Tape 2 - Counseling Seminar

The Counselor Personality and Why Christians Must Mix with People

And you can judge sometimes whether they're feeding you or whether they're not. You know, so then it's going to look like you're hearing anything I say. Their eyes glass over and they go into a daze, you know.

You know you're not getting through to them. And it happens so many times. So, you and I want to counsel with people. Because we want to bring them to the point of where they can understand what the Christian life is all about.

And when you and I go witness, that is actually a form of counseling. When you and I go share the gospel, that's actually a form of counseling. When we speak of sermon, when we speak of friendship classes.

Involved in that is a counseling process whether we recognize it or not. Or we can call it whatever other words. So, you and I have to develop what we call a counselor personality. A counselor personality.

Now that doesn't mean you have to grow a beard. And it doesn't mean you have to get you a pipe. And it doesn't mean that you have to wear canvas shoes. And a wild tie that never matches anything that you wear.

And it doesn't mean that you have to, you know, do any of those things. But there is a personality attitude that has to be developed to be a counselor and to share it with people. Let me just give you a few of these.

And I think there are seven. At least for me there are seven. There may be eight. I only know of seven. People will always come to someone they know. People will turn to someone they know. Now, they may go to someone they don't know.

But they will go there because of someone they know. Most likely. Whether it's a medical profession. Did you know a good doctor? Do you know a good counselor? We hear it all the time. We do not take anyone that is not referred.

They have to come to us from someone who knows us. It just saves you a lot of problems. Now, so that means you and I must mix with people. Well, I'm going to sit home and I'm just going to pray God will send me somebody.

Well, sometimes He does. Sometimes He does. But that's sort of like sitting in the rocking chair and praying for a harvest without ever planting seeds. It usually doesn't work that way. It usually doesn't.

You can pray and many times the Lord will bring people by your path and you know you haven't gone out actively. But the more you and I mix with people, the more opportunities you and I are going to have to share with them what we know to be the truth.

What we know to be the truth. Creating personal contact. Another thought is people will usually turn to someone in confidence that they like. That they like. It's just a fact. People will listen to someone they like.

If they like, they can tolerate a lot of things from a person. You and I do. Someone we don't know says certain things to us. We become offended or very hostile or we will become defensive somehow or other.

But if someone we like says almost identically the same thing, we can kind of overlook it a little bit. I mean, truth. They're our friends. I mean, they're saying it because maybe it's true. Something isn't it.

So, the counselor personality should be congenial. We should be able to accept people for where they are. And not categorize ourselves. We have a great tendency as Christian people to move in cliques.

That's a cliche, but to move in cliques. You know, we say, well, there's people around my financial category, so let's move in cliques. These people in this area. These people in this educational class.

You look at the people we function with. We have a great tendency to be with people who are in our category. And yet, you and I know that a believer should be comfortable in the person or presence of any other believer.

No matter what their home is like or what they have or don't have, it matters not. But that isn't the way it is. And I heard a situation in a church, and there are so many. And a lady came and she said, Pastor, I don't think that this lady is going to be happy in our class.

What I think is she'll be happier in the other class. What she should have said was this. Pastor, if this lady comes into my class, she's going to break up my little clique of power. And she's a threat to me.

And therefore, I don't want her in my class. Put her in that other one and let her do whatever she will over there. But the pastor was very perceptive, and he just put her in there. And it's amazing how that little power structure dissipated within that situation.

We tend to do such a thing. So people will turn to someone who is congenial and cordial. Congenial and cordial. Another part of the Council of Personality that's very basic, of course, is that people obviously turn to someone they respect.

You say, well, people will turn to any minister. You and I travel around, and this is an indictment upon the ministry of the man of God. You know what most people will say? I do not go to my pastor. Because if I go to my pastor, I'm afraid that everybody in the church will know about it.

All right, if I go to my pastor, I do not believe that he will keep to the conscience of what I tell him. Or they will say, why go to him? Look at his home. Look at his life. Look at his church. And so they don't have respect.

And so they go off to a counselor, marriage counselor. They go off to a psychologist or psychiatrist. So what does that say? In order for respect to be gained, it's earned. It is not just given. Respect is something you and I have to earn.

And it's not automatically given because we are a, quote, man of God or we're a woman of God. And because we claim to be in the, you know, have the ordained hand of the Lord upon our life or we're in a certain position as pastor or staff member or deacon or whatever you're in the body of Christ, that respect has to be earned.

