February 22, 2016 Show with Gregg Hodge on “Men Worth Following Are Men Who Follow Through: A Vision of True Manhood For Fathers To Pass On To Their Sons”

Live from the historic parsonage of 19th century gospel minister George Norcross in downtown

Carlisle, Pennsylvania, it's Iron Sharpens Iron, a radio

platform on which pastors, Christian scholars and theologians address the burning issues

facing the church and the world today.

Proverbs 27 verse 17 tells us, iron sharpens iron, so one

man sharpens another.

Matthew Henry said that in this passage, quote, we are cautioned to take heed whom we

converse with and directed to have in view in conversation to make one another

wiser and better.

It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next hour, and we hope to hear

from you, the listener, with your own questions.

Now here's our host, Chris Arntzen.

Good afternoon, Cumberland County,.

Pennsylvania, and the rest of humanity living on the planet Earth, who are listening via

live streaming.

This is Chris Arntzen, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron, wishing you all a happy Monday on this

22nd day of February 2016, and it is, by God's mercy

and grace, a gorgeous, breathtaking day here in Carlisle, Pennsylvania, the most

spring -like day that we've had in quite a while, and we have returning

to the program today as a guest, Greg Hodge of Princeton Revival,

and today we are going to be discussing men worth following are men who follow through,

a vision of true manhood for fathers to pass on to their sons.

We're also going to be delving more deeply into his book and his teaching concerts that

he and the Princeton Revival run all over the United States, and it's my honor.

And privilege to welcome you back to Iron Sharpens Iron, Greg Hodge.

Joy to be back with

you.

Yes,.

I'm just as ready to sharpen the old iron, and we have in studio

again joining me as a co -host, the Reverend Buzz Taylor, and it's great to

have you back behind the helm to co -host today, Buzz.

Thank you, and hello again, Greg.

Hello, Buzz.

Good to hear you again, brother.

Glad you're.

Having nice weather up there.

And one of the things I wanted to address even before we get into our subject at hand,

I want you to, because we forgot to do it last time, I want you to give

a review of the new movie that's out, Risen, and

I know that you actually have friendships with with some folks who are involved in the production of that

movie, but if you could tell us something.

About it.

Sure, of

course,

it's out

now.

I went to a screening

last week.

White, who used that

as a

piece,

called it a

great movie, and

he's kind

of, it's

a

great,

but I

found

the

characters compelling.

There's even humor in this.

I mean, it had

a very somber nature in the genre of that,

kind of highlight in the beauty of pride.

I found it to

be compelling.

I think it's one of the best made Christian movies I've ever seen.

Great, and so

this movie, although it is a fictional story, in your opinion, it is not.

Really conflicting or contradicting anything that is a biblical truth about the

resurrection.

Narrative?

No, you

know, when

we

look at,

so they're from,

you know, from

a fictional character standpoint, but the

historical recommending

it, he

began with, well,

filmmaking.

Some of the

shutter speeds, they're for

the lighting.

That, obviously, the fact you're highlighting

how

well

it does.

And I know that there is great debate amongst even

theologically minded brethren within the Reformed community who disagree whether one should

ever have an image of Christ in a film.

At

all.

Is Christ

actually depicted in

the film?

He is, and well done,

allow for it.

I do think the portrayal of Christ is one that is

in the background, if I can say it that way.

I think when he speaks,

it's either, but

recognizing and

seeing it's

unfair.

What

an

opportunity,

what a

glorious

opportunity

that

we sense.

And

I do think that there

are appropriate conversations.

So Greg, when you say Christ is not the central figure, is that sort of like, the only thing I can

relate to that is, is it like along the lines of Ben -Hur where, you know, you see his influence in

the people very well, but he's not really up front.

It's a perfect analogy, Buzz.

I think.

You certainly

don't want to downplay by following somebody

exactly with great

advance.

I'm

not

suggesting that we substitute the reading of the Word of God by watching films, but you know, I

did, when I went...

That's good, and I

don't want to belabor this topic

because that's not.

Really why we had you on today, but do you know anything about the faith or lack thereof of the people

who created the film?

I know that, for instance, when Mel Gibson created the Passion movie, his

extreme sect of Latin right Catholicism that he was

a part of, I don't know what affiliation he has with it now, but I know his father and other members of his family

were in a sect of Catholics that really

are of the more extreme nature of anti -Protestant.

They deny Vatican II's olive branch to Protestants and so on.

I actually think that they're, I think that they're in many ways more consistent with historic Romanism, but there

was some heretical or aberrant views that were clearly in the film

that Gibson created, especially regarding Mary and so on.

His movie was based largely on a vision of some woman

whose name escapes me right now, some Catholic visionary

or saint.

But anyway, I was just curious if there was anything that you noticed anyway that was of an

aberrant nature when it came to the depiction of biblical.

Subjects.

Yeah, I didn't notice anything.

I'm not saying that, I didn't

see anything that, you know, I didn't

have a check on it.

