EP 38 – An Urgent Plea to Pastors BEFORE the Presidential Election, #maga #maca #shepherd

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So my encouragement to pastors is talk to your congregations, tell them what's at stake, encourage them to go out and vote.

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We should have 100 % of Christians voting in this election, and pastors need to get out there and tell their congregations.

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This is my plea as a pastor to pastors. Please get your congregations out to vote.

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Otherwise, America is going to be a very, very, very dark place, not too far down the road. Yeah, and I'll be the bad cop to Seth's good cop.

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Seth was just encouraging pastors, but I'll say it in the negative, that if a pastor is unwilling to speak against this level of evil right now, he's not a shepherd.

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And it's not too late for you, pastor, if you haven't spoken out against abortion and all this trans agenda and the communism that Kamala is pushing.

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You're not a shepherd unless you do it. You still have time to do it, but your identity as a pastor is on the line at this point.

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And welcome to Tearing Down High Places. My name's Average Joe. Got the pastors all gathered around from around the states and Mount Laurel, New Jersey.

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So welcome again, Seth Brickley. Where from? Great to be with you guys.

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Just north of St. Croix Falls, Wisconsin. Just north of St.

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Croix Falls, Wisconsin. Nice. It's great to be with you again. And, of course, last week we were together doing the

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VP Debate Watch Party, but this week we were together again to talk about the upcoming election.

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Yeah. Welcome, Jeff. Welcome, Tim. Tim's traveling, but making it anyway.

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You want to share your secret? No, we don't need you to tell anybody. It's okay. Say greetings from Martinsburg, Virginia.

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Or Martinsburg, West Virginia, I should say. West Virginia. Yes, yes. We're listening to Jeff's favorite song,

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Country Roads, on the way here. Is that your favorite song, Jeff? When I'm in West Virginia. That's a great song.

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I did some time in Morgantown. I did a little grad school at WVU.

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And after every football game, that's what they sing. And the musketeer shoots his gun.

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If you like that song, Jeff, I was going to suggest we go to the Mountaineer game. Oh, okay. Yeah, but only if you're there,

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I guess. So we got some big questions to talk about today. We're doing a lot about the election.

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Pastor Jeff has been actively leading the charge over in Pennsylvania, the swing state right next to our church in East Philly, a .k

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.a. Mount Laurel, New Jersey. So we're focusing a lot on that. Do you guys want to talk about why we're focusing on that?

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Yeah, I would just say that all of human history hinges on this moment. And it's almost not an overstatement because secular humanism has so infected the culture that half of the people are buying into it.

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And the manifestation of that in all of these areas, the killing of innocent babies by the mutilation of children, the exposing of children to pornography in the library and in the school libraries.

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The list goes on and on what secular humanism has rocked in our culture.

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And to give a champion of secular humanism like Harris the presidency and to give her that opportunity then to bring in Washington, D .C.

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as another state, to get rid of the filibuster, to open the borders as they have been for the last four years, to flood the country with future voters.

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We may never have the chance to return to where this country began. After this year, if we don't win this election.

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So I don't know if it's an overstatement or not because we could be plunging right into the tribulation.

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And this is just the birth pangs. The one world government is just on the precipice. Maybe it's supposed to take over and we can't stop it.

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But for our part, when Christ comes, will He find faith on earth? We need to occupy until He comes.

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We need to be battling and fighting because maybe for such a time as this, we are here and the

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Lord will give us a revival. And our kids and grandkids and maybe great grandkids, we don't know, will grow up in a

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Christian culture. This is the moment as we approach the 250 year anniversary of this country.

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This country will part completely into apostasy or there will be a revival. It's either or at this point.

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So that's why we're talking so much about it. How big a problem is it that both parties right now are only talking about abortion and the

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Republicans have backpedaled from that? And the other side's kind of pretending like they can get along with us.

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It's not a big deal. The Democrats are like, oh, yeah, we're going to...

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Hey, Kamala's out there talking about cutting taxes. I don't see that happening. What do you guys think?

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They're going to say whatever they need to say to win. And you can't believe a word that Kamala Harris, her campaign is saying.

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Because like Jeff said, I mean, we are on the brink of losing our nation forever.

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This nation, by the way, that was founded on biblical Christianity. When people ask the question, what made

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America great? The answer is it's biblical Christianity. And the founders understood this.

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They understood that the Republic would only succeed if Christianity was the focal point of the nation.

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So we as Christians, we as pastors, we have a responsibility to speak to these issues.

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We need to love our neighbor in the public square. That's the second greatest commandment. And by standing down and not doing anything here, by letting the

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Harris campaign win, we would be hating our neighbor. And we would be giving up the opportunity for our children to grow up in a land of freedom and grandchildren if Christ's return delays.

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So we always say this is the most important election of our lifetime. But this one truly is.

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I mean, it is so important that Christians get out and vote and make a difference.

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And Joe, maybe we can talk about what would a country where Kamala Harris and the

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Democratic Party, what would a country look like when they get complete control? Yeah, I was going to jump to that or either the other question in regards to that.

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What does that look like, Jeff? Proverbs 14, 34.

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Righteousness exalts a nation, but sin is a reproach to any people. It's not just a matter of how much money this country has or how the population, how educated we are.

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If we reject God and continue down this path of just godlessness and unrighteousness, then that sin in this culture will be a reproach to us.

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And the country will fall under that kind of discipline and judgment from God. So righteousness exalts a nation, but sin is a reproach to any people.

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Is it possible for us to live in two separate worlds here as Christians with this, dare

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I say, demonic government? Are you talking about like coexist and everything can just be fine?

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Yeah, because I feel like the theme today is addressing those pastors who are not speaking out about the evil that's in front of us.

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The devastation that the Democratic Party has included in their platform and the fact that they are no longer pretending to be able to get along with a

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Christian culture. They are attacking the Christian culture, and they have stated that they want to outlaw parts of the

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Bible. Maybe not all of it, but they've started with some. And I'd be really curious. I mean, we talked about the

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Equality Act, and I don't want to bore our audience with the Equality Act anymore. But what happens after they get that passed?

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What's the next thing they go after in the Bible? What do you think? Yeah, well,

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Joe, what we're seeing is they believe that they are

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God, right? They don't believe that the government, they don't believe that God is God. They believe that the government is

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God. And I spoke at an event last week with where U .S.

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Senator Ron Johnson also spoke. He's our Wisconsin Senator, and he's really on the front lines in Washington of fighting these things.

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And as he's fighting these things, he sees what's going on. He sees the inner workings. And what he said was, he said that they hate

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America, and they want a one world government. Okay, what does that sound like?