And so that means you ought to be a good character and spiritually mature. That means you and I must first of all get our own life in order and then our own family in order. We've got our life in order and our family in order.

People will see that and they'll respond to that. And that's where they will come. And that's where they will go. And so that's a part of it. The fourth basic factor involved in the counselor personality is people will usually respond to someone who shows an interest in counseling.

And I'm using that word counseling very generally, not in the professional sense of the word. If you and I show an interest in speaking to people about their difficulties, if they know we are sensitive to their problems.

Christian people have a theme song. You and I are not as sensitive to other people's problems, I think, sometimes when I say you and I. No, but Christians as a whole. Christians are so wrapped up in their own lives so many times that they don't fellowship with each other.

They don't have time for each other. They don't go into each other's homes. Therefore, they don't know. You know, many Sunday school teachers that I know have never, I mean, many Sunday school teachers have never been in the home of every person in their class.

How could I teach somebody and I don't even know what problems they face in their home? I don't know what difficulties they have in their home. I don't know what hurts them. How could I teach them? Now, obviously, a pastor cannot go in every home of the church immediately, but he can get there eventually.

But I know many pastors, excuse me, that have been pastors in churches for years and have never been to every home in their congregation. And yet I believe eventually you can get to at least one in every home.

Well, God will tell me what to share with him, you know. But the people will never respond to you unless you show interest in them personally as well as corporately. So, to be available, to be available.

And I know that there's a balance that has to be found. So, they need to know that we are available to them to help them with their problems. And I said that we Christians are so wrapped up in ourselves sometimes.

I believe a theme song of modern Christianity is simply, nobody knows the problems I feel. That's ours, isn't it? I don't have time for yours because you just don't know my problems. I mean, mine are unique.

Nobody has ever had the problems I got. And yet you and I both know that whatever problems confront you and me, some Christian man, woman, boy, or girl has already walked through that particular problem in life and they have gained the victory in their life and they are peace with Lord in that very same difficulty you and I are now facing.

But if you and I do not have our lives balanced, how are we going to help someone else with their life balance? We may can give them advice, but it's much easier for them to accept it and to do something with it if they know that our life is in balance and that we are interested in solving their particular difficulties.

Also, people have a tendency to turn to someone who's competent. Again, I make the point that because you and I happen to be in the ministry, does not make us competent. There's preparation. God uses prepared people.

There's no question He does. And preparation can be a very relative term. Some people are more prepared than others, but that's relative because you only have to be as prepared as God wants you to be in the situation that God expects you.

But you should be as best prepared in your situation when God expects you, whenever that happens to you. So it doesn't mean everyone goes to college. It doesn't mean everyone goes to seminary. It doesn't mean that at all.

One of the largest churches in North America, there's a man who's directed at Trinity School for years. There's a man, and I don't say this to discourage him at all, he has a high school education. Churches from all over the country sit people up there, and he just says, well, if you want your son to grow, just teach him what he's got to do.

And he'll grow. And he has, oh, sure, they run several thousands. He hasn't been off to school learning all this stuff, but he is competent in the area where God's placed him to learn how to do what he does.

And you and I can do the same. We must be competent. So that means we must study and prepare ourselves in the area that God's placed you, wherever that is. Wherever that is. And then another thought is that you must be ethical.

People turn to those who are ethical. It is, it's amazing how many people go to a counselor, psychiatrist, psychologist, or pastor, and they say, well, have you been over here? And they say, I'm not going back over there.

Just had a couple, came to us not too long ago. And they said, we've been going to another counselor. And I said, well, I think it would be wise if you would continue with me. They said, no. And it came out that there was an ethical problem.

An ethical problem. Professional ethics must be used by a layperson as well as a person who is in the profession, because the priority for a good reputation is a must. Your reputation cannot be tainted in these areas.

People must know you have a good reputation in the field of ethics. And then, of course, the seventh one, it is unbelievable to me how many non-believing people turn to people who know God. People want, when they come to the crisis, I mean the real crisis, they want to know somebody who knows God.

Because, you see, they've already been doing what everybody else has been doing, you know, and they'll turn to people who know God. And the more of God they see in your life and mine, the more God's able to draw them to you and me, as they see the life of the Lord manifested in you by the ministry of His Spirit.