You know, it's such the, you

can see quite well the

other side

of

the

family.

Again, I didn't see anything for something, but that's not

my, that's not my, that's not my bag, baby.

I'm just, I'm much more about highlighting what's positive and

using that.

You know, it's, you know, the old Puritans used to call it redeeming something.

Don't you go hear bad preaching, I'm not,

don't you, and then

they go view it and

do likewise.

Right, I'm just thinking about like a really laughably ridiculous movie

about Christ that was made for television film on ABC years ago.

And after the scene where Jesus turns over the temples of the money changers in

the tables of the money changers in the temple, when he comes out of the temple, he's rebuked by one of

his disciples.

And Jesus actually said, yeah, no, I'm sorry, I really lost my head in there.

Are you kidding me?

But that kind of a thing.

And of course, I did, I did not see any of that.

And we had the obviously the horrifically heretical Noah movie.

Oh, wow.

Yeah, I didn't say you did.

He was on that set, who was a

legitimate believer and was excited about the potential of that film.

But anybody who was on the, you want to give you want to tip your

head, clearly, they're all

good, accurate opinion.

I think it had an agenda, the

person's

imagined.

Well, I am planning to see that movie this week, God willing, and I will let you know

my thoughts after I see it.

And perhaps we could get an interview with your friends who are involved in some fashion with

the film.

Yeah, sure.

And so today, we're actually talking about men worth

following are men who follow through a vision of true manhood for fathers to pass on to their sons.

And if anybody would like to join us on the air with a question, our email address is chris arnzen, at gmail .com, c h r i

s a r n z e n at gmail .com.

And please give us your first name, at least your city and state and your country of residence,

if you live outside of the USA.

And so if you could tell us where this concept of

following through came from,.

And exactly what do you mean by it?

Well, one of the

offerings and even

beyond that, I could say,.

And if and maybe this would be a good time to describe the band because people who missed your first

interview will know nothing about what you're speaking.

Yeah, sure.

About a year ago, I got

and we prayed about forming a men's ministry that involved

music and teaching.

That's

solid -ground

-books .com.

That's solid -ground -books .com.

Unearthing treasures for the Christian community.

That's right.

But

it is,

I

evolve

that, and so

Princeton

Revival, we

don't

even,

we don't

think, I get into some of this in the book,

you know, there are reasons why we don't get into the Bible, and Satan has been

massing the Word, but the Word is that which

will bring revival when attended by the Spirit of God.

And so I think I

put together a teaching concert to kind of step

people through the Bible of contents, and so

with that, we are

trying to offer an

event

called,

it's based on Timothy 4 -7, and if

you just, it's an easy pick up where Paul says, I have fought the good fight, I've

run the race, and now

I've remained as men by the grace of God.

Yeah, the problem with a lot of men is that

while trying to do the right thing for their families, in fact,

a commanded thing, that they work and provide for their families, some men

get so caught up in the anxiety of how much their

next paycheck is going to be, and whether or not they get promoted to that sought

-after position that they've been longing for for years, or the fear of getting fired, and all these other

things that are combined into the very typical mindset of a

working man who is filled with anxiety.

Very often, the very children and the wife that he is seeking to

provide for get neglected horribly, and sometimes even to the point where a man should be

under church discipline for something, but if you could comment on that.

Sure, yeah.

Well, this also comes out of the

consequence, if

minding

your faith is the call to get in,

and thereby, at

least, so what

does it look like?

What I'm not doing is a list of don'ts for men.

What I am trying to say is that the Lord is

active through his word, and the means of his word.

I

wrote a 15 -phrase statement, Chris,

that I taught to my own son, and that is the thesis of this book,

and we had quite a little ceremony,

that men study

with guys my

age to say,

what a

real change,

and I'm,

and I pay an appropriate amount of time as a leisure, you know, as a

breakaway to recharge, I suppose, it's not my own thing, but I'm not going to down that, but like

anything, the

next

book and also this event.

Yeah, perhaps you could even go through some.

Qualities of Christian manhood that may not be as obvious

to men and women as we think that they are.

Sometimes you have this machismo

understanding of masculinity that not only can be a

ridiculous goal for a man to even attempt to achieve, but maybe even

a sinful way of living, you know, very often the

character traits of a macho movie hero are one of,

ones that include promiscuity, lack of commitment to

a wife, or he's not a one -woman man,

a man who looks upon those who pray

and find strength in God as weak, even in some of the old

movies, some of the old westerns, you know, you'll have the guy who's the hero of the film

saying things like, well, I'm not much of a praying man, you know, we're supposed to look upon

that as a great noble trait, because he is so strong and confident

and fearless, he doesn't need to be a praying man in his mind.

But if you could just go on with a list, if you could, doesn't have to be exhaustive, but

some traits that men should be seeking to acquire from a biblical point of view.

In fact, if you could start doing that when we return from the break, because we're going to a break right now.

Great.

