, you would praise the Lord God. When I go to other churches and speak, I usually say to them, whatever country or whatever state

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I'm in in the United States, how much is it worth to you as a dad, a mom, a father, to have a pastor who will teach you the whole counsel of God?

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Is it worth a million dollars to you? 10 million? You cannot put the number on a pastor who by God's grace is faithful to his calling, faithful to the local church and faithful to his family.

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That's right. It reminds me of an email we received here a couple of weeks ago. A lady was listening and then found out about our church and literally wept that there was a church.

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She went to our website and wept that there was a church that would preach the Bible. Well, it sounds so funny to me.

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Well, we're a church and we focus on all these other things, but where is the focus on the Bible being taught?

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I thought that was just a given, but these days one never knows. So that's interesting.

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Let's go to the second one. What not to look for in a local church? I choose my church, the person might say, on the basis that it doesn't waste my time.

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It's practical. Wow. Doesn't waste my time. That's pretty good. Doesn't waste my time.

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Now, as I think about that, I'm saying to myself, I wonder how many hours that person watches

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TV a day. I do enough time wasting at home and I'm like the

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American family average and I have the TV on at home seven hours a day, of which I watch for four hours a day.

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And so I don't really want to waste any more time when I go to church. Yeah, and the underlying message there is,

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I want some practical takeaways. Please give me eight ways to be a better neighbor, seven ways to be a better parent, five ways to a greener lawn.

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50 ways to leave your... Oh no, that's something else, sorry. Well, people want to be told what to do.

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Steve, what's the problem with this kind of moralistic, seeker -sensitive preaching that strictly tells people what to do to have a fuller life?

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Well, moralism, that is changing someone's outward behavior is not the issue. If God will transform the heart, the activities of a person, their outward activities will be changed, will be transformed.

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You can go to any false religion and they can tell you what to do. I mean,

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Islam has a list of rules that are unbelievable and that does not make you any nearer to God.

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Well, I think what people are saying is that basically God is boring, the

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Bible's boring, I'm a boring person and therefore spice up my life with THX, Dolby sound, give me something else.

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And so I was telling the story of the congregation the other day, I was in Maine, sitting in a jacuzzi, a boy was sitting in the jacuzzi, he was about 13 and my family was all around the pool and I walked over to warm up a little bit in the jacuzzi and the boy said, well, my dad over there, he's a policeman in New Bedford.

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I said, oh, that's great, I'm the mayor of New Bedford. And he said, oh, really? And I said, no,

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I'm not, but I'm a Bible teaching pastor. I don't say I'm a pastor because so many pastors don't teach the Bible, so now I have to say

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I'm a Bible teaching pastor. And he said, yeah, the Bible's super boring. And I said, have you ever read it?

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Oh, yes, of course I've read it and I just thought, well, maybe you haven't read it, but you certainly broke every law in the

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Bible with those lies. But I said, have you read that one part where that woman was in a tent and that man came running who was the enemy of Israel and said, can

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I hide in your tent? She said, oh, sure, lay your head down right here. Here's a nice, comfortable pillow and blanket.

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Get the weight off your feet and lay down. And as he was sleeping, he was sawing logs. She quietly picks up the tent stake and drives it through his head with a hammer.

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I said, are you bored now, kid? And he's like, I guess I never really read the Bible. And so if you teach the

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Bible, I don't think there's much boring about it. So I think it's more an indictment on who the person is.

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Isn't it? I totally agree. I mean, when people come and they say, I didn't get anything out of it.

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Well, what did you put into it? Worship is giving. That's right. And so when Sinclair Ferguson says, don't read your

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Bible with a where's Waldo mentality, what's he trying to say? Well, I think we're always trying to figure out, where am

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I in this? How is this going to help me? And that's just wrong thinking.

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The word of God is supposed to transform our thinking. We're supposed to be renewed in our own minds by the washing of the word.

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That's right. You read the Bible and all of a sudden you say to yourself, I'm reading Ephesians chapter one about God electing the son dying for those that the father has chosen, the spirit sealing them to the day of redemption.

