Evangelizing "the Church of Christ"

One is reading the Old Testament the old law and then you know, you graduate into the New Testament. We see two totally different, you know.

Everything because I mean the ceremony salvation was different in the Old Testament to New Testament. I.

Do yeah, okay.

This is where we part ways because I believe Romans 4 we were justified had our sins forgiven the same way Abraham was which was by faith. And so I don't think there's two different Gospels in Old and New Testament.

It's always been in the finished work of Jesus Christ.

Good evening to everybody. Welcome to the narrow way podcast and Allow us to introduce ourselves and our guests. I am the host of the narrow way podcast. My name is Andre Moore Minister for the Oakleaf Church of Christ and we do have our co-host with us here sister or Toria Pittman and we also have a guest special guest with us this evening.

His name is the apologetic dog also known as named Jeremiah so we will be talking with the apologetic dog this evening in regards to Believe that the topic of discussion we have here is baptism. So we'll talk about baptism as baptism necessary for salvation.

Things of that sort and we are you know, as obvious we're going to be very cordial and very polite that's you know what we do and we are going to allow each side to Express their thoughts and you know as we get to the scriptures and rightly divided scriptures.

So the apologetic dog if you would like to introduce yourself or say anything further.

Well, thank you so much and you're Andre. Is that right? Yes. Yes Andre. Thanks so much, man. So, my name is Jeremiah nortier. I'm a pastor and elder at 12 -5 church in Jonesboro, Arkansas so we're in the Deep South over here and my heart has been in ministry serving the Lord for oh Wow, I've been a Christian now for over 20 years the Lord has been so gracious in my life just with The gospel illuminating my heart to looking to Christ alone by faith alone all to the glory of God alone.

And I've been in pastoral ministry now for about eight years. And so about two years ago, my church family was telling me hey, you should pursue apologetics. And so that's been something I've been doing for about two years now and the apologetic dog.

Some people are like why dog and I try to say I try to explain that it comes from First Timothy 6 verse 20 where Paul says that Timothy Oh Timothy guard The gospel or the the deposit that's been entrusted to you.

And so the heart behind my apologetics ministry is guarding the gospel of grace. As as we will discuss what that looks like more is guarding the gospel Against false gospels that say it's faith plus works and so defining terminology is so important in Apologetic endeavors and looking at proof text in light of context and so maybe we can get a little bit more into that.

But that's essentially where I'm coming from Andre and oh.

We will get this discussion started and you know as we go ahead and discuss these things. You know. We want to keep it in the atmosphere of you know. As we're having a conversation within a living room and things of that sort as well again, you know just allowing you know each side to express their views.

And the topic at hand this evening is Baptism. Is baptism necessary for salvation. So we do want to allow you to take the floor in beginning this discussion Jeremiah and to discuss your.

Okay, well y 'all just cut me off because I'm known to ramble and yellow preachy sometimes. But my understanding of baptism is that baptism is a wonderful gift from God to the church. Now I believe Baptism is meant for professing believers those that already have Their sins forgiven those that are trusting in the perfect Savior and his finished work.

In my understanding of baptism comes from kind of the Greek word and there's a few different forms of it. But bad tits Oh bad tits ma. But when we look at the Greek It's literally a ceremonial, right?

That's being immersed into water. And so since it's a ceremonial, right? We participate and bad tits Oh means that it signifies the forgiveness of sins and I love this because baptism is a beautiful Representation a beautiful picture of those who already have their past sins forgiven because they're expressing their faith in their working.

Participation.

Within a church context and so baptism isn't just individualistic. It also includes a baptizer. And it's in the context. I would argue from Acts chapter 2 and other places in the book of Acts, but the Ecclesia.

It's in the context of the church meant as a celebration. I would say baptism pictures the reality the spiritual realities of what God has already done in a person's heart and in their life and. So that's kind of the positive side that I would say of baptism.

Especially looking to acts 238 as my main understanding of where I get that functional understanding of baptism but something that I would say I do not see baptism as is the instrumentation or means of how someone has their past sins washed away and I think one of the dangers that I see and Y 'all maybe you've seen some my content.

My heart is to say this this can't be the means of how you have your past sins washed away when we look to Acts 238 or Acts 22 16. Because when we look at the word or God's of my or works. It's not our participation in a list of commands that makes us right before God.

