117: Postmillennial Fan Fiction (Part 2 of Marcus Pittman Interview)

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Hello everyone and welcome back to the podcast where we prod the sheep and beat the wolf. This is part two of my

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Marcus Pittman interview post -millennial fan fiction. Well hello everyone and welcome back to the podcast.

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I'm so excited for this episode. I'm really excited because we almost had this episode, we didn't have this episode, now we have this episode.

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The Lord waited to the right moment to have this. The enemy tried to take you down, but we are back.

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For those who don't know, like right before last week we were doing this and I got a migraine like maybe like 10 minutes before the show and like I think we did five minutes.

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I said I'm gonna throw up so we're just gonna have to do this another time.

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I was just getting over a sinus infection that I've had for the past few weeks, but it's better because I did a podcast last week and I sounded like I had gunk in my throat the whole time.

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Must be miserable to listen to, but this time I think I think we'll be okay. You know man, the sermons that I preach that are right after me like puking my guts out, they're always the best because I'm like,

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I'm like, something's trying to take me out. The Lord has preserved me for this. Got all the demons out.

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You got all the demons out. I'm excited man because last time we talked we were talking about how the arts and movies intersects with post -millennial thinking.

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You're the founder of Lure TV, which give that a plug. It's great. You guys are funding new movies, new projects.

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You walked us through the history of why art matters and why we need to invest in good art.

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Why that's a part of Jesus taking dominion of the world is having that kind of medium expressed biblically and joyfully.

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One of the phrases that stood out that really let me know we needed to do a second episode was you were talking about some of the ideas in all of this and you used this term that someone had labeled you with kind of as an insult.

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I'm going to own it. They called you post -millennial fan fiction. What is that all about?

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Well, fan fiction is usually when you write off skirts to the canon, right?

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It's off skirts to the canon. I think we have our canon, which is scripture.

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I like to think, okay, well, what does this look like? What does

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Christianity look like 10 ,000 years from now, should Jesus delay? What does

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Christianity look like 100 ,000 years from now or a million years from now post -consummation?

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Because the world still exists. The Bible says the sun and moon will rise and the seasons will change until heaven and earth pass or as long as heaven remains or whatever.

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But I don't think heaven's going anywhere, right? I don't think the existence of matter and the world

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God created has any plan on leaving. We'll get into the scripture that obviously proves that case, but I think it's a bigger, less gnostic view of our involvement in the world and turning the universe into a garden.

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Well, let's sort of set up tonight. We're meeting right now. It's 7 p .m.

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my time. I think you're around 4 p .m., 5 p .m. your time. But I've been kind of going through this series called

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Practical Postmillennialism for a couple months now, and I want to make postmillennialism practical to folks who maybe never heard of it, or maybe they grew up breathing the sort of dispensational air that this country has offered for the last hundred years or so.

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I'm trying to show that this is the biblical view. Recently, I was going through the prophets, and the prophets are really bold in what they claim is going to happen.

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A light bulb went off in my own mind that everything that was lost in the fall is going to be restored by Christ.

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The final enemy is death, and then you've got eternal state. But before that, it's not like God's not having some impact on the physical world.

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As Christians use the term Gnostic. As Christians, we often think about salvation, my quiet time, my time in the word, my this, my...

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We think about how redemption has affected our soul, but not our body. So help us understand, and maybe this is a segue into what you were talking about, is help us understand what postmillennialism is promising in a holistic sense.

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Yeah. Well, basically, postmillennialism says we're not going to be escaped away.

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We have work to do, but the result of our work will further the gospel, and as the gospel fills the earth, the world will be restored back to the

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Garden of Eden until the point where the last enemy to be defeated is death.

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So I always say that whenever I hear a guy, and he's like, we're going to invest this venture capital in this company that's going to try to stop death, like some deep tech, whatever.

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I'm like, man, your return on that investment is the last final return on that sort of thing.

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It's ridiculous. But, and I don't know when you want me to go into this.

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Let's go. I do believe that we're going to delay death a lot.

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And I think prior to Christ returning, we'll live for the 900 years that Methuselah and all those pre -flood did again.

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I think scripture is clear about that. Bonson convinced me of this as well. And so that gets you thinking in terms of a lot of science fiction sort of stuff.

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I mean, it's going to be very hard. Let's just say we live 500 years.

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If we live 500 years, it's going to be very hard for faithful children to walk away from the faith when the great -great -great -great -grandfather is sitting on the porch as the patriarch who brought this family into 500 years of faithfulness.

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So it's easy now for a generation to lose track of who their grandfather even might be.

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But as our ages increase, we'll be able to do that.

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But I want to go back, because we'll get to that, because that's the teaser as to where we're going. But what

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I want to do, I think we should start with the curses in Genesis and what a lot of people don't think about in terms of the reverses of those same curses that happened in Genesis.

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So it's not something that's future, but it's both and. So the first one is

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Genesis 3. I'm going to go back to it. Come on.

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I don't think we've found a Bible software that has a really good user interface yet.

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It's part of the curse that needs to be reversed. Somebody needs to invest in some UX design on Bible software, that's for sure.

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Quit investing in death reversal and upgrade our Bible platforms. That's right. So starting in Genesis 3, you have the

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Garden of Eden. They eat the fruit. And then one of the curses is, you shall not eat of it.

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Curses the ground because of you. In pain, you shall eat for all the days of your life, thorns and thistles that shall bring for you, and you shall not eat the plants of the field.

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So we have this cursing of the ground, this toil, this hard work of the ground that happens in Genesis 3.

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So that gets us very quickly to Genesis 4 or 5.

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Genesis 5, verse 28. When Lamech had lived 182 years, he fathered a son and called his son

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Noah, saying, Out of the ground that the Lord has cursed, this Noah shall bring us relief.

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This is relatively quickly. And then, of course, you have the flood.

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He builds the ark, and then he gets off the ark. And when he gets off the ark in Genesis 8, so we always go to Genesis 9 about the rainbow and no more will

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God flood the waters and all this sort of stuff. There's an additional promise there that I think is actually part of the same.

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It says, And when the Lord smelled the pleasing aroma, the Lord said in his heart, I will never again curse the ground, because a man, for the attention of man's heart, is evil from the youth.

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Neither will I ever again strike down every creature as I have done. So there's two, right? So there you have the flood, as I have done.

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But then you also have never again will I curse the ground on account of man. So that doesn't mean that the ground's not still cursed.

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Even today, there's still curses. But after the flood, we have this amazing agricultural revolution like the world's never seen before.

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So it's like, well, how did that happen? Because the ground is not being cursed, the planets, the earth, the stars in the heavens, they're not being cursed as a result of the works of man.

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That doesn't mean we still don't have floods. It doesn't mean we still don't have earthquakes, and we don't have local judgment of God.

