November 10, 2022 Show with Geoff Thomas on “In the Shadow of the Rock”

Live from historic downtown Carlisle, Pennsylvania, home of founding father James Wilson, 19th century hymn writer George Duffield, 19th century gospel minister George Norcross, and sports legend Jim Thorpe, it's Iron Sharpens Iron.

This is a radio platform in which pastors, Christian scholars, and theologians address the burning issues facing the church and the world today. Proverbs chapter 27 verse 17 tells us iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another.

Matthew Henry said that in this passage, we are cautioned to take heed with whom we converse and directed to have in view in conversation to make one another wiser and better. It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next two hours, and we hope to hear from you, the listener, with your own questions.

And now, here's your host, Chris Arnzen.

Good afternoon, Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, Lake City, Florida, and the rest of humanity living on the planet Earth who are listening via live streaming at ironsharpensironradio .com. This is Chris Arnzen, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, wishing you all a happy Thursday on this 10th day of November 2022.

As many of you may have recognized, we have a brand new intro to the program since we actually had to move out of the parsonage, the historic parsonage, of 19th century Gospel Minister George Norcross a year ago because my landlords there had to move themselves.

They moved into an assisted living facility, and therefore I have found a new place. I've been here almost a year, two months shy of a year, and we finally got around to having a more honest and accurate intro since we are no longer in that parsonage, an even more detailed description of Carlisle, Pennsylvania, where we are broadcasting from.

Geoff Thomas’s New Autobiography and Long Pastorate in Wales

And I am thrilled to have on today, the first day that we have our new intro airing, to start the program. I am thrilled to have back on the program one of my favorite guests, and apparently one of the favorite guests of many people who listen regularly to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, Reverend Jeff Thomas, who, beginning in 1965, served for over 50 years as pastor at Alfred Place Baptist Church of Aberystwyth, Wales, and he is the author of many books.

Today he's going to be discussing his new autobiography, In the Shadow of the Rock, and it's my honor and privilege to welcome you back to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, my dear friend Reverend Jeff Thomas.

Well, thanks.

Well, I'm sure it will be, especially the autobiography of a faithful Christian who served for over 50 years in one church. That is an extremely rare accomplishment, and our mutual friend who is now with the Lord for eternity, Walt Chantry, he was the pastor of Grace Baptist Church of Carlisle for 40 years, and even that is considered a marathon, a very long time to serve in one place, but you even beat that, over 50 years of service at Alfred Place Baptist Church of Aberystwyth, Wales.

And what's another fascinating fact about Alfred Place Baptist Church of Aberystwyth, Wales, is that you folks, in two weeks, are celebrating the 150th anniversary of this.

Church.

It's actually 152 years old, but the 150th anniversary celebration had to be delayed because of all the COVID mandates, and I am excited to hear that you'll be having that celebration two weeks from tomorrow, and you are going to be one of the speakers at this celebration, and the other speaker is who?

About 40 to Kenya.

Wow.

And of course, the church is...

Well, praise God. Well, if anybody wants to attend this conference, this celebration of the 150th anniversary of Alfred Place Baptist Church of Aberystwyth, Wales, you can go to the website of that historic church, alfredplacechurch .org .uk.

Alfredplacechurch .org .uk, I know that we do have listeners in Wales, we have listeners throughout the United Kingdom as well. In fact, you might find this interesting, one of my former pastors, David Campbell, who pastors now in Northern England, he told me that he has had two visitors to the church where he pastors there in Northern England, who heard about that church from Iron Trip and Zion Radio, so we have listeners all over the world, and I am excited to discuss, as I mentioned, your new autobiography, In the Shadow of the Rock.

First of all, that is a beautiful title. Can you tell us more details about how you came up with that specific title, In the Shadow of the Rock?

I would go, was, have a girl's, master's, so it's a phrase that, and that always struck my, and it was a very popular hymn.

Now, is that also, because it's an unfamiliar hymn to me, is that hymn also in the Trinity hymnal?

I'm not sure if it's very popular, I mean, Francis Ridley Avogadro wrote so many, I don't know it.

Okay, well, I'm going to have to find out about that, because Grace Baptist Church of Carlisle, I know that you're very familiar with that church, having preached there, they have songs that they, very often, in fact, every week, typically, they include at least one song in the church bulletin that is not in the Trinity hymnal, so perhaps I will recommend that hymn to them to have in the bulletin some Sunday.

Well, tell us, how far back into your life does this autobiography begin?

And also, Charles Adonis Spurgeon, did he not battle this? and die upon the cross. Let me tell you about him. He started children's meetings, Friday nights, from six to seven, and my mother and her sister went along every Friday night, and sometime around 1919, she sang hymns every day.