We are justified by faith apart from works as the Old Testament Prophesized that Jesus taught about in the Gospels that Paul and in the letters to the New Testament along with the other Epistles to the church just say it's our faith.

Faith and works are related. But they are distinct as we all know James chapter 2 says a mere professed faith only without a change of life. That's a dead thing. And so hopefully with our conversation.

We can look at a number of different proof texts acts 238 X 22 16 mark 16 16 just to list a few first Peter 3 21. I like to bring out that baptism there has a surrounding context that a lot of times is talking about maybe baptism of the Holy Spirit and I believe that that is the working of the Holy Spirit a baptism without hands that Regenerates a heart that causes a person to look to the Savior in faith.

And therefore in our experience when we have taste and seen that the Lord is gracious. Then we desire to be obedient to all that Christ has commanded us. But what do y 'all think as far as just getting the conversation started?

I like I said, I don't want to keep going and I just want to give you some time miss.

Oh, that was great. You know, I appreciate what you said because that's helping me, you know to to gain a better understanding. You know of your belief and you know kind of where it originates from so thank you for the art.

So, I guess um, I guess the first thing that I want to know. How do you officially. Like what's your official faith? Are you Baptist? Are you Pentecostal? Are you holiness? What would you say?

Yeah, I would thank you for the question. I tell people first and foremost I'm a Christian. My soul authority comes from the Word of God. Now when I say Soul authority, it's the ultimate authority. So I think there are some other great authorities but lowercase a that come throughout church history.

I love the Baptist heritage. It's funny because we're talking about baptism, but within kind of the Baptist heritage. I would definitely identify Once it's understood that I follow Christ and him alone ultimately for the forgiveness of my sins.

I don't mind to also say now underneath that banner I would definitely identify as reformed Baptist. But sometimes people think oh Jeremiah you care more about a Denomination than looking to the Bible as your soul authority and that's usually where I try to bring some clarity out there.

When it comes down to baptism, I heard you say Basically that it Signifies the forgiveness of sins. Am I fair in did I quote you right on that? It signifies that okay. So, let me ask you this if if it signifies the forgiveness of sins Who it who is it signifying it to is it other people or their Saints the lost?

Jesus God, you know like who is it signifying it to all the above? Okay, okay. Okay, and if that is the case then thank you. Um, what would you say? About Philip and a eunuch, okay so When we read that account, um, you know, and just for the listener's sake I'm actually talking about X 8 26 through 40 where the Ethiopian eunuch he only knew of you know, the Portion of the gospel.

He did not know the whole gospel. He didn't know know about Christ. So When Philip, you know was told, you know to go and tell him about the gospel and all of that If I understand what you're saying at some point before The eunuch said hey, there's water his sins were forgiven.

Is that fair to say from your perspective. Repeat that last thing you said, please. Sure. Sorry. I know it was a lot.

So in a nutshell The Ethiopian eunuch before he said hey, here's some water. What hinders me from you know being baptized. At what point I would say was he was his sins forgiven? Yeah. Well a great question.

So back in verse 35 then Philip opened his mouth in Beginning with this scripture. He told him the good news about Jesus. So With acts being a narrative book Primarily descriptive I would interpret when he explained the good news to Philip About how Jesus is a perfect Savior.

He is the fulfillment of Isaiah 53. Hey, dude. That's okay, hey you listen to mama, okay. So with acts being a narrative book I would interpret right here where he was preaching the good news. That's when he received the gospel by faith.

Which Romans 1 16 would tell us that the gospel is the power of God unto salvation when someone receives that in faith. Then they display their faith in good work. So I would say the fact that he wants to be baptized shows that he understands that the good news was talking about Jesus.

He's put his faith in Jesus Christ alone. And that's why he is desiring to be obedient in baptism to display his faith to the world. Even though it's just before Philip because this is kind of a missional context and then obviously he is Displaying his faith before God who already knows the heart and he would already be justified.

That's why I was a little confused because I was like, okay if there's no one, you know there to kind of. You know show. Or or you know the I guess your faith and then God already knows. You know whether it's sincere or not.

You know, that's why I was like, okay. Well. Who is around because this is a person that is displaced, you know? He is he is a far far far away from his, you know country. And so, okay so in that so in that instance.

If he was saved, you know before being baptized. And so now that he says hey, you know what hinders me if if he would not have gotten baptized. Do you think he was still be saved? Oh.

