Chosen: Understanding Election

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Welcome to No Compromise Radio Ministry. My name is Mike Abendroth. And finally, ultimately, penultimately?

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Tuesday guy's back. Steve Pooley, welcome. I think it's ultimately. Thank you. Thank you very much. Are there any other words?

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Ultimate, penultimate, uber -ultimate? Finalmente. I don't know.

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Finalmente. You can always write us, mike at nocompromiseradio .com or info at nocompromiseradio .com.

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We've got a new YouTube channel. Our superstar Mario is running that. So Mario's behind the scenes right now.

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Looking at Mario's face. Way to go, Mario. We appreciate you, Spencer and all the other guys behind the scenes.

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Steve, today I thought we'd talk a little bit about the election. The election. Okay. Which one?

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I presume 1928. That's one of my favorites. I'm not talking about politics.

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Although you could probably discuss the election, right? I usually can. Was this rigged?

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Define rigged. So today - Was the outcome known beforehand? Well, I guess now that gets us into theology and divine stuff.

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Which is where we're supposed to be. Today we're going to talk about election, unconditional election,

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God choosing. Now to start the show, Steve, I thought maybe I'd ask you, why do you think people have such a hard time with election?

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What's kind of stuck in their craw? I think that's, it's a common question.

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And I think it's one that people think about, but I think generally speaking, they think about it wrongly. And here's what

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I mean. I mean, people think about it and go, well, if God chooses, then somehow everybody doesn't get the same chance.

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And so therefore, that's not fair. And that doesn't sound like God. God is fair.

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Above all else, God is fair. Steve, my God would be fair. Well, your

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God is probably a pagan idol. So. Of my own imagination. I was doing a little study on this and supposedly

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Herman Melville's Moby Dick was a book that he wrote with the undercurrent of I don't like Calvinism and determinism and predestination.

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Have you heard that before? Probably from you. I think I heard it from R .C.

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maybe. Did you? Well, yeah, you probably channeled that to me at some point. Somebody also said that Edgar Allen Poe's book,

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The Fall of the House of Usher was actually a metaphor for Calvinism's decline. I thought it was about hip hop.

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Yeah. Edgar Allen Poe. Hey, on the positive side,

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Robinson Crusoe with Daniel Defoe. Yes. That was very Calvinistic, very predestinarian, very penultimate.

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Thank you for watching NoCo Literature today. Call me Ishmael. What was the line for 1984?

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Something about it was quiet and everything and then the clock struck 13. So today on the show, we're going to talk about some ways to help you understand and grasp the doctrine of election, unconditional election.

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And for many of you, you probably already know it, like it, but maybe today's like an intro, right?

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101. Election 101. Kindergarten. Okay. Where'd you go to kindergarten?

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Where'd you go to kindergarten? Vincent Elementary. Vincent, okay. I went to Laura Dodge. Who knows what she was?

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Probably a liberal lunatic educator. Vincent Elementary, which by the way now is

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Condos. Oh, I don't even know what Laura Dodge is in Omaha, Nebraska. It's interesting,

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Steve, when Moses asked, this is kind of an intro, Moses asked the

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Lord, could I see you? And of course, no one can see God and live. And God graciously tucked

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Moses behind the cleft of the rock and passed before him. What passed before him?

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Who passed before him? This is interesting. Exodus 33 and 34.

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I myself will make all my goodness pass before you and will proclaim the name of the Lord before you.

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Drum roll. And I will be gracious to whom I will be gracious and show compassion on whom

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I will show compassion. Isn't that interesting? It's like almost the essence of God.

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If you want to see who God really is, included in that is I choose. I'm in charge.

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Isn't he quoting Paul there? Well, Paul does go on to quote him in a very famous chapter,

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Romans chapter nine. By the way, I've heard of pastors that won't preach Romans chapter nine. What's up with that?

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I can believe it because it's really, it goes against the grain because basically

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Paul raises this whole issue that we're talking about, fairness. And his ultimate answer is in Steve Parlance, shut up.

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In other words, to be nicer about it, he's saying that's the wrong question. The question isn't why does

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God choose some? The question is ultimately, why does God choose any? Good point.

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So today, before we get into the passage, I just wanted you to know, Steve, because I don't think

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I told you this. The book that I wrote about God as King back in 2007 or something like that,

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I have the rights for that now. And so I was just trying to put together some little tweaks to it and maybe like a little tiny little chapter booklets and stuff like that.

