A Remote Dividing Line Discussing Abortion, Gender Issues, & Then More IFB Craziness

Alpha & Omega Ministries

Subscribe

Download

Share

00

Comments are disabled.

00:40

And welcome to the dividing line. I didn't hear anything. So here we go

00:48

At least I think it says go I'm gonna run with it so Yeah, it looks good.

00:53

All right. Welcome to the dividing line. What am I doing here? Well, it's real simple You may hear some noises in the background.

01:00

You may hear some voices. You may hear some saws. I Have workers at my home today

01:07

Trying to get something done before the holidays and so I Can't get to the office, but we've subscribed to a service that Seemingly works quite well in fact

01:21

I'm gonna be throwing accordance up here and some some visuals up here and in some ways

01:28

I Think we need to get something like this for the studio Because I think it might be easier when we do that To be able to do that.

01:38

So we'll see how it works. And of course, we still have any control over What happens with the stuff?

01:47

From from the office elsewhere, but you know, that's that's how that goes. See there's somebody pounding in the room

01:56

Play the new RFG song. No, I'm not gonna play the new RFG song. This isn't radio free Geneva So why would you play a radio free Geneva song on a non radio free

02:03

Geneva? We'll get to it. Eventually. Don't worry All will be well Lots of stuff to get to today lots of strange things happening

02:15

Around the I Shouldn't have Twitter up while this is on around the the net many things happening one.

02:24

I Guess we'll start with the rough stuff first. Shall we it's I I Here let me put this up I saw this

02:40

Maybe is yesterday day before yesterday. I I Don't know. I don't know who

02:46

Skylar Rose lush is. I Don't know. That's an actual picture of Skylar Rose lush

02:53

I tried to do a search on on Facebook couldn't find anything other than just people talking about this

03:02

I Would like to hope that this isn't true, but I don't have any reason not to think that it is

03:11

Because of the shout your abortion stuff and be proud of your abortion stuff and things like this

03:20

Living my best life and then there's an ultrasound baby lush number four

03:31

Look at the look at the thing 11 for 18 to 12 11 18 Think about what's being said here, baby.

03:41

I loved you with all my heart But you just weren't meant to be with us right now we're going through a lot and You deserved all the love in the world your brother and sister would have loved you too

03:58

That means this woman is a is a mother she already knows that there is a life inside her

04:06

Rest easy, baby. Love you'll never be forgotten 11 for 18 to 12 11 18 hashtag

04:17

Abortion I I Don't even know what to say it

04:25

Because you you experience a Mixture of emotion utter revulsion shock

04:32

The the inability to conceive of such evil and yet such decadence self -centeredness

04:44

But what I want us to see in this is The inability to escape

04:55

The inevitable reality that we are made in the image of God everything here screams it

05:00

She can't she cannot avoid speaking as A person made in the image of God can't

05:15

Baby I love you with all my heart. No, don't even That that is a level of self -deception that is difficult to conceive of you didn't love that child you loved yourself

05:27

You loved the ease of your life. You loved your best life now, whatever you want to call it but you are a very self -centered individual and You put yourself before a child now, of course we could back up here and you have all the issues relating to You know, is she married

05:54

How does she view how does she view the issue of Sexual morality

06:05

Even within marriage what about what about the very production of life? Baby, I love you with all my heart

06:13

No, you didn't but you just weren't meant to be with us right now and I think about that from a sheet.

06:18

She's just murdered this child She's she's addressing the baby as a human being

06:27

Not as a not as a clump of cells, I mean this is this is the greatest Rejection of the

06:34

Planned Parenthood narrative. I mean It's stunning You just weren't meant to be with us right now think about that word meant

06:50

Yeah, there's someone just posted a tweet in the chat channel from looks like the same person

06:57

My 21st birthday is in three months and since I'm not pregnant anymore That means

07:02

I can finally drink on my b -day on my birthday Yeah in that.

07:08

Yeah, this is what happens when spoiled brats become adults

07:16

But notice the language you just weren't meant to be with us right now think about the word meant

07:24

And try to put that into any type of worldview that would justify what this woman has done

07:32

You can't not without massive inconsistency meant meant requires meaning meant requires

07:42

Well requires a theistic system to make any sense You just weren't meant to be with us right now

07:51

We're going through a lot What does that mean? It's bought a new car Who knows and You deserved all the love in the world, but I'm not gonna give it to you even though I'm your mother

08:06

I'm called to but I won't do it Because I'm too selfish your brother and sister would have loved you, too

08:18

Would have should have Can't now because I killed you

08:25

Rest easy, baby. Love you'll never be forgotten. You were forgotten the next day the everything about this screams lie and depravity and guilt and oh my but when you look at the 1 .6

08:51

K Responses and many of them are laugh. Well, this was on on her living my best life one

09:01

Laughter thumbs up some angry faces, but that'll probably be illegal before long just stunning it's

09:17

What society could possibly demand? Blessings from God that is represented by this kind of Depraved inhumanity