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Well, that sounds like Revelation 13. That sounds like the Antichrist taking his throne. So literally, we are standing here in 2020 ending in the way of this beast system that is trying to set up before our eyes.

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And how sad it would be if we don't even talk about this with our people as pastors and fellow

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Christians. We have a tremendous responsibility to speak out against what's going on and say, we need to do whatever we can to stop this evil and to have righteousness prevail in this land.

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I just heard recently that Tim Walz, of course, last week we did the Tim Walz VP Watch Party.

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Tim Walz, under this bill that was passed, that if there's a botched abortion, the baby would be left to die.

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Eight babies in Minnesota have died already because of that. Think about that.

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Heartbreaking. I think that's such an important point because I don't think people understand what is being spoken about when

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Republicans try to squeeze that into a tiny sound clip. Right?

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I think that needs to really be expanded upon and talked about. And I think when it's squeezed into that little sound clip, certain media outlets are able to distort the truth.

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Any thoughts? How about you, Tim? Jump in.

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I think what Seth was saying is really on point. We need to be fighting and you can't just sit back and watch the country get destroyed.

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Honestly, I feel like my fear is that it's just going to go so downhill that our children and our grandchildren are not going to be able to enjoy what we enjoyed, what our parents enjoyed, what our grandparents enjoyed, what our great grandparents enjoyed, because they are asking for evil to be in charge of the country.

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And they're proud and they're happy about it. And they're going to realize that that was a huge mistake when it's way too late.

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So I think that the best thing we can do by loving our neighbor is telling them, no, we need to vote for Trump, not because we think he's the greatest guy in the world, but because Kamala Harris will destroy the country.

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And I think other countries can probably take advantage of a vulnerable state our country would be in as having that woman running it.

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So for me, I think what drives me is I believe in the Bible and I believe in God and I want other people to believe all of those things.

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But I also am looking to the next generation of people and I want to try and teach them the right things, because what happens once the generation of pastors is gone?

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And then we need to really start raising up new young people to be able to decipher the times.

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And even politically, I think we should be talking about it a lot more. People hate talking about politics and religion, but it's the two most important things we need to talk about.

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Tim, I love what you say about, I mean, you're basically saying, you know, you're worried about the next generation being able to enjoy the blessings that we've had.

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And I feel like there's some great pastors out there that are, well, I don't feel like anything.

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I gotta stop saying that. That's because of the air I swim in, that I say that too much.

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But I believe that it's true that there are great pastors out there saying, well, you know, the next generation is going to have an opportunity to suffer more.

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And that's always good for Christianity. Guys, is that our role to allow that to happen?

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It's so ignorant of history because where the political structure and system becomes oppressive, it actually decreases the number of believers.

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They say that, you know, martyrdom is the seabed of the church. And in the first three centuries of the church, you did have a lot of persecution.

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And oftentimes it came from, at first, the Jewish synagogue against the believer, and then later the

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Roman Empire. And yet Christianity grew. But have we not had 2 ,000 years of church history to see where different government structures have been tried?

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All you have to do is look at the difference between North Korea and South Korea, where freedom and capitalism were preserved in the

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South, and where oppressive authoritarian government overtook the

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North. And the difference is 50 million believers, 500 ,000.

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Christianity does not thrive under communism and authoritarian government.

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And so we don't allow that to overtake America. It's not even the result that has happened through history.

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So that wouldn't, Jeff, are you saying that you can't vote for Kamala Harris with a clean conscience if that's your goal?

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You have to have some other reason to vote for Kamala. Right. What could that reason be?

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Is there a good reason? Is there any reason? It's not, but here's the irony. Everybody seems to acknowledge, even great church pastors acknowledge, that the abortion issue is on the side of the

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Bible and the truth and conservative Christianity. But they say, but you have to show love to the immigrant and you have to show love to the poor.

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And they are just assuming that the Democratic Party is not hating the poor and hating immigrants by encouraging illegal immigration, which leads to so many deaths, so much human trafficking, so much fentanyl coming over the border.

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What they're doing for the immigrants, so -called, is actually hating the immigrant. And the poor, with all these social programs and social engineering handouts from Uncle Sam, is actually hurting the poor.

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If you read the book, White Guilt, by someone who was,

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Shelby Steele was his name, the Hoover Institute. He traces the government handout programs to the destruction of the inner city.

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And he talks about how incentivizing the breakdown of family, where the government becomes the father in the home, and single -parent homes are encouraged by government incentive handouts.

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This is what caused the poverty of the inner city. It was these very handouts.

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So it's not loving the poor to give more and more government money to the poor. That's, in fact, what's caused so much of the problem.

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And it escalates the problem to the degree that you keep doing it. Yeah, yeah. And there's two groups of people here that we have a problem with.

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One group is they're actually going to vote for Kamala Harris.

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And that is the David Frenches, the Russell Moores, the

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Ray Ortlund. Ray Ortlund just came out a week or two ago saying that he's going to vote for Harris. And then on the other end, you have pastors who won't say anything about the election.

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It'll pretend like there's nothing going on. They'll just preach their sermon that Sunday before the election.

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And so my plea is more towards that group. I feel like the

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Russell Moores of the world, the David Frenches, they're evangelicals for Harris.

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And I came up with a better term for that. That is wolves for Harris. I mean, they're just showing who they are.

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If you love Christ, you're going to love what he loves. And their whole platform is pagan ethics.

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So what they're showing where their values are. They have worldly values. Okay, so they're not evangelicals for Harris.

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They're wolves for Harris. But on the other end, you have great pastors.

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You know, a lot of these guys, I would say they're brothers in Christ. They do a lot of good things.

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And my plea is to them is to understand where we are at, this place that we are at.

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Communism is patient. China either has to invade a land or they infiltrate it from within, right?

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So what's happened in America for a very long time is that through the universities, through the media, through politicians being paid off, they have infiltrated institutions.

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And now Ron Johnson, who I heard last week, he even said this. These Marxists, these communists have infiltrated the church, right?

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So that's where you have people like Russell Moore who infiltrated the ERLC of the

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Southern Baptist Convention when he led that organization, the ERLC. Now, here's something that's very interesting, guys.

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Tim Keller, of course, he passed away a year or two ago. Trevor Loudon is an expert on communism.

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Have you guys heard of Trevor Loudon? No. So Trevor Loudon actually just released a 700 -page book.

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It's the most extensive research on Kamala Harris there is to show her communistic roots.

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And what Senator Johnson said one week ago is that he said that communism has infiltrated the church.