So, this is part of the counselor's personality. Now, if you're a minister, of course, when we go back, we find a minister today, we go back in the Old Testament, it's almost a prophetic attitude. It's almost like an Old Testament prophet.

And the minister of God today, they have so many similarities. They were, you go in the Old Testament prophets, they were constantly counseling the people. I mean, we just kind of get the picture sometimes, you know, I think of these men, I hear, proclaiming, you know, repent from the kingdom, you know, and all these things, John the Baptist comes storming on the scene, prepare to meet your God, and this is, if you'll read the incidents, Elisha and Elijah, Jeremiah, constantly counseling the people, giving them suggestions, spiritual suggestions, spiritual advice, spiritual guidelines of how to do what God wanted them to do.

And you find it was because they were called of God. You are called of God. Now, you may be called of God into the ministry, but you are called of God unto His Son. And if you are a believer, then God's Spirit does indwell you, and therefore God has a purpose and a plan for your life.

And I always say this, God never sent His Son to make you happy. God sent His Son to make you holy. And if you and I get our lives holy, then we will be the people, the men and women of God that He wants us to be, and then when we come into confrontation with people, then God's Spirit begins to move, God's Spirit begins to act.

And if that is true, you and I, as the Old Testament prophets, as the New Testament apostles, as the New Testament Christians, we are going to become conscious of and faithful to God's leadership. If you and I, as Christian people, are not conscious of His leadership, and if we are not sensitive to His leadership, how can we, as believers, go and assist another individual, or a person who even comes to us, with their particular difficulty, and be assured that we are giving them something from God, something from God.

So that means that you and I cannot go through our days in the sort of little routines of life, so to speak, in the relationship that we have to other people. And also, when we study the Word, the men and women of God, all of them, we will find that they heeded God's Word and they communicated the truth of God.

And the truth of God is not tradition. The truth of God is not what someone else told me. The truth of God is basically what God teaches me from His Word. Now, I can get teaching from other people, and I can listen to that, but I firmly am convinced that Christian people should never make anything a part of their living process until they've gone to the Word of God, and God has convinced them from His own Word, through the Spirit in their own life, that that's exactly what that Scripture is teaching.

Because if I don't, then I am acting upon what someone else has told me, and that's not what I'm supposed to do. I'm supposed to do as God leads me through His Spirit, according to His Word. I take your advice, and I take your counsel, and I take your direction.

But I must go to the Word of God to find out if that is what it's saying to me. And if it is, then I must react to that and do as God wants me to do. And then, of course, such a great life, in my own life, that I recognize and am convicted about, that the men and women that God has used through history have always been great people of prayer.

Reading the lives of men like George Whitefield, Peter Cartwright, people in North America, great men, Peter Cartwright said, I have laid prostrate before God on my face for three weeks. And that bloke, I could figure out all kinds of reasons why a man couldn't do that.

He's going to lay out there in the woods on his face praying for three weeks. First thing I thought about, what's the rush? Surely he has to go to the washroom. I don't know all kinds of reasons why. But then I began to read about his life.

I read one great man, he said, I know God has never put his hand of anointing power upon any man or woman who did not pray three hours a day. I'm sure. Then I went and tried to find one. Now, we're not talking about some big, some of the biggest Christians are the most proceeded Christians you will ever know.

Big, but deceitful. Activity does not make one spiritual, does it? We are active because we are doing those things that God wants us to do. And so we must have prayer dominating the life. And I find that if a person wants to give up something, they'll say, well, I won't give up prayer, but they'll give up studying God's Word.

One does not take place of the other. But if you had to give up one, you'd be better off giving up prayer than studying God's Word. Because God is more interested in using what he's got to say than He is in what you and I have to say.

But it's a balance, isn't it? Studying God's Word will drive one to prayer. And prayer will drive one to the study of God's Word. If God puts a person in your life for you to help, you cannot help that person without praying for them.

Impossible. You have to pray for that person because the forces of hell itself will be unleashed upon that person, keeping them blinded to the truth of God. And you and I have to pray for that individual.

And then we'll find that these people that God used have great concern, they have tremendous compassion, and they've cared. As I go back and look at early Christianity, and as you go back and study early Christianity, I'm amazed at the sensitivity that they had to each other.

And yet, even in our fellowship, again, I think we don't take time to each other. Years ago, you can go and read about the great meetings of the churches. You can read about the people. They spent time with each other.

