MSL: April 5, 2024

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The following program is recorded content created by The Truth Network. It's Matt Slick Live!

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Matt is the founder and president of the Christian Apologetics Research Ministry, found online at karm .org.

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When you have questions about Bible doctrines, turn to Matt Slick Live for answers, taking your calls, and responding to your questions at 877 -207 -2276.

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Here's Matt Slick. Hey everybody, welcome to the show. It's me, Matt Slick, and your listener, Matt Slick Live.

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If you want to give me a call, all you have to do, as usual, is just dial 877 -207 -2276.

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We have nobody waiting right now. So hopefully, you'll want to give me a call. That's easy peasy.

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And if you want to email me a question or a comment, that is just as easy. All you have to do is direct your email to info at karm .org.

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Info at karm .org, and you can just check it out.

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I'm looking, why is that not working? There we go. I'm trying to do something here. Oh, that's weird and interesting. Lately, just having some interesting odds and ends happening in different contexts and different things.

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Maybe I should start praying for technology and stuff. That's all right. So, if you want to email me, like I said, just radio comment, radio question, that's all you've got to do, and we can get your stuff.

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All right. I'm trying to do stuff here and get this to work. There we go. Now, look at that. Look at this. Look at this.

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It's weird. Oh, man. I'm going to just do something here.

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Wow. So, for those of you who are watching online, wow, we'll figure it out.

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All right. Let's just get to Tricia from Virginia. Tricia, welcome. You're on the air.

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Can you hear me okay? Yes, I can. Yes, I can. I can hear you fine. What do you got? So, I am a

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Christian. All right. And I wanted to get your take on cremation. Yeah, cremation.

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It's not a problem at all. People can get cremated if they want to get cremated. That's okay. The Lord is not going to be restricted by or surprised by, you know, an issue of us getting cremated.

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It's not a problem. Okay. All right. I didn't know if there was anything actually in the Bible. I did not think there was that said, no, you should not.

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No, people die in fires. They die in different ways. And God is certainly able to reconstruct the molecules, do whatever you want to call it, however you want to say it, that God can do in order to bring about what he desires.

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So it's not an issue. All right. Cremation is certainly within the biblical realm. And it's not sinful.

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Nothing in the Bible says we should not get cremated at all. Okay. May I ask one other question?

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Sure. Yeah, please do. And your take on, I guess, suicide.

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You know, I guess I feel, you know, the Bible always says, you know, thou shalt not kill.

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But when then someone takes their own life. So it kind of is your take on that.

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Yeah. Actually, it's a thou shalt not murder. And that's definitely not a sin. All murder is killing, but not all killing is murder.

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So it's just an unfortunate thing that a lot of times people will come to, you know, they will, they will just say that, you know, it just means you can't do this.

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You can't do that. And that's not got to be correct. So anyway, suicide, generally speaking, when someone commits suicide, they are not in their right mind, generally speaking.

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I'm not making an excuse for this, but let's just say that someone is in a great deal of pain and they are struggling left and right.

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They're just struggling constantly in order to be able to just endure the pain. And then the strain on the body causes them to get to the point where they commit suicide.

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Well, is God going to condemn them to hell for that? Well, of course not. Now, when it says, you know, thou shalt not murder, that's the unlawful taking of life.

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Now, if someone says suicide is illegal, well, then we've got an issue here.

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But I don't believe that we lose our salvation because of suicide. I believe we can lose a lot of reward and the like, but it's not an automatic, you know, gate to damnation.

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OK? I got it. All right. Thank you for the clarification.

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Sure. No problem at all. God bless. All right. Hey, folks, you want to give me a call to do is dial 877 -207 -2276.

04:52

Let's get to Christopher from Raleigh, North Carolina. Christopher, welcome. You're on the air. Hey, Matt.

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Thanks for taking my call. So my question is regarding whether we well, it's kind of like a twofold question.

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First, is tithing taught and committed in the

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New Testament? And with that, is it a part of the law?

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Tithing is part of the law, most definitely. And we are no longer under the law. Now, what

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I tell people is about tithing is that we're not obligated to do that.

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We don't have to do that. We're free to pray. And so if you want to tithe, then tithe. If you don't want to, then don't.

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But here's something to look at. This is for Timothy 517. Let me get to it.

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And it says the elders who rule well are to be considered worthy of double honor, especially those who work hard at preaching and teaching for the scripture says, you shall not muzzle the ox while he's threshing.

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And that is used of making money. And so we could, so I heard one comment or read one comment here that said it's possible to say that the elders are worth more money than the average person because of this.

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They said, if it's talking about money, double honor. And it's just a thought. And let's say that is the case.

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But the idea don't muzzle the ox while he's threshing, he's able to make a living out of what it is he's doing in order to do that.