09:32

There are many Well vast majority of mammals are significantly

09:39

More advanced In their care of young Than someone like this

09:46

This is subhuman It's subhuman stunning in a

09:55

Western society that Has closed its ears and its mind to the reality of its own nature its creator

10:04

Everything that has made this has given us all the things all the best life now stuff that she's celebrating being able to have all came from a worldview that she detests

10:14

I Just gotta close that window because it's just Well, um

10:29

I'm a week late on this But From Virginia a

10:37

Virginia high school teacher you probably saw about a week ago Who refused to refer to a transgender student as a boy has been fired

10:47

News outlets report that the West Point School Board voted unanimously so there's no one left in the school board with a scintilla of morality ethics or Grasp of reality

11:03

But Unanimously Thursday to dismiss French teacher Peter blaming Aged 47 after a four -hour hearing that drew an overflow crowd

11:12

The school system said in a statement that blaming was fired for insubordination Over the summer the ninth grade students family

11:21

Informed the school system of the students gender transition to male The student wasn't involved in Thursday's hearing

11:30

Now there are some of us Who live in the real world that recognize there is no such thing as gender transition that that young woman's body

11:41

Still carries the exact same chromosomes as before that cannot be changed as yet. And if it could be

11:49

That would be Well, let's just say right now that's completely outside realm of possibility and even the wildest human genetic engineering

12:04

And so the reality is that this is a female Who wants to pretend to be a male and I don't see any difference here in Someone coming to into school and I want to be treated as a lion as an orangutan as a horse

12:32

Anybody who does that we go you need help Well, if you decide you're a different gender than what you actually are you you need help to Unfortunately that help is no longer

12:42

Available because of the fact that this insanity has infected the elite society

12:48

And I'm not going to go into the specifics of the culture who then control the educational system and now we've got the insanity that we are dealing with Witnesses describe a slip -up when the student was about to run into a wall and Vlaming told others to stop her.

13:08

How do you run into a wall? When discussing the incident with administrators blaming made it clear.

13:14

He would not use male pronouns a Stance that led to his suspension referral for disciplinary action.

13:23

I Can't think of a worse way to treat a child than what was happening said West Point High principal

13:28

Jonathan Hoffman Who testified that he told blaming to use male pronouns in accordance with the students wishes?

13:34

Oh, yeah That's the worst thing could ever happen. Mr. Principal The educational system's gone folks.

13:44

Hello. These are the people in charge The the inmates are running the asylum Blaming told superiors that his

13:55

Christian faith prevented from using male pronouns with a student blaming said he had the student in class the year before When the student identified as female

14:05

So don't you realize what this means? See right now, well, we only take it seriously when it lasts for well how long

14:14

Well, it needs to at least last for you know a year why not six months

14:19

Why not six days? Why not six minutes? I?

14:26

Mean, this is so insane. It's a fundamental denial of reality blaming attorney

14:34

Shawn Boyles Says his client offered to use the students name and to avoid feminine pronouns

14:40

But Boyle said the school was unwilling to accept the compromise that that discrimination then leads to creating a hostile learning environment

14:47

Now, how about for the teacher? How about for the rest of students who actually are not nuts?

14:57

Hostile learning environment. That's what the entirety of the school is now for anyone who actually cares about truth and The student had expressed that the parent had expressed that said

15:09

West Point Public School superintendent Laura Abel they felt disrespected Mmm, it's here.

15:21

I Don't know how many times it has to happen to people I guess once it happens to you

15:29

We have said over and over this could be this could be the dividing line that gets us gone

15:36

I mean, uh, I don't know a lot about this, but I've received some some emails From some folks that were involved with a

15:45

Facebook group called popcorn theology. I think it was popcorn down And I think if I recall correctly they talked about movies

15:54

I Don't know. I wasn't a part of it, but They got closed down a couple weeks ago and they can never find out why and if I'm reading what

16:03

I was sent correctly The only way they could appeal was from within the group

16:08

But since they had locked the group down and locked everybody out, no one could so it's done There's no way to appeal, you know on Facebook, you know,

16:16

Google is the essence of What the communist bloc wanted to be

16:26

But couldn't be because they they were a little bit early. They just didn't have the technology to be able to pull it off Now now the technology exists and that's what you have with Facebook and Google are these low -level

16:49

Ideologues with all the power in the world that can just simply enforce their will upon everyone again,

16:58

I I Can not help But to think of the

17:06

Stasi prison in East Germany When I went through there, they talked about the you know, the the main thing they wanted

17:14

Was not to imprison people but to break people To get people to say what the state wanted them to say.

17:23

It's just like 1984 haven't worn my shirt yet, but I did buy one of those shirts you can get on Facebook With the

17:31

Venn diagram on the front where it's got 1984 and brave new world and when they intersect and says you are here

17:38

Yeah, that's that's where we are 1984 brave new world. It's right there people seen it coming didn't stop it and The next generation seemed to go.

17:50

Oh, this is cool Of course, I've never read any great literature to know any better, but this is cool

18:03

Yeah, so I Wonder what? Mr. Blamey is gonna do now that he can't teach a

18:11

French because France nests isn't necessarily on the top of everybody's tourism list right now.