They did faith together. They did visit with one another. And now fellowship, which actually means mutual burden-bearing, now means we don't have to beat. You don't have a fellowship. That means we don't have to punch and talk and kiss you.

There's nothing to do with fellowship forever if you don't understand the Word. The Word means mutual burden-bearing. I share with you the burden of my heart. You encourage me, exhort me, rebuke me, challenge me.

You can share with me the burden of your heart, and we two together, all of us, we shall go to the Lord in prayer, and we'll uplift one another and encourage one another. That's fellowship. Now, there's nothing wrong with having to punch and kiss each other for sin, but it really has nothing to do with fellowship because you can have all those things and never have fellowship.

Never have fellowship. And the one dying need of people today is to know that somebody cares, that somebody will listen. We know that in our country that one-third of all teenagers who die in our country commit suicide.

One-third of all teenage deaths are suicides. Major universities in our country now are teaching suicide as a valid alternative to living. There are actual classes being taught in some of our major universities in the United States that suicide, on actual terms, is a valid alternative to living.

And kids are patient. Why? Sure, because nobody cares. That's not true. Many people care. You care. I care. Many people care. They just don't know they care. They just don't know. Young couples. We live in the Dallas-Fort Worth area.

Dallas has now become the divorce capital of the United States. The divorce rate is higher there right now. So, because they're looking for people who will care, and by our caring and our compassion, then obviously we can take to the will of God for their lives.

God's Wisdom: Purity, Peaceableness, Gentleness, Mercy, and Good Fruits

Well, I made mention a few minutes ago, and then I want to give you a chance to perhaps make a comment or two or ask a question if you desire concerning something that we have shared in these moments together.

I want to give you six attributes of God's wisdom. As I said, I have probably been guiltier or more guilty than any person that I am aware of of not understanding that the accumulation of facts, that the accumulation of information is not God's wisdom.

It is not wisdom that God needs. And I'm convinced that many times in the ministry and many times in the body of Christ, Christian people, we gain information, we gather facts, which is necessary and it's commendable and it's good and it has to be done.

We gather this information, we put together these facts, and because we haven't saturated it in prayer, because our daily devotional life is not what it ought to be, and because our commitment is not all that it should be, and because our compassion has not grown to the point at where we'd be willing to give up a meal, or we've not grown to the point at where we'd be willing to sacrifice some recreational time, we've not grown to the point at where we'd be willing to make any sacrifice necessary to touch another life for our Lord.

Therefore, the caring attitude has not developed. So I rationalize all that away so that whenever they do come, or I do get a chance, I'll just pick up the phone and call them and I'll give them a couple of scriptures to read and tell them I'll be praying for them and that'll solve their problem.

And so therefore they flounder on the free of life. Six attributes, I believe, of God's wisdom. And these are so basic to you, but if you'll permit me just to share them. First of all, I believe that it is pure.

That means it is not contaminated by the world's philosophy or the world's ideas. You and I as Christians do not get our counsel from ungodly people. We do not get our advice from ungodly people. We get our counsel and our advice from Christian people.

There are people such as our brother who are in the business world who are Christian people who can give those things you and I need from a business perspective, but as a believer. We have other brothers and sisters.

Christian people who are in the business world who can give us advice in those areas that we need. Bible teachers, whatever, banking, whatever. But so many times Christians get their advice and their counsel for living from people who do not even know their God.

And if a person does not know Jesus Christ, their God is Satan. And Satan controls their life whether they recognize it or not. Jesus said so. He said so. Ye are your father the devil, and the lust of your father ye will do.

So we must have a pure wisdom. It must be uncontaminated by the world's philosophy and ideas. Secondly, it is to be a peaceable thing. Peaceable. It brings peace with God, and it brings peace with oneself.

And obviously if I have peace with God, if I have peace with myself, then I'll have peace with you. What does the scripture say? Pride bringeth forth contention. Whenever two believers in a fellowship cannot get along with one another, it's because of pride in one of their lives, and there's no exception to that.

Pride is the root behind every sin. Every sin, the root of it basically is pride. It's the sin that got Satan kicked out of heaven, that changed the angels from demons, that changed their abode from heaven to hell, that changed an existence of light to that of darkness.

Sin is premeditated, predetermined rebellion against God. Now that's awful. I like to think of it sort of a stumble. You know, I forgot, or I didn't mean to. Now I have different kinds. I don't know what kind you have.