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He has to eat and he's going to support his family. So where does he get the money for that? Well, by the tithes and offerings that the

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Christians give. So it's not unbiblical to do that. And that's how generally that's how pastors survive.

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In fact, in this ministry, in this ministry, it's how we live. This ministry,

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I've been at it for 28 years, the website. And I've been full time in it probably 19 years.

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And so we are supported by people's generosity.

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That's it. And we support missionaries. And I do this full time. And so I'm enabled to do a great deal of work that other people can't do because of this.

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And so, yeah, in their gracious attitude, support me in this ministry. Actually, that's cool.

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I'm grateful to you. Yeah. Well, yeah.

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The reason I'm asking is because I, I agree with everything you just said. I, you know, a lot of churches teach

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Malachi three. If you if you tithe 10 percent, you know, or more, whatever,

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God will bless you. If you don't, he'll curse you. But it's like so out of context. Yes.

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What they're even what he's even talking about. And one reason it's so heavy on my heart, you know, my

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I just got married and trying to work through like because my wife is like, oh, well,

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I'm going to do tithing 10 percent because the Bible says like, what do you what do you mean? She's I'm being obedient.

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I'm like to to what? Well, what the Bible says is like, OK, well, that's what the law says. So are you, you know, and I was like,

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I don't have a problem. You would do 10 percent. Cool. But don't attach it to what Malachi says, because it's out of context.

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And in two, if you're saying that God is going to curse you because you don't give him money, is this the

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God that saved us? Did he save us to pay tithe? Because every time

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I hear this, I that's what I think. I think so. Jesus saved us so we can give him 10 percent.

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If not, he's going to punish us. That's what I'm hearing from people. Right. And and it's bad.

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So here's a there's a couple of things. One, you're married, newly married. You are the spiritual leader of the family, and she needs to be in submission of that leadership, whether she likes it or you like it or don't is irrelevant.

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This is what you're commanded to be and do. The woman's job is to be a helpmate for the man. Your job is to spiritually lead.

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I'd be glad to teach on this to a seminar on this. But that's what the scriptures teach. It doesn't mean that she just blindly obeys everything you say and do.

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That's not what's going on. But you're the one who's like the captain of the ship. You do this. You lead biblically, prayerfully, lovingly, patiently and kindly.

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But you lead and you're the one responsible. So you're the one who has rightly divided the word of God in this context.

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And you inform your wife and teacher biblically and lovingly and patiently what the scriptures actually teach.

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Now, something to think about is this, that the tithing is an Old Testament requirement under the law. But we have died with Christ, Romans six, six,

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Romans six, eight. And if we've died with Christ, we're no longer under the law. Galatians, I mean, excuse me,

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Romans seven, four to just read Romans six and seven. You'll see all this that we've died.

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We're no longer under the law. Well, then we're not obligated to tithe. And what I tell people is you're free to tithe.

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You're free to tithe 12 percent, 100 percent, 50 percent, 1 percent. Do what you have to do.

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If I were a pastor of a church again and the tithing issue came up, I would say, look, you do what you was before you and God.

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I'm not trying to guilt whip at you. You know that the pastor needs money to live on.

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And if there's not enough coming in from the congregation, you know, I would say I'd have to get a job and just do this part time.

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And that's fine. There's no complaint. It's not a threat. That's OK. Many pastors are like that. And that's perfectly fine.

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Paul was that he was a tent maker. And so he was able to do other things to provide. And that's

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OK. So the thing is, we're free to tithe. We're free to give. We're free to give more.

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We're free to give less. And I just say, do what you think is right before God, you and your wife. You discuss it and you come to an agreement and whatever.

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And you go that way. Now, here's another thing. Think about this. Is she saying or is someone in this camp saying, if I do this spiritual thing,

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I am guaranteed a spiritual result? Yeah, that's what that's what witchcraft is.

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You know, witchcraft is you do a formula and it affects a spiritual realm and you're guaranteed a spiritual result.

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We've got to be careful that we are not saying I will tithe and I know God will do this in response.

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He owes me. Now, some people will do what's called a congruent or condign merit.

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It's a it's a thing out of Catholicism, but it applies here, even though Catholicism is apostate. Condign merit is that God will obligate himself to bless you, but he's not obligated to do it.

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He doesn't do it because you owe it or he owes it to you, but because he freely blesses you in your work. Well, that's

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OK. I get it. But it's called a condign kind of effort. And I can see that.

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So if you tithe, you know, I would expect God to bless you. But I'd also expect that maybe he won't.

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Maybe he won't. Maybe that's just the way it needs to be for a while. And maybe if you tithe, you find yourself short on some bills and he might be testing you.

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You might it might be that you shouldn't tithe at the moment, because I'll tell you, my wife and I, when we were newly married and had kids, literally the car ministry was just starting off and we got to check for fifteen dollars.