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For sure we do. But if you look at just the science of the agricultural revolution, and even the science and technology of navigation, and taking control of the earth through the winds and stuff through early sail and stuff like that, and compass.

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Basically, as the gospel's gone forth, it's just expanded on all the more. So that I think is really significant, because we don't ever talk about that.

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Noah's name was that he would bring relief from the curse of the hands. And then when

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Noah gets off the ark, that curse is lifted. So Noah's faithfulness and belief in God and stewardship of what he had to build the ark and to bring his family on,

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I think led way to the first basically reversal of that curse.

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Because of Christ, of course, right? So it's not because of Noah or anything, but because of Christ and his faithfulness to Christ.

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So there was a reversal of that curse. So that curse is lifted.

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Suddenly, everybody can do amazing feats.

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There's agricultural. There's probably more, I believe, technological innovation during this phase in Babel than we've ever seen in the history of the world, probably since the

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Industrial Revolution at this point. And then they get together and they build the Tower of Babel, and it's all for evil.

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And God doesn't curse the ground, right? He doesn't curse the ground. So, well, you know, I don't know.

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You're back now. Okay. That might happen. My microphone does that with Riverside.

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So he doesn't curse the ground. He doesn't make it harder to make bricks.

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Instead, he curses the people, and he separates the languages, splits them up, makes it harder for them to speak.

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And then that gets us all the way to Acts chapter two, where you see the reversal of the Tower of Babel, and everybody can speak their own languages again.

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And since then, we can look practically at scientific innovation when it comes to communication and innovation.

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And you see this just tremendous advancement of everything from paper, the invention of paper, right?

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All of scripture was written on papyrus. 4 ,000 years of writings was written on the same form of communication, and that was done by hand.

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And then paper got invented about 100 AD, or it was invented before that, but it was never really valued until post -crucifixion, and then it really spread.

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And then you get to the printing press, and the printing press, obviously, by Gutenberg, who, by the way, this is something

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I always point out when I talk about venture capital and investments. He died penniless. Gutenberg did.

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Nobody believed in his invention. And the people that did believe in his invention rejected it because of the disruption it would cause technologically to what

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I call the monk villages, where they would handwrite stuff, right? And it was actually, it didn't get any use at all until Gutenberg, or one of his acquaintances,

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I'm not sure the specifics of the story, but Gutenberg basically decided, he went to the

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Catholic church and said, hey, you can print a lot of papal indulgences with this machine.

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I think that was the only thing that really got the printing press out to the public and not locked in his basement all along.

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He still died penniless, but that was one of the things that actually resulted in the favor of the printing press, which

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I find is just an amazing story. So printing press comes, and that, obviously, it was

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Martin Luther that really took advantage of that tech. And he did branding and print design and was the first to print music on paper and books, and just bookstores started opening up.

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One of the most significant inventions of the last thousand years, for sure.

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And then you get to a lot of other technological innovations up until that point, electricity, for sure.

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But then you get to, well, probably what I think is probably the most significant invention ever done by a

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Christian, and it's Samuel Morse's Morse code. And so Gary North writes about this, and he says that the day before the telegraph was invented, the speed of communication was only that of the ability at the fastest of horses.

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So I think maybe three miles an hour is probably what a horse would top out at long -term.

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So that's as far as your communication is. And the story, what happened was Samuel Morse was a painter, he was an artist, and he was doing a painting for a client out of town, and his wife died.

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And he got a letter that said, by the time you get this message, your wife will be dead and buried, so continue your work and come back home and mourn later.

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And so he was just haunted by this idea that he couldn't get word back about his wife being sick fast enough.

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And you can read really just the... When I say

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Samuel Morse was a Christian, he was a legitimate catechized Christian. You can read some of the letters from his family during this time, where his mom's reminding him of the

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Westminster Convention of Faith to bring glory to God. And it's just an amazing, amazing story.

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And no one's made a movie, a Christian movie, about this. So telegraphs invented.

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The very first telegraphed words was, what hath God wrought, quoting from scripture, and it was the blessings of God on a nation.

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And the Senate rejected it because it was too expensive. He presented it before the

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United States Senate and the Senate said it was too expensive. Thankfully, they said that because it immediately went to all the companies to create telegraph lines all across the country.

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And then that gets you to the transatlantic cable. And both of these technologies, Morse code and transatlantic cable, we still use foundationally today.

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Obviously, the telegraph is a series of dits and dots, dots and dashes, or ones and zeros that were used for binary code, for digital communication.

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And then the transatlantic cable was tried several times. It failed every time.

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And then the Christian that finally did it, the England ship and the

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American ship met in the middle of the ocean and they soldered the cable together and they prayed a prayer in the middle of the ocean.

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And then that's what did it. And the first transatlantic communication to the

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Queen of England from the president basically was a post -millennial statement about how this technology can be used for the furtherance of the gospel among the nations and all this other things.

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And people wrote hymns. People wrote hymns and praised to God for this technology at the time.

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It's like, we don't do that. We're not writing hymns and praise to God for AI right now.

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We're fearful of it. We're gnostic of it, for sure. So you just see, really, and there's other technological inventions too that have been started by Christians and I believe will only ever be invented by Christians.

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I think there are significant scientific breakthroughs left for us to discover, but it won't happen without the gospel being the foundation of that invention.

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And so I'm not a materialist.

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When I talk about post -mill fan fiction, this is my foundation and I'm not a materialist.

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But I believe that God, when he spoke things into existence, that was miraculous.

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And I believe that when Jesus healed lepers, that was miraculous. But I also don't believe that God works outside of what's logical in the world that he created that's a reflection of his nature.

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So I think, and I would love to have the capital to be able to invest in companies that think this way with me, that everything that Jesus did, it's possible somehow scientifically that we can do.

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So teleportation into the building, the disciples being teleported,

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I don't think we can just speak it into existence. I don't think we can be miraculous with it.

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But I think just like antibiotics helps us cure diseases that Jesus cured instantly by his word,

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I don't think any of the miracles God did is outside of the laws of the world that he's built for us to be able to discover somehow how to do.

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And so - Tavis We got to get into that because that's great. That's jumping us a little way.

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As a recap though, and I love what you said back in the reversal of the curse from Lamex Prayer and Genesis, you said, was it four,

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I believe? 4? Genesis - Matthew No, it wasn't Genesis 4.

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Tavis So Lamex Prayer is Genesis 5? Matthew Yeah. Tavis When Noah is born, and that's what

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Noah means. That's a name. That's what his name means. He will lift the curse from the ground.

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Matthew So I love that. So I love that because right before that the world was stuck in this period of just futility, misery, and cursing.

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God lifts an aspect of it, and then technological revolution happens. And then you see the exact same thing.