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And so I pulled this up and was just looking at it. And the idea is if you understand God as a King, as a monarch, it should be easier to swallow hard doctrines.

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In other words, don't Kings choose their own, right? Didn't, who chose

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Vashti and Esther? What's his name? Ahasuerus. I'm like,

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I can barely say it when I'm reading it, let alone off the cuff. Let me think.

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So today, six, seven, several election truths. If you understand

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Ephesians chapter one better, you'll just grasp sovereign election. How's that?

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Excellent. Okay, number one, election is for all Christians, not just for the super mature.

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And what I mean by that is in Ephesians chapter one, Paul doesn't say, you know what?

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Let's talk about this on Wednesday night church. Let's talk about this at the Bible Institute, at the men's super duper group, at the ladies elevated group.

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He starts off just as he chose us in him, praising God for that in Ephesians chapter one.

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Not like the men's intensive seminar, elder training, you know, whatever.

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And I've heard of churches that we don't talk about doctrines like election or hell or other things because they're too difficult on Sunday morning and they're reserved for the super duper group.

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Yeah, I mean, and there's a reason why it's for everyone. I, you know, just a little story. I remember years ago seeing a woman, this was back in the jail.

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She was carrying around a, I think it was a women's study Bible. Like in the NIV or something like that.

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So I said, you know, oh, are you reading that kind of thing? You know, just innocuous enough because we're not supposed to talk about religion at work.

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And she goes, yeah. And I said, somehow I got to the topic of election and she goes, yeah,

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I don't like that. And wasn't it Spurgeon who said, I never thought you would.

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Right. Who likes that? James Dane, a professor said this, sermons on election are so rare that even a regular church goer may never hear one.

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No other doctrine has been so central in theology and so ignored in the pulpit. Was he a

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United Methodist or something? I think, I mean,

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I've heard a number of sermons. I might've preached one or two on election. And the reason

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I might've preached one or two or three or four or five is because it comes up so frequently in scripture.

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Jesus talks about it. Paul talks about it. I mean, you really have to hop, skip and jump to avoid preaching about election.

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You can do it, but it takes some theological gymnastics to do it.

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Did you play hopscotch when you were a kid? Rarely, because I was not all that coordinated.

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So it didn't really appeal to me. I wonder maybe kids play hopscotch on their phone now. They don't go outside.

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It's easier. It's interesting, Ephesians 1 .1, Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the will of God to the saints who are at Ephesus and who are faithful in Christ Jesus.

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In other words, every believer needs to understand election and Paul was not afraid of it.

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And he didn't say this is for graduate level stuff. When you're a baby Christian, you can learn about election.

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Yeah, I mean, I would just say this, that if you're a Christian, if you read the scripture, which those two things tend to go together,

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Christians read the Bible, right? Legalist. Well, I didn't say they have to,

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I just said they tend to. So if you read the scripture, this is something that you really ought to work through.

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Because if you just go, I don't wanna think about it. Well, then there's a whole bunch of scriptures you're gonna have to skip over and not think about.

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In light of that, Steve, because that's a really good point. It was John Calvin. Of course, you have to mention

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John Calvin on a show about election. It was Calvin who said, did the Holy Spirit make a mistake, including the doctrine of election, including the doctrine of predestination and other things?

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Did he kind of slip up a little bit, the Holy Spirit? No, absolutely. I mean, you already know the answer to that, but it's this idea that somehow we ought not to talk about it because it sounds, well, it's offensive to unbelievers and some people who are less mature also stumble with it.

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And by the way, we can be nice when we teach people this, right? We don't have to be cruel and calculating and cold.

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Yell at them, a little shout. Calvin said, but for those who are so cautious or fearful that they desire to bury predestination in order not to disturb weak souls, with what color will they cloak their arrogance when they accuse

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God indirectly of stupid thoughtlessness? Yeah, or again, not being fair, all these kinds of things come to, how could

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God say such a thing? Well, that's your translation. There's a lot of Bible translations.

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There's a lot of differences, different manuscripts. Yes, but I've got all the nuances. No, I think that's the new living translation you have.

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All right, so that's the first one and we want to say anything else about that? No. If you're a Christian, you need to understand the doctrine of election.