And once again, if you'd like to join us on the air with a question of your own, for Greg, our email

address is chrisarnsen at gmail .com, c -h -r -i -s -a -r -n -z -e -n at gmail

.com, and we'll be right back after these messages with Greg Hodge of

Princeton Revival, and my co -host, Reverend Buzz Taylor.

Don't go away, we're going to be.

Right back.

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Go to solid -ground -books .com, solid -ground -books .com, and

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And our email address, if you'd like to join us on the air with a question of your own is chrisarnson at gmail .com.

And we were talking about, before the break, I was asking you to give us some

traits of biblical masculinity that our listeners should want

to embrace if they are men or boys growing up to be

men, and for those traits that are desired to be passed on to

the children who are the men of our future.

Well,

I, a man

worth following,

acknowledge

that.

So let me

read the

statement

and then, you know, we can, as

a matter of fact, I'll email it to you.

But I do think it could yield some great,

the best distillation of what I think gets us underway in the pursuit

to glorify God,

assess ourselves by our conformity to the image of the Son, and

engage ourselves,

rejecting past,

become men worth following as we follow Jesus the Christ.

There's a lot in there.

Yeah.

Amen.

Well, why don't you start with the notion of enjoying

God?

And by the way, you sent me an email, but I could not open it.

Oh, right.

Okay.

Well, that's that statement there.

But I had also

sent some lyrics and I will

definitely play it on WeTransfer.

And I can set that song up a little bit, but it's about a guy worth following.

You know, I do, in the book, in both these books and ahead of everything,

I just, I

agree

with

the old discussion about

the fact that God

is the one

thing.

And I tend to lean myself, Piper's intro,

the primary way.

One of the things is that we can

make the connection between everything that

He is the

Creator, that enjoyment in that.

And I want

to say

to him, look, you're not

here for those.

To one thing.

And I think that

guys miss this.

They think that God is to be open.

I love Baxter's way of

complaining about all the tools that he has, and the student doesn't complain about all the books that he has to

read.

Why?

Because you get to read those things.

You get to own those tools.

And so that you can do, you know, fulfill your calling to the greatest degree with joy and

skill.

I think for us to complain about the way that God commands us to do so,

Baxter says they're not only your duties, they're mercy.

What he's pointing to is the reality that this is the best way you.

Could ever live.

When you say we get to live this way, you mean we have the great opportunity and.

Privilege to live this way?

Exactly.

Yeah, exactly.

I mean, you've got the qualifiers in there that we need to put

in.

This doesn't happen.

We don't even

desire to do it.

I want to find it beautiful and find it joyous.

A conversation with a friend of mine who's a lawyer here in town.

I've known him for so many years.

You know, after decades of living and seeking to live as a Christian,

you begin to see I have banked my whole life on

Scripture.

I've done it horribly.

I've drifted away.

I've come back, blah, blah, blah.

But as God's son, and he's persevering in me, my goal, my

heart longs to live out his will.

And when you

get 30,

most

men, they're not thinking that.

And if they are, they're thinking about their own fulfillment and gratification, which is a piece

of it.

But that, again, I think is

the Bible.

The way we print it, we'll print it in the book.

We exist to glorify God by enjoying him forever.

Amen.

And

obviously,.

Those of us, or those of our listeners who have the shorter catechism, the Westminster Shorter

Catechism, know that that actually is a part of the questions

of discipleship.

The very first, in fact, is what is the chief end of man, and it's to glorify God and to enjoy him

forever.

And that is something that people may look upon with puzzlement.

How can you enjoy following Christ being a quote -unquote born

-again Christian?

But it's all about giving up stuff, isn't it?

How can you enjoy that forever?

That seems to me pretty boring, and it seems like I'm being robbed of freedom to love

life and enjoy it and have fun.

But that is not true, is it?

I mean, obviously, when you come to Christ, there are many things that you

should cut off, like a cancerous tumor, because you shouldn't, with a new

heart, even love them anymore.

But beyond that, there are things that God has given all men to enjoy as well that we.

Need not stop enjoying as Christians.

Absolutely, brother.

I think that's part of what I'm saying in the front part of minding your faith, is

that they follow a God.

I'm really

not a great golfer,

but I've winded

you up.

So I have to get some

lessons.

A hobby might

be, importantly.

But the reality is, as we open ourselves up to each other, that's where the enjoyment is.

It's a geek

in my own

language.

But

the

lyrics of this

is exactly this.

Scripture is what we're calling minding your faith.

It's putting this...

So that's a great...

If nobody...

When we started this, and I did it up here, we spent a number of weeks

just...

You don't want to put...

Incredible

sense of

rest

and

relief.

You were talking

earlier

about...

And yet that is the height of folly and betrays an absolute misunderstanding of the gospel and God.

Who wants to wake

up?

Who wants to wake up and

continue to argue with a

wife or misuse a wife or to abuse a child in any way?

Or who wants to go to work and be lazy and not feel contributing?