It wasn't a day I didn't hear her singing, washing and ironing, I surveyed the wondrous cross, and I just took that for granted, and then one day when I was 50, I thought, every mother sang hymns just like my mother, and so, that was the, twice a Sunday, and he was a deacon and a treasurer of the church, and he lived according to the light that that liberal, and it wasn't until he and his mother, nor till then that he heard the gospel, very evident, and the first mark of it was Bishopmaster Welsh Valley, and there was a church there in 1904 by a group of people who were saved in the revival, and were overzealous in sharing their faith, and telling people they'd entered into new blessing, and that the people didn't establish this congregation, they were the older people, experiential.

Praise God.

J .I. Packer's Fundamentalism and the Word of God, and then I read T .C. Ryle's Holiness in the Sermon on the Mount, by, oh, what a beautiful life, the righteous life is magnificent, there's nothing like it, that life, living out in the Sermon on the Mount, by evil, but overcoming evil by good, loving your enemies, pure in heart, hungering and thirsty.

One day I hung around the office as the student, because students are older ministers, but they were enormously respectful, and spoke in awe of him. He was coming to Cardiff to preach at the Inductions, and I walked to other hall, walked, and J .I. Evans was going to his authority.

Why was he so, in 55 minutes.

Amen, and we're going to go to our first station break right now. If you'd like to join us on the air with a question for Jeff Thomas, our email address is chrisarnsen at gmail dot com, c-h-r-i-s-a-r-n-z-e-n at gmail dot com.

As always, give us your first name at least, and your city and state of residence, and your country of residence, if you live outside the USA. Only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter, and don't go.

Away.

We're going to be right back with Jeff Thomas.

I'm Dr. Joseph Piper, President Emeritus and Professor of Systematic and Applied Theology at Greenville Presbyterian Theological Seminary. Every Christian who's serious about the Deformed Faith and the Westminster Standards should have and use the eight-volume commentary on the theology and ethics of the Westminster Larger Catechism, titled Authentic Christianity, by Dr. Joseph Morecraft.

It is much more than an exposition of the Larger Catechism. It is a thoroughly researched work that utilizes biblical exegesis as well as historical and systematic theology. Dr. Morecraft is pastor of Heritage Presbyterian Church of Cumming, Georgia, and I urge everyone looking for a biblically faithful church in that area to visit that fine congregation.

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Please tell Dr. Morecraft and the saints at Heritage Presbyterian Church of Cumming, Georgia that Dr. Joseph Piper of Greenville Presbyterian Theological Seminary sent you.

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James White of Alpha Omega Ministries here. If you've watched my Dividing Line webcast often enough, you know I have a great love for getting Bibles and other documents vital to my ministry rebound to preserve and ensure their longevity.

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The silver gilding he added on the page edges has a stunning mirror finish resembling highly polished chrome. Jeffrey will customize your rebinding to your specifications and even emboss your logo into the leather, making whatever he rebinds a one-of-a-kind work of art.

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When Iron Sharpens Iron Radio first launched in 2005, the publishers of the New American Standard Bible were among my very first sponsors. It gives me joy knowing that many scholars and pastors in the Iron Sharpens Iron Radio audience have been sticking with or switching to the NASB.

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Go to nasbible .com. That's nasbible .com to place your order. Welcome back. This is Chris Arnzen. If you just tuned us in, our guest today is Jeff Thomas, and he is discussing his autobiography, In the Shadow of the Rock.

If you have a question, send it in to chrisarnzen at gmail .com. Chrisarnzen at gmail .com. Jeff, we do have a listener in Wales with a question for you. He is someone that both you and I know, Mike Eliff, and I hope I'm not mispronouncing Mike's.

Name.

He says, Hi, Chris and Jeff. I really enjoyed Jeff's book. The bookshop here sold nearly 50 copies. How do we specifically in Wales and the rest of the United Kingdom compare with, say, the United States?

God is blessing here and there, but the church seems to be an utter irreverence. I try to regularly go into town with a book table to engage with people and to just be there when the Lord moves. We make contact with ones and twos, but people are mainly indifferent.

Do you think the church needs to realize God is our only hope or we are completely sunk? I include myself in that. How can we stir ourselves in our churches? That was Mike Eliff. Mike also asked about your opinion when you compare the theological or religious climate between Wales and the UK and the United States.

Britain doesn't book the largest seminary in the world, 5 ,000 students. You know that is in bigger conferences than that. America does have retained historic Christian churches and its magazines and these series of seminaries that it has.