I have white ones, and I have big ones. You know, sort of like that. You know, we have white lives, black lives, green lives, blue lives, fibs, stories, tales. And one's not as bad as the other. But yet when I put it all together, I find that I rationalize this way, and therefore I don't have peace with myself because I'm not at peace with the Lord.

Therefore I don't have peace with my fellow man. Pride brings forth compassion, and pride is the root of it all. But if we have this peace, then it will bring peace, and it will bring peace into the fellowship.

And then also, a very difficult thing for me, and I'm trying to learn this in my life, is that the wisdom of God is a gentle thing. It brings a gentleness into the life. I'm not talking about weakness, but a gentleness.

It is easy to be entreated, and it's approachable. It's understanding. It is warm and sincere. People have no difficulty. That's our shalom and faith. And when he speaks, he just says, Can I speak my heart to you?

And when he speaks, you know he's coming right from his heart. I mean, it's coming right out of his innermost being. When he shares, he's just wide open. This is just he. And you have no trouble. Other people I speak with, and I'm sure they have the same me, I don't feel like I've really talked to them.

You know, I feel like they're just up here. I walk away feeling kind of cool. You know, I don't really feel a meeting of the heart. I don't feel a real meeting of the spirit. I'm not talking, their spirit doesn't bear witness to my spirit.

And mine doesn't bear witness to theirs. It's just sort of been some kind of a conversation. Gentleness. It's entreated. It's approachable. It's also full of mercy. It's not critical. And it's not overbearing.

It's not critical. One of the great things that you and I have to deal with in our lives as Christians, before we can ever help other people, is criticism. Sex. No matter what problem they have. And we'll talk about this week.

Whether it's homosexuality. Whether it's lesbianism. Whether it's drug abuse. Remove that criticism and look at them as the Apostle Paul looked at them. It took a miracle of God to change a haughty Pharisee who walked the streets of Jerusalem into the flaming Apostle to the Gentiles.

But from the moment Paul met his Lord, he looked at people as people for whom Christ died. That's the way he looked at them. And he didn't see them with that criticism as he had seen before. He looked at people as Christ would look at them.

And that is a merciful look. It shows compassion. And then the wisdom of God is that wisdom that brings about in that life good fruits. Good fruits. Good works. Good acts. Good deeds. Whether it be the fruit of the Spirit.

Christian character. Fruit of the Spirit. Galatians 5. We're talking about the fruits of righteousness. Philippians. Romans. This will be our conduct in the winning of the people of the Lord, the converts.

All of these things in your life and mine will help people have confidence in you. And then, this is so hard, again. And I'm just sharing with you things that I'm gripping with in my own life. And that is without partiality.

God is a respectful person. He tragically treats his people many times harder. Many times harder. I've been a member of churches. Someone came of good stature. Had a great stature in the community. Maybe with a professional degree.

And things of that nature. So much is made of it. This brother is an attorney. He is the attorney general. This person is a doctor of law. This person is a medical doctor. And, oh, the pastor. Excuse me.

Pastor Brethren. They'll just make over that person. And then, here comes. In our area, we have a lot of seminary students. And most of the seminary students, you know, when I went through school. And most of us have gone through any kind of school.

You have very little. You're trying to get through school. And yet, they have very little. Well, so-and-so, so-and-so is coming in. It's just a small thing. Some widow lady comes. And there's so-and-so coming down with us.

And if they happen to come at the same time, you will see many times more is made over the one than the other. It's just so small. You know, I know it is. But it's done. Many, many times. And I remember, I mentioned this quickly in closing, that there was a meeting held some years back.

And there was an old man. And it's very rare that an old gentleman in his 80s, flowing white hair, came forward to trust the Lord. And the people were just so excited about it. They'd been praying for him for years.

And a little boy came down and stood beside him. He wanted to give his heart to the Lord. And the pastor dealt with the little boy. And the little boy sat over there. And one of the men came, and they prayed.

And the little boy asked the Lord to come to his heart. And so he stood back up. And the people just came by and said, Pastor, you know, just hugged that older gentleman and just loved him and so forth.

And the little boy just, he just said, Many of them walked right by him. Two weeks later, the older gentleman died. And that little boy was Dr. W .A. Criswell, pastor of First Baptist Church in Dallas, Texas, the largest Southern Baptist Church in the world.