Who wants that?

Nobody wants that.

The Christian will be really is the best.

Via

Mick

Jagger,

of

course.

I do think the

song

signals

something that

I think every man, to the degree that we are not living in God's will,

and how do I quiet this?

How do I suppress teen

hobbies?

Am I right?

You can golf.

Guys could get more excited about their fantasy football league.

Again, I'm not

downing that.

We can

have...

I almost want to say

often we can just substitute on

what would really satisfy you.

And the fear of God grants

me repentance and a dependence on God to live and

to cease my activities.

I don't have to look beyond what scripture says.

I just want to concern myself with knowing the Lord.

I'm going to...

Go ahead.

I'm sorry.

Well, I was just going to say, I know, you know, Buzz, why don't you speak to your vision?

Oh, yes, yes, of course.

Yes, I was wondering what legacy you've passed on to your sons other than very bad habits.

But before we do that, before we have Buzz enlighten us with his pearls of wisdom, I was

going to try to play one of your songs here, Specificity, and

let's see what the Lord has in store as I make...

Well, I think... I'm going to interrupt.

You, brother, sorry to interrupt.

Yeah, sure.

If you press play on that, you'll just get lyrics.

Okay.

Specificity, I think I have

tragically

died

again.

Amen.

And so there's...

So that song,

One Day.

Amen.

And if you've got that, that's a

song that's been down the

street, but the more I'm realizing, comfort to many.

Well, ladies and gentlemen, brothers and sisters, when I see you again by the Princeton Revival,.

And I'm not hearing...

It's a very quiet song.

For some reason, that's not playing, and I can't tell you why, brother.

It's a tacit.

But perhaps at some point, we will be able to return to...

Oh, wait a minute, let's see.

No, I'm a technical logical ignoramus, so this is

not that easy to do here for me anyway.

It's probably very easy for most people in this business, but not me.

About the time I get used to it, they change the technology.

Exactly, yes.

But you were going to Buzz before.

Buzz, you are a father.

You have sons that you long to see really trust in Christ

through all affliction and all the trials and tribulations that they face,

and to glorify him in good times and bad.

One of the things that I'm sure is difficult is that they are no

longer under your roof, and now you...

No, no, they're quite spread out, as a matter of fact.

And if you could, just what, as an ordained minister and a father,

what have you sought to do to remain a godly influence in their lives?

Well, of course, obviously I've always wanted my children to understand the scriptures and to walk in

obedience to Christ, but I have to admit that in many ways I

was coming into a lot of certain knowledge myself as I was raising them, and I can tell you this, time does

not wait.

It's like, okay, hey, now I've...

Listen, guys, you got to catch...

Oh, wait, where'd they go?

You know, but one of the things I've just recently told

all my...

When you say my sons, I have four daughters and two sons, okay?

So I'm going to include my daughters into this.

But I recently, in communication with them,

let them all know that, you know, I quoted, I can't remember if it was 2nd or 3rd John,

you know, that my greatest joy is to know that my children, you know, are walking in

truth.

And I have a tough challenge in my life with my children, especially

because I did go through a divorce.

And, you know, I was very much concerned about how was this going to

be affecting my children, because I didn't want the divorce.

And one of the reasons I didn't want it was because of the fact that, you know, I didn't want that negative effect on

my children.

But I have learned since then, and we're now over a decade

beyond this, that I am amazed just how...

Grace is amazing, because the small time I had with

them to impart the things of Scripture, to impart godly life,

they caught a lot of it.

And, you know, I was kind of thinking, well, I'm sure by now they're losing it all because, you know, of this extenuating

circumstance in our family.

But they catch it.

And that is merely the of God, really, because things were

very badly sidetracked.

But it is a joy when I talk to them on the phone, and they ask scriptural questions,

and they know that life is to be patterned after Scripture.

It's just tremendous.

I probably shouldn't be reading your book, but like I said, I want to tell the men out there, don't

wait too long, because time does not.

And if you want to impart something to your children, you don't have long.

And one of the things that I've noticed, the only daughter of yours that I've met, Tiffany,

she certainly has a diligence and a zeal to

find the right man of God.

She's fussy in a good way, not accepting any man that

she's introduced to, to even date.

Yeah, that's been a joy.

And not only...

Even if the man is stunningly handsome and has a good job, she seems to be very

concerned about the person's faith and what they believe doctrinally and theologically.

She really shocked me one time, because she is very picky about

boyfriends and all that, and she does not go for mere recreational dating.

And if a guy isn't a potential, he's not going to last long with her.

But here she is being very careful about who's the man that

God is going to lead her to.

And then we went out to eat one night, and she tips the waiter really big.

And I'm like, what are you doing?

Oh, he was hot.

Tiffany.

But yet, it's a joy, because she understands that even because of

doctrinal differences, most young people, especially when they're in love, it's already too

late to talk any sense into them once they're in love.

I'm sure Tiffany, wherever she is,.