18:18

You know me What's going on in France what's going on in Germany what's going on in the

18:28

UK? Big things going on and you know, it's that thing is vast majority of even my

18:37

Christian friends have no earthly idea What's going on in any of those places? Oh, I've heard some something about people and yellow vests rioting in Paris, but There's there's something that something's been broken in the

18:50

UK Brecks break it, right? What Brett? What? I don't know. I don't get it, you know and As a result, we don't see

19:00

The massive cultural shift taking place the the destruction of nation -states as a result of Open borders and George Soros and all the rest of this kind of stuff

19:11

That's behind a lot of what we've got going on here. His money's everywhere the man is

19:18

Absolutely part of God's judgment upon Western society even the way he's gotten his money is a judgment upon Western society and As a result, we don't we don't see the

19:32

European Union for the draconian Dictatorial Anti -christian

19:40

Entity that it is and what it wants to do what it wants to do to it's trying to make an example of the

19:47

United Kingdom in In leaving the Union by just trying to destroy it economically don't don't miss the fact that That's exactly what they're they're seeking to do

19:59

What's happening in Germany as a result of having thrown the borders open and just come on in open borders?

20:07

Yeah, that's worked out and now in France in France the thing that triggered this one of the things that triggered this

20:15

Was new taxes on fossil fuels to stop global warming as if France has almost anything at all to do with global warming

20:23

But it primarily impacts the poorer people outside of the major cities and do not have public transportation

20:31

You're talking seven bucks a gallon for gas For those people out there and they're trying to they're the ones you know, the farmers and stuff like that They have to use this fuel to try to make a living

20:41

They're not they're not the elites in the cities Who have all the trains and all the rest that stuff and all the tax money from from the people are actually working elsewhere

20:50

To be able to do what they're doing. And so that's what's caused this people had enough and they are

20:59

Lashing back, but it shows this fundamental divide between The cities and the elites and the secularists who have no connection with what's really going on in the world

21:10

They don't know what you know, they don't care where their food comes from. They wouldn't be able to get their food if they tried

21:16

But they're all concerned about global warming and all the mythology associated with that and They finally said other people said that's enough

21:29

And that's not the only reason it's happening But Europe is in desperate straits and folks.

21:36

There's lots of nuclear weapons in Europe. There's lots of nuclear weapons in Russia in the former

21:41

Soviet States lots of nuclear weapons lots of fissionable material.

21:48

I Don't know how we've gotten as far as we've gotten without a mushroom cloud appearing over some

21:56

City somewhere if not in the United States someplace else Well, I do know how

22:02

God has kept his hand restraint for his own purposes Is he under any obligation to maintain that hand restraint?

22:11

I know of none. I know of none Almost everyone

22:16

I think Poland might be an exception I could be wrong, but as far as I know every one of these

22:22

European states murders babies just like the United States does Just as callously is that one we were just looking at So What can we say

22:38

If again, if I sat around just watching the news, I would be a basket case Because if you can put two and two together and sort of go hmm connect that to that that bad

22:51

I'd be a basket case. I really would be it would be it would be bad well, um

23:03

I'm gonna play one sec. I have to play one section like can we lay aside the uber super heavy stuff for just Just a moment

23:16

You know, I I was raised

23:25

Well a long time ago next Monday is my birthday I entered into my 57th year

23:32

I means I turned 56 in case you don't count yours or a certain occasion one of the people who thought that 2000 was not really the beginning of the millennium at all because you can't do the one thing.

23:41

Yeah, there were a lot of people Anyway So I Am inching closer.

23:53

Well, it's not inching. It's running at full speed Toward the big six. Oh and the beginning of my seventh decade

24:02

Of life and that means I was raised in a different time There's been a lot of change and it's been accelerating a lot.

24:11

And so those of us from those time periods are

24:17

Feeling more and more and more Disconnected from the world around us because it is is just changing at a pace that is hard to conceive of and So when

24:32

I say I was raised as a fundamentalist What I when

24:39

I use that term it didn't have quite the number of negative connotations

24:45

That it does for most people today and even for me today In fact there was a time around 1999 or so I did a

25:01

Seminar on why I am a fundamentalist and what I was doing was I was focusing upon what the fundamentals were the historical work

25:10

That was a reaction a response to the rise of modernism and it was basically

25:20

You know a reaffirmation of the central aspects of the faith. It did have a particular eschatological bent to it but you know inspiration scripture high view of scripture supernaturalism all the things that historic liberalism pretty much ignored and rejected

25:39

It was not in its origins an anti intellectual anti -scholarship anti -meaningful biblical studies

25:49

Anti knowing what's going on in the world around you interacting with other perspectives.

25:55

It wasn't any of those things but Decades pass time passes and what we have seen

26:06

Take place over time is a

26:14

Isolationist type of movement an isolationist situation that has developed to where There is a there is a fundamental fear

26:29

I think that marks Fundamentalism today it is a fear to be exposed to Any thoughts other than those that are?