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And Ron Johnson's not even coming from this as a guy who's this strong born -again Christian.

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He just sees it from a governmental side of things because he's in the government.

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But here's what Trevor Loudon said about Tim Keller. Trevor Loudon is not even a born -again Christian. Now, he might be getting close to that, and let's pray that he does become a

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Christian. But Trevor Loudon, as a student of communism, as one who studies communism, he knew who

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Tim Keller was, even without knowing the inner workings of Christianity like we do as pastors.

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He knew who Tim Keller was because of Keller's communistic influence on the

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American church. Think about how alarming that is. So we as pastors, we have to have discernment to see what's going on here.

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The devil has used certain men to infiltrate the church with a movement that doesn't view

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God as God, but it views the government as God. And it's evil. It's satanic.

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There it is, Trevor Loudon. There it is. Thank you. Kamala Harris's communist roots.

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So Seth, I got a question for Seth. So Seth, say you weren't a pastor, right?

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Or you went to visit somewhere, or you're just an average churchgoer, and you go into a church, and you're there for a year, and especially like heading up to the election, and the pastor never said anything about politics.

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As a churchgoer, what would your move be? Okay, so the election comes and goes, and you didn't make one mention of it.

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And this is, by the way, we're talking about gray. Some people might not understand what we're talking about here.

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So Jeff Cleaver wrote a book, Blood Red Church. And it's really targeted, and Jeff, you can speak to this, but the blue church is the liberal social activist church, right?

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Let's have these Democratic candidates come and preach about how they've been oppressed their whole life, right?

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And then you have the red church, which is they've been influenced by the ethics of the

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Bible. And as those who've been redeemed by the blood of Christ, we are making a difference in the public square for Christ's sake, right?

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And then you have the gray church, which is they're silent. They don't really talk about politics. Or even they've even compromised a little bit.

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Is that accurate, Jeff? Is that accurate? Absolutely. Yeah, and usually the point of compromise has to do with issues of race because they've taken on the diversity, equity, inclusion mantra around the issue of race.

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So they might be at least claimed to be strong on abortion, although you don't really ever hear them talk about the problem of abortion.

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They keep that out of the pulpit. But they do much with diversity. And then immigration tends to be a bit leftist.

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So it's great because it's the blue and the red just mixed together in an ungodly mixture.

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Yeah, so to answer Tim's question, though, you're pretty much saying they go to a gray church.

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Yeah, I would say they're going to a gray church. Yeah, they're going to a gray church. How do you deal with the gray pastor if you're in the congregation?

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Yeah, I think a layman in that congregation should go to the pastor after the election and say, you know what?

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We had this great opportunity before us, even if Trump wins. But I'm really concerned that we didn't do our part.

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I mean, we as a church, you should have said something to encourage us to get out and vote, to vote for righteousness.

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And you didn't. And I would say, depending on his response, he might say, no, we don't do that in this church.

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I would say find a different church at that point. But I think give your pastor an opportunity to explain himself because this is such a lie out there.

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It is the lie of pietism. We don't get involved in this. You're not going to find that in the Bible. We talk about these biblical

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John the Baptist, the Apostle Paul, Jesus. I mean, they're calling out the governing authorities.

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They're holding them accountable. It's in the Bible. But there's this false conventional wisdom that's out there that, oh, no, we don't, you know, we stay in our lane.

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We don't go there. And a lot of pastors listen to that. And guess what? It's Big Eva.

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It's the poison, this poisonous machine we call Big Eva that we talked about in a previous podcast.

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That's the lie that's out there. We don't want Big Eva pastors, right? Christians should not want a

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Big Eva pastor who bows the knee to Big Eva. We bow the knee to Christ. We listen to his word.

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And if you have a pastor who doesn't have enough courage to actually and enough moral conviction to actually address these things,

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I would say find a church. Be willing to drive 30 miles if you need to, as inconvenient as that is.

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But to be with a shepherd who's doing his job is far much better than to be with a shepherd who is committing a dereliction of duty.

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Is it as simple as a dereliction of duty? I mean, do they actually know what to do?

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Are they ignorant? Who is influencing them? I think they're probably influenced maybe by the church themselves.

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And I think it becomes this model as the church is shepherding the pastor in what to say, when the pastor should be shepherding the flock on how to grow in Christ.

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So I think it's almost fear for I got to give the people what they want to hear or don't say what they don't want to hear.

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So maybe they're like, oh, politics is a touchy subject for people in my church.

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I'm not going to go there because people will leave or they bought. That's a good way to say it. They might have bought the lie of this false wisdom.

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That's not wisdom. It's foolish to say, you know, never talk about this. Jeff, I think it's so important that you reshare what you said in the past about certain groups.

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And I think you should name those groups that are teaching pastors to deceive their flock and not let them know where they stand politically.

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And I think that is sin that needs to be repented of by these great pastors. Yeah. And some of them have gone beyond like the

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David French and Curtis Chang and Russell Moore. They've gone beyond the just be silent and neutral position to saying, well, you should talk about it.

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So an example of that would be Bill Rydell down in Washington, D .C., an evangelical free church.

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He has a talk called Politics and Our Christian Witness. And he actually says the same thing that we do about pietism.

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He says, you know, you can't just not talk about politics. The trouble is when he weighs in, he falls on the left side of the aisle.

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So he pushes people to minimize abortion and to see other things as pro -life issues.

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And he gives credence to that argument. So he just really believes in communism.

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Why doesn't he come out and say, I love communism. I think communism fulfills scripture.

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Why does he say that? But the same reason Kamala Harris doesn't come out and say it. I mean, it's not a

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Christian though. I'm talking about these pastors. If you come out and say it, you know,

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I mean, a lot of these guys are wolves. If you come out and say it, you're not going to deceive anybody because you have to consider this.

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Why is it that this political party, the

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Democratic Party, which is further from biblical Christianity than any other political movement, any other political party in the history of our country.

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Why is it that there's an increasing number of evangelicals going in this direction? And the answer is social justice.

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This is how Satan gets people. He preys on people's emotions. Seth, what

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I hear you saying is because they don't have the truth, they know better than to come out into the light and try and defend it.

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Is that what you're saying? Yeah, they're deceivers. What they're doing is they know the truth and they've been deceived themselves into thinking somehow government handouts and social justice and showing compassion in these areas.

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This is how Satan works. He goes after emotions. Like, oh, nobody wants to be called a racist.

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Nobody wants to be called a bigot. Nobody wants to be called a homophobe or transphobic or xenophobic.