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Absolutely. Number two, election stimulates praise rather than squashes it.

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What do you think I mean by that title? I think you mean, and I'll presume a little bit here, that if you just think there's nothing in me that would make

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God choose me, but he chose me anyway, that doesn't make you think I'm all that in a bag of chips.

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It makes you think, I can't believe he chose me. Thank you, Lord, for choosing me.

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Not anything more than that. That should be the Christian's kind of theme is just thankfulness and gratitude because I know that no good thing dwells in me and yet he chose me anyway.

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Amen. So many people look at this doctrine and then they seethe with contempt.

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God chooses and is that fair and all these other things versus, wait a second, God chose me.

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I think you could probably relate to me, Steve, in terms of we get saved, we're excited, we're enthusiastic, we're thankful, can't believe it, forgiven.

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And then you learn the doctrine of election and then it's almost like getting saved again. Right? It's the second blessing.

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What happened when you first understood election? Well, I mean, there were a lot of things that blew my mind, but this is one of them because I just thought it was just incredible to me that before the foundation of the world,

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God would choose me. That of his own sovereign free will and that in time, then he would cause me to believe and all these things, the sovereignty of God, in other words, especially coming from a background where basically

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God was like me, only better. It was amazing to me.

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When Paul starts off in Ephesians with this blessing in chapter one, verse three, he says, blessed be the

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God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who's, I almost started doing first Peter, cause us to be born again.

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Well, Peter's praising God too. Yep, same thing. Just as he chose us in him, before Paul praises

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God for the son's redemption in him, we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins. Before God, the

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Holy Spirit through Paul praises the Holy Spirit sealed to the day of redemption, he praises God for election.

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We're supposed to praise God for choosing. Why wouldn't we? I mean, it is an amazing truth presented in scripture.

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Not so, I mean, you said it, but I'll kind of amplify it. Paul's writing this letter to the churches in the

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Ephesus area and he starts out typically and then he interrupts himself to do this praise, this doxology and it starts with election because he's like, oh,

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I can't contain myself. I have to write about this. And don't you think it would be good for the listeners, the viewers to have the same response that Paul did?

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Absolutely. I mean, you could read every other letter that Paul writes and he never starts and then just kind of explodes like this in a massive, what is it?

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12 verses, all one sentence in the Greek, we know all these kinds of things.

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But, and just praise, praise, praise, praise to the Father, praise to the

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Son, praise to the Holy Spirit for election. Spurgeon said, whatever may be said about the doctrine of election, it is written in the word of God as with an iron pen and there's no getting rid of it, there it stands.

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You've got to, I guess what we do, if we're not thinking about the sovereignty of God, we just redefine election, right?

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Because they see the word election, he chose. And you have to redefine a lot of things, like original sin or depravity, all these kinds of things, you have to moderate them,

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I'll say, alter them so that election doesn't stand as such a stark choice, but an understandable choice.

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I mean, I was pretty good, so God decided to make me better or he, you know, whatever, however you wanna redefine it, there has to be some redefinition in order to justify a lowering of what election actually means.

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God chose me. That'll get you through quite a few trials.

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Yes, it will. All right, number three, unless you wanna say anything else about number two? No, I'm good with it.

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All right, all right. Number three, every Christian must believe this and this ties into what we've already been saying.

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It's in the Bible. So when it says he chose us and predestination, every

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Christian has to believe it, right? It's in everybody's Bible. That was my point. That's right.

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The same woman, when I asked her about the word predestination, she's just like, and she said, essentially,

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I don't like it. And I go, I said, well, a lot of people don't like it, but we have to grapple with it, try to understand it.

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So what does it mean? And kind of a shrug of the shoulders, because if you don't know and you don't wanna, and of course

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I explained it to her. I don't know if Sylvia is her name. I haven't talked to her for 35 years or so.

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I don't know what she believes now, but that's exactly right.

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Every Christian needs to wrestle with it. Why? Because it's in scripture. You can't get away from it. Jesus, again, in John 17,

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John 6, it's over and over and over again throughout the scriptures. And you have to grapple with it, try to understand it and make sense of it.

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And to just say, I don't get it and move on is not dealing with the text, honestly.

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Steve, we are a people that like to choose. The last time I checked,

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I think you chose your bride. Yes. I chose my bride. Now there are some arranged marriages even here at the church, different cultures.