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Fifteen dollars. We had to decide how much food, diapers and gasoline to get out of the fifteen.

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And that happened more than once, many, many times. And we didn't have enough to tithe. So we didn't at that time because we just didn't have it.

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We were busy trying to feed our family, keep diapers on the kids and pay the rent, which was being raised.

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And so, yeah, I don't believe that God was upset. And, you know, he's blessed us greatly, but you see, we're free, not under the law.

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That's the whole thing. OK, yeah. And yeah. And real quick, just a couple of things.

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I did mention that to her. It's like, hey, we're we're free under the law. You know, we're no longer a law.

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But what what scripture you said, Romans six and seven. What other verses or chapters would you recommend to look at?

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Because it is in the law and there's some other resources that I have for her to look at.

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But as far as scripture goes, is there any other scriptures that or chapters or anything that you can recommend?

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Well, I have an article, are we obligated to tithe? And you go to Carmen, you can look it up. Are we obligated to tithe?

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The answer is no. OK, OK, OK. We're free that I try to look for.

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OK, so I could just type in obligated to tithe and it'll pop up in CARM search engine.

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Yep. OK. OK. All right. Great. Thanks, Matt. I appreciate it. All right. God bless.

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OK. Hey, folks, we have wide open lines. Eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six.

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Be right back. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six.

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Here's Matt Slick. All right, everybody, welcome back to the show. If you want to give me a call, all you have to do is dial eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six.

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And we have nobody waiting right now. It's a nice Friday and that often happens on Fridays. So what

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I'm going to do is get to some questions that people have sent in. In the meantime, if you want to give me a call, all you have to do is dial eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six.

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You can also email me info at CARM dot org, C -A -R -M dot

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O -R -G. Just put the subject line radio comment, radio question. And by the way,

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I was in a debate last night. I talked about it yesterday and I don't know how many people watched it.

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It was on total depravity. And if you did, if you have any comments or questions or follow up you'd like to talk about on that debate, all

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I have to do is give me a call and we could talk eight seven seven as toll free, you know, two zero seven two two seven six two zero eight.

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I mean, not two zero eight eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six.

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You can give me a call and we can talk. I would be interested to see what people thought about our little debate last night.

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In fact, next week I'm supposed to debate somebody on the deity of Christ.

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Does the Bible teach that Jesus is divine? And the answer, of course, is yes.

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It's also a topic I'm very familiar with. So I should be able to, well, hopefully represent the truth of who

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Christ is and discuss relevant issues and some stuff with with the opponent.

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So if he says the Bible is corrupted, that's not the debate is not about if the Bible is corrupted, does the

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Bible teach what the Bible is? Does it teach it? That's the question. So we'll see how well he does if he sticks to the scripture.

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All right. Let's get to Tony. I will do this. We'll get a 24 N .D. E's. Hey, Tony, welcome.

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You're on the air. Hey, thanks for taking my call. I hope you can hear me. If you can't,

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I'll call back another time. Yeah, I hear you. I called in a couple of weeks ago. This truck makes a lot of noise.

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I apologize if you can hear me. OK, I'll keep talking. If not, I'll call back.

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I hear you fine. I hear you fine. Go ahead. Not a problem. Yeah, I called a couple of weeks ago.

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You had a caller yesterday talking about near death experiences. I had mentioned my name and I was hoping, you know, with the form you have that I could get to some people all over the country that would, you know, read my story and understand that, you know.

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Well, here's what we bring. I don't know. Here's the thing. I don't know who you are. I don't know what you teach.

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So we can't just say, hey, go for it. We have to vet you first. So if you could send your information to info and car .org,

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then, you know, you say, hey, well, yeah, maybe. OK.

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Yeah. Yeah. Oh, I was just yeah, I was just hoping, you know, maybe you could. But anyway, you know, we talked about I was dead and was dead for close six minutes.

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I was just at the cardiologist yesterday. You know, we talked about you asked me if I saw anything.

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No, I didn't see anything. And I can honestly say that, you know, Jesus brought me back.

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There was an atheist there that day. And the whole the whole department of cardiology is

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Christian. And so anyway, she was they'd been working on her, trying to, you know, get her to understand.

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And and she wouldn't. So, you know, I feel like my death was, you know, for her, maybe.

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But I don't know. I think I was left here, you know, to witness things like that. And I know

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I was laying there being examined by him yesterday. And he's a good Christian man.

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And he goes, you know, Jesus brought you back. He said we were just here to witness it.

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And I said, well, Doc, just how dead was he? Looked at me. He said, you were dead.

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That was his very, very word. So, all right, well, you know,

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I'll send the information to you and I'll send you the link. And if you want to take time, you know,

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I understand you don't have time. But if you do, sometimes take a look at it. It's a it's a good story.