And nobody said much to him, just the little boy. You see, we don't know who's standing there. And God doesn't deal with people that way. He wouldn't make a difference who he was. For he's seven or seven.

God looks at them with the eyes without partiality. And you and I must learn that secret. Tomorrow, you're patient people. You see, I like, my goal is this. I like to probe people. I like to deal with things that will help us and challenge us individually.

Because if we just deal with the professional aspects of counseling techniques and procedures as we move in some of these particular areas of how to set up an appointment. And as some of the pastors were saying, you know, how are we going to do this?

How do we set up these appointments? And how do we do these particular things? I want us to be aware that, you know, that some are not in these areas. And so I'm sensitive to this, and I want to give some things that will help us all.

And then, of course, we move into the areas of marital counseling. I want to talk to you about our own marriage relationships and move into some of these other particular areas. Concerning something that I've shared with you, something I've said that I should not have said or something that I said or didn't say and should have said, would you have a thought or a concern in that area or a question concerning something?

We'll take just a few moments and share that with you. We don't have to do anything until 7. Yes, ma 'am. Would I define ethics? Ethics, they say, the basic definition of ethics is my relationship to those around me.

And, of course, you and I, as believers, I would look at it on godly principles. And so to me, to deal with ethics, I deal with what is my response to them according to the principles that God has laid out before me using godly principles.

And so I base my relationship or response to other people in every avenue of life. If I don't, then I'm not so, when I say bad ethics, but other people look at me and they say he's a Christian, then he is violating a biblical principle.

But I also can violate a business principle, a business principle. If I have two fees and I trust somebody that has money, one fee, and if they don't have it, then I'll give them the lower one so I can keep them.

You know, there are fees that bounce. So integrity plays such an important part. And this is a field that integrity is so important. So important. Because there's so much room for misunderstanding. Exactly so.

And the problem with that, an additional problem, and that's exactly true, is the pastor is so limited. He doesn't have the time. And we were just talking about this last evening with Dr. Paul and John, and we were speaking, just saying that basically that the pastors are so limited that, and I know myself, that I got so out of balance when we first started taking people in years ago that that's all I did.

And I didn't realize that's all I was doing. I thought I was fulfilling the other thing, but I wasn't. And so he is so limited that consequently a lot of churches are bringing in people and putting them on staff who are capable, competent, and qualified to take over this area.

Not that the pastor would not do some, but it would relieve him of the burden of that and place someone in the community that can bring the people and have a counseling ministry through the body. And also it's such a great tool because anyone that is dealt with will have an allegiance to that fellowship.

They just will. The tragedy is if we don't send them to, and if there are no Christian psychologists or psychiatrists, then obviously they're going to turn somewhere. And Satan always has somebody available for them.

He always does. So I also believe this is why Christian people individually, that individual Christians in the fellowship can prepare themselves to a point as to where many of the difficulties that people face, that person is capable of handling those.

Only the severe cases, if you want to use that word, would have to come to a person and set up a series of sessions together. Many of their problems, if we can get by what they're saying, and go through, could be solved by the average Christian in the fellowship if we would just prepare ourselves.

And we'll talk about that. I think a person needs to know a little bit about anatomy. We need to know some of these things that can happen. Sometimes they need a physical. Sometimes some babies come to you with problems, sometimes they need a physical.

That's one of the things I ask them, have you got a physical? And sometimes they go get a physical and they've got a metabolism problem or they've got a blood problem. So we have to know there are three parts, body, soul, and spirit.

And either one of those can get out of balance, and they'll all affect the other. Each one affects the other. Get that scent out of your life, man, you'll be all right. That isn't really true. Two answers that I have had all my life, if I may say this, and this is the thing that started us moving in the area of trying to understand spiritual warfare and demonic problems, is I had the two answers, at least in our area, that every preacher knew well.

I was taught, well, if someone came to me, I had two answers. Go pray about it. Or, if you really wanted to, you couldn't. Until I found people who wept and cried and tried and couldn't. Their will was incapacitated.

And then I found people who tried to pray and couldn't. Could not repeat the name Jesus Christ no matter what he said. And I had no answers to them at that time. And God set up for that. So I feel like that, you know, Christian people can, and it's not very difficult to just, how can I say it, if most Christians would take, and as our brother's been telling us, to apply the time properly in the areas that we want to develop, instead of just reading everything we grab.