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I mean, Jesus took upon his brow the crown of thorns. Why don't we see that as a further lifting of the curse on the land?

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Tavis Well, that's the finishing of it for sure, right? In the sense of there's no more work to be done for the curses to be lifted.

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So now there's still work for us to do to turn the earth back into a garden.

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I think it's Andy Crouch, or who's - not Andy Crouch, I think. Somebody said,

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Adam and Eve was placed in a garden, not a forest. Matthew Yeah. Tavis So it was already cultivated.

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It was already beautiful. There's already pathways and walkways to walk through. It was a garden.

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And so the rest of the earth was forest. And so their job is to beautify the entire earth.

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That's our job now. And we do that evangelistically. We get that. We had the missionary revolution in the 1900s.

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So we get the evangelistic part. And now I think what we're coming to terms with is the practical part.

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So obviously, there's a political restoration that needs to happen.

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And I think we're starting to sense that with all the discussion about Christian nationalism and Christ as King being anti -Semitic and people getting mad about it.

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So I think we're starting to say, okay, well - and I don't know which order

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God's going to use. So missionary and then once we're saved now, we change the government.

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I thought we already did that in 1776. I think it's a great example of that happening, but we've forgotten it.

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So we've got to be reminded about that again. And I think that's starting to happen. But there's also, I don't think it's going to happen with the boomer generation.

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I think it's too late for them. But I think the successful entrepreneurs that come up, the successful Christian entrepreneurs that are coming up now that are rejecting boomer philosophy, which is mainly,

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I'm only going to invest in stuff that I'm going to use. So I'm only going to invest in cruise lines because I want to go on cruises.

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Or I'm only going to invest in a movie that I want to see, but I'm not going to build machines that create movies because I probably won't like some of those.

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So that's boomer mentality. That's how they invest. But I think the ones coming up after that, the successful entrepreneurs are going to invest in venture that furthers the kingdom as more totality.

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So there's going to be a more investment in technology that serves a worldwide purpose that's bigger than just,

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I want to return on my investment. That'll come. That comes with any sort of cultural or technological advancement, but it's not so much a personal return on investment as it is a global return on investment, which makes a bigger

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ROI for you individually. Just to add to what you're saying,

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I think so much of the boomer generation has, they've lived through some pretty horrific things that have happened in the world.

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Sort of, as they've pulled away, and just speaking of Christians here, as they've pulled away from culture, culture has gotten worse.

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And there's this isolationist tendency there that I've heard folks from this generation say,

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I'm not going to leave anything to my children because why would I do that? The world's as bad as it is. It's all just going to crash and burn.

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I'm not going to have children. I knew people that believed that when they were dispensationalist too.

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So there's just a lot of that. But I think what we're looking at now is

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Christians with capital and that have backbone and are not risk averse.

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They're not burying their talents in the sand and they're not cowards according to Revelation.

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And so they're like, what do we invest in that's really going to change the world?

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Why are the conservatives or the Christians never the ones that are pioneering something like AI?

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Even AI, I think it's going to be tremendously amazing, really powerful. I'm 100 % that AI is important and we should invest in it.

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But I still don't think AI is truly going to be unlocked until the gospel's at the center of it.

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So God is basically going to Tower of Babel every technological innovation and restrict it unless the gospel is at the center of it.

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So that gets to Isaiah 65. So Isaiah 65,

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I have it pulled up here. So this is the prophet talking about God creating new heavens and new earth.

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And so we read this as dispensationalists and go post -consummation. This is what happens after Jesus returns.

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This is the promise of heaven. For behold, I create new heavens and new earth.

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Former things shall not be remembered or come into mind. But then it goes on in verse 20. It says, no more shall there be in it an infant who lives but a few days or an old man who does not fill out his days.

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For the young man shall die a hundred years old and the sinner a hundred years old shall be accursed.

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There's this promise of long life, but there's also still death. So it's not post -consummation at all.

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So there is a promise of long life. No more shall there be an infant who lives but a few days.

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That's insane. And it says the young man shall die a hundred years old. So he'll be a hundred years old and people will go, man, he was so young.

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What a tragedy. What a cursed sinner. Yeah. That's what it goes on to say that they'll call him accursed if he dies at a hundred.

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Yeah. Right. So it's like, that's an insane mindset that you never hear anybody ever talk about.

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Nobody ever talks about that. The dispensational, amillennialism doesn't have a place for that.

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Dispensationalism would say, well, this is like only during that thousand -year reign.

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And it's like, yeah, but there's still death during a thousand -year reign?

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It doesn't make any sense. So I think postmill theology is the only thing that can really justify that.

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So the question is, is it worth Christian's time and money to think of ways that we can extend the life of man longer than 120 years?

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And I would say there is. And I don't know what that is because that's not my field.

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But I believe in the world right now, there's everything that's needed to be able to extend the life of man that long.

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And a lot of that might be generational. I know a lot of people who believe there's going to be radical dietary shifts as the gospel goes forth.

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I've heard less eating meat, which makes sense because in the same passage, it says the lion shall eat the straw like the ox.

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So a lot less animal death, I think, is probably part of it too. So I've heard the vegetarian discussion from a postmill lens, which

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I think is just too early in time. Yeah, that doesn't sound like victory to me. For me to embrace that one yet, but I totally get, obviously, there's going to be less animal death.

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Let me ask you this, brother. So I can imagine anybody who's listening to this is having a million red flags popping up in their head.

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It's about salvation. This world is broken. This world's not my home.

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I'm just a passing through. Why would I want to invest in prolonging my suffering and my sojourning here when really it's about salvation?

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It's about leaving here and going to be with God. I'm obviously playing the devil's advocate. Well, I would say that James makes it clear it's not just about salvation.

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It's about faith and works in the life of a believer. And so if you don't have works, your faith is dead.

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So I think that's a very solid objection to Gnosticism that says there's something inherently evil with the world or what exists.

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And I would say the same thing for digital Gnosticism too, when you think anything digital or technology -based is inherently evil.

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But I think this is part of the original plan and intent of Adam and Eve in the garden was to restore the earth, or not restore it, but to beautify the earth.

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And then our job as a result of Adam is to do the job that they failed to do. It's what we're still called to be fruitful, multiply, and fill the earth.

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And fill the earth with what? Right? Just bodies? No. Beauty, technology, science, art, books, movies,

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TV shows, culture, government and politics are all part of that, of being fruitful and multiplying.

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So it's multiplying the Christian worldview as well, and multiplying the works of Christians through different things.

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So what you're saying is that it's human to want these things, because we were designed for these things in the garden to be fruitful, multiply, and take dominion of the earth in all of the various ways that that happens.

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So that's a human impulse, and seculars are doing it, whether they know it or not.

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Leftists are the most post -millennial people you've ever seen. I mean, they've been working on the

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LGBT agenda for a hundred years. Yeah. And we don't ever do that.