26:42

within a very very very narrow spectrum This is why when you listen to the worst fundamentalists today

26:51

They cannot help but just grossly misrepresent everybody that they attack

26:57

Because they don't understand what those people actually believe they won't take the time to seriously read and if they do read something or if they

27:07

Listen to a video they're doing it with such thick filters that they're only looking for things. They can attack

27:13

They're not looking to understand because they're not really looking to convert you They're not looking to have meaningful interaction with you this is a very fear based and when you're fear based then what you're gonna do is you're just going to Do the flamethrower type stuff and that's what you have with the

27:31

Steven Andersons in the world as you just have this Fear base fear -mongering, that's how they control their congregations is instilling fear in them and all the rest that kind of stuff and So modern -day

27:45

Fundamentalism the independent fundamentalist Baptist King James only Separatists this that the other thing type, you know, you end up with 47 descriptors

27:58

This kind of a of a movement Cannot engage the other side in any meaningful fashion because they don't do meaningful study of anybody else's perspective and They become a character of themselves and as has

28:18

Steven Anderson. I mean, that's just and that's what he wants for some reason evidently myself and Jeff Durbin have

28:31

Drawn their attention and They Seem to be very intense

28:40

Maybe we're making inroads. Maybe they know how because I've had a lot of people tell me yeah, you know I used to be part of that and then

28:47

I read your book on this or I watched this video that Jeff did over there and You know, and then

28:52

I started seeing You know, so maybe that's what's causing it.

28:57

You know, I don't Put notches in my in my in my gun

29:04

For stuff like that. I mean keep track of that kind of thing I'm just thankful and someone says hey, your ministry has been very helpful in getting me out of this

29:12

Movement or that movement or whatever else it might be Great. Wonderful. I don't sit there and go. Aha. I got that group again.

29:18

I don't have time to think think along those lines so Yesterday a

29:28

Video was posted I can play it. I don't have a key though a video was posted And I I'm pretty certain that I have put in fact,

29:39

I know that I have put up on The website well the website on Facebook and on Twitter and Announcements that next

29:53

Thursday That would be the 20th of December at 4 p .m

30:03

Our time 6 p .m Eastern Standard Time after Jason Robinson Who of Mountain Baptist Church, I believe in West Virginia who is the one who posted the

30:23

Video Talbot is a heresy of Jeff Durbin and James Lane I Don't know

30:31

I don't know what I was gonna say, I don't know what possessed me I Don't know

30:39

Why I thought of doing this, but as I was listening to Robinson's Laughable attack.

30:46

I mean again knows nothing about reformed theology knows nothing about reformed exegesis doesn't provide any meaningful

30:52

Criticism and you know still with you know, just the childish Nasty language and stuff like obviously no desire to actually

31:05

Reach out to us To use our language to communicate with us and anyway, no, none of that.

31:12

That's one of the marks of fundamentalism their apologetics is Only meant to win a battle for their side and it's not meant to actually

31:23

Tell anyone in the movement that they need to be not in that movement So this would be to convince a

31:29

Calvinist. They shouldn't be account anyway But the thought crossed my mind and I looked up the church and I found the contact information and I wrote to the church and I said

31:42

Because I figured this would be useful The best way that I know to compare and contrast

31:56

Two different perspectives such as this Especially when both sides are basically saying the other is completely off on Offline, of course, they're saying we're false teachers false prophets

32:06

Not Christians, etc, etc. I Don't know what their spiritual state is

32:13

But I know that they are not accurately handling the Word of God that's for certain is to challenge someone to present their interpretation of a particular text at the same time you do let you interact and My experience has been that really

32:34

That's really effective. Remember when I debated Tim Staples on first Corinthians chapter 3 How about how about remember in 2001 when

32:41

I did the cross -examination of dr Peter Stravinsky's on first Corinthians chapter 3 and Rome's use of that text to defend purgatory.

32:49

Remember that Wheels Absolutely fell off.

32:54

Oh Stravinsky's. I mean to this day He has not recovered from that cross -examination

33:00

Because he Just didn't know the text. He couldn't he couldn't deal with meaningful questions about the text.

33:07

I don't think Tim Staples could I'd certainly far better at blustering than Stravinsky's was but I Thought the cross -examination on the basis of first Corinthians 3 again elucidated the text very clearly made it clear what it was about and It's all

33:25

It's always better than just simply having One side posts their videos as I post their videos and then there's a response video and that response video

33:33

There may be some utilization to some of that some usefulness to some of that But it's far better to have the two sides

33:42

At the same time so you can see directly one same amount of time

33:48

Same time constraints in the same situation so you can see which side has to bring in extraneous traditions and beliefs

34:00

Because especially people in the independent fundamentalist Baptist kjvo only movement are

34:08

So deeply entrenched in their traditions. They don't even see they just the the grave danger of Their perspective is that they identify their traditions as the very word of God itself

34:21

They don't know they have traditions. They reject they have traditions They do have traditions and because they can't examine those traditions and based in scripture then those traditions actually become scripture and If you attack their traditions, you're attacking the

34:34

Bible. You'll hear that type of language in them all the time and so I wrote to The pastor and I said

34:44

I'd like to Invite you on the dividing line to do a time equal absolute equal time

34:54

Timed dialogue on Romans chapter 8 verses 28 through 34 so that includes the golden chain of redemption includes the statement of Romans 8 28 and it also includes

35:09

What I think is the Impossible to get around plain clear teaching

35:18

That is found beginning at verse 31 of the law court situation and Who exactly it is the

35:31

Christ is died for particular redemptions, I believe clearly taught there and So I wrote and To be honest with you not expecting a positive response and it did not take a whole lot of time

35:48

Before I got a positive response Saying here's what my working hours are during during the week.