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Nobody wants to be called any of these things. So it's like, oh, these are political issues.

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And somehow they find a verse to try to make it fit. But Satan is a master deceiver. That's how he gets into churches.

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And we're calling it out. Yeah, go ahead, Jeff. Yeah, I wanted to share. I don't think it's so simple as to say

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Bill Rydell is a communist. Right? That's the issue. It's that they're so devoted to this idea of social justice that they're willing to tolerate differences over moral questions.

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So I sat down with another pastor in the EFCA whose name is Joe Hensler. And we had a long talk, and it seemed to be a very agreeable conversation until afterwards he cast it as being a horrible thing.

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Because we spoke for like three hours. He thanked me for it. It was all great until it wasn't. But the point is he described himself as a libertarian.

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And he really got his hackles up when I said that a Christian cannot vote for a

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Democrat because what he understood that that would mean is that he would have to call it sin to vote for a

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Democrat. And this would be so divisive in his church, and it would be especially divisive along the racial ethnic identity lines.

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So you just can't ignore the fact that in the

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African American churches, the turnout for the vote when you do the polling is something like 90 % voting for Democrats.

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Well, to call that sin, they identify that as racism.

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This race issue is at the center of it. But it's really because many people have been led to believe that it's okay to vote for Democrats.

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And they're upholding that in the name of social justice. So for these guys, a libertarian like this

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Joe Hensler, he doesn't like government involved in anything. He's not wanting government to take over and give handouts.

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But this commitment to racial diversity in his church precludes him from telling the truth about how serious it is to vote for an abortionist.

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And that's really the dividing line, I think. It's the issue of social justice and their commitment to diversity and looking at people by the color of their skin rather than speaking about these moral issues.

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Have you shared with that Pastor Jeff about how abortion is part of the destruction of the family and the destruction of – which is coming in from communism?

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I mean, does that – do you go down that path with them? Yeah. And this particular pastor, his name is

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Joe Hensler, big church up in Allentown, he would surely agree that abortion is wrong.

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And he personally hates it. It's more of a matter of how outspoken he would be against it and whether he would make the connections to – whether it's a communist agenda behind it.

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What do you mean by that, Joe? Oh, so, I mean, you know, the late 1800s, communism was alive and kicking over there in Europe.

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And, you know, they sent people over here. And it was – that's when we started getting feminism and homosexuality and all these wicked things hitting our – and it was all designed.

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It was all part of the Enlightenment philosophies that came from – that hit us up with Hegel and Kant and, you know, anything you want coming out of your mind.

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And it was – you know, it's part of making the government God, right?

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In order to make government God, you have to destroy the things he set in the foundation. I think of a sermon you did two weeks ago when you established the four governing bodies created by God, one of them being the family and one of them being government, the other being church and the self.

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And great sermon, by the way. The self is the one I always forget about too. Yeah. It's so true.

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We should be putting most of our effort on self -government. We sure should. That's not the topic today.

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But you're 100%. But yeah, I mean in order to get people to love the government, they have to hate

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God. That's what communism is. You know, in order to absorb all that power, you've got to take what's keeping people, you know, being self -responsible and being self -governed.

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It's only their trusting God that gives them the ability to trust or love their neighbor enough to give them self -governance.

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Otherwise, you want to control them, put a mask on them, shut them down, lock them in their house. And what people don't understand is that in America, Christianity used to be the most powerful force in America.

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And then over the last 30, 40, 50 years, there's kind of been this transition. It's kind of a neutrality that we've lived in.

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And I think a lot of pastors who grew up in that environment think that it's just going to stay that way.

33:59

You know, that's just the way things are. But eventually what happens is that when you move away from Christianity, some other ethic is going to replace that, right?

34:08

And so that's what we're seeing. We've seen this flood of, and they're not tolerant of Christianity. They see

34:14

Christianity as the enemy. So we're moving, and some people, others have talked about this.

34:20

We once lived in positive world where society was positive toward Christianity. Then it's neutral world where it's like, okay, well, we're not going to persecute them.

34:29

But there's some pagan ethics in there. And then now we're moving towards negative where Christianity is going to be persecuted.

34:36

They're all a bunch of lying worldview squatters. Yeah. Stealing our blessings.

34:44

You guys ever heard of J. Warner Wallace? He's an apologist. He has this book where he looks at all the evidences for the blessings of Christ outside of the

34:56

Bible. If you want to talk to an atheist, that's where they want to go, right? So let's appease them. Let's split that.

35:02

Let's take a look at history. And he looks at 0 AD, what happened there?

35:08

Oh, we had to rename everything, the whole clock and time because of one guy.

35:14

And then he's got this thing where he goes to this timeline. And then all of a sudden, all these inventions that cause blessing and culture and society just go straight up.

35:24

But we can't look at that and say, thank you, Jesus. All we've got to do is go, wow, I want more.

35:33

And there's another book by Wayne Grudem called The Poverty of Nations, where he traces the degree to which the

35:39

Reformation took root and where those innovations come from. Notice the Industrial Revolution comes from England and from the

35:47

British Empire largely, and then to a slightly lesser degree, France and the Scandinavian countries.

35:53

And then ultimately, the United States of America, where the Protestant Reformation took root, that the blessing and the powerful economic engine of capitalism really came from.

36:04

And communism doesn't build anything. They steal what's already been built.

36:10

So Christianity made this country great. And now they're trying to hijack this great country of ours.

36:18

And how about we, if you guys are OK with this, let's look ahead. Let's say Kamala Harris wins this election.

36:26

And let's say that she wins the House and she wins the Senate. And then the

36:31

Supreme Court, they get the Supreme Court down the road. Because they pack it. They would pack it if they had the ability to do that.

36:39

So let's imagine together, what will America look like if this happens?

36:46

And you guys can jump into it. Maybe I'll start off. You mentioned the Equality Act, Joe. Joe, explain the

36:54

Equality Act. You seem to know it pretty well. 2021, the

37:00

Democrat -led House of Representatives passed a resolution that would have gone to the

37:07

Senate and then it would have been signed by a president had not the Republican -led Senate blocked it just barely because they don't have unity when it comes to these kind of packages either.

37:20

We've got a lot of Republicans that vote along the line of Democrats on these issues because they are globalists.

37:30

And globalism requires one world religion.

37:37

And that is what they want. They want a unified religion across the planet.

37:42

Which means if you translate that into Newspeak, it's the end of the freedom of thought.

37:53

I mean, atheism has benefited greatly from Christian rule. Christians being in charge meant that we valued freedom of thought, freedom of belief.