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Very rarely do we play that long game with anything.

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Mm -hmm. Not even mission work. It's almost all about sharing the gospel, but you guys go to do mission trips for two weeks, and then you come back, your missionary vacation package, right?

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You get that, you go there, you feel bad about yourself, and you go on to live your life. But the missionary play is a lot longer than most people really think of it as.

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I mean, when you sit down and say, I'm going to go to the jungles in the Pacific Asian islands, well, you're supposed to go there for the rest of your life, right?

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There's circumstances, of course, but that should be the plan. And then it shouldn't just stop there after your life.

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It should say, well, how are my grandkids going to continue the missionary work I've done that I've established there with them there?

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So we're talking about, I'm going to go be a missionary. I'm going to share the gospel with people. That's the first thing.

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But after that area gets inundated with the gospel, you should have third world countries become first world countries.

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There should be economic success. There should be health and prosperity, not in the health and wealth sense.

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I'm not talking about that, but I'm just talking about that's what the gospel brings. That's why you have first world nations.

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That's the difference between first world nations and third world nations is longer life and financial prosperity, and then third world nations.

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David Chilton talks about this in his book, Productive Christians in the Age of Guilt Manipulators.

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He talks about, he's like, no amount of money you send to Africa is going to convince them of the capitalistic work ethic required to save their land.

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It's only the gospel. And God is going to continue to keep that ground cursed as long as the gospel isn't the foundation.

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Mr. Beast can pump as many wells in Africa as he wants, but it's not going to create prosperity and turn third world nations into first world nations.

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It's just not going to happen. Your first world nations, when they reject the gospel like America's doing, you start to see it crumble into a third world nation, which is exactly what you see in LA and New York right now, especially

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Portland too. There are these economic factors that result as a result of faith and the gospel.

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It's not a miraculous, you're a Christian now and you just won the lottery yesterday.

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It's not that at all. You're a Christian now, now get to work and build a nation for 200 or 300 years and with Christ as King and the forefront.

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That's how you build these things out. Richard Dawkins just bemoaned this.

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He's watching secular Europe and England specifically that he helped build that secular ethos.

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He's watching it completely erode and he's - And now calling himself a cultural Christian. Now calling himself a cultural

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Christian. I prefer a world where Christianity exists, even though I believe none of it. Right. But that's exactly what scripture says.

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It says the jealousy of the pagans will bring them to the knowledge of the Lord. I think we see that a lot right now.

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I was following the quartering, Jeremy, who's a big

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Twitter following rumble guy, and he's talking about reading the Bible right now for the first time.

37:03

Well, why is this happening when the world's falling apart and everybody's like, this nation was built on Christianity, right?

37:13

What does that mean? What does it look like? I'm going to start reading the Bible. So I think that's there.

37:22

And so I think that also frees us as Christians to think about how to turn science fiction into science reality and those sorts of things.

37:33

It shouldn't be Elon. If Elon, I just watched his presentation that he did on basically how we're going to get to Mars.

37:45

What's the next phase? Now that Starship can successfully get to space and Starship is the first space vehicle that can not only get us to Mars, but it can send the tons and tons of material that's required to live sustainably on Mars.

38:07

And he's speaking about this from a completely humanist standpoint.

38:15

Whereas he was talking about how life in the universe is really relatively short, maybe a conscious life humans is about maybe 10 ,000 years, right?

38:33

Imagine that. But basically he didn't say these words, but the words

38:40

I got from him are, maybe were the aliens that traveled to other worlds, right?

38:48

We always say, all the aliens are going to come here, but maybe were the aliens. And I think that's accurate.

38:54

I think God put us on earth. He prioritized earth as the central focus piece for all of creation.

39:03

What happened at Calvary obviously is the main focus and the purpose of everything.

39:09

And I think we're going to do space travel and we're going to travel the worlds.

39:15

And once we've beautified earth, we're going to beautify other planets as well.

39:20

So I think all of Elon's plans are wrongly foundational in humanism.

39:26

It makes me incredibly nervous to be on a ship to Mars. At least when they went on the moon, they took communion.

39:34

And then they read scripture back as they circled the moon for the first time. On Christmas day, they read back

39:41

Genesis 1. I don't remember which ones or which

39:48

Apollo mission it was, but I think they circled, they were the first to circumnavigate the moon, or they were coming back to earth or earth was in the picture or whatever.

40:01

And they're told, everyone on the planet is going to be listening to you.

40:08

So make sure you have an important Christmas day message for them. And they read Genesis, the creation story in Genesis from scripture.

40:15

And you can actually go here, if you ever go to the Answers in Genesis planetarium show, they play that clip before the show starts.

40:22

Just insane. So you had that that led us going to the moon and they had communion on the moon that was scheduled to take place at the exact same time as they were doing it at the congregation.

40:37

So it wasn't outside of the book of church order. And so it was just insane.

40:44

It was just insane amount of faith and Christianity that propelled really the space program.

40:52

So it makes me really nervous about Elon's program. Wasn't he the founder of NASA? Doesn't he have on his tombstone the heavens declare the glory of God or something to that effect?

41:03

Yeah, something like that. There's also the astronaut that goes to John MacArthur's church that did that.

41:11

He did a book on creation with photographs he took from space or something like that. And I think

41:19

MacArthur interviewed him or something like that, but he goes to MacArthur's church as an astronaut. So you've had this history of Christians in space or at least at the very least cultural

41:30

Christians in space. I don't know if I would consider those guys Christians anymore, but at least during that time, they thought themselves to be and they worked under the authority of their church and the permission of their church to do what they needed to do.

41:46

And I think one of the guys that took communion was an elder in his church. So Presbyterian church, it's

41:54

PCUSA now, but this was in the 60s. So it's hard to say what that church was at the time.

42:03

But again, you still have this foundation of cultural Christianity that led to space travel.

42:09

And I think I'm starting to see now people like Rod Martin and some other

42:15

Christians who are investing in space. And like Rod Martin said at the

42:21

Fight Life Feast conference several years ago, that he wants to plant the first church on Mars.

42:29

That's his goal. And he's investing in raising capital and building funds to build space companies that can help him achieve that goal.

42:40

And his premise behind it is basically everything Elon sets out to do, he does.

42:46

So if he says that there's going to be 100 ,000 people on Mars by the year 2050, it's very likely that's going to happen.

42:56

And we need to be prepared and we can't be thinking about how we're going to get a church planted out there.

43:02

We need to be the ones to do it. And we certainly don't want false religions to come out there and plant churches.

43:10

So the reformed faith leading the way and building those churches on Mars is going to be amazing.

43:21

And that's just Mars. We don't even know about intergalactic travel yet. We haven't invented it.