35:59

So I need to do it at a time other than that and And That presentation is on sermon audio,

36:10

I have no idea how long that was put up there So I know which one that what you're referring to. Sorry The chat thing is sort of out of my line of sight.

36:17

So it's hard to see I should probably have down here. Um, anyway so we worked it out and So each is gonna each of us didn't have 15 minutes to present an exegesis of that tech.

36:29

That's tough enough as it is I mean, that's such a deep deep text.

36:35

But at the same time by having it fairly short You sort of help to Cut out some of the filibusterings can sometimes take place in something like this

36:48

So you have 15 minutes present your exegesis of that text and then the other guy's 15 minutes

36:55

Then each of us will have 15 minutes to ask the other one questions concerning their position And then we have five minutes closing statements only 70 minutes long hour and 10 minutes will be done

37:09

So that will be next Thursday. So almost almost exactly a week from right now

37:18

No, let's say no yesterday, sorry today's Friday when it's track of the day

37:24

So six days from almost exactly right now and So, I hope you put that down on your on your calendar be with us live when we we do that Might be doing a

37:42

Program before it sort of leading up to it. I'm not sure I was talking with okay.

37:48

I was talking with Jeff about doing that because He and I are he especially for some reason

37:56

I Think it's primarily because Steven Anderson went after him at that conference thing and there are a bunch of guys that just are trying

38:09

To be the next even Anderson like there's a lot of room for that We just need lots of Steven Anderson's Would be fitting these days with it.

38:23

Oh Oh a historic fundamentals, yeah, it is on sermon audio. Yeah Rich says he can't handle that much coogee in the studio

38:34

Yeah, we could definitely make sure that Jeff wears a coogee. We could double we could double the coogee elements to the

38:42

To the program. That would be that'd be awesome And there's nothing you can do about it.

38:47

So there you go anyway so that's coming up but That was one video

38:58

Anderson came out with his own video and This may be what

39:04

Jeff and I take time to respond to but I I just had to show you just this one section of this

39:11

Just to illustrate, you know, it's how I just my face just got really dark. That's because the primary light being provided In fact,

39:18

I need to put that back up because now I just it looks like I just descended into dark See how much better that is.

39:24

That's a cordage Sang it. I think keep a cordons up over there so that you can still see me

39:31

Is this dr. White's house? Yes, this is dr. White's house This is this is my what would you call it family room the kitchens right over there the other rooms living room anyways

39:44

That's my granddaughter Clementine right there Up on the wall. That was some really cute little pictures and taken of her when she was like two and a half or something

39:53

She's she's always been a really very photogenic child that the one of those pictures is like model level really nice, but anyway

40:03

A video I saw today from Steven Anderson, though. He doesn't speak in it. So I think it's from this church

40:11

Jeff Durbin's thinly veiled works salvation now if you if you remember

40:25

Back when I did the non debate two -and -a -half -hour

40:30

Interview two hours 20 minutes interview with Steven Anderson. I Wrapped it up when it started getting really weird.

40:39

I Did not realize when he came over that he was a cheap grace anti -lordship

40:48

Anybody who believes the historic reformed understanding of The relationship of faith and works

40:55

Actually, it's the soul of PDA as it was defined by the reforms that those people are all heretics

41:01

Once he started promoting that stuff. I was like, yeah, we're done. So He likes to attack anyone that has a biblically balanced soteriology that is that recognizes

41:21

The beautiful Balances found in Ephesians 70 For my grace you've been saved through faith and that not of yourselves is a gift of God not a worse

41:30

I mentioned both for we are his workmanship Created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which

41:35

God before they know we should walk in if you'll just listen to verse 10 For we are his workmanship created in or by Christ Jesus So There's no there's no ground for human boasting there

41:52

Jeff and I would both believe firmly That we are his workmanship that God is the one who saves the divine election is absolutely true

42:00

We cannot save ourselves. We're enemies of God. We're dead in our sins. We're running the opposite direction and He is the one who has not just simply made a way of salvation possible, but has actually

42:13

Accomplished it in and through Jesus Christ His Holy Spirit is powerful to bring about the salvation of God's elect and at his time in his way

42:23

He caused us to be born again. He raised us a spiritual life It's all of God for we are his workmanship created in Christ Jesus what?