38:05

Because why? Because God gives us freedom of thought and freedom of belief. So we value that enough to put it into our government.

38:12

They want that gone. And they want their own thought process.

38:18

They want their own blasphemy laws. They want their own ways of controlling everything.

38:24

And the Equality Act is, dare I say, the cornerstone to that desire to build on that.

38:35

So it's basically an anti -discrimination. You can't discriminate against gays and transgenders.

38:45

Also hiring practices, you would have to hire. The specific undercover thing that it does that tears down Christianity, Orthodox Christianity anyway, is the elimination of pastors to be able to counsel people who struggle with homosexual thoughts

39:04

They've already done this with professional psychologists because of course they would volunteer for that anyway.

39:10

But when a young Christian person comes into one of your offices, you're no longer going to be able to open the book, the

39:22

Bible, and say, God's word says this, and help them with their sinful struggles.

39:29

Because one, you're not going to be allowed to call it sin, right? And then if you preach from those same verses, what they call the clobber verses, there's plenty of them, right, as we all know.

39:40

If you preach from that, you could be shut down. Find her jailed for speaking out against these things.

39:48

I got to say jailed. I don't think they put penalties into it specifically.

39:54

So think about that. The Democratic leadership, they want this.

40:00

And not only that, in 2023, in January of 2023, the

40:07

House Democrats, the same House Democrats, voted almost unanimously to, in the case of a botched abortion, just like we talked about Tim Walz in Minnesota, that the baby would be left to die.

40:21

Almost unanimously they voted for that. So this is the same group voting for these same things.

40:27

Well, you asked a great question about the exact penalties, which we don't know because those are all run by bureaucratic processes that happen after our so -called representatives represent us and vote in these things or vote them out.

40:40

And those bureaucracies can do whatever they want, right? So that's why there's a bill in front of the

40:46

Supreme Court, and they potentially could change that, which would be wonderful. But right now, you know, and that's something that the

40:54

Republicans all love the bureaucracy too. You know, they just want to love it a little bit less so they can get elected.

41:01

But, you know, this whole bureaucratic system where we don't really have representation, we saw that in Mount Laurel recently with the library, nobody wanted to represent us.

41:10

They just said, oh, we don't really have power. We can get bonded off on somebody else. But think about a guy like Ray Orland.

41:18

Okay, so he just says, oh, yeah, I'm voting for Harris this time.

41:23

And maybe he's, again, some of these guys are wolves, and maybe Ray Orland is just a really woefully deceived shepherd who's just completely been confused by Big Eva.

41:34

You are voting for your persecutors. Think about that.

41:40

You are voting for your persecutors unless he's going to be casting the first stone, showing himself to be a wolf.

41:49

Does a guy like Ray Orland even read the whole Bible or does he skip a whole bunch of parts he doesn't like?

41:56

And I say that very seriously. I mean, I'm not trying to be funny. I mean, I think. That's what's so deceiving about it,

42:02

Joe, is that he's been considered one of the more reliable, you know, preach the whole counsel of God kind of guys.

42:09

I mean, he's. Is he? Yeah, I remember growing up. I mean, I didn't. I'm not super familiar with Ray Orland, but he's in that club.

42:18

He's kind of in the, you know, the maybe the neo -reformed club. You know,

42:24

Jeff, maybe you can explain a little bit about him, too. Well, yeah, I mean, it's basically that whole.

42:30

But I mean, if you look at the staff at his church in Tennessee, it's the laundry list of the movers and shakers that are pulling evangelicalism to the left.

42:41

Russell Moore and not just Ray Orland, but a whole bunch of others are on staff there.

42:46

So, yeah, they come together and they're trying hard to pull it. Can you tell us some average

42:52

Joe's about pietism and why it's so bad? What's wrong with pietism?

42:59

Sounds good to me. Is that like piety is something to be upheld, right? What's pietism? What's the ism?

43:07

Well, the pietism of the German pietistic movement was calling people to devotion to Christ.

43:15

And it was so internal and so much about individual progressive sanctification that it basically said, let the world and the politics sort themselves out.

43:27

And you're too high and mighty, too heavenly minded to really get your hands dirty in any of the earthly kind of things.

43:34

So that's where the danger comes in. But I kind of feel like the big Eva movement has left pietism to some degree and is actually now getting their hands dirty in the wrong way.

43:46

They're actually speaking out now, saying like Ray Ortlund did. His quote was something like,

43:54

Kamala this time, never Trump, and then whatever next time. Always Jesus.

44:00

Always Jesus. Yeah, there's the pietistic part of it. It sounds so spiritual, but it's completely against the principles of the word of God.

44:09

And this is the thing though, Joe. Biblical ethics, when you read the law of God and you understand how

44:16

God values life and the distinctions between gender and economics,

44:24

Jesus gives parables about those who work in the field and the freedom of those who are employing someone who works in the field to pay an agreed upon price.

44:34

That's capitalism. It's just capitalism. That's all it is. Economically and with regard especially to sexuality, all of these things, the

44:45

Bible could not be any more clear. And there's one side that is at least holding on to that biblical ethic.

44:53

The other side is not only jettisoning it, they are completely opposing it and pushing an entirely different worldview.

45:03

So it's a clash of worldviews. So a pietist that puts the name of Jesus on evil has just become a complete workman of the devil, trying to institute unbiblical, ungodly things into the culture.

45:17

It's as simple as that. It's not like a hard question. I guess it's just confusing because you see these people that label themselves that way and they don't look pietistic at all.

45:29

They don't look pietistic. So pietism is not very pietistic, I guess. Well, that's the point.

45:35

Anybody can say, always Jesus. But if you love Jesus, keep his commandments. Amen. Don't throw a baby under the bus.

45:45

Don't kill a child. Jesus said that if someone harms a child, it's better for them to have a millstone tied around their neck and to be thrown into the sea.

45:54

That's how Jesus regards these children. Yeah, and Joe, may I jump in real quick here?

46:00

The great example of the failure of pietism was, Jeff mentioned Germany in the 1930s.

46:07

This is when Hitler rose to power. And Erich Metaxas in the book, Letter to the American Church, he is laying out a small percentage was for Hitler rising to power.

46:19

A small percentage was against Hitler rising to power. And then you have this mass of churches who were silent, who were sitting on the sidelines.

46:29

And the boxcars carrying Jews would be on the way to the concentration camp. And these churches would be singing songs, doing absolutely nothing, stopping

46:42

Hitler's tyranny in Germany. So obviously, the

46:47

Lord wanted them to rise up and do something. I mean, that's common sense. I mean, that's what the Bible teaches. But they rationalized their inactivity.