If she's listening, is delighted that you shared that story.

Yeah, I'm sure of that.

Oh, listen, I already had my spell about that with her once before, because

I spent some time in radio, and people down here in the

Carlisle area knew her, but they didn't know my other daughters.

And one of my other daughters got engaged.

And when I was on the air, my co -host asked me, anything interesting happen in your life last night?

I said, oh, yeah, my daughter got engaged.

And everybody's going up to Tiffany saying, oh, that's wonderful.

About time.

That's good news.

I'm like, what?

Well, your dad just announced it on the radio.

It's like, he what?

And I had to get back on and say, hey, no, no,.

No, no, it wasn't her.

Well, we have to go to a break right now.

And by the way, Greg, if you want to email me a much more simpler

method of playing your song that you want to be to play, for some reason, I cannot play

this link that you sent.

But anyway, we're going to be going to a break right now.

And if you'd like to join us on the air with a question of your own, our email address is chrisarnson at gmail dot com,

chrisarnson at gmail dot com.

And please include your first name, city and state and country of residence if you live outside the USA.

Don't go away.

We'll be right back with Greg Hodge of Princeton Revival.

I'm James White of Alpha Omega Ministries.

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Welcome back.

This is Chris Arns, and if you just tuned us in, our guest today is Greg Hodge of Princeton Revival, a

ministry and a band, and we have in the studio once again our co -host Buzz

Taylor, the Reverend Buzz Taylor, and if you'd like to join us on the air with a question of your own, our email

address is chrisarnson at gmail .com, chrisarnson at gmail

.com.

We have an anonymous listener who writes, uh, my wife

says that she will begin submitting to me when I begin leading like a biblical and

godly husband, and it gets very frustrating because I am trying my best, and she has been a believer

longer than I have.

Please give me some much -needed advice.

So, Greg, you got any advice.

For

this

individual?

Well,

there's

your

obedience

system,

and then this

time

I'm not doing

that.

They

naturally

want to

follow

that.

They

want to

believe

it.

I remind him, remind her,

in

the

development

of untraining

to

love

the wife,

uh,

sanctifying and unbreakable love.

Spend some time praying and meditating about that.

Why is this important?

Why do you think the Lord wants us to love our wives?

Why, why should we do it?

Uh, and then that'll motivate you to get to the how.

How do I do this with my wife?

You gotta know how to care for your wife personally.

And what her love language is, and those kinds of things.

And to, you know,

keep that in front of you.

And, and then, uh, and the why.

And you begin to think about how that might look, particularly in your marriage, at

this.

Say, when am I going to do

this?

Teach them all that

the way, because that's the first step of any act of

repenting, brother, if

you're patient.

Only caveat

to that, as I've

seen, I'm sure,

Buzz, uh, I think we also need

to, uh, somewhat define terms here,.

Uh, because what I'm hearing in this situation is something that I have run across many, many times

in dealing with men.

Um, what, what do they mean by, I wish he would lead.

Um, there are many men who are intimidated, uh, by their, their wives because,

uh, the wives take this, the stance that they are more spiritual than the man anyway.

And, uh, I've been in a Bible study where the woman actually in front of her husband said to the whole group in the room there, you know, well,

I'm more spiritual than my husband.

And, you know, I have to remember, you know, and I'm thinking, well, how does she know that by, by what standard is she more

spiritual?

Um, does she mean more obedient or what?

And, uh, what I have found out in many cases is that, uh, the

women aren't trying to make us better Christians.

They're trying to make us women.

And, uh, I, I, you know, I've had this conversation many times that we are not, my

relationship with Christ is not going to look like a woman's relationship to Christ simply by the fact that

I'm a man.

And, uh, Christ did not tell men that if you love me, have these warm fuzzies.

He said, keep my commandments, feed my sheep.

You know, uh, I have very good friends, uh, that, that are male

friends.

And a lot of it is because we don't talk about it.

It just is, you know?

Um, and, and I think the women need to understand that, that men are different from women.

They're, they're wired different.

They communicate differently and are they actually leading, but they're not getting it.

Yeah.

It brings up a great discussion about what is male leadership and, uh,

and, and probably a

treatment of it.

Yes.

You're talking about that fat blue book.

Yeah.

Now it's a bit intimidating.

So you might grab a three chapters of that book, which

is a little more

digestible masculinity and femininity, but there's a wonderful, those first opening

chapters are, are just a great reflection, biblically understanding the kinds of things that you're talking about.

Chris, you have to understand, you know, I, I've

heard guys, you know, uh,

they're both sides of this.

And I fully agree with you and that we need to address because

I, I, again, I totally agree with you.

I'm not a spouse from a wife, uh,

because our genders are different and they're complimentary in nature.

I, my wife, uh, the way a woman would do

them.

And, uh, his friend, Mark Mann says, uh, he has people in the church say, well, Mark,

you need to get in touch with your feminine side.

He says, well, I put my arm around Barbara and say, there, I just did.