Great question. So when someone is justified, this is a this is a really important term. I think in talking about baptism because Paul would argue that Justification is by faith apart from works. When someone has been gifted saving faith and are justified before God and having all their sins forgiven.

Then they necessarily will display that faith by being obedient to all that God has commanded not a perfect faith, but we're we're demonstrating our faith in Sanctification. So if someone refuses to get baptized, but they say they're a Christian.

Then we understand that that's a mere said faith that doesn't save anyone. And so we can never see the heart we can only look at someone's professed faith by their fruit a good tree produces bad or a good tree produces good fruit and a bad tree produces bad fruit.

So the fact that someone is desiring to be baptized. This would be good evidence that they have a sincere faith now time will tell like I said We can't infallibly see the heart but when we see that the unit is saying what hinders me from be baptized.

This is excellent evidence of someone that already has a changed heart and is wanting to display their faith. And so in a missionary context, um, he would be displaying his faith before Philip and Obviously all things are before God and two other verses that are important that we might can touch on a little bit is We are justified by faith apart from works and Genesis 15 6.

That's how Abraham was justified and then back at 2 for Old Testament text the just shall live by faith. And so justification is always by faith apart from works and then a believer lives out their faith in Sanctification which is sanctifying works of obedience to all of what God has commanded.

Okay.

Got a question I will. And Two questions that I want to ask. A little bit earlier you had made the statement that God already does the work in regards to our faith. So I guess the question there that I want to ask is is there anything that we can do on our part? with regards to our faith in the Lord and Jesus Christ since By your statement you said God already did the work and Then the next question that I want to ask you stated That we are justified by faith.

Which is what I'm assuming you're you're taking from the book of Romans for that. Is that correct?

Romans Ephesians Luke 18 and then like I said in the Old Testament In the narrative of Abraham He was justified by faith or is counted to him as righteousness based on his faith and not his circumcision.

Okay. Okay. I'll I'll follow up with that question a little bit later, but I did want you to Answer that question with regards to. Is there anything that we can do on our behalf if God has already done the work?

There there's nothing that man can do in terms of his works to be made right before God and so defining works really helps that Out but when I what I was referring to the work that God does. We read in John chapter 6.

I may have to look it up around verse 28 and 29. But the fact that we believe is a work of God. So it's not something that we pull ourselves up by our bootstraps and that we conjure up on our on our own.

The work of God is Something miraculous. Earlier in John 6 Jesus is doing miracles. He's doing the work of God and then you have a crowd that's following Jesus wanting to fill their tummies. And they're like what what can we do to be doing the works of God.

And then Jesus says the most spectacular thing. He says oh you must believe that's the work of God. It's not anything that you as a human being can do. God must do a miraculous work and this was actually prophesied.

In Ezekiel 36, this is a beautiful passage if you don't mind me reading. This is kind of the framework that I'm coming from. But Ezekiel 36 God promises that one day he would put his spirit within his covenant people.

And this is the promise of the new covenant. He got y 'all. So this is Yahweh on high speaking. He says I Will sprinkle water on you and you shall be clean from all of your uncleanness and from all your idols.

I will cleanse you. This is the key. I will give you a new heart and a new spirit I will put within you and I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh and I Will put my spirit within you and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to obey My rules and so when I say that God does the work I'm saying man is born dead in his sins and his trespasses.

Romans chapter 3 says there's none good. We are all born children of wrath in our federal head Adam and so from birth. We're not born neutral. We're not born in this like perfect sinless state. We're born as enemies of God and God must do a miraculous work on our heart so that we can see the Savior for who?

He truly is and that's a work that God does. Ephesians 2 8 says that our faith as believers is actually a gift from above that he worked in and Philippians 2 12 says That yes, God. Is that work both in you to will and work for his good pleasure?

So verse 12 says we work out our salvation and fear and trembling I would say in terms of our sanctification the verse 13 says oh. But it was God that first did that work in you he who began that good work of regeneration in your heart.

He will see it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ. Philippians earlier says so when believers are at work. It's in terms of our sanctification and we don't bring our works to the table in terms of our justification.

That's by faith apart from our works because if we were to add a work like baptism. It would be adding to the already finished work of Jesus Christ.

Okay.

There were there was something that you said there. While you were talking in regards to you know, we are born children of wrath, which means we're born sinners. Right on there. There is a problem with that.