46:58

And I think we see that in America right now. Like Jeff said, we have some people who are actually voting the wrong way, which is just egregious.

47:06

But then you have people who are just like, nope, that's not even our issues. Somehow America is going to stay neutral.

47:12

And the Equality Act isn't really there. And I mean, it's all there. I know. Are you going to do something about it?

47:19

But I want to know how these great pastors get there. I mean, so I think, you know, I'm looking again.

47:26

I'm asking you guys about the forest because I'm just looking at some trees, right? So how do they read through the five books of Moses, look at all the laws, and how do they view the law today?

47:42

In other words, is there any commonality between great pastors and how they look at God's law and how

47:50

Christians are to operate under the law versus how they should be looking at the law?

47:58

You put your finger on a crucial spot because it's this whole idea of the gospel, the gospel, the gospel.

48:04

And we're all about the gospel. But they've divested the gospel from the law. So you know how

48:10

Ray Comfort uses the law to bring people, to get them lost before they can get saved? This has always been the orthodox way of approaching the law and the gospel.

48:19

It's how Paul frames the book of Romans. He begins the first three chapters with law to prepare people to understand justification by faith in chapters 3 to 5.

48:29

What this group has done is they're Marcionite. They've neglected the

48:35

Old Testament to such an extent that it's all about gospel, New Testament gospel. We want to make sure we get as many people saved as possible.

48:42

And the way they think they do that is by accommodating in this kind of seeker -sensitive way,

48:49

Democrats and Republicans and everybody come as you are. We're not going to touch those political issues. We're just going to preach the gospel, just preach the gospel.

48:57

But what they've done is they've left out the law. And so there's no repenting of works that lead to death in order to come to saving faith.

49:04

So that's how they get there. Most of them aren't nefarious. It's just that they read the gospel coalition. That's all about the gospel, the gospel, the gospel.

49:11

But they don't even read the law or consider it much. Part of it too is an overemphasis on the dispensational discontinuity between old and new.

49:24

A lot of these churches have made the Andy Stanley error of thinking that the old is really almost like the written code is no good.

49:33

And all we need is the message of Jesus and Him crucified. Just leave the law off altogether almost as something that's bad.

49:42

You know how Andy Stanley said, unhitch from the Old Testament. So, yeah, I think the way you framed your question there really answered it.

49:49

They don't regard the law of God. They have left it behind. Now, most of my questions,

49:55

I think I know the answer when I say, when I ask you. Yes.

50:01

This one I don't. Since you mentioned dispensational, how does dispensationalism and covenant theology play into it, if at all?

50:12

Yeah, let me just clarify what I was saying there. I'll jump in, and then Tim, you're up next because I haven't given you a chance to speak here. That's okay.

50:20

Honestly, I enjoy listening to you guys, so I'm happy. If you guys want to argue about who should speak next, by the way,

50:26

I can always cut that part out. Tim's got the floor. I'll cut this part out. Yeah. I'm a dispensationalist.

50:35

But what we're saying in that is that there are significant discontinuities between the

50:41

Old Covenant and the New Covenant. In the New Covenant, there's a deeper work of the Spirit by a matter of degree.

50:48

He was with us. Now he's in us. And the church is fundamentally different from Israel. Strong distinction.

50:55

So many things about the law had a purpose that came to a conclusion and fulfillment in Christ.

51:01

And Israel remains part of God's program and plan, dispensational. So what we're doing there is we're emphasizing differences, discontinuities between Old Covenant and New.

51:13

Covenant theology emphasizes what's the same, what continues. And so you'll often have in covenant theology baptizing babies because there's a continuity there between the circumcision of the 8 -day -old boy and a

51:30

New Covenant child in the faith. So you have a greater emphasis on continuity, and therefore the law then tends to have more of an emphasis in classically

51:42

Reformed churches. If you read Calvin's Institute, Book 4 has a lot about political theology and so much about the law influences what he says about ethics.

51:54

That's true of the Reformers. So covenant theology would lend more towards that. The error amongst some dispensationalists is to so emphasize the discontinuities that you just leave the law behind altogether.

52:08

And that's what I think the danger is. So, yeah. Wow. So you're saying shotgun, it's all across the board.

52:16

Those two things aren't really going to play into. Right. It doesn't matter whether you're a covenant theologian or a dispensational theologian.

52:27

The law of God is always the law of God. And it always must be applied to the public square.

52:34

So anyway, yeah. So when is it? So I get the feeling, man, there's that word again.

52:40

I said it. I believe that what I've heard people say is that they are not continuing with certain parts of the law unless Jesus repeated it.

52:57

Other people are saying we're going to continue with all parts of the law unless Jesus or one of the apostles negated it or it was completed, never deleted but completed.

53:11

But I don't think that's true. I think a lot of them that are saying that aren't considering the entire law.

53:21

Let's say you. There's different ways to look at it. Like some people look at it that way.

53:27

But I think one thing to be mindful of before Jeff gives you a big theological answer is that the law is still written on believers' hearts.

53:35

So I think with these pastors, I think that I worry about their conscience because I know

53:43

Seth and I know Jeff. Their conscience would be telling them to lead their flock the right way and to do the right thing.

53:52

And sometimes, sure, we love the law. But sometimes we know internally what the right thing to do is.

53:59

And for Christians, it's a sin to know the right thing to do and then not to do it.

54:05

So they will have to answer for things like that that we might not even know of, but God knows, and they might have to answer for that one day.

54:13

I could say something really stupid right now. In fact, I think I will. But since I'm prefacing it, you'll give me some patience.

54:21

So I think sometimes some of these guys, and this is how I think of pietism, they're so busy praying so much that they forget to get in God's word enough so that their prayers are full of truth and God's word, and they talk themselves into stuff.

54:39

So I was listening to James White debate a guy who thinks he can be labeled gay, but he's completely orthodox in everything else as a

54:54

Christian and agrees with almost everything except that you can have this little label that kind of talks about your identity, but identity not in the same way as other people's identity.

55:06

Like, my gosh, the exercise, the gymnastics that have to go on in your head to squeeze your desire for this label into your theology, it just, am

55:19

I on the right track? Jeff, help me out here. I mean, am I on the right track? Is that what they're doing?

55:26

Well, yeah, basically in the book of Judges, everybody did what was right in their own eyes because there was no king.

55:33

They hadn't knelt to the lordship of God. And in the New Testament, we understand the lordship of Jesus Christ.

55:41

So yeah, there's an issue there of submitting to the revealed will of God and just doing what they feel.