43:27

But there's no reason to think that that's not going to happen too, because it's all out there for God.

43:35

And there's probably going to be another 10 ,000 years of just the planets and the stars doing what they do to worship

43:43

God without any humans ever knowing about it. And eventually we will know about it and we'll be able to give

43:50

God praise and glory for it, because I think that's what he wants. Yeah. So you brought up intergalactic travel, colonizing and planting churches on Mars, teleportation, living to be 900 years old.

44:03

And as a pastor, I can't even convince, not consistently throughout my career,

44:10

I can't even convince people that alcohol in worship service is a good thing. It's crazy, right?

44:18

It's crazy. We got a long way to go. I don't think these are problems that are going to be solved tomorrow.

44:30

But what I would like to see is some Christians with deep capital now just investing in companies that's going to create more capital that can eventually invest in those sorts of things.

44:49

I think I would like to see a Christian company that's invested in using

44:57

AI to solve the problems, the consequences of sin on the body.

45:06

So whether that's extending long ages or getting rid of cancer, using AI to figure out what the heck is going on with cancer or anything else.

45:15

Let's figure that out. I think that's within the realm, but I don't think we're going to solve cancer.

45:22

I think we can solve cancer tomorrow, but I don't think we can solve cancer tomorrow without a gospel foundation.

45:30

Somebody was telling me about, I don't know all the details of this, but basically junk

45:35

DNA, which evolutionists thought, yeah, this DNA is just junk DNA. They've spent the past 20 years with this assumption that it was evolutionary disposed of DNA.

45:48

It turns out to be very important. All of our science for the past 20 years is on this premise of evolutionary theory that throws out this very important DNA.

45:58

So when you get a bunch of Christian creationists together and they're scientists and they say, Hey, let's look at this again.

46:07

I think it's possible that it'll be

46:12

Christians that reject evolutionary theory that figures out what it is that allows us to cure cancer.

46:18

And I think it's probably a very simple problem. You look at penicillin and you go, rotten oranges.

46:30

It was in the trash can the whole time. Millions of people died just because somebody didn't come along and go,

46:39

Hey, maybe this rotten mold on these oranges was useful for something.

46:45

Now what I'm getting ready to say is speculation. Yeah. Everything I said is pretty much speculation, but still.

46:50

That's what I'm getting ready to say. What I'm getting ready to say is basically speculation, but it could be real.

46:59

This is not speculation. Cancer is not going to be cured until there's a gospel foundation.

47:05

Amen. And the reason is because it probably could have already been cured if it wasn't such a financially lucrative industry.

47:14

You can't have a cancer research industry if cancer is cured. I really believe that the

47:19

God of money has stifled innovation in so much of the secular world because they don't have a gospel foundation.

47:26

In the conservative world, for sure. I got a message today from a big time conservative influencer who manages an investment fund.

47:39

And you would know him if I said his name, I'm not going to say his name. But the message he sent me on LinkedIn is,

47:46

I rarely check my LinkedIn on messages, but I rarely check my messages on LinkedIn.

47:53

But if you really want to get in touch with me, you can pay $800 a minute for a video call by clicking this link here.

48:01

And I was like, that is the worst venture capitalist I've ever seen.

48:07

Because I was told very early on, I'm very glad a guy at my church told me this very early on because it's never left me.

48:14

He said, when people are looking for venture capital, you're not asking for a handout, you're asking to bless someone.

48:24

And then the venture capitalist isn't looking to give a handout, he's looking to be blessed.

48:32

So you are risking time and labor, and he's risking capital.

48:37

There's a mutual risk there. And you're bearing each other's burdens that both of you profit at the end.

48:45

That's what venture capital is. So when you sit there and say, well, it's $800 a minute for me to just hear your idea, it's a scam, first and foremost, it's for sure a scam.

48:57

But it also creates barriers to entry that are unnecessary that make furthering capital in the world harder.

49:08

And so it's like a short term, like this will save me time, because I won't have to deal through all these people that are pitching me.

49:16

Yes, that's true. But any legitimate business owner and investor isn't going to pay attention to you.

49:24

So it's going to be a lot harder to find those diamonds in the rough based on the system that you set up.

49:32

It's a Christian system. And so that's really important.

49:38

But a lot of conservative ideology and stuff is based on that, because as our

49:43

Chief Content Officer Jason Varley says, conservatism is about influence. So every time you...

49:50

I don't know if you've ever been to a turning point conference or CPAC or some sort of conservative forum.

50:00

But if you go there, they give you a badge and then that badge is color coded based on your class.

50:07

So if you're a vendor, and this is most conferences, but people really pay attention to it at the conservative level.

50:17

So whether you're a vendor or whether you're a guest or an executive guest, whatever that means, or you're a speaker or VIP access, whatever.

50:30

So it's a conservative caste system. It is. It is. Yeah. But all of conservatism is caste system.

50:35

You have Shapiro at the top. And then you have all these underlings beneath him.

50:41

And then you have these YouTubers who never get any attention and are fighting the

50:46

YouTube algorithm all the time just to make a voice for themselves. But imagine if Shapiro just started not charging for retweets or to be mentioned on the podcast and was like,

51:00

I found this guy on YouTube the other day. He's really great. And then he could help build an audience for himself, the younger audience that'll further

51:08

Ben Shapiro's cause from a few generations. So we tend to think of like, oh, everything's pay to play.

51:15

Everything is this caste system. And that's not how you build things.

51:23

And I think when you look at lore and the time we spend with artists, every artist we bring on to the lower platform is essentially a startup.

51:36

So every time we receive a pitch for a movie or TV show, it's the same thing as getting a pitch for a business or an idea.

51:45

So we have to sift through artists and ideas and find out.

51:50

We're not too interested about the story so much as much as we're interested in whether or not the artist is talented and can actually deliver a product with our subscribers money.

52:01

That's the main focus. The story comes actually second to that because we give artists freedom. And so if we know they can make something, we don't really care what they make, if they can raise money for it.

52:11

It's not important. So we do things to specifically go and try to find people.

52:27

So we do cigar and whiskey nights at Christian film conferences. We meet with people.

52:34

Jason prays with artists all the time. He has prayers. He'll meet with artists who are struggling and just need prayer and counsel.

52:42

So this sort of attitude of we might be running lore, but the artists really are what's going to really help make this thing succeed.

52:52

And getting rid of those barrier to entries is really foundational to what we do.

52:58

And Jason says it all the time too. He's like, I will quit the day we start making money off the artist directly.

53:07

Because you go to these Christian film conferences and they're like, if you want to get in this room with these producers, you got to pay an additional 200 bucks or pay for this class that's going to teach you how to pitch.

53:21

You don't need to charge people to teach you how to pitch. You need to teach them how to pitch because that's going to help you.