Yes.

We need, and this is it, you know, we need, when you read the text of scripture, you, you,

again, coming back, we need men who mind their faith.

If you're in the word of God and the spirit is communicating truth to your soul, you can't miss the fact that we're to

be sensitive and caring.

We're to be the tender warrior.

Uh, we, we are to be the island of

like, uh, and that's done with grace though.

I don't see, uh, I don't see them bag and test them,

you know, having the fuzzies.

I, I don't listen to, I, I mean, I'm sure

all three of us, uh, you

can't even

speak to go back to the

garden, you know, I felt responsible for the teaching

and to deal with the understand this all

obedient begin from the mind.

And I think that that's the male role.

It's the breaking down the vision.

God is going to hold men accountable to understand,

understand, like you said, Chris, define it.

That world mess right now.

We're vague and vote.

By the way.

I was just curious.

Uh, does your wife ever scream out from across the room to you?

Hey, expert on manhood, take out the garbage already.

Well, yeah.

Uh, something like that.

That was so typically Chris.

Uh, I just don't, I always liked it.

Watch.

You could hear my SOS

melt

away at the second when, uh,

part of what your children, I know

that I can't do this.

Your dad makes

mistakes.

I'm

doing my children to be that guy

who never messes up.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Uh, so when I do mess up, which is the inevitable piece of this, of this life, when

I do, um, but

I, I would say to

me, you know,

you're

not, you know, certain guys aren't strong enough or certain personalities aren't this or that.

And I've said, look, my pastor told me, my mentor told man

clearly is to have the last word in the home.

And that's the way it is in my home.

Yes, dear.

Which, you know, you

know, I think there is a sense in which we ought

to out.

I don't know

if you're aware of him that

I reflect on regularly.

It's, uh, it's a little article called, um, when does a book

called

masculinity

and he has these traits, these are marks.

I mean, when I was thinking when you were asking earlier, Chris, can we delineate or

can we enumerate some,

uh, albertmuller .com.

What you're saying reminds me of, uh, first Corinthians 13, 11, the apostle

Paul, uh, stating that when I was a child, I used to speak as a child, think like a child,

reason like a child.

When I became a man, I did away with childish things.

And I think that that is probably one of the hardest things for men to

overcome most men anyway.

And the cause of lots of, uh, derision in the home and, and

arguments and all kinds of things.

Um, I mean, I've been hearing some tragic stories of a father,

uh, a grown man, uh, in his sixties who, uh, you know, gives

his own children, uh, who are separated by great distance from him, the

silent treatment and has like disowned them practically for months because of

the way he feels he's been treated.

And during arguments and just, uh, just utterly amazing the, the childishness

and the selfishness and the narcissism of this adult person.

Uh, that's don't you think that's one of the things that, uh, one of the things that

men very frequently often mistake as a sign of manhood is always being right and

demanding to have our way and all that, but that's really childish, isn't it?

Well, absolutely.

And

there's so

many ways.

I would also, and

there's, I think

there's a way,

and I think we're very

encouraged and

prayers.

I certainly have, but I don't see

that.

Yes.

Yes.

And, and, you know, um, I think there's also, uh, I'll give you a couple scenarios along those

lines that come to my mind.

Uh, I don't remember if it was with you or with another guest, but, uh, recently I was sharing about the fact that

there's a number of us that meet every Saturday morning.

Um, we are called the Back Porch Bible Institute.

And, uh, and we, we should be reached.

Our brand new, uh, as of yet very much under construction, um, website

is a backyard Bible, a back porch Bible, excuse me, back porch Bible .com.

Uh, and, uh, but, uh, we've been meeting, some of us have been meeting for years and,

uh, that has been a very meaningful time to where my schedule has been totally changed

around that.

And we have others joining us now and things are happening naturally there that,

uh, churches have tried to do and have not been able.

To duplicate it because they're trying too hard.

And they're actually on an FBI watch list for.

Some reason.

I won't even get into that part of it, but, uh, anyway, it all started

with the uniforms that they started wearing.

I'm sorry.

But, um, I mean, there's this, this camaraderie that's approaching, but then, you know, I think about it as opposed to, for example, uh,

uh, a program in a church to try to do the same thing, the good old monthly

men's breakfast, where you get together, the men start talking before you really get into anything deep, it's time to stop and

listen to the missionary speaker.

We don't get together.

We've got busy.

Lives.

And, um, but you're saying it's important for men to have times of fraternal

fellowship.

Well, all we did this, this whole, the whole purpose of our getting together on Saturday mornings was just to, we read books,

we talk about what we've read.

And like I said, I, I, I really, um, wish you didn't steal the title iron

sharpens iron, because that's what I wanted to use for our group, because that's, what's been happening.

Iron has been sharpening iron and all of a sudden the iron's getting sharp, you know, uh, it's, it's, it's

become a lot more meaningful over the years.