55:48

As you've mentioned a few times, your feelings. This guy feels like he's gay, and he wants to hold that label as part of his identity, and he does whatever he can to make that right, but it's not in submission to the

56:01

Lord Jesus Christ. Yeah, and I guess when we ask the question, why are so many evangelical leaders saying it's okay to vote

56:09

Democrat and even pushing to vote Democrat? The answer is that they're worldly.

56:15

I mean, they've been so influenced by the world, worldly thinking, and this is just a symptom of that, right?

56:23

And of course, the side B theology is what you guys are talking about, the same -sex attraction.

56:29

How does a person, how does a church, how does a pastor get to the point where he says that's okay?

56:35

It's that he's been influenced by the world's thinking. I mean, look at John Piper, for example. John Piper believes in side

56:41

B theology, same -sex attraction, and John Piper has written articles against voting

56:46

Donald Trump. John Piper does? John Piper's a side beer? Yeah, yes, he is.

56:53

Didn't know that. Yeah, and Sam Alberry is kind of the big one who's pushed that.

56:58

Know that guy. Preston Sprinkle is another, Rebecca McLaughlin.

57:04

Yeah, so there is a connection between they're okay voting for a

57:11

Democrat, or people, if they don't vote for a Democrat, they're okay with others voting for a Democrat, and then they also have the same -sex attraction thing here.

57:18

You realize, and they believe in the earth is old. It's like, whoa, you guys have been really influenced by worldly thinking, and we have to come to that conclusion based off of all the evidence that we see.

57:31

I was an old earther until a few years ago. I think it really does make such a difference.

57:37

I really, I think, yeah, I mean, just changing your whole, you got to start with God's word, not start with what

57:47

I learned in public school. Do worldly Christians think that they're worldly? Tim, answer that, and then ask

57:54

Joe the question. What's that? Do worldly Christians realize that they're worldly? Do worldly Christians realize they're worldly?

58:04

You know, I think they might not, because I think that someone with discernment can identify worldly and godly, and I think someone holding that view and worldly views, they must not understand that Christians are not supposed to be of the world.

58:27

So I would say, I don't think they really get it, and the

58:33

Bible says how these kind of people are deceived themselves, and then they deceive others.

58:41

So I would have to believe just based on the Bible, and being a Christian myself, I can't see myself wanting to believe the worldly.

58:51

I would really, everything in me wants to believe an old earth, because that's what

58:57

I see in the Bible. So it really would have to be like something crazy convincing for me to even want to believe the old earth.

59:05

And my question for Joe is, did your schooling, and was that in you so much before you understood the old earth that it was hard for you to jump onto the old earth?

59:22

Because for me, I don't know, I think God just protected me from that thinking of evolution and things like that.

59:29

I thought it was just really dumb. I think I spent 20 years in a seeker -sensitive church that even told me that seeker -sensitive teaching was bad, but they're seeker -sensitive themselves.

59:41

And I think they told me that that was not something that Christians should argue about, that old earth

59:46

Christians and new earth Christians, I mean, they brought it up in the same light as Calvinism and Arminianism, right?

59:54

So, you know, these are things we don't know. How about how you vote? Same thing?

01:00:00

Yeah, totally great church that I left. And, you know, and it's interesting too, as I've seen some of my friends, you know, since I've left there, double down on some, you know, repenting of their conservatism almost.

01:00:16

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So what happens is, you know, that question, do they realize they're worldly?

01:00:23

Well, they're justifying... No, they think they're radicals, like David Platt. Yeah, they're justifying in their mind that they are biblical.

01:00:32

They are the biblical ones. I thought I was radical. And I wasn't. I was being worldly.

01:00:38

Where does that leave us? It leaves us as these Pharisees on the right.

01:00:43

I mean, that's kind of, we are these radical right wing people when really it's like, no, this is like...

01:00:51

The Pharisees didn't get everything wrong. I mean, Jesus said you have to be as good as the

01:00:57

Pharisees. I mean, they weren't getting everything wrong. This is their heart issues, right? But we're not the Pharisees.

01:01:03

I mean, we were standing on the word of God, you know. And the interesting thing is that if anybody is more like the

01:01:09

Pharisees, it's this big Eva leadership because they are the ones who are making their own rules.

01:01:16

We're not making our own rules. We're standing on the word of God. They are saying things like, oh, no, you can't say don't vote

01:01:23

Democrat. Well, the Bible says you can't vote for these pagan ethics. I mean, you made your own rules.

01:01:31

We're following the Bible. That's such a good point, Seth. And they are so schismatic about it too.

01:01:41

Remember how we talk about that sanctification is having thick skin and a soft heart?

01:01:48

These guys are so thin -skinned. If you name names or interact with something that they say, they'll just flop around on the floor like a fish and just act like you've just harmed them so egregiously.

01:02:01

Then behind the scenes, they censure you. They then take your ordination. It's just outrageous how schismatic they are.

01:02:11

But they do it behind the scenes and under the cloak of darkness. And you mentioned the Free Church, Jeff.

01:02:17

They used Democratic tactics against you, against David Whitney, and others.

01:02:28

There's a playbook. They silence you. They censure you. They cancel you, however you want to say it.

01:02:35

They don't let you present your position. They don't use evidence to actually condemn you.

01:02:44

That's because of what you said, Seth. That's what you said about these guys. You said they don't want to talk about sin.

01:02:52

Or no, Jeff said it about his friend down in D .C., that he knows better, but he's struggling with having to label something sin.

01:03:01

We're labeling everything except sin. Everybody wants a label. Let's label this.

01:03:06

Let's label that. You're a Christian nationalist. Oh, yeah. There's another label, man.

01:03:12

Come on. How come these people can't remain calm, though? Why is that their thing?

01:03:18

They realize they're wrong. They get upset. And they flop like a fish, like Jeff is saying.

01:03:24

For me, I think we need to train people to be able to recognize that. When two people are arguing, and the calm one is making good points and just trying to have an adult conversation, and then there's the other side that is getting emotional,

01:03:40

I think we need to train people to be able to say, if you're not sure, most of the time, the calm person who doesn't mind being questioned is probably telling the truth.

01:03:53

I don't know about that. You don't think so? No. No, no. So it's one of the things that they talk about, and I don't want to change the topic too much, but in certain court circumstances that I've discussed before, the calm person is the one that doesn't mind that the baby gets ripped in half.

01:04:16

Oh, true. Man. Yeah. Coming in with some wisdom.