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They called me a few weeks after I got out of the hospital and they asked me if I would do the story.

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And I said, sure, I'll do the story. Well, I appreciate that. But, yeah, there are lots of cases of people who've been dead on the table, you know, for a period of time.

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And that's great. What we're really interested in is if they've seen anything and if they just died and came back or revived.

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Well, not to say that it's not significant, but, you know, that's that's interesting. And I'm glad that you're back and serving the

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Lord. And so what we're curious about is to encounter people who this is what

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I saw. This is what happened, et cetera. But it doesn't seem to follow a follow with you.

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So I don't know how relevant it would really all be. I mean, I try to be dismissive of your experience and you're in D .E.

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But, you know, that's where we focus, basically. OK.

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Yeah, I just, you know, like I said, I think, you know, we need to give on this call,

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I want to give Jesus the credit for all that he does and everything he does. There's always a purpose in something.

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And one other thing before I'll get off, but I think I heard you say that you believe that the tribulation and the second coming was the same time.

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Yes. Is that correct? Well, the tribulation is a period of time. And so the second coming is at the end of the tribulation.

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Yeah. OK. Yeah, I don't I don't believe that. I want to debate with you on that, but I got to get my homework done.

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I was looking at all the scriptures yesterday. I'll get it all together and give you a call back out of this noisy truck.

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We're going to wait on that one, because I think it's true. Yeah, I think it's two separate times.

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You know, I really the tribulation is a different thing than the return. The return happens at the end of the tribulation.

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That's all. OK. Yeah. All right. I'll just say that,

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OK, I believe that, you know, the rapture and then I think then the second coming.

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But anyway, when I get my ducks in a row, I'll call you back and we'll debate. All right. Sounds good.

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All right. Well, thanks a lot. All right, Tony. All right. God bless you, too.

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OK. All right. Let's see. Now let's get to Jeff from South South South Carolina.

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Hey, Jeff, welcome here on the air. Yeah. How are you? Oh, hanging in there.

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Hanging in there, man. What do you got, buddy? Oh, I was on social media the other day and looking at these reels or whatever, and that kept popping up.

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This I you see in Israel United in Christ and it's guys dressed in these purple outfits like uniforms.

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And they were in the cities and they were had megaphones and they're shouting this stuff like.

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Jesus was black and all this stuff, and I didn't know if you'd ever heard of it. It's in Israel.

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It's a black Hebrew Israelite or Israelite movement, and they're usually racist that the blacks are the ones who are very racist the way they were talking, you know?

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Yeah, it's the the blacks are the true Jews. And Jesus was black.

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And I don't care if he was or wasn't. I don't believe he was. But it's a racist, very racist kind of thing.

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So I've talked to a lot of the column BHI, you know, black Hebrews. But they don't like being called black

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Hebrew Israelite because they're expanding just calling themselves Hebrew Israelites. And underneath there, there's a lot of subgroups, subdivisions like two or three hundred of them right now.

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And so they're adopting also and including people who are of Hispanic descent because they're not white.

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So that's OK. Right. It's a very, very racist group. These people, it's cultic,

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OK? I know, because I mean, I guess it's been around a while, but that's the first time I ever noticed. I was like, what in the world?

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That's crazy. And then we got to break, man. Hold on. Got to break. OK, so I'll be right back. Folks, we'll be right back after these messages.

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Please stay tuned. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877 -207 -2276.

23:14

Here's Matt Slick. Welcome back to the show. Let's get back on with Jeff. Are you still there?

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Yes, sir. All right. So, yeah, it's a it's a non -Christian cult and should be avoided.

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It's very racist and salvation. So keeping the commandments, observing laws, white people are basically evil, stuff like that.

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It's racist, non -Christian cult. Yeah, I thought I think his name is

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Michael Brown. He's on the truth radio. Mm hmm. But he was debating one on YouTube.

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I saw in the it was a real conversation. But as soon as Michael Brown, he knows so much about Jewish history and all that.

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I mean, oh, he's got it in heaven. The guy didn't have a clue.

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And so he just started shouting stuff like shouting. We are the true Israelites.

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You know, just shouting. Hey, yeah, I think they take scriptures out of context.

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Oh, yeah. Yeah. And one of them was where it's in Revelation, where it says that his hair was white as wool and it's so, you know, hair was like wool.

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So therefore, it's right. And that's good. That's good. Yeah. Uh -huh. I'm like,

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I don't know how that proves that. Yeah, it's just what they do. It's just what they do.

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That's symbolic of the less symbolic about the vision that John had.

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It's not actually Jesus. Looks like in the flesh. I think that was more symbolic.

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Right. I don't know how they get that. Right. They take verses out of context. They don't know what they're doing exegetically.

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They submit the scriptures to their personal racist ideology. They look for whatever they can out of the

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Old Testament to make it fit their ideology. It's a non -Christian cult and it's bad news.