And, uh, even over the past few weeks, as a matter of fact, and, and it's just, it's a natural thing that's happening because we are

getting together and we are talking about scriptural issues from the scriptures and real life

without the burden of, gee, I can't say that here because I don't want them to know.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I totally resonate.

With the

kinds of

training

that we can't

deny.

There's

a place for more formal learning, a body of

content.

My guys meet first hour,

I'll script your

memory.

There's no kumbaya thing.

There's no, there's no prayer

with, and I'm not necessarily, um,

somebody said that wherever ritual is prevalent,

grace is probably diminishing.

Um, brief, uh, but

intense, the next prayer or a text or

my thesis on, on the book.

And then I, I, I'm quiet because I know I put the nugget out there,

but not

before this

good fellowship.

Right.

Yeah.

Well, we're going to be

going to

our final break.

And when we return, hopefully we're going to be actually playing the song we promised to play when I

see you again.

And, uh, I think that I see a familiar, uh, file that I can play without

having a brain aneurysm, trying to figure out what to do.

And, uh, we're going to be going to our final break and this is your last opportunity to email us at

chrisarnsen at gmail .com.

Chrisarnsen at gmail .com.

Don't go away.

We're going to be right back with Greg Hodge of the Princeton Revival.

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Welcome back.

This is Chris Zarnes,.

And if you just tuned us in for the last 90 minutes, we've had Greg Hodge on the program who is

actually related by blood to the great Charles Hodge,

one of the Princeton divines of the 19th century, and we have been discussing

passing on visions of biblical manhood from father to son, and we've also been

discussing his ministry slash musical group,

just like the old Saturday Night Live skit, Shimmer.

Is it a floor wax or a dessert topping?

Well, we have a ministry that's also a musical group called Princeton

Revival, and we're going to play, God willing, a song, When I See You Again,

and I know you set it up before in the first hour of the program when we

unsuccessfully tried to play the song, but if you want to say a

few words before we play this again, Greg, before we try to play this.

Again.

Sure,

Chris, and

thanks for playing

it.

It is

Until, or

should I say, When I See You Again.

By Princeton

Revival.

I wish you could laugh

with

me, make me

strong.

I suppose all heaven can see,

but you're now half the

person that we used to be, and I still

can't believe it.

Are you really gone?

Now I've got to find a way

to get by without you day by day,

so I'll keep praying every face the

pain this all behind us.

When I see,

start making,

when I see,

when

I see.

Amen.

That

was When

I

See

You Again by Princeton Revival,.

And if you just tuned us in, Greg Hodge is on the program today, has been for

over 90 minutes now, and that is his song for a

brother in Christ who has departed from this earth and who, Greg,

longs to see again the other side of glory, and I plan on sharing that song with some of my

own friends who have lost spouses and loved ones very recently, in fact.

One in mind that immediately comes in mind, my friend Al Stein, who

used to be on this program quite frequently in the old Iron Sharpens Iron when I was broadcasting out of

WNYG and WGBB in Long Island, New York.

Al Stein was an Assembly of God pastor there locally, and

in fact an overseer in his denomination, and he was a very unique

individual.

He believed firmly and solidly and enthusiastically and zealously in the

doctrines of sovereign grace, which was not a typical thing in his denomination,

and was quite a, not only a brilliant man, but

also a very kind and compassionate and humble man, a true heart of a shepherd.

He is dearly missed.

He was killed in a car accident in January of

2015, and right within

the first week of January on an icy road in upstate New York,

but he is dearly missed, and I'm sure his family would appreciate that song.

And my dear sister in Christ, Jackie, who is in Minnesota, whose husband just passed away about

three weeks ago, I'll share that with her as well.

Thank you for that song, Greg.

You're

welcome,

brother.

Thanks

for

playing

that,

brother.

Yeah, as you just stated, the primary reason for us

going to heaven is not to be reunited with departed loved ones, but it is obviously

an important blessing, and that's why the Apostle Paul was using the very fact to

comfort the church in Thessalonica as one of the primary.

Things he was comforting them with.

Yeah, the

power of God,

as we talk about it, anybody

can

do

that,

and that's

what we need.

That's

okay.

We do have a listener in Cumberland County, RB, who says,

I am very opposed to the modern pop psychology that began to

contaminate evangelicalism decades ago with the self -esteem movement.

However, are we not as Christians to find within the

character traits and other things about us that God has

put within us, are we not to be grateful to them and find blessings

in those traits and things about us that might be otherwise looked

upon as a disability or something that is a

negative, but in reality, we can use it for something very positive to the glory of God?

Absolutely.

Boy, I love that comment.

I don't know.

It's just initials RB.

Okay.

Well,

I

love

that.

We're going to

be judging

Amy.

We'll call

her

name, but she has written a book dealing with this very topic

called The Dilemma of Self -Esteem.

Yeah, we have nothing that's lovable within ourselves innately that would make us deserving of

heaven, but God does love things about us that we

often focus upon in a negative way and become.