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But we like - Let me be clear, excuse me, but we don't arrange marriages here at the church. Okay, I would just wanna be -

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Indirectly, hey, this family, that family. Yeah, that would be way indirectly. But we choose and we say, well, this is my favorite football team.

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This is my favorite food. So we're choosing people. Why is it then when we look at scripture, while we have no problem with Jesus choosing the 12 and not thousands of others,

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God choosing Israel and not any other nation, God's choice of, what else does

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God choose? Angels. God chose some angels and not the other. But when it comes to who goes to God's holy heaven, he can't choose his own bride.

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We choose our brides, no problem, but we don't want God to choose his bride. I mean, when you, not that I've ever done this, but if you take your family to Walt Disney World, you don't just go, you know what?

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I'm gonna take a couple of hundred people with me, or I'm gonna pay for everybody today or whatever.

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Why? Well, first of all, because I can't afford it. But secondly, why would

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I? I mean, I have a special affection for my family that I don't share for everybody else.

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Do I love all mankind? Yes, but I'm not paying for all mankind to go to Walt Disney World, right?

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I mean, we understand that, and we would never, you know, bicker with anybody.

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I mean, I wouldn't say to you, Mike, what's wrong with you? Why don't you take my family to Walt Disney World? That'd be weird, right?

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And if I did, that would just be my own special favor. By the way, the root word for favorite, favor, he shows favor.

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Isn't that what this is? We're all talking about sovereign grace. And God, if he wants to show favor, in a little bit, maybe next week, we'll get into what people deserve.

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But just to jump the gun a little bit, if you understand what you deserve and what your sin deserves, then

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I think that magnifies the praise of God chose me. Right. Because if God knows what we've done, and he does, and he still chooses us, and he does, then we should be thinking, that is like one of the most amazing things.

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Actually, today, as we sit and talk about election, I'm thinking to myself, God chose me. And he didn't choose you because you are fit.

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He chose you because he's going to make you fit, right? He's going to shape and mold you into the image of his son.

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Amen. Now, that's two points ahead. So let's just go to the next one. That's okay. They all go together.

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They merge together. Number four, election took place before the foundation of the world. That's what

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Ephesians chapter one says. So give me kind of an overview of that. And what's he trying to say?

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And what does it mean on the negative side? Well, he's saying that before anything existed,

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God determined who, which is really amazing, because that means before Adam and Eve were created, before anything else existed, he decided that he was going to save some particular people.

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Why? Because he knew what was going to happen. When I talk about time and the future and all these things,

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I compare it not to the linear experience we have, but to a map. God sees everything at once.

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So there was nothing in us, nothing good that he foresaw, nothing, no choices that we would make that he said, you know,

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I can see that Steve is going to believe. And on that basis, I'm going to choose him. We don't see that anywhere in scripture.

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What we see instead is before the foundation of the world, in other words, for no reason other than his own sovereign choice, which is what we're talking about, he chose to save Mike, to save Steve, to save other people, specific people.

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And it was on the basis of his choice alone. Before we did good, before we did bad,

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I wasn't in eternity past doing bad things. No. Or good things.

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No, there's no pre -existence. A lady was saying she's got some problems with election and other things.

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And John Newton used to tell the story. Sir, the lady said, after she learned this doctrine, the

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Lord must have loved me before I was born or else he would not have seen anything in me to love afterward, which jumps ahead to our next one.

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But still the idea is before time began, God chooses.

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Now, even that sparks praise, sparks wonder, sparks I can't get my mind wrapped around that.

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Well, and it speaks to the character of God too, because he does not change once he makes a determination.

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Once he makes a decision, he doesn't say, you know, in retrospect, I probably shouldn't have chose

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Steve. That was because if that was the case, right? Then we would have no way of thinking, if I'm saved today, then

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I'm going to go to heaven. And we would be thinking like a Muslim. I hope

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I'm good enough, or I hope God keeps me, or I hope - God shows mercy.

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Yes, I hope God doesn't change his mind. So - Steve, as I contemplate election and just kind of going back and forth and off the notes, we have something in theology called the covenant of redemption.

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And here we have the father and the son with the spirit and eternity past.