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It's racist. But it's like they talk over people like, you know, I can't really say anything because they got these megaphones and they're shouting just they take the scripture and they'll sit there and shout it like really loud.

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And like they have authority or something. Right. Yes, I'm aware of that.

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Yep. Mm hmm. OK. All right. We have a great weekend.

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You too. All right. OK, God bless. All right. Now, let's see.

25:40

Next longest waiting is Tom from Virginia. Tom, welcome. You are on the air.

25:46

Hi, Matt, how are you? Oh, I'm OK. Hang in there, man. So what do you got? OK, well,

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I got it. I've been pondering while I'm sitting here on the phone thinking, but my question is about election and maybe predestination.

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Yeah. And so I understand election is God chooses who is going to who's going to be part of Jesus's flock, who's going to be saved, who is the very good.

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Right. OK, so there's there's lots of scripture in there. And I apologize.

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I kind of called you on a whim, so I wasn't really prepared. But there's scripture. Yeah, there's yeah, there's scripture that that says that.

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But there's also a scripture in revelations, I believe. And yeah, I think it goes something along the lines.

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We're supposed to evangelize and pull people out of the fire.

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Of course. Of course. OK, yeah, yeah, yeah. So so I guess that goes into predestination, right?

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So election is is where God tells us where God just kind of maybe indwells us with the

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Holy Spirit. Would that be a way to look at it? He election is his choosing.

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That's what it means. Election is the choosing. So he chose us in Christ before the foundation of the world that we'd be holding blameless.

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Ephesians one four. That's what it was called. Yeah. So that's that's that's that's like Jesus is.

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That's everybody who who who calls Jesus their savior. That is anybody and everybody whom

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God himself has called. Right. OK, so that's that's whoever

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God's called. And then God's still calling people at the very end times where we're pulling people out of the fire.

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And that's predestination, right, where we go evangelize. Well, OK, so here is how generally how it works.

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Election is is the work of God before the foundation of the world where he chooses for salvation people.

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And that's what he does. Second Thessalonians two, 13 says he chose you for salvation from the beginning.

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Acts 13, 48, as many as had been appointed to eternal life, believed. So there's verses like this in the scripture that teach this.

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A lot of people don't like it, but that's not my problem. That's theirs because of the scripture teach. So what is predestination?

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Predestination is the work of God to bring about what he degrees, what he desires. He can do this and he can bring about people to do some things that have been predestined to occur.

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Yet they are the ones still responsible. So, for example, when you go to Acts four, twenty seven and twenty eight for truly in the city, they were gathered together against your holy servant,

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Jesus, whom you anointed, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, along with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel to do whatever your hand and your purpose predestined to occur.

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So the two people, individuals, Herod and Pontius Pilate and the two groups, Gentiles and the

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Jews, did whatever God's purpose predestined to occur. Yet what we see in Acts two, twenty three,

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Peter says, this man delivered over by the predetermined plan and for knowledge of God, you nailed to a cross by the hands of ungodly men.

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So even though it's predestined, they were the ones responsible. In fact, Jesus says in Luke twenty two, twenty two, he says, for indeed the son of man is going as it has been determined.

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But woe to that man by whom he is betrayed. So it's determined that it'll happen.

29:30

But this man who does this, Judas, he's in trouble. So we have a mystery here.

29:36

God elects and God predestines. And yet we are still responsible. Now we get into the issue of what you're talking about, evangelism.

29:42

We don't know the criteria that God uses for evangelism, for how he hears us in prayer to save people.

29:48

We just don't know. He does not tell us. Some people, what they do, in my opinion, is stop the thinking at this level and just say, well, you can't have evangelism if God just evangelize predestined.

30:02

Why evangelize? Well, he told us to. And furthermore, we don't know how he elects.

30:07

We don't know what the criteria is. We don't know if from all eternity he's ordained that I, you, other

30:13

Christians pray for the salvation of people because it's what he wants and he saves them because it's part of what he's decreed to occur in his grand plan of things.

30:22

I just don't know. So our job is not in production. Our job is in sales.

30:27

What we do is we promote the truth and let God save.

30:33

OK. OK, well, thanks, Matt, I appreciate that. OK, hope that helps.

30:42

It did, actually. It, you know, the question's been on my mind, you know, why, why do we have to go and evangelize if if if it's already if God has already elected for us to follow

30:57

Jesus and you just answered the question because he said to the man where he said to, you know, we do it because he told us that that's the answer.

31:06

Yeah. No, that's another thing I tell. Another thing I tell people is, well, God teaches predestination election.

31:12

I mean, he does. It's right there and it's in the Bible. I tell people there it is. But it doesn't mean we understand it sufficiently.

31:20

It's always possible. Like myself, who I've studied this a lot.