Well, thank you, Mike. Mike signs off by saying, Jeff, I will see you in a week or so at the Reformation Conference.

I met Walter Chalmers at Westminster, the man most full of God, Wood J. Young. The great contribution he has made. He started, his first year was my last year in 1963 -64. And, oh my, they were unforgettable years.

Years in which I was, to young men my age, I'm going to become a heart of hearts. I wanted to, but to articulate. Forty years later, I was speaking in California where he was the president. He wanted to see me.

Three days since you graduated and it gets rather tedious. Again, I would be a man of God. Word of God. Those were the things. And that I would be a good family man with my wife and my three daughters.

You know, those things. Got married to the girl back home. That's the wages for National Coal Board. But I stayed there. In the town, her husband was my closest friend. And 50 years, 47 men who had sat in the congregation went into the ministry.

In the morning. And they did the Lloyd-Jones. And the guy would have been better in those early years. Doing prophecies of Isaiah, Jeremiah, and Ezekiel. That are there in the most wonderful living offer.

Morning and evening. And then he thinks it would have been better to have varied it in the evening. Like Spurgeon did. I regret that. I don't. And that's what I encourage young men. Why they should love him.

And why it's a sin. Love will be as white as snow. I'm more evangelistic now in my old age. I'm very evangelist. All my preaching. And when I'm on the streets. And when I'm in any pulpit as I visit church.

Present a loving, forgiving Christ.

Amen.

And you are uniquely blessed to do that in a very powerful way. I've been blessed to hear you on numerous occasions preach. So are you basically saying that you lament that far too much. Far too high of a percentage initially of your preaching was academic in nature.

And perhaps addressing technical issues in the Bible. And lacked the passion of having an urgent call to repentance and faith to the lost. Is that what you're saying as far as the way.

Yeah. I'm saying that. Of redemption. Long past.

So as a senior representative of the faith. And not only of the Christian faith. And not only of reformed theology. But of the pastorate. I'm assuming then that you are giving a critique or a loving chastisement.

To many within the reformed faith perhaps even especially. Who are in the pulpits of reformed churches. Who are perhaps in an overreaction. To the dumbed down gospel of modern evangelicalism. Which is very shallow.

Which doesn't even challenge the listener to stretch and grow. And perhaps an overreaction to that. There may be more of a professorial approach from the pulpit. Now obviously as you said before. There are times for that in Bible study and so on.

As long as the deeply intellectual and academic things being taught. Are broken down for every listener to understand. But I'm assuming then you're saying that reformed preachers have to be careful. Not to dominate too much of their preaching.

With the more professorial and academic approach. And we have to go to our midway break right now. It's a little longer than the other breaks. As anybody who listens regularly knows. In the midway break.

Because Grace Life Radio. 90 .1 FM in Lake City Florida. Requires of us a longer break in the middle of the show. Because the FCC requires of them to localize geographically. Their programming including Iron Sharpens Iron.

To Lake City Florida. And they do so with their own public service announcements and other local things. So while they are doing that. We are simultaneously airing our globally heard commercials. Please use this time wisely.

Write down as much of the contact information as you can. For as many of our advertisers as you can. So that you can more successfully and frequently respond to our advertising. We depend on our advertisers to exist.

We need the income that comes in from their sponsorship of this program. We could never survive on donations alone. There are not nearly enough of them that come in. So please respond to our advertisers.

And if you can't pay for anything that they are offering. Please at least thank them for sponsoring the show. If indeed you are grateful that there are churches, ministries and businesses. And private practices out there.

Who are sharing the wealth that God has blessed them with. With us at Iron Sharpens Iron. So that we can continue to exist. If you are really grateful about that. Please thank our advertisers using their contact information.

And also of course. Send in your questions to Jeff Thomas. To Chris Ornson at gmail .com. Chris Ornson at gmail .com. As always give us your first name at least. Your city and state. And your country of residence.

Don't go away. We will be right back. Right after these messages. As host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio. I frequently get requests from listeners for church recommendations. A church I have been strongly recommending.

As far back as the 1980's. Is Grace Covenant Baptist Church. In Flemington, New Jersey. Pastored by Alan Dunn. Grace Covenant Baptist Church believes it's God's prerogative. To determine how he shall be worshiped.

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Reading, preaching and hearing the word of God. Singing psalms, hymns and spiritual songs. Baptism and communion are the scriptural elements of their corporate worship. Performed with faith, joy and sobriety.

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James White of Alpha Omega Ministries here. If you've watched my Dividing Line webcast often enough, you know I have a great love for getting Bibles and other documents vital to my ministry rebound to preserve and ensure their longevity.