You know that that we do see in Scripture because if we were born sinners, then Jesus Christ was born a sinner as well. So, you know. G Scripture tells us in first Peter 2 and verses 20 through 21 there or 22.

For what credit is it if when we are beaten for your faults, you'd take it patiently. But when you do good and suffer if you take it patiently, this is commendable before God for this. For to this you were called because Christ also suffered for us leaving us an example that you should follow his steps.

Who committed no sin nor deceit was found in his mouth? So that would be the you know. The issue with being born sinners because Christ was fully human being and we needed that human sacrifice for human sins.

Yeah, well, I appreciate you sharing your thoughts there Andre I will say kind of Reform Baptist and Church Christ. We have completely different worldviews. We have a different understanding of who God is.

So we have a different understanding of who man is and we have a different understanding of the gospel itself. Now the way that I would back up a little bit is I don't think. Being born a sinner is what it means to be human because in the very beginning God created Adam from the dust of the ground and breathed into him the breath of life and He created everything that was good good and with man.

It was very good. And so in the beginning God created man, and he did not have a sin nature. Now all of humanity that is born in Adam, I would argue from Romans 5 We definitely are born sinners not seeking God.

We are at enmity. We're not just corrupted by our environment. But we have corrupt hearts as Ephesians 2 says that we are dead in our sins and trespasses and we are by nature Children of wrath. But going back to Jesus how can Jesus be the perfect God man and somehow Surpasses the stain of original sin with Adam.

Well, I think it goes back to in the beginning. You're not. God didn't make Adam a sinner, right? He he made him in his image the Imago Dei and so in Luke 135 the angel answered to Mary. The Holy Spirit will come upon you and the power of the Most High will overshadow you.

Therefore the child to be born will be called. Holy the Son of God and so also in Romans 5. It talks about Jesus Christ the one who is to come. He is the only one that that has been born and lighted the fall that actually did not he was born of a virgin.

So he did not suffer the stain of original sin that we bear because we all died in Adam Romans 5. 1st Corinthians 15 Says. But Jesus being the the second and better Adam He never sinned. That's why if you put your trust in him.

Then you can have all your sins paid for because he is a perfect Savior not just your past sins.

Okay.

Thank you for that comment. I do want to follow up on that comment with regard as we're you know, talking about.

You know.

Talking about being you know born sinners First John 3 and verse 1 before yes whosoever commits sin as you're familiar with the verse Transgresses also the law for sin is the transgression of law. So my question to you with regards to this would be is a baby able to transgress law.

I.

Would say a baby is not able to transgress law. But babies still die. And so a popular question I ask church why Christ is why do you think babies die?

And you know, that's big sin was introduced into the world into the world as Romans 5 It says through one man sin, namely Adam, you know sin was introduced into the world. So.

Okay.

And it made the condit when sin was introduced into the world. It made the conditions likely for Men to sin. But one of the Penalties or punishments for sin with regards to Adam was death. You know. And God had instituted or prophesied back in Genesis 3 15 that Jesus Christ will come into the world to rectify that.

But that was the punishment.

All the way in the beginning. So I have a question. So would you say the infants suffer death by the sin of another?

Well, you know Romans 5. Let me put that there. Yes, sir. Romans 5 verse 12 wherefore as by one man sin entered into the world and death by sin So death passed upon all men for that all have sinned so and again.

This you know just goes back to the point of where God sold Adam and Eve, you know in the garden. And the day that you eat of the fruit you will surely die. And That was passed upon all men until Jesus this was to come into the world.

But.

It doesn't contradict Sin being you know a transgression of the law when we. We look at babies. For example, they don't know how to walk. They don't have any knowledge of anything else. Therefore they don't have knowledge of sin.

So, you know with regards to being born sinners with sin being a transgression of law. You know, we can't really say that babies and we can't we can't say that babies are born sinners.

So this this is what we mean because when you look at verse 19, it's talking about all of humanity were made sinners. It's by nature. And so when we talk about original sin, we're not saying that babies actually sin.

We're just saying their entire nature is corrupt from birth and they will sin now. I noticed that oh, we're shaking her head when I asked you why do babies die? Is it because the sins of another she shook her head?

No, I think I was just gonna double-check because you were actually affirming that it's because of Adam's sin.