31:26

Maybe I'm just not getting it. And maybe someone who disagrees with me really is getting it.

31:31

But I just can't see it. That's certainly possible. So I don't put all my eggs in the election predestination basket.

31:38

I say, well, you're the sovereign king. I see that that you elect. I see that you predestine.

31:43

I see that you say, go evangelize. I do. I believe in what you do. I believe what you called us to do as Christians.

31:49

I'm doing it. And I pray, Lord, save them. Say that person, if they're not elect, please elect them.

31:56

And I'm saying, I don't know how it works. So I just teach one thing and then try and live by that one thing.

32:03

I don't know exactly how it works. So I do. I believe one and do both believe in election and also evangelize.

32:12

OK, OK. Thank you. Thank you much. You're welcome.

32:17

Much. God bless, buddy. All right. All right. Now, next longest waiting is Christian from Dayton, Ohio.

32:24

Welcome. You are on the air. Yeah, it's actually Chris. But that's all right. Don't worry about it. So thank you.

32:31

Thanks for taking the call. Yeah, I just wanted to say that I really appreciate your ministry.

32:36

And I've used some of the information. And this is a shout out to you and to anybody else that goes on there to read about, you know, apologetics regarding, you know, whether it be

32:47

Mormonism or Jehovah's Witnesses. And, you know, I've talked to them over the years. And and some of the material that I've used has been from your website.

32:56

And I really appreciate it and the ministry that you do. So shout out to you and all your work.

33:03

Thank you. Praise God. Praise God. Appreciate that. Yeah. The question

33:10

I had was basically I just wanted to comment on that guy that made a comment about the tithing.

33:17

I, when I first was a believer, I tithed all the time, did that for years. And, you know,

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I finally kind of saw the light years back and just realized that, you know, it's part of the law.

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And, you know, God wants me to give because, you know, I want to do it for him, not because I'm getting something, you know, and I'm doing it to, you know, figure out some kind of formula.

33:41

And so, yeah. And, you know, grace giving, you know, whatever you want to call it.

33:46

You know, I you know, there should be a sacrifice. But, you know, it's not to get something.

33:53

We're we're having a break coming up. So hold on. Sorry to cut you off, but hold on. And we'll just get right back to you after the break.

33:59

OK, that's OK. Hey, folks, we'll be right back after these messages with Chris. Please stay tuned. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877 -207 -2276.

34:15

Here's Matt Slick. Everybody, welcome back to the show. Let's get back on the air with Chris.

34:23

OK, Chris. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah, I just want to. Yeah, I was just kind of echoing that guy, you know, talking about timing.

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And I know people feel real passionate about this sometimes. And I've even talked to people and they just lose their minds over this because I used to do it.

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I used to do it all the time and would do it religiously and thinking, OK, I'm doing this because this is

34:45

God's command. Well, be careful about that, because it's not the New Testament. And it's not a command.

34:51

And, you know, we have to be careful that we still hold to this Old Testament law. Now, God obviously calls us to give and I support my church.

34:59

And I really think, you know, maybe this is me personally thinking this, but I think he wants me to sacrifice something when

35:08

I when I give. And so whatever it is that I have to give up and that's going to be different for different people.

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But, you know, it doesn't mean that I can just do whatever I want. So, well, you know, it's all, you know, it's all his anyway.

35:20

And, you know, so, yeah. And there's different ways to tithe. You know, we can tithe of our money.

35:25

We can also tithe of our time and we can do absolutely. And so what do you what do you do if, you know, you're at a grocery store, for example, and someone behind you or in front of you or next to you suddenly doesn't have enough money for something?

35:38

And, you know, that person has kids and they're struggling, which would be a thing to turn back. Hey, I'll buy it for you.

35:44

You know, it's a little help because the idea of tithing is to give for the work of the Lord. But within that word is, you know, helping others.

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And so these are more might we consider offerings. We're offering something.

35:57

But tithe is generally, you know, the first fruits of what it is that you have earned. And then you give offerings about that.

36:05

That's generally how it is. Yeah, I wanted to Malachi section, the passage,

36:12

I think the context is that my understanding that they were robbing from basically the

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Levites or the people that were actually supposed to. They needed the money. Right.

36:23

And so, however, he knew God, he knew they were doing this. And God wanted them to be able to live out of their work.

36:33

People don't realize, for example, ministry is difficult and very time consuming.

36:40

And I'm not a pastor anymore, but I do this ministry that I'm working in, for example.

36:46

And 40 hours a week to me is a joke. 40 hours. Why would

36:51

I work so little? I work six days a week. And on the seventh day, I do nothing but watch

36:57

TV, relax, run an hour or two with my wife, whatever. And I'm anxious to get back to work on the next day because there's so much to do and I want to serve

37:06

God. I work 60, 70 hour weeks. It's just what I do. And so but I'm able to do that because of people's support, which means going online and doing debates like last night or writing articles like I'm doing or getting ready for video work, which

37:20

I'm going to do today and tomorrow. Other things which I wouldn't be able to do otherwise. So that's what people have to understand.