42:33

unto not by but unto Good works, which

42:39

God has before ordained that we should walk in God is in charge of all of it the initial salvation as well as the walking in Sanctification that demonstrates the work of the spirit within you

42:55

He doesn't save us to just simply leave us sitting there in our sin he saves us to conform us to the image of Christ and So One of the main problems with the

43:10

IFB's and I remember this from my youth, uh, you know, once I got into Greek I I started really

43:17

I was honestly it was one of the first things that made me really uncomfortable in my education about my own background was that I knew that there were a lot of debates over The translation of the present participle of Soto in the

43:41

New Testament, what do I mean by that? Well Paul likes to compare and contrast

43:49

Those who are perishing with those who are being saved and The problem is that For some people and it would include these types of IFB's For some people

44:08

There is no category of being saved You either are or you're not there.

44:14

They find any kind of a recognition of a process To be of great concern because IFB's don't do categories well

44:28

You can see categories require you to think clearly and to hold things in contrast and to weigh things and Give certain weight to certain things and not as much weight to other things

44:42

You know that that's just sort of how it how it works they they don't they don't do that kind of thing and So you're either saved you're not saved.

44:51

There is no being saved And because of that the distinction in the various aspects of salvation is lost on me

45:00

And you see this a lot of the anti -colonists too. So for example even

45:06

Dave Hunt He would conflate categories So you've got regeneration

45:13

You have Forgiveness you have adoption You have sanctification

45:19

You've got obviously justification glorification all these things that historically we have recognized down through history that are a necessary element of Understanding the multifaceted nature of the work of God in what is broadly called salvation but there are

45:46

Elements that must must be distinguished one another We know that if you do not distinguish justification sanctification you end up with the error of Rome.

45:57

That's what Rome does that's where Rome's problems are is Conflating justification and sanctification and so Just as Rome has that problem the

46:10

IFB's have that problem They don't want to be associated But they have the same problem they will not make the necessary category distinctions and keep things clear in their speech and their in their minds and so there is a sense in which a person is either

46:31

Not saved or is completely saved, but there is another sense that we must allow for inscription

46:38

Where we are being saved and That it is a process and it's not a process based on what we do

46:48

It's just simply recognition that God has an intention the salvation of his people which is to conform them the image of Christ and so Unless we demand and this is another fundamentalist problem

47:01

There are fundamentalists who would say what you do is you come up with one meaning For everywhere in the

47:07

Bible and you enforce that on every single text the result is Insanity, but that's what you get

47:17

That's the problem and so saved Can't be distinguished from Regeneration and forgiveness and justification and sanctification.

47:30

No, that's this you just put all together and This leads to all sorts of problems all sorts of problems.

47:39

And so when folks who have this It cripples their ability to interpret their their traditions limit them and cripple their ability to hear the categories of Scripture itself and to take all of scriptural teaching and Hold it in harmony with itself to harmonize it you end up making your traditions here, this is it and everything else just ends up getting flattened down and and and and there you go and So this is what is taking place as this video from Anderson attempts to attack

48:20

Jeff Jeff did a video on the relationship of faith and works because we deal with people who need to get a

48:32

Biblical understanding of exactly what the relationship of faith and works is. It's a common question.

48:37

We get it all the time You have to be able to work through James chapter 2 you have to be able to explain

48:43

James chapter I've preached on it out how many times and if you're afraid of James chapter 2 don't tell me you really believe the

48:49

Bible Don't don't tell me you really believe the Bible. I understand. Hey, it gets misused by cultists all the time

48:56

So what it's still Scripture still given by the Holy Spirit of God. It's still necessary. You should love it and If it's used by a false teacher all the time

49:03

Then you better learn how to respond to it either that or just don't deal with that particular faults faults range of false cults and isms and so on so forth.

49:16

So Jeff did a presentation. I don't know where it was. I'm sort of looking at a freeze -frame of it up here on the relationship of faith and works and You know

49:30

Jeff and I are not the same person and Jeff has different views and I do like an eschatology, but I don't know that it's that huge of a difference, but we do and that's okay

49:43

But when it comes to stuff like this Listening to him and listening to me or you're hearing the same stuff.

49:50

That's that's you've got to have that kind of unity to be able to work with people in in ministry and that's one of the reasons that That I am very comfortable being

50:00

Under his leadership at apologia, and he's comfortable having me there to provide

50:08

Backup and do anything else that I can to be an assistance to the church So his explanation is exactly what

50:16

I would say so I just want you to see this one little clip and Like I said, the software's pretty neat.

50:24

I think of course, I'm not seeing it, but rich television screen But let's take a look at this at this little clip here and How they respond and then we'll we'll go from there.

50:38

So here's the here's the clip I missed it.

51:13

Sorry Bingo that's what

51:19

I want right there Catch that screenshot He has just said if your church does not recognize and understand the relationship of faith and works and that good works are a natural result of the work of the

51:32

Spirit of God That church doesn't have the gospel and notice the the screenshot. That's not what

51:38

Romans 4 or 5 sets now as we Saw on the last biting

51:48

When we went through Another IFB video

51:54

These folks Think that merely quoting a scripture without executing without giving in context without any concern about how it fits into the argument

52:03

Just just throw it out there and you can simply trust You can simply trust that the prejudice of Your The prejudice of your audience

52:20

Oh Okay, sound not coming through started over it was on my end fixed

52:29

So, I'm glad that rich is saying it wasn't the software It was it was it was rewind try it again.