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And I think sometimes when we think of the covenant of redemption, we think about the three persons of one

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Godhead sitting there talking, who should we elect? How many? But we instead call it an eternal council because there's no back and forth debating, two pick one thing, another pick another.

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So this is the eternal council we're talking about. Yeah, there can't be one. Well, there can't be disagreement among the -

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No, but the father is the main hierarchy and the son and the spirit are subordinate in eternity past.

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Don't you know that? Spoke the heretic. There's one will of God, right?

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There's one essence. I mean, if we have two or three divine wills, then we have two or three different gods.

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And we have, we're no longer monotheistic. So, and that is very clearly not the case.

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I mean that Jesus never says, and when I say never, I mean, never. Jesus never says, well,

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I disagree with the father or the spirit doesn't say, I don't know. In other words, like you said, there was no vote.

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And then people point to Matthew 26, Jesus in the garden of Gethsemane was a Mark 14.

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And they'll say, well, wait a minute. What about when Jesus was in Gethsemane?

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Not my will, but your will be done. Okay. Human will versus, you know, the will of God.

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Incarnation. Yes, so. I saw a couple of verses in Revelation that relate to this point on election.

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All who dwell on earth will worship him. Everyone whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book of life of the lamb who has been slain.

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There is this book of life written from the foundation of the world. That's amazing.

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Before time began. And there's no eraser. The holy eraser that, you know.

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Yeah, but you know what they do? They use the Revelation chapter three, verse five. No one can erase his name from the book as meaning, but you can.

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I mean, I think it's technically a lie to tease and it's trying to emphasize the point that it can't be done. Right.

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Matter of fact, I'm gonna look that up. You talk while I look it up. You do that. I mean, if there were something, you know, that could remove us from the hand, as it were, of God or from Jesus, that Jesus wouldn't have said nothing and no one can remove, you know, can remove me and take the ones that we've chosen out of our hands.

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Here it is. Revelation three, five. If you ever, by the way, are wondering about a certain Bible verse and you can't quote it perfectly and you're just rambling about it, do what

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I just did. Look up the verse and it makes it a lot easier to explain. Hmm. That's a hot tip here from NoCo Radio.

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Well, sometimes people will come up to me after church service or around the church building and they'll say, well, Mike, you know, this verse, you know,

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I don't really know what this verse means. And they kind of say it. And then the first thing I do is I say, let's open the

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Bible and actually look at it because the answer probably is found in the verse, not in your mangling of the verse.

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Right, in your own personal translation of it. Yep. Revelation three, five. The one who conquers will be clothed thus in white garments.

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And I, Jesus said, will never blot his name out of the book of life. See, you can be blotted out.

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And that's what a lie to tease is. He's negating one thing by the extreme example of the other.

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So he's wanting to make sure that you understand that can never happen. Anyway, today on No Compromise Radio, Steve and I have been talking about the doctrine of election.

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Aren't you glad the doctrine of election is true? And as Steve said earlier, I mean, where is it not in Scripture, really?

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You just see it so many places. And I think it's just assumed in other places. And while it might not be in Philemon, when you think of God, you should be thinking

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King, Lord, and Kings choose, Lords choose. Any final comments, Steve, before we get to part two next week?

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Yeah, you know, just this real quickly, people object to this and they say, what about our free will?

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And, you know, it's kind of the flip side of that. And the question always pops up in my mind, well, do we actually have a free will?

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And if you think about original sin and the things that we'll be talking about here in a minute, you're quickly going to come to the realization that free will is the problem.

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Because if you look through the Bible and look for free will, you're going to run into great difficulty.

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I'm glad you brought that up. And if it's free will, meaning people choose according to their nature, okay, fine.

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We even have in the 1689, our confession. There's a section on free will, but it has to be defined.

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And what Steve is saying and what I'm saying, are unbelievers free from Satan's influence? I mean, they're captive to do his will, 2

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Timothy chapter two. Are unbelievers free from the world's influence?

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Well, you watch us, Buffalo Wild Wings. Free from indwelling sin?

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No, you're either a slave to righteousness or a slave to sin. And so that is the flip side. We should probably do a show on the bondage of the will someday instead of the freedom of the will,

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Erasmus and Luther. Anyway, you can write us, info at nocompromiseradio .com. Don't forget the

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YouTube channel. And if you want to pick up the new book, Law, Gospel, a Primer, that's on Amazon. See you next time.