37:26

That's how you that the pastors are supported so they can do that work of ministry and preaching and teaching.

37:32

Yeah. Yeah. Amen, bro. So, yeah, thanks for your ministry.

37:39

And I'll let you go to the next caller. So thank you. All right, man. Sounds good, buddy.

37:44

Thanks. All right. OK. All right. Now let's get to Luke from Washington, D .C.

37:52

Luke, welcome. You're on the air. Luke, are you there?

37:59

Hi. Hi, Matt. How are you doing? All right. Hanging in there. So what do you got, man?

38:05

Oh, yes. The same predestination question. I just heard Adrian Rogers.

38:12

You know, your advertisement always talk about Adrian Rogers explains predestination.

38:19

Predestination is not God saying from eternity that one man's going to heaven and another man is going to hell.

38:28

Predestination deals primarily with what God intends to do for those who trust him and what

38:35

God will do for saved people. Yeah, that's just me. That that's bad, bad theology on his part.

38:42

Sorry, but it is if that's what he's saying. That's very good. OK. I can prove it from you to Romans Chapter eight, twenty nine and thirty.

38:52

All right. So what he's saying there or what that quote is saying is that it's predestining those who trust in him.

39:00

Right. Right. Yes. Yeah, that's not what biblical theology is, because that would then mean that God will show favor to those who trust in him.

39:09

But why does they trust in him? Is there a good quality in that person? And then God shows favoritism based on the goodness that's within them.

39:17

Well, that violates James two, two through four. It's not the case that God looks at the future or knows the future choices of individuals in counterfactual knowledge by middle knowledge, by which he then makes his decisions based upon the total concomitant, simultaneous knowledge of all conditions.

39:34

And then he elects what would be best. This is a form of Molinism. And I just flat out reject

39:40

Molinism. This is what the Bible says. If you go to Romans eight, twenty nine, those whom he foreknew, he also predestined.

39:47

Now, people say, well, that means the foreknown means he looks into the future to see who's going to pick him. That doesn't mean that. I mean, they read into the text what it does say.

39:55

The ones who are foreknown are also the predestined ones. The ones who are foreknown are also the predestined.

40:02

Those whom he foreknew, he also predestined. And when you go to Ephesians one, Ephesians one, four, those as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, his choosing of us before the foundation of the world is not because of some quality in us.

40:17

This is man centered theology. We will say that. No, God foreknows because the only way to for things to be foreknown is if God ordains them.

40:28

The ordination of God means that all things are caused directly or permitted indirectly by God.

40:34

And so all things are working after the counsel of his will. Ephesians one, three, eleven. Eleven. So when he says he foreknows, you can understand that the pattern of God knowing people, he knows people.

40:46

He says, get away from me. I never knew you. In Matthew seven, twenty three. And those are the people who are trying to be saved by their faith in our works.

40:52

That's a whole nother issue. But it says in Galatians four, eight and nine, when you did not know God, you served by nature, those which are not

40:59

God's. But now that you've come to know God or rather are known by him, now you come to serve the true living

41:05

God. So if it's not if you know God, the issue is whether or not he knows you.

41:11

So he knows you. But when he foreknows someone, it's him in a saving relationship style that he is looking in advance to them and predestining those individuals.

41:22

That's biblical theology. OK. So what do you think about one man going to heaven and another man is going to hell?

41:32

Well, what about it? Do you agree with that? Yes, some people go to heaven. And some people go to heaven and another man is going to hell.

41:40

Well, let's look at this. I'm going to quote to you, Proverbs 16, for the

41:46

Lord has made everything for its own purpose, even the wicked for the day of evil. Proverbs 16, for let's go to Romans nine, twenty two and twenty three.

41:56

What if God, although willing to demonstrate his wrath and to make his power known, endured with much patience, vessels of wrath prepared for destruction?

42:03

And he did so to make known the riches of his glory upon vessels of mercy, which he prepared beforehand for glory.

42:09

Then we can go to first Peter. I think it's was it been a while since I've gone to this one to this doom.

42:16

They were appointed. And that verse is I think it's first Peter two, eight. Yes, it is.

42:22

For they stumble because they are disobedient to the word and to this doom, they were also appointed. Now we could look about this and what it means.

42:30

You know, people say, well, it was appointed because he knew they were going to do something bad. But see, this then means that God is looking at the condition of the heart.