So yeah, so it's two ways to look at that. So as Andre is explaining, you know that death because of the original sin that entered into the world. Death is a thing. Now, you know, I'm saying so so death happens.

Versus it would not have been happening. You know had that not happened. You understand so. What he's saying. Totally true. What I was thinking about ways. Let me see. I think it's Ezekiel.

18 verse 20. Yeah. All right, then. All right. Now, come on. Man this Baptist does some bobble drill over there. Come on back about.

Yes.

So, you know there where it's talking about like, you know, the son will not inherit the sin of the father. Vice versa. So, you know, where does where does their sin? I'm thinking to myself like where does their sin come from?

You know, but but I think you just explained it. Basically what you're saying is that It's not that they have seen when they come in is it's the fact that they will.

Okay, they will by nature. They will by nature, okay, so.

Do you think that that happens? Like, um when they know right from wrong.

So no, they're born by nature fallen sons and daughters of Adam. So they they don't become sinners when they sin. They are sinners so they necessarily will sin. And when we look at church history There was only one heretic called Pelagius that believed babies were born Without sin and it was possible that they could live an entire life sinless and so the church universally has Condemned that as heresy.

And I look at you know. A church history is a good metric to study and look at. But when I look at Romans all sin and fall short of the glory of God. And when we look at the wages of sin is death. And we look at Infants dying it's not that they had personal sin.

But they suffer the consequences of a sin of another and so that's why even when we look at Ezekiel 18 There's no injustice with God. Even though Adam represents all of humanity. We still bear personal responsibility With our lives, so I would contend that's what Ezekiel 18 is talking about now.

Are they damned?

Because you know, there's different types of ways to view, you know this sin that we're talking about. You know, like I was just saying, you know, there's the there's the fact of the matter that we come into a sinful world.

Where sin was introduced once and that's it. You know, we can't get rid of it, right? This is it's the same thing with death. Once death was introduced. We can't get rid of it. It's gonna take Jesus to get rid of it, right?

Okay, so with these little ones. Okay, so we're saying that they sin, you know, they do they do things that are wrong. But they don't know that they're wrong, right? They have to be taught. Is that sin on there like impugned to them, you know, so when they die, are they damned?

Now you you said a good word. You said impugned. Now, maybe the full word is impute. Is that fair?

Yeah.

Yeah, so Romans 5 so, you know, we're already talking about verse 12 about how all die in Adam, right? Death is universal because sin is universal. And so 19 says for as by the one man's disobedience the many all of humanity were made sinners and I would say by Imputation meaning that we are derived out of the essence of the first Adam the fallen me.

So even though I believe infants are Sinners from the womb by nature now that is Ephesians 2 verse 3 by nature children of wrath and God is holy. Holy. Holy also believe that God is merciful and saves to the uttermost and I don't think in I Personally believe all infants go to heaven but not because they're without a sin nature.

I believe it's because God is merciful. And so even though they're totally depraved and if they would have continued to grow up It's not that they would have searched for God on their own. They would have been like Saul of Tarsus going the opposite way now by God's mercy.

He intervenes in their life and I believe that we have enough principles to know the the character of God is merciful and It seems very consistent that he would save someone that is the lowest an infant that bore That died in infancy an infant that died in the womb.

But I would say just the fact that an infant is saved by God and goes to heaven for such are the kingdom of heaven. It's not because they were sinless. I would say they they had a corrupt nature, but God is merciful.

Interesting. So why do you suppose that God says we have to become like little children.

Child like faith. Infants, they can't do any accomplishments on their own. They're not gonna be able to participate in a ceremony. A child just believes in his parents. He believes By the accomplishments of another.

And so we must become like a child with a faith alone now not a mere intellectual ascent not just believing facts. But a heart change a trust that God can accomplish his promises like a little child trust their parents.

Okay. All right. So I am I Want us to not to stray too far away from you know, the the topic at hand is baptism necessary. So I want to because we have been touching on Romans chapter 5 for a little bit I want to Bring go or go back up to Romans chapter 5 and verse number 1 Justified by faith.

So I've got three questions that I want to ask. One is I want if you could Tell us when or why was is Paul talking about? Justification in Romans. When did he begin talking about justification in Romans and when does it culminate in regards to.

Justification in Romans, you may have to remind me all those questions. What was the first one win or the wine?

Yes, why did Paul begin talking about justification in Romans?