01:04:22

Yeah. All right. Yeah, we need wisdom to know. Yeah, because sometimes you're right. Sometimes the calm person is the one who's right.

01:04:30

Yeah, yeah. We can't try. We just can't. It's just not a blanket statement, but it's definitely sometimes it's true though.

01:04:38

Yeah. You just can't say all the time. To split those two hairs, on the one hand, to be overrun by emotion is a bad sign.

01:04:47

Absolutely. But on the other hand, there's a kind of callousness and hardness of heart that might be completely composed and dry and rational, but it's just evincing that the person is just evil to the core.

01:05:03

Yeah. Do you think that Tim Walz has shed one tear that eight babies have been left to die on the operating table?

01:05:12

Nope. He just threw some truth out there when I explained it, Seth. Seth, what happened? Tell us in the background.

01:05:18

I don't think people know about that. Yeah. I think I mentioned earlier, but yeah, that's the

01:05:24

Democratic, that's the bill that was passed in Minnesota. The very thing that they want to pass nationally, where during a botched abortion, the baby will be left to die.

01:05:34

So think about that. If you're talking to any Christian who's thinking about voting for Harris, you cannot do that.

01:05:41

I mean, I know it's politically incorrect to say that, but we have to say it loudly and clearly, you cannot vote for her.

01:05:48

To vote for her is to vote for a satanic agenda that is for murder, that is for lying.

01:05:54

I mean, look at John 8. The character of Satan, he's a liar and he's a murderer. That is the

01:06:00

Democratic platform. Yeah. Very much so. And you might say, well, Trump, he's got equally bad issues.

01:06:06

And that's the argument that John Piper has made. You know, there's a moral equivalence. It's like, no, Trump actually has some positive attributes.

01:06:13

Yes, he has flaws. We look at his character when he almost got killed in that assassination attempt.

01:06:19

He stands up courageously, yells, fight, fight, fight. And, you know, and he's, he's, he's literally risking his life because he loves his country.

01:06:31

We as Christians should notice that and say, that is a biblical virtue right there that we can get behind. But yeah, so there's,

01:06:40

I mean, we could, I mean, and then during his first term as president, all the biblical things he did that got the economy rolling, they got, got

01:06:50

Roe v. Wade overturned, that, that made the world a safer place, that made

01:06:56

Israel, that Jerusalem, the capital of Israel and moving the embassy there. I mean, you look at all these issues.

01:07:02

It's like, well, he actually did a lot of good. And this is the point I want to make guys is that God has used flawed men in the past for his good purposes.

01:07:11

I mean, Cyrus and Artaxerxes and Samson, for example, in the old Testament, it's, he, he does work this way.

01:07:20

Yeah. Why did that bullet miss Donald Trump? I think it's because it very well may be that the Lord is not done with him.

01:07:26

Right. All right, guys. Well, listen, our clock watchers just been, we're going to fire them because we're an hour and six, but it was really great.

01:07:37

It was really interesting. There's so much to say. I think we really got the ball rolling and started like a steamroll thing.

01:07:44

So I think we need to start trimming it back. What do we got in the last, last comments?

01:07:49

Anybody? Well, when you see a brother down, I'm just kidding. Well, I, I do have one last comments.

01:07:59

No one else does. There was a, there's a regarding the bill that Seth is talking about that they passed in Minnesota.

01:08:06

There was an episode on the Tucker Carlson show last week. Medical ethicist,

01:08:12

Charles Camosi debunks media lies about abortion and Kamala's love for infanticide.

01:08:18

So kind of interesting. It was really about the where, where, where our love of death comes from in this country.

01:08:26

And in a lot of ways, the guy's a Christian. And he actually claims that, you know, leaving infants to die in certain situations was much more common than we've heard about.

01:08:40

Now, that doesn't make it right at all by any stretch of the imagination. But he gets into a lot of things about death, including something

01:08:47

I've been very interested in studying. And I'm don't know enough about his brain death and how that originated in 1968.

01:08:54

It was never a thing before that. So I might be a good thing to tear down at some point in the future.

01:09:00

Yeah. And maybe I could, I could say this, that it, a lot of pastors think that they can't talk about politics because of a 1954 bill passed by then

01:09:10

Senator Lyndon Johnson. Of course, Lyndon Johnson became president. But, you know, this, this law was pushed forth to pretty much silence churches because he knew that they weren't going to vote for Democrats back then.

01:09:24

They were largely voting for Republicans back then, even. So we do have, we are protected by the constitution, right?

01:09:33

Which is the highest law of the land to speak on these things. They will threaten to go after your 501c3.

01:09:40

And that's what the 1954 bill does. So what? Don't need it. But we are protected by the constitution.

01:09:47

And even if we weren't protected by the constitution, we have a moral duty. As the word of God teaches us to stand on the word of God in every area, including the public square.

01:09:58

Yeah. So, so my encouragement to pastors is talk to your congregations, tell them what's at stake, encourage them to go out and vote.

01:10:08

We should have 100 % of Christians voting in this election. Yeah. And pastors need to get out there and tell their congregations.

01:10:16

This is my plea as a pastor to pastors. Please get your congregations out to vote.

01:10:22

Otherwise America is going to be a very, very, very dark place. Not too far down the road. Yeah.

01:10:28

And I'll be the bad cop to Seth's good cop. Seth was just encouraging pastors, but I'll say it in the negative that if a pastor is unwilling to speak against this level of evil right now, he's not a shepherd and it's not too late for you, pastor.

01:10:44

If you haven't spoken out against abortion and all this trans agenda and the communist communism that Kamala is pushing, you're not a shepherd unless you do it.

01:10:56

You still have time to do it, but your identity as a pastor is on the line at this point.

01:11:02

Amen. I feel like the best way to shut down today would be to pray for those pastors to repent of the sin of neglecting their, their sheep.

01:11:15

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, we can do that. So Jeff, Jeff, you want to lead us in prayer?

01:11:21

Yeah. Gracious heavenly father. We do come to you now in the name of Jesus Christ. And we pray that every true pastor, every genuine shepherd would see the wolf coming and cry out and would help the sheep and protect the sheep.

01:11:36

The watchman on the wall of Ezekiel 34, Lord God make these men speak. Lord, give them the courage that they need.

01:11:43

Even knowing that there are people in their congregation who will likely leave and be angry and it might cause problems for them.

01:11:52

Lord, we pray that they would not be a hireling as Jesus described in John chapter 10, that these pastors would be genuine shepherds willing even to die for the sake of the sheep.

01:12:03

And we pray for that kind of heart and spirit and courage in the pastors across this country. In Jesus name.