And besides that, they feel so good. I'm so delighted I discovered Post Tenebrous Lux Bible rebinding. No radio ad will be long enough to sing their praises sufficiently, but I'll give it a shot. Jeffrey Rice of Post Tenebrous Lux is a remarkably gifted craftsman and artisan.

All his work is done by hand, from the cutting to the pleating of corners to the perimeter stitching. Jeffrey uses the finest in buttery soft imported leathers in a wide variety of gorgeous colors, like the turquoise goatskin tanned in Italy used for my Nestle All in 28th edition, with a navy blue goatskin inside liner, and the electric blue goatskin from a French tannery used to rebind a Reformation study Bible I used as a gift.

The silver gilding he added on the page edges has a stunning mirror finish resembling highly polished chrome. Jeffrey will customize your rebinding to your specifications and even emboss your logo into the leather, making whatever he rebinds a one-of-a-kind work of art.

For more details on Post Tenebrous Lux Bible rebinding, go to PTLBibleRebinding .com. That's PTLBibleRebinding .com.

When Iron Sharpens Iron Radio first launched in 2005,.

The publishers of the New American Standard Bible were among my very first sponsors. It gives me joy knowing that many scholars and pastors in the Iron Sharpens Iron Radio audience have been sticking with or switching to the NASB.

I'm Dr. Joseph Piper, President and Professor of Systematic and Homiletical Theology at Greenville Presbyterian Theological Seminary in Taylors, South Carolina, and the NASB is my Bible of choice. I'm Pastor Chuck White of the First Trinity Lutheran Church in Tonawanda, New York, and the NASB is my Bible of choice.

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Hi, this is John Sampson, Pastor of King's Church in Peoria, Arizona. Taking a moment of your day to talk about Chris Arnzen and the Iron Sharpen's Iron podcast. I consider Chris a true friend and a man of high integrity.

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The Need for Evangelistic Preaching in Reformed Pulpits

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Hi, I'm Buzz Taylor. Chris Arnzen of Iron Sharpen's Iron Radio has had a long-time partnership with our friends at CVBBS, which stands for Cumberland Valley Bible Book Service. They specialize in supplying Reformed and Puritan books and Bibles at discount prices that make them affordable for everyone.

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I'm Dr. Tony Costa, professor of apologetics and Islam at Toronto Baptist Seminary. I'm thrilled to introduce to you a church where I've been invited to speak and have grown to love, Hope Reformed Baptist Church in Corham, Long Island, New York, pastored by Rich Jansen and Christopher McDowell.

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Charles Haddon Spurgeon once said,.

Give yourself unto reading. The man who never reads will never be read. He who never quotes will never be quoted. He who will not use the thoughts of other men's brains proves that he has no brains of his own.

You need to read.

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Before I return to Jeff Thomas and to further discuss with him his new autobiography, In the Shadow of the Rock I just have a couple more very important announcements to make. First of all, folks, if you really love this show and you don't want it to disappear you love the fact that I interview folks like Jeff Thomas and other brilliant and gifted men of faith both from behind the pulpit and those that have written books that have been of great benefit to the body of Christ and, of course, Jeff Thomas has done both and you would hate for this program to go off the air.

Well, if that's the case, can you please help us financially because we are in urgent need of your financial assistance. Please go to IronSharpensIronRadio .com click support, then click click to donate now.

Evangelistic Burden in Old Age and Pastoral Self-Critique

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Please don't do that. Also, if you are really struggling to survive financially and make ends meet please wait until you are more financially stable and back on your feet before you send us a financial gift.

Those two things are commands of God and Scripture providing for church and family. Providing for this radio show is obviously not a command of God. But, if you love the program and you are financially blessed above and beyond your ability to provide for your church and family you have extra money in the bank collecting interest you have extra money for benevolent, recreational, and trivial matters please share some of that money with us if you don't want the program to disappear.

Go to IronSharpensIronRadio .com, click support, then click, click to donate now. Last but not least, if you are not a member of a Christ-honoring, biblically faithful, theologically sound, doctrinally solid church just like the church where Jeff Thomas served for over 50 years the Alfred Place Baptist Church of Aberystwyth, Wales well, no matter where you live on the planet Earth I have extensive lists spanning the globe of faithful churches and I may be able to help you find a church as I have done with many people all over the planet Earth sometimes even helping folks find churches within minutes of their own home.

So, if that is the case with you, you are homeless spiritually send me an email to chrisarnson at gmail dot com and put I need a church in the subject line. That's also the email address where you can send in a question to Jeff Thomas.