52:38

All right. All right. All right You can you can we can make this happen.

52:43

It's not overly difficult to do All right, pretty much right here and we will try it again and There we go

53:00

It always has worse if it is truly saving faith

53:06

It will produce worse because it's a divine faith given by God that's real if a church doesn't have a

53:17

Statement of believe That says That true faith is always accompanied by works

53:25

Then that faith doesn't understand the gospel Let's see what the

53:31

Bible says Ephesians 2 8 and not okay. So it goes into a miss only to 89 by the way

53:38

Not to 8 to 10, which would completely and utterly destroy their point but What I want to focus upon was

53:49

Putting that up there and saying that's not what Romans 4 or 5 sets really

53:56

Isn't it interesting that we address this just recently on the program, but let's take a look at it again

54:04

Yeah, someone in chat trying to talk to me as if I can both do the program and chat at the same time it's sort of difficult to do but anyway, let's take a look at Romans chapter 4 verse 5 and Let's get the context.

54:20

Shall we? here is accordance Bible software Romans chapter 4

54:27

What then shall we say that Abraham our forefather according to flesh has found unless you take the

54:34

NT right reading of that word gets really weird, but Having established in the preceding section

54:42

Romans chapter 3 the concept of justification the freeness of the And by the way, when

54:48

I say we do this in the program, I just realized this was I covered this in the solas presentation at grace life prior in prior,

54:58

Oklahoma last week so we linked to those particular presentations if you want to go back through them and Follow this particular section, which was on soul feeding anyway

55:10

For if Abraham Was justified by works he has reason to boast but not cross they on before God for what do the scriptures say and then he has a citation of Genesis 15 6 a

55:26

Abraham Abram believed In God and it was credited or reckoned to him for righteousness or as righteousness then

55:38

What you have? Now to please notice what's being discussed here what's being discussed is justification not regeneration not sanctification not adoption adjustification

55:54

The IFB's don't make a distinction so they can't talk about the difference between justification and sanctification

56:01

Hence, they can't really critique Roman Catholicism other than just rail at it and scream at it and yell at it and and so Because they won't let the context determine that they end up making the kinds of mistakes that they do and as a result falsely attacking

56:20

Jeff who makes the proper distinctions who recognizes What is being said and can tell that there's one conversation going on in Romans chapter 4 and there's another conversation

56:31

Going on later on in Romans chapter 6 Where you do have the discussion of these things or even

56:39

Romans chapter 7 into Romans chapter 8 the the fundamentalist mindset cannot follow careful lines of thinking and thought and therefore ends up conflating things and creating

56:53

Problems and hence attacking someone who's speaking the truth So does Romans 4 5 contradict what

57:00

Jeff is saying? No, let's let's notice something and I again pointed this out probably a little bit more fully if you want to watch the grace life prior presentations

57:10

I'll try to remember when I write this up to put the link to it because there's a playlist for all the solar but When you in fact, you know what?

57:20

Oh, this could I wonder if I change this Hmm, I dare not do that.

57:26

I Can blow everything up If you look at these

57:35

These two verses Toe day air gods on men. No, I'm a sauce like it's a type of cotton a la cotta

57:42

I'll file a ma but to the working one and to my Greek students right now Who are trudging through the almost?

57:50

Almost done just finished chapter 31 and mouses. There's not much farther to go.

57:55

We just did part of it Substantive partisan this here's the substance of some type of person to the working one to the working one

58:04

But then notice verse 5 Toe day may air gods on metal toe day air gods.

58:12

No, what's the difference the word may so Verse 5 is the direct negation of verse 4

58:23

You've put in the particle may To the one not working

58:30

To the one working so this is a contrast this is a 108 degree contrast between these two position so to the working one the wage

58:42

The it's not a reward. It's the ways what's earned the sauce these and by the way all through verse 4

58:48

These are the standard Greek terms that would be used of business debt

58:56

All these things very very straightforward very very standard to the one working the

59:04

Wage is not reckoned or credited Kata Karen literally according to grace or as a favor something that's free as a gift

59:12

But kata off filing mom. So notice kata kata It's not according to the categories of grace, but according to the categories of debt

59:22

So if you are if you are trying to do something to receive something from God Then what you get is what you're owed.

59:31

You're doing something to put God in the position of debtor ship That's what air gods on metal implies but to be not working one

59:43

But this is day being used as the adversity but on the other side

59:49

This you auntie believing upon the one justifying the ungodly

59:57

So this is the God who Justifies the God who credits down here in verse 6 the

01:00:04

God who who credits? imputes righteousness apart from works

01:00:09

Here is the one not working but believing upon the one who's justifying the ungodly

01:00:15

This is why Joseph Smith not understanding this change this in his own quote -unquote translation

01:00:20

He could not translate any of this so it shouldn't be called translation but He says the God who says not justified because he could not understand how

01:00:28

God could justify the ungodly because Joseph Smith never understood the Gospel, I didn't understand grace in any way shape or form

01:00:38

So not working but believing upon the one who justifies the ungodly His faith hey pistas out to the faith of the believing one not the working one is credited as righteousness so the context of Romans 4 or 5 has nothing to do with living the

01:01:01

Christian life has nothing to do with the Results of the work of the Holy Spirit within this has nothing.