53:27

The more people that learn how to pitch know how to present a good story is going to help you. And so all these barriers to entry, whether it's in the film world or whether it's the barriers to entry in the conservative world to get your business out there, those are all really a big problem.

53:48

And the liberals don't have that problem as much. In the liberal world, they share stuff all the time.

53:57

They are active. The LGBT mob is sharing every TikTok that's pro -LGBT.

54:03

It doesn't matter if they have a platform or not. It doesn't matter who they are. They're just sharing everything.

54:09

And then the only thing we share is the LGBT TikToks. We have lives of TikTok.

54:16

We always share their stuff all the time. Fox News is always talking about what the left is doing.

54:24

They're always sharing what the left is doing. But try to get an interview on there for a conservative organization.

54:30

You can't do it. And so we've secluded ourselves.

54:37

That's not what it's going to take to really... You can't build an empire that way when you seclude yourself and gatekeep everything.

54:46

It has to be why we have a republic. It's why we have the ability for people to vote.

54:56

It's all about decentralizing things. As I'm thinking about this,

55:02

I know we could go on forever. And who knows when some of these things will happen, like long life that we were talking about.

55:09

I really believe that. I believe that that is part of the curse that is going to be lifted before Jesus returns.

55:15

I believe that. I believe that Isaiah 65 is saying that. I would say it's only a tiny part.

55:24

It's like two sentences. So that to us would be tremendous if that happened tomorrow.

55:32

One of the greatest technological revolutions in the history of the world is if people could just start living to 900 years old.

55:39

And that's just like a brief mention in Isaiah 65 amongst other things. Exactly. So that's sort of my point is, those are things that are far off from us.

55:48

And I believe that that will happen. I'm not sure. I haven't done any research whatsoever on teleportation, so I have no idea.

55:56

And I don't know if I see it in script. Look at it this way. The goal of teleportation is to lift the burden of missionary travel.

56:06

Yeah, I can see that. You have teleportation, and suddenly you have missionaries in third world countries that return to their church service or have a meeting with their pastor immediately.

56:22

That's how I look at it. It's like, how do we lift the burden of missionary service? And it's teleportation.

56:28

It's the last hurdle. But what I think, so those are things that I think are still far off that will happen, but they're pretty far away.

56:37

How can we invest as people now, because we can't invest about things that are going to happen in a thousand years or whatever.

56:45

Let's say we're convinced that post -millennialism is true. We have to live in our day, in our time. I think about cross -border payments and how crypto can do instant transactions and what a burden that will be to lift off some of the swift cumbersomeness, high fees.

57:03

I think that's an example of instant payments. Another one, you speak into Google and you're talking to someone who speaks

57:12

Bangladeshi, or I don't even know what language they speak there, but you know what I mean. Let's say Chinese. I'm speaking to somebody and immediately the language is translated and I can have a real interaction with that person.

57:24

That's a reversal of the curse. That's essentially, even though we have the wrapping paper of thousands of languages, we really can all speak in one communication now.

57:35

So that's a reversal of the curse. Infant mortality is going away. So abortion certainly is an evil that needs to be ended.

57:44

But as Christians, give us a list of things that are on the forefront right now that we can be participating in that are part of seeing

57:52

God's dominion come to this earth. My wife was just reading an article about this organization.

57:59

I don't know the name of the organization. It's called 21 Weeks or something like that. And it's an organization that takes miscarried babies and tries to demonstrate that there is technology available for them to be viable before 22 weeks.

58:16

So right now, any hospital, they have DNRs on any baby that's born, 21 weeks, four days, they won't do anything about it.

58:24

But this organization was trying to say, no, no, no, it is possible. So that's something

58:30

I think is really feasible. And I always say, well, let's take that to the extreme.

58:37

How do we save babies in the womb that are just conceived?

58:45

Let's go all the way that far. So let's push it for 21 weeks, push it to 15 and 10 and six.

58:53

But as long as you have abortion at 15 weeks, as a prince, as the foundational view, no one's ever going to try.

59:04

No one's ever going to try. And as long as hospitals refuse to even try at 21 weeks, it's not going to happen.

59:12

So I think that would be something. The point is you have to put capital. We've spent so much money on missions and we've got very little fruit from that because we haven't put money on missions and means.

59:33

We've been Gnostic with our missions. So we've got very little fruit from that.

59:40

Chris Didn't James say something about that? You tell someone to be well, but you won't actually clothe them and you won't actually feed them.

59:46

Right. Right. Exactly. Right. So we want to go preach the gospel to them, but we don't want to...

59:55

What's the word we don't want to... What do the liberals call it? Colonize them.

01:00:02

It's like, well, yeah, we do. It's been the best thing that's ever happened to any... Remember the missionary guy?

01:00:08

I don't know if you saw the movie on National Geographic about it, the missionary guy that went to the islands that has the people where they've never...

01:00:19

They're like the last tribal people that's been unreached by civilization.

01:00:26

And I forget the name of the island. But anyway, so it's illegal to go there.

01:00:34

And this missionary just had it on his heart that he had to go there and he died.

01:00:42

The islanders killed him as soon as he got on the island. So supposedly.

01:00:49

Now, the documentary does not make the case there's a chance that he survived because it's

01:00:56

National Geographic and they're trying to tell you to stop colonizing different skin color people with white theology.

01:01:04

But Jason Farley saw it and he said, you know, all those guys' friends weren't sad at all.

01:01:17

They acted like he wasn't even dead. It could be because they just have faith. But there was something really weird about it that made me think, maybe he didn't die.

01:01:28

He just told them to tell him that he was dead. So I don't know. He's got a successful ministry going.

01:01:34

Right. But anyway, the reason I said that is because when it came out that he died on the island, the gospel coalition went nuts.

01:01:41

How dare you colonize these people? How dare you're going to spread disease to them and all these sorts of things.

01:01:48

And you're going to infect them with you know, whatever white man virus. Yeah. And the gospel.

01:01:55

And it was just, it was very, very evil. I felt like. And because,

01:02:02

I mean, that's not even like evangelistic at all. Right. Well, they've moved on to writing about Taylor Swift now.

01:02:09

Yeah. And periods. Did you see the period one? Nope. Theology of periods. That was recent.

01:02:14

Oh my gosh. Yeah. But so, yeah. So, but yeah.

01:02:21

So I think we should, I mean, like, I think we should just send in helicopters and land on that place and tell them about the gospel.

01:02:28

And so that doesn't mean when you share the gospel with a foreign nation that you remove their culture.

01:02:37

You keep the good culture. And that's what the

01:02:43

United States military did to Hawaii when they stole

01:02:48

Hawaii from the Christian queen. Right. So I don't know. Have you heard that story? No.

01:02:54

I love to. I got to tell it. I know we're over time, but I don't really. Time is really. So yeah.