Okay, so if we look back in Romans chapter 1. Probably one of my favorite verses verse 16 for I am NOT ashamed of the gospel for it is the power of God. For salvation for everyone who believes and so we're going to talk about more with what that kind of believing is.

Is it a mere ascent to facts only or is it something much deeper? He says for everyone who believes the Jew first and also the Greek verse 17 I think think this is the answer to your question, but there's two verses.

I want to keep in mind. We look at verse 17. For in it the righteousness of God Is revealed from faith for faith as it is written the righteous shall live by faith. Paul's writing about justification because Salvation has always been the same.

There's always been one gospel message from Old Testament to New Testament. Now we have there's progressive revelation meaning the the proto Evangelion of Genesis 15 6 that the offspring of the woman would crush the the serpents head.

All the scripture further expounds on this gospel promise and so Paul is explaining that Salvation has always been by faith in that Messiah that perfect Savior. Now I think throughout church history you have heretics you have those that have added Works you have added law to the gospel of grace and so Paul is gonna make it Abundantly clear even to the Jews not your working participation and ceremonial mosaic Laws are gonna make you right before God.

It's by faith. And then he even goes to Abraham who precedes the Mosaic Law and said Abraham even the list of commands that he Obeyed like circumcision leaving the land of her. Willing to offer up his son Isaac on an altar.

None of those works justified him. It was always his firm trust in the promises of God. So that's the why and he quotes from Habakkuk 2 4 and verse 17 the rights the righteous the just shall live. By faith now, that's sanctification.

That's Paul's language at first Thessalonians, I believe chapter 4 where he really goes deep and what it means to live a holy life a sanctified life. Paul also says in Romans 8 29 that we are being conformed to the image of God's Son.

So sanctification is growing in holiness. Sanctification is becoming less like the world and being conformed more into the image of King Jesus now He kind of begins the letter that way. I would say justification starts after Romans 1 2 and 3 that talks about the Universality of condemnation for all people.

Now I would say that's important and I would I would include infants infants don't deserve heaven. They they they have died in Adam. They Do not have a righteous nature that was lost at the fall. And so Romans chapter 3 Paul also kind of switches gears and he talks about justification that God is both the just and the justifier for those that Have faith and so Romans chapter 3 I have a lot of conversations about when do you contact the blood of Jesus?

Is it by your working participation in a ceremony or is it at the point of faith? And so I try to point people back to Romans 3 23 for all of sin and fall short of the glory of God and are Justified by his grace as a gift with whom God put put forward as a propitiation by his blood to be received by Faith and so we receive the blood atonement of Christ when you put your faith in King Jesus.

And so Romans 4 makes that probably the most clear Chapter in all of Scripture that those that precede the law of Moses like Abraham justified by faith apart from works King David in verse 6 with the quotation of Psalm 32 David was under law Justified by faith apart from works the law and then the Apostle Paul identifies his personal justifications with Christians after the laws fulfillment and then the the summation verse which you begin with.

This is this is kind of tackling the the win and the the to what extent verse 5. Therefore we as Christians have been justified by not our works not our baptism even in Romans chapter 6 to come. But it's by faith.

We have peace true. Shalom. The Jews would have understand all we want to have peace a a true ceasefire. Well, you got to put your faith in the author and the perfecter of our faith. Who is Jesus Christ and his perfect work who never sinned.

Okay, so that's where you would say Excuse me that it you know culminates there.

Yeah, therefore since we have been justified by faith We have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.

Okay.

Thank you for those thoughts. And speaking where the Bible speaks. Well, I thank you for those thoughts. But this is the point that I wanted to point out with regards to that as we you know, talk about justification.

We know the the bulk of chapter 1 is talking about the sins of the Gentiles and then chapter 2 It's talking about the sins of the Jews but also here in chapter 3, you know is talking about both. But the point of emphasis here is in chapter 3 in verse number 8 and he says.

And not rather as we be slanderously reported as. Some affirm that we say let us do evil that good may come whose damnation is just.

So.

He's referring to the justification by doing evil that good may come. Now immediately after verse 8 beginning with verse 9. He starts talking about justification the whole justification process again.

He's condemning both Jews and Gentiles he's quoting from the Old Testament and Then we you know drop down into verse 25 through 27 there. It tells us there because everybody is you know Sin all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God, which is why we need Jesus.