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I'm not found anywhere in here. Here's this glorious triune redemptive

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God. And I'm just in awe and I'm amazed and I don't need to say to myself, well, how do

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I fit in here? When the Bible talks about God choosing us in eternity past, where do we fit in there?

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Well, we don't really fit in there except we are the objects of his pleasure. We are not the ones who are actively driving the issue.

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And so when people say, I want to pick a church where it's just super relevant.

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Basically they're saying this, hi, my name's Joe Churchgoer and I'm immature and I'm selfish and I want the world to revolve around me.

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And I'd like to have my thumb in my mouth and suck it real hard, except I think I don't want to do that in a church.

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So give me a big bottle and I'll call that bottle full of formula, a local seeker sensitive church.

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And then why are we surprised when they cry and when they wet themselves and they act like little children and their lives are not transformed, they stay infants their whole lives if they are

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Christians, why should we be surprised? It's just this big kind of me monster. I don't know what the, me monster, is that some movie or something?

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What's a me monster? I think that must be from Sesame Street or something. Yeah, sesamestreetradio .com.

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We won't compromise, Cookie Monster or Grouch. Let's shift gears here and this is something.

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Hey, it's my show. We shift gears when I'm ready to shift gears. Just kidding, go ahead. Okay, I'm the clutch.

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From foil to clutch in two seconds. This is a common issue. People will call even our church and they'll say, what version of the

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Bible do you use? And so here's the issue. They'll say, the most important thing to me is that they use the

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King James Bible. Every other version is satanic. Well, when people call and ask me that question,

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I don't answer the phone that much anymore. But when they do, I simply respond this way. Thou shall not ask that question.

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I mean, Bible translations, you bring up a good point. Of course you want to pick a church that has a real translation.

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You don't want the message or other some kind of piece of garbage that's not even a Bible. You don't want the living Bible, both paraphrases that are very psychological and they're bent.

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You would like a literal Bible. I mean, God did not speak in kind of cloudy forms.

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He spoke precisely and he wants his people to realize who he is precisely. So you wouldn't have a problem,

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Steve, if people used the New American Standard, the English Standard Version, New King James.

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You wouldn't even mind if they said King James was a fine Bible, would you? No, those are all fine choices to me.

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And the key is, it's this mentality that, hey, the King James was good enough for the apostle

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Paul. It's good enough for me. And that's just wrong thinking. Well, to quote the King James Bible, out of context, but I hate to do that, but we can do it for the show today, he stinketh.

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When he has that kind of philosophy, that kind of philosophy, like Lazarus, smells after some time.

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It is a shame to me when I think there are certainly Christian people who believe that only the King James is inspired by God and breathed out.

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But they forget about Tyndale, they forget about Wycliffe, they forget about Hus, they forget about lots of other issues and that becomes the drum.

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And so I think they are spiritually midgets when it comes to evangelism, when it comes to sanctification, when it comes to a lot of other issues.

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I have not met many King James only people in my life who are very, very mature in Christ, who know the word.

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Oh, they might know certain passages about Revelation 22 and some other issues. But the original was given in Greek and was given in Hebrew.

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And there are good translations with the 5 ,000 different manuscripts or pieces of manuscripts we have.

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And so that would be a bad way to pick a church. If you say, I want a literal translation, that's a good reason.

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If you say it has to be this one or no other translation, then there's a problem.

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Good, what else do you have on that list, Steve? Well, using the metaphor of beating the drum, how about we talk about this one?

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Drums in worship? Well, close. Karaoke? I choose my church on the basis of the worship band.

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The worship band has to rock. In fact, I think worship should be measured in terms of the number of windmills the lead guitar player performs.

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Wow, that's pretty good. Who wrote that? Well, you helped.

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Okay. Listen, we all like music. We all have preferences when it comes to music.

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And as I say to people many times, if you love Striper, then get in your car and rock out to Striper.

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If you'd like to have some secular music, there's nothing innately wrong necessarily about secular music.

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I think many of the classical composers were far from being born -again Christians. But it's an immature thing,

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I hate to say it, but it is nocompromisedradio .com. It is immature to say, this is the kind of music

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I want, and so I pick for an unbiblical reason. It's biblical to pick for preaching, it's biblical to pick for, well, they've got church discipline, but it's not a biblical reason to say,

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I want the music that I like. That's right, that's right. And too many people get hung up on that and not the content of the music.