01:01:06

It's not a contradiction to Ephesians 2 10 Which says that we have been created by Christ Jesus unto good works

01:01:14

Which God's before a day that we should walk in them. That's why they didn't even quote that I mean that that is just right next to dishonest how you can try to refute what just said by quoting

01:01:25

Ephesians 2 8 9 and skipping verse 10 I Don't know Hey, it's possible that the the tradition was so thick in these people thinking that they don't even see that next verse

01:01:36

Consider what it might possibly mean, but it's it's astonishing.

01:01:42

It really is So what is verse what is verse 5 talking about it's talking about justification and that justification is by faith and That that faith is reckoned as righteousness

01:01:54

Jeff believes all of those things He just believes the rest of the Book of Romans and the rest of the

01:02:00

Ephesians and everything else that comes along with that Which tells us that that same faith his faith is reckoned as righteousness that faith is gift of God and Since it is a gift of God.

01:02:11

It is imparted by the Spirit of God and Let me just give you one passage just to Tie this all together.

01:02:20

I'm not sure how that happened Titus 2 11

01:02:27

For the grace of God has appeared bringing salvation to all men Remember I was pointing out the problems this with him not him

01:02:34

Jeff, but Anderson himself instructing us to the nine goddess world desires with a sensibly righteously and godly in the present age the

01:02:44

Grace of God that brings salvation is a grace that instructs us

01:02:50

I do this up it is it is a training grace and disciplining grace and instructing grace It does not leave us so that we

01:03:00

Love ungodliness and worldly desires and Do not know how to live sensibly righteously and godly the present day

01:03:06

You can't make heads with tails out of the New Testament If you do not see this balance if you do not see the balance of Ephesians chapter 2 verse 10.

01:03:15

We mentioned it before but Quickly, why does it keep doing that? I don't know if it's a just the way

01:03:23

I'm sitting here this way For we are his poem on his workmanship

01:03:31

Created not creating ourselves, but being created I would say by The love the instrumental concept here in the day of by Christ Jesus unto ergo ace agathois good works and It is those ergo ace agathois, which?

01:03:51

God prepared beforehand in order that we might and it's it's literally to walk paraphernalia, but That's the standard terminology to live it's it's what we're to live in it's to be descriptive of how we

01:04:07

Live to walk live in them. What's the antecedent of our choice? ergo ace agathois good works

01:04:15

Good works. How do you deal with that? And isn't amazing that they quote

01:04:22

Ephesians 2 8 to 9 and skip to 10, which is the utter reputation of their position.

01:04:28

That's That's what you got. That's what you have when you have tradition that overrides exegesis and You just follow that excuse that that tradition rather than the excuse it.

01:04:42

So I'm hoping and this time of year I'm hoping but so many things can come up, you know,

01:04:53

Jeff's pastoring a church and it's not goes on and I I might have stuff come up.

01:04:59

I don't know but we're gonna try to get to it Look, it would just be fun for the two of us to do it

01:05:05

And take apart a bunch of these clips. It's not difficult to do. It really isn't but it's very

01:05:17

Very very Most people say that's when we get into text like this You put you put the

01:05:23

Greek text up there and you walk through it and you've got a clear position You're responding to you accurately represented because you played it.

01:05:29

You've let them say it for themselves That's where they really learn a lot. And so We want people to get to learn so that's what we are gonna try to do

01:05:39

We'll see if we can make it work out if not We'll we'll see what happens.

01:05:44

But anyway, so with that I want five minutes over because it want to go back You need to go back and replay that but some strange stuff going on in the world tonight.

01:05:54

Very strange So I appreciate your watching the program today, I hope it was useful to you even with a different background

01:06:02

It's not quite as high a quality camera as the cameras we have but that's okay, the information is the saying that we're able to put up the

01:06:12

Biblical text and deal with things as well. So I Am out of town on Monday and Tuesday of next week.

01:06:21

So right now A slight possibility of a late program on Wednesday If not, then maybe a big humongous program on Thursday, which would include the 70 minute interaction with pastor

01:06:43

Robinson on Romans chapter 8 We'll see we'll see and then of course next week is the holidays

01:06:52

Tuesday. I think I think Christmas is Tuesday Maybe get to do something later in the week

01:07:00

I don't know, but then I'm teaching at code about to see a lot of seminary the third through the fifth

01:07:06

And so I believe on the second and so that that whole week is gone I think

01:07:12

I'm back one week and then g3 comes Then I'm gonna hopefully give you in Russia and then

01:07:17

Germany and all the rest of January's gone Yeah Yeah That's it's good to have something to do

01:07:26

And places to go and things to do and saints to edify. It's a good thing.

01:07:31

So anyways, hopefully this has been useful to you Hopefully at some point next week. We're back together with you with something that will be also equally useful to you.