Involved in a pity party and so on.

Exactly, and I think there's so much

in

there.

You guys need to

get

practice.

You know, with

self -being

and our

personal,

let's re -agree that

are showing him.

I think

it's fine to enjoy that.

Anyway, I think that book is great.

Yeah, I think that's something.

At least she says a lot better than I just did.

That's the way I feel about a lot of people.

How do they word it so nicely?

And I think that people, when it comes to the whole self -esteem movement, and they

use words like, you know, pride, we should be proud of our

race and all that kind of a thing.

I think what they're doing is they're mistaken.

It can be a matter of poor word usage, and of course it can be also

the endorsement of sin, if you're actually talking about pride, because you're not supposed to boast in anything about the cross of Christ.

But there's a difference between pride and being unashamed.

We're not supposed to be—an African -American should not be ashamed of being black.

The only thing that we should be ashamed about is our sin.

But there's also something to celebrate, in that God is redeeming us, God is

pleasuring us, and that's to be celebrated.

That's not to us on the floor.

Too much

celebration,

amen.

You know, the Apostle Paul summed it up so well, really, when he said, you know,

don't think more of yourselves than you ought to, but think soberly.

I don't know if I just quoted King James or what, but anyway, you know, and he said,

you know, to the Corinthians, I believe it was, what do you have that you have not

received?

If you have not received—if you have received it, why do you act as if you have not received it?

And, you know, it's unfortunate, going back to that email,

the pendulum so often swings the other direction so far.

And, you know, so you go away from the self -esteem movement, and then you get into this other

really raunchy thing, like, woe is me.

But we cannot deny the fact that God has worked in us.

It's been grace, but his grace has been at work.

And, you know, quite often, I find, I don't know, you probably discovered this too, in

discussions with some individuals, they try to make you sound like you're somehow very

boastful because you've studied the Word, and you actually know something, and, well, who do you think you are?

Yeah, yeah, there's an, um, I think that's an

insecurity, or maybe a prick in the lore.

You know, I mean, we get it right for a few seconds, and then we usually slip off one side of the other.

Again, it points me back to

collectivism.

If I'm certain we've

all done that, I

find that in

the body of Christian men,

balance can be achieved.

You know, you're

not there.

Yes, yes.

And the time we have left, I want you to really unburden your heart so our listeners have what you most want

etched in their hearts and minds before we leave the program, and also let them know how they should go

about booking the Princeton Revival, what booking the Princeton.

Revival would

entail, and that

kind of a thing.

If you, you can go

to, or you

can go

to,

from me coming

in

and

speaking

on the

book.

And

give us

all of

your

contact

information,

the

websites,

the email addresses, and

so on.

Sure, it's greghodge

.com.

And I just

remembered, or should I.

Say, just came up with a good way for people to remember how to spell your first name.

Greg gives glory to God.

There you go.

Amen.

Three G's there, right?

Amen.

Thank you, brother.

I appreciate it.

And one of the things that in all of this

testosterone -driven discussion today, we have

to remember as men that, especially the husbands out

there, that the calling to love your wife as Christ

loved the church is something that you're never going to fully

attain on this earth, but it's something that you should be striving to do.

And that involves a lot of patience and forgiveness towards the spouse that God

has given you.

And wouldn't you say that that is, if people were to recognize,

if men were to recognize, how much they have been forgiven themselves by God, and how patient God has

been with us, that would be the prevention of a lot of

disputes, arguments, separations, and divorces in this.

World, wouldn't

it?

I certainly

agree,

brother.

Well, it's been such a

great pleasure to having.

You back on the program.

I look forward to having you back when the album is out, and we'll be able to play some more

music of yours on the show.

And I want to also remind our listeners of your website.

It's greghodge .com.

Am I right with that?

It's .com, right?

Yes, it is.

It's greghodge .com, and that's G -R -E -G -G, two G's,

greghodge .com.

And I want everybody to know that tomorrow we've got two guests that I'm really excited about for the

first time ever on Iron Sherpa's Iron.

Michael Kruger, president of Reformed Baptist Theological Seminary in Charlotte,

North Carolina, is going to be on for our first hour talking about the canon of scripture.

And then Richard Barcelos, very well known in Reformed Baptist circles, is going to be on.

Actually, Richard was on the program many years ago on the old program.

He was involved in a debate on our program, but this is the first time he's on the all -new Iron Sherpa's Iron.

So mark your calendars for tomorrow, 4 to 6 p .m.

Thank you so much, Buzz Taylor, for being on the broadcast.

My pleasure.

And Buzz's website is backporchbible

.com.

And hopefully by the time you look up that website, the FBI will not have shut him down.

I just want to thank everybody who listened, especially those who took the time to write in questions.

I want you all to always remember for the rest of your lives that Jesus Christ is a far greater savior than

you are a sinner.

We look forward to hearing from you and your own questions for our guests tomorrow on Iron Sherpa's Iron Radio.