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What I wanna hear is music that reflects the glory of God in the lyrics, so that when we sing, it's just not mindless repetition.

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It is Jesus Christ being exalted and God being praised. Well, Steve, I think as my subordinate at church,

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I'd like you to now sing, holy, holy, holy to the tune of Yankee Doodle Dandy to see if form and function both matter.

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I don't think you'd like that. There, you know, you can't just say, well, the lyrics are really good.

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There has to be music that backs up those lyrics, and there's a special kind of church music.

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I'm not against contemporary music. I'm not against old music. There's some Unitarian hymns in our hymnal at church that we have excised and have banished to the netherworlds that we won't sing, but there are also good contemporary songs.

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The good thing about a hymnal is that they've weathered time. Some of the contemporary songs have not weathered time because they're just new.

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I like contemporary songs because when we're to sing to the Lord a new song, it's like God saying there's a new generation that's been redeemed by my son's blood, by his death, by his resurrection, and they express themselves in a song.

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And so singing and songs are good. I think churches should sing them. What happens if there's a church that has no instruments?

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Would that be biblical? It absolutely would be, yeah. What if they have percussion? I think that's fine, too.

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Bongos? Well, I mean, if you look at kind of the Old Testament, I certainly would say that they worshiped with a timbrel and a lyre and all these different kind of instruments, and I think we ought to just, instead of being concerned about the style, be concerned with the overall emphasis of the worship.

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Is it man -centered or is it God -centered? When people come to the church and say, well,

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I really like the preaching, but I didn't really like the worship. Yeah, well, worship has become some kind of synonym for music, and that's just wrong.

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Worship contains or encompasses all of the service. It's a worship service, we don't have a worship segment in the service.

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And what about people that are in the congregation that really like those songs that maybe you don't like, but you, in Christian love and in deference and in preferring others over you, you say, well, they really love those songs, and so I'll be glad to sing them because they're gospel truths and gospel verities.

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That's right, I mean, it's not a matter of always having my own way, otherwise we wouldn't have a church. If everybody had to have everything they liked, then we couldn't possibly get together.

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It would be fair to say that I don't, although I influence the local church, Bethlehem Bible Church, we don't sing all the songs that only

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I prefer. We don't sing all the songs Steve prefers. We don't sing, you know, U2 songs and have it a

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U2 -chorist. Maybe you like U2 songs and you think, oh, I wanna sing Yahweh, or I wanna sing, you know,

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Gloria, Psalm 40. We just don't do that. I'd like to see Bono get saved and then maybe we would sing some of his songs.

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I don't know if we'd sing them in a service or not, but we would maybe sing his songs in the car or something,

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I don't know. So anything else before we're time is, time is flying by No Compromise Radio. It's like the millennial kingdom.

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It seems like one day is like a thousand years and a thousand years like a day. Well, let me give you the easy one. I choose a church on the basis of its schedule.

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They have Saturday night services and they have other services, so they don't conflict with the things

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I like, like NFL games. Yikes. Well, sometimes when the

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Patriots lose, I actually like it because there's another idol with clay feet and down they go.

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Listen, you can worship Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, can't you? As long as you hold the

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Lord's day as something special. We're not against Saturday night services. I would be against a

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Saturday night service if it was in lieu of the Lord's day service. And so what we're going to do is we'll pick this up next week.

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No Gospel Radio. No, No Compromise Radio. We will not compromise with the gospel.

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Thanks Pastor Steve for being in here. We'll see you soon. My pleasure. No Compromise Radio with Pastor Mike Abendroth is a production of Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston.

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Bethlehem Bible Church is a Bible teaching church firmly committed to unleashing the life transforming power of God's word through verse by verse exposition of the sacred text.

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Please come and join us. Our service times are Sunday morning at 1015 and in the evening at six. We're right on route 110 in West Boylston.

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You can check us out online at bbchurch .org or by phone at 508 -835 -3400.

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The thoughts and opinions expressed on No Compromise Radio do not necessarily reflect those of WVNE its staff or management.