01:03:01

So you had, so I learned about this when I was at apology and we were planning apology of Kauai. So we went over to Kauai about four times.

01:03:09

And one time we were trying to get footage for these documentaries you're making on the church plant.

01:03:16

But what we found out really quickly was that we have a view of government that the

01:03:21

Kauai natives don't have. And they need because a Christian view of government would look at the history of Hawaii and go, oh, we were wrong.

01:03:30

America was wrong. And this land was immorally sold. So basically what happened was you had the son of the

01:03:38

King of Kauai goes off to school in America's 1800s.

01:03:45

And he goes off to school in America, gets connected with the American Bible society, becomes a

01:03:51

Christian American Bible society says, Hey, we have this Hawaiian Bible.

01:03:57

We want to get to the people in Hawaii. Would you like to go? And he's like, yeah, my dad's a King. And so he gets in the boat, he gets off the boat and they would have a violin and a cello.

01:04:09

And he starts playing the cello, the doxology on the sand of the beach in Kauai. His father, who's

01:04:16

King thought he'd never see a son again, immediately recognizes a son like the prodigal son and goes and puts his

01:04:23

Royal robe on his son, like pronouncing him Prince immediately. And still to this day, they sing the doxology all the time in Hawaii before meals, whether you're a

01:04:34

Christian or not, it's part of the culture. And so that led to that Kauai becoming

01:04:41

Christian. And you get all the way up to the Queen was last Queen of Kauai, a very faithful Christian.

01:04:47

She wrote tons of hymns, amazing, really solid theology stuff. You can read some of her writings and stuff.

01:04:53

And the United States Marines needed money to pay for the civil war. So they stole the land, they imprisoned her into her home, into the palace.

01:05:04

And they said, if you don't sign over Hawaii to the American people, we're going to execute all the people on the island.

01:05:11

And so she, as a means to save her people, signed over the land to the

01:05:16

United States. And then they went in and did sugar. We had no idea of this. And the only reason we really found out about this was because we went into the museum and we were like,

01:05:26

Hey, we'd love to ask you some questions. We're hearing about the Christian theology of Hawaii, and we'd like to know more about it.

01:05:32

And the guy goes, where are you here? And we're like, well, we're planning a church. He's like, Oh, so I can tell you the real story.

01:05:38

He says, come back tomorrow. And so we come back tomorrow and he gives us a guided tour of the museum from a

01:05:44

Kauai Christian theology of just all the missionary stories. He has a story of one of the

01:05:50

Queens went up and she walked all the way up the volcano and she picked all the sacred pagan flowers that lined the volcano.

01:06:01

She picked every one of them all the way at the top of the volcano and threw them into the volcano and declared

01:06:07

Jesus is Lord is away. So whenever you hear Hawaiians say that the land has been stolen from them, they are absolutely right.

01:06:19

It's far more worse than most people think. But that's the sort of thing.

01:06:25

It's like, we don't even know those stories. They've just been erased from our history. And imagine what

01:06:33

Hawaii could be now. Their constitution is the most Christian constitution

01:06:38

I've ever read in my life, by the way. You can Google it. Just Google first Hawaii constitution 1800, something like that.

01:06:46

And the very first preamble says, no law shall come in conflict with the law of the scriptures in the

01:07:00

Bible. That was better than the one that we had that we took when we sold our land.

01:07:06

They had a better constitution. Most people don't even know that stuff.

01:07:13

I think you go apology studios and you type in Kauai. I think there's like three or four documentaries I made that tell that whole story.

01:07:20

I don't remember which one is the best one to watch. Maybe if we get the links for that, we'll put it in the notes for this episode.

01:07:29

I'll try to find them. But they do need to be prominent and be sent out again.

01:07:35

Because I think we live in a country now that doesn't trust their government.

01:07:43

And this is a really good reason to show, even in the 1800s, we were bad people. Well, that just makes so much sense to me.

01:07:49

If we're thinking about how do we bring all of these blessings to the earth, how is this going to happen?

01:07:56

Our government is wicked. Our government is sinful and wretched. So Christians need to take over government and bring

01:08:04

Christ back into the halls of government. Why are we opposed to that? Why is Christian nationalism controversial?

01:08:10

I have absolutely no idea. I want my nation to be Christian and I want my government to be Christian. I want my government to be

01:08:20

Hawaii Christian. Yeah, amen. I'll move there. Not just Christian like we say it is or Bible about Christianity.

01:08:28

I want Hawaii Christianity. Like theonomically Christian. It is.

01:08:34

It was. Yeah. There's still laws in the books in Hawaii that's a result of... There's basically like a love your neighbor view that they still have in their local governments.

01:08:53

So you're not allowed to force a homeless person to leave the beach.

01:08:59

They're allowed to be on the beach and whatnot. So a lot of really

01:09:05

Christian rooted that still remains. It's just amazing.

01:09:13

But it was government. And then our government came in and started just giving them food and an economy.

01:09:23

They stole Christian capitalism and then started that in Hawaii. And so now they're dependent.

01:09:29

They believe anyway that they're dependent on American tourism. When they're not, they could do their own tourism just fine.

01:09:37

And so that's why there's a lot of rejection still in Hawaii and a lot of race issues of the natives versus the white man.

01:09:46

And it's completely justified, I believe. And they've never had a

01:09:52

Christian view of government... Christians come in and say, hey, this is what...

01:10:00

You guys are right. Here's what the Bible says. How do we restore Hawaii?

01:10:05

No one ever does that to them. But that's exactly what they need to hear. That's the message they need to hear. Yeah. I think about how you said the left is really rabidly trying to make a difference, but just with an absolutely putrid worldview.

01:10:21

And then you've got the conservatives who are so obsessed with finances and pay to play and all of this just garbage that they actually can have no effect.

01:10:32

And what a wonderful opportunity that the church has. If we would pull our head out of the sand and stop playing ostrich, if we would actually bring

01:10:43

Christ into all of life, we would see things happen. Right. Yeah. So a lot of that is we need to start investing in companies and businesses, because that's how you create economies.

01:10:59

So if we're going to have a Christian economy, we have to have Christian capital that backs it and supports it.

01:11:06

And so a lot of that means I'm going to invest in this company, but I'm not expecting them to sell the company so I can get exit.

01:11:17

So that's a much higher risk investment, which the Bible talks about higher risk investments.

01:11:26

So it is a much better risk, higher risk. But the fruit of that is not necessarily for you, but for your great grandchildren.

01:11:34

Because I talked to a guy who invested millions of dollars in Christian media and he goes, man,

01:11:40

I really love you guys. I wish you guys met me about 15 years earlier, but I'm in my seventies now.

01:11:47

So we don't do these kinds of equity investments anymore because it just won't be around long enough to see the fruit.