42:39

This is a tough theological position. But you can understand that what's happening in America largely in a lot of pulpits is

42:46

Christian humanism. So what they'll do is they'll define Christian theology based on what they think is true, what they think

42:52

God ought and ought not to do. God will never predestine someone to hell without giving him a chance. What book of the

42:58

Bible is that out of? But people assume things like this. If God wants to predestine people to hell for his choice, that's his right.

43:06

You have to accept that if he wants to do that, the question is whether or not he does or doesn't. They can't just go say, no,

43:11

God would never do that. When people tell me he would never do that, I say, show me the verse that says that we want everyone to be saved.

43:18

Yeah. First Timothy two, four, first Timothy or second Peter three, nine wants all to be saved. And I cross reference it.

43:23

I say, let's work with that. Let's assume that your position is that he wants every individual to be saved. Right. OK, good. And why is second

43:29

Thessalonians two eleven, does he send a deluding influence on people? He says, so they'll believe a lie. And then why does

43:35

Jesus speak in parables in Mark four, 10 through 12? He tells them so they'll not be forgiven. And I say, you have to look at all of the scriptures.

43:43

Don't just look at a couple of verses and say, we're done thinking. Look at all of it and put it all together.

43:49

And because, in my opinion, I'll make a lot of people mad with this. In my opinion, the pastors and a lot of the commentators are not doing the deep, heavy lifting of theological thinking.

43:59

And what they're doing is settling and saying, this is what it means. And that's all we're going to do. And if you disagree, then you're just wrong.

44:06

Well, if God wants to predestine people to help, that's his business. The question is, does he or doesn't he?

44:12

And when I read verses where it says in Romans nine, twenty two and twenty three, what if God, although willing to demonstrate his wrath and to make his power known and do it with much patience, vessels of wrath prepared for destruction?

44:27

And he did so to make known the riches of his glory upon vessels of mercy, which he prepared before him for glory.

44:33

People say, well, that's because he knew what they're going to do. But they're all depraved. Everybody's a sinner. Why is he saving any?

44:39

And this goes on and on. I had this discussion a thousand times. And so if that quote that you're saying from him is accurate, which

44:46

I'd like you to send that quote to me with the documentation and I'll write a response to it and put it up.

44:52

I have a section on karma about people, what they say. And I will just say, no, I don't agree with that. I think it's weak.

44:58

It could be it's the contact context made something different. I don't know. But, you know, that's why I said, if what you're saying there and if that quote is whatever,

45:05

I would totally disagree with it. OK. OK, thank you. So I have one more question.

45:12

I will ask that tomorrow. I don't want to waste time. OK. Thank you.

45:19

OK. No other question. That's it. We have two minutes. I have one more question. The question is, if God knew that Adam and Eve would sin, why did he create them?

45:31

Because he created us for his glory. Isaiah 43, verse seven. Also, in the fact that they are not holy by nature, they then do not have the capacity of the inability to sin.

45:43

In other words, they must eventually, in my opinion, come to a place of sinning because they don't possess holiness, which is a characteristic of God.

45:50

First Peter one, 16. And so he knew they were going to sin because that's the nature of the fall of the non divine being.

45:59

It can never be as perfect as God. And so therefore, it'll fall. And this is why I believe in first Timothy five, 17.

46:04

It talks about the elect angels, those who were called by God not to sin. And he did something in their election with them so they would not fall.

46:11

I believe all sentient beings will fall. So he made them in part, I think, for this reason, for this glory.

46:17

And because in the fall, then the greatest act of love can be manifested because Jesus says in Matthew 15, 13 or John 15, 13, excuse me.

46:27

He says greater love has no man than this, but he lay his life down for his friend. So that's the greatest act of love.

46:33

And first John four, eight, God is love. Well, if God is love and the greatest act of love is self -sacrifice, then such a self -sacrifice can only occur inside the fall.

46:42

So if the fall is permitted because Adam and Eve freely acted under their own will, they weren't forced to.

46:49

It's their own choice. They did it. Then God can enter into creation and redeem those who misused the gifting that God gave to him to them and in the process demonstrate the greatest act of love and glorify himself and save for people that he chooses to have eternal fellowship with.

47:07

So he receives all the glory and the honor through that. OK. Well, thank you.

47:13

You're welcome. All right. Well, God bless, Luke. All right. There we go.

47:19

But at a time here, I know that boy, that's heavy stuff. I know I went quickly because we're at the end of the hour.

47:25

So I've thought this through a thousand times. Doesn't mean I'm right, but that's my opinion. That's what I've got. And maybe we could talk about it sometime if you disagree.

47:33

But if you do go to scripture and say, man, I think you're wrong because of what this says here,

47:38

I'm going to go, OK, show me not not knock this chip off my shoulder, but maybe you're right. Show me because I'm always open to be corrected.

47:47

Hey, may the Lord bless you. And by his grace, we're back on the air on Monday. I hope you have a great weekend.