01:11:52

I was like, well, what about your grandchildren? You can pass your equity down to your grandchildren. It's continual income and dividends for them.

01:12:01

But just people just don't think that way. They don't think that way. They want to sell everything and give their cash to their kids who will just blow it on meth.

01:12:12

Right. I don't know if that guy's kids are going to blow it on me, but I'm saying that's what happens.

01:12:18

These guys get millions of dollars in inheritance and then they just spend it frivolously.

01:12:24

And so the best inheritance you can give your kids is an apprenticeship within the company. And then from that apprenticeship in your company, you can train them how to run it.

01:12:37

Right. And then that way, not only are they getting the dividends, but they're also getting knowledge of the work in the industry.

01:12:44

And they can pass that down to their children as well. This is a thing that drives me absolutely nuts, especially when you're talking to Christians about investment capital.

01:12:54

They go, have you ever talked to the Hobby Lobby guys? It's like, well, no, I haven't talked to the Hobby Lobby guys. I was like, well, those guys didn't leave.

01:13:03

They're not leaving any money for their kids. They're giving it all away. And I'm like, what is going on?

01:13:12

What is that mentality? That's not biblical. The Bible talks very, very highly about the blessings of inheritance and that sort of thing.

01:13:21

And also despising your inheritance like Esau and what a curse that is. That's right. Well, yeah.

01:13:27

So that happens too. I think despising the inheritance and either blowing it or investing it in a leftist communist company or something like that is equal to that for sure.

01:13:41

Or selling it. Like your father dies and then you sell the company immediately.

01:13:48

That too is despising. There are other ways to despise the inheritance. But with the

01:13:54

Hobby Lobby guys, now I think what's happening is the kids are despising what's happened.

01:14:05

And so they're creating their own companies and businesses off their father's name and becoming more leftist in everything they do.

01:14:15

Because they're trying to figure out a way I can make that money back. And so instead of showing this is what faithfulness has got us, they don't have anything to account for that.

01:14:28

So now they have to go a different way. And so I think there's a danger and we're seeing that.

01:14:34

I think we see that with, I think, maybe Chick -fil -A might be coming more leftist. I can't get that scene of Kathy washing

01:14:42

Lecrae's feet. If you've ever seen that. So I don't know what's going on.

01:14:49

I haven't had those conversations. But it doesn't seem good, especially when you look at the

01:14:55

He Gets Us ad campaigns and all that sort of stuff. And how insanely left those are and how excited the

01:15:05

Hobby Lobby kids were about those ads is very concerning. And I wonder if the lack of inheritance given to them is propelling them in the opposite direction of their father, whether that's unintentional or spite.

01:15:20

I don't know. But it's not good. It hasn't been a good result. And I don't think the fruit of Hobby Lobby is going to be around once David Green passes away.

01:15:32

Yeah. So there's investing, as you just mentioned, investing in things.

01:15:38

I've thought about this. I'd love to hear your thoughts on it. As a man,

01:15:44

I should have a nice yard. That's something attainable for anyone.

01:15:50

Yeah. If the world is going to be transformed into a garden, may my yard look nice and be a testimony of my faith that the

01:16:00

Lord is going to make the world into a garden. I'm terrible at this, by the way. Me too.

01:16:07

But may I get better at it. And the fence post that I haven't fixed and mended yet, may I do that with diligence?

01:16:14

My wife, she got this really clearly. She bought some decorations and I came home and there was this blue bird that typified the entire pile of decorations.

01:16:26

I looked at that blue bird and I was like, what is that? How much did you pay for that blue bird? And she started talking to me in Edenic language like,

01:16:34

I'm making the home a beautiful place. And that's theological. She started talking to me in that way and I was like, my goodness, she's right.

01:16:42

I need to give money towards making my home a garden place.

01:16:49

This idea of... Yeah. But I would also argue, since we're talking about post -mortem fan fiction,

01:16:55

I would say that cutting your grass, mending your fence, those are all menial tasks.

01:17:03

That's a waste of time. And that there should be technology that helps you do that so you don't have to worry about it.

01:17:09

Amen. So you have more time to spend with your family. A friend of mine started a pretty big company in California recently.

01:17:18

A nuclear company where his goal was actually...

01:17:23

He's like super Christian, super post -mill. He just started a...

01:17:29

It's called Valor Atomics is the name of the company. And basically their idea is

01:17:34

God gave us oil and it's completely useful.

01:17:41

And he still intends for us to use it. And so they're creating nuclear fission.

01:17:52

I'm not a nuclear guy. I don't know how. I don't know what he's doing. But they're basically creating nuclear reactors to pull water from the ocean and turn that water into hydrocarbons and oil.

01:18:05

So they're reversing what people do with nuclear energy. And they're saying, instead of using nuclear energy for clean energy, which is wasteful because you can only have a nuclear power plant in one area.

01:18:15

So it only helps in one area. We can transport oil anywhere around the world. And all the logistics to transport oil all around the world is well -established and in place.

01:18:25

So if we can just create oil from water and using nuclear energy, then we can do that.

01:18:31

He's raised several million dollars on this so far because the science is real.

01:18:38

It's been done. It's not science fiction. Just everybody thinks of nuclear as evil or whatever.

01:18:48

And the truth is God gave us nuclear energy. He gave us nuclear energy as a way to bless the world.

01:19:00

But we used it for evil first. And so God tower babbled that. And I think he's restrained the value of nuclear energy.

01:19:09

I was talking to someone, this is completely unrelated. This guy is a nuclear engineer.

01:19:15

And he was just telling me about all the amazing things that nuclear energy has done and what it can do that no one in government has the courage to fight for it.

01:19:28

And it'll bless so many people. There's so many people that'll be blessed by this nuclear technology we've just started to learn about.

01:19:37

And we've only given it to the government, which we can't trust anyway. Nobody wants to give nuclear power to the people, but the government's more evil than the people.

01:19:46

And he was saying that all the waste in the entire world that's ever been made from nuclear could fit in basically the garage that we were having the

01:20:02

Fight Life Feast dinner in. And he's like, that's all it is.

01:20:08

It's not a lot. And Elon can ship out tons of stuff now to space, to anywhere.

01:20:16

So it's not even a concern anymore really. So I think nuclear energy is definitely one of those things that we haven't unlocked because we're too evil of a people.

01:20:32

And once we turn our weapons into plowshares, I think that's a great analogy of nuclear.

01:20:39

There's probably not a better one where it's like, how do we take this weapon and we turn it into something that'll provide food and energy to millions and millions of people?

01:20:50

And that might not be through the traditional nuclear power means, but it could be through something like Valor Atomic.

01:20:56

But again, it takes capital and risk to be able to invest in a Christian that is not a nuclear engineer, that just has studied the science in the same way

01:21:05

Elon has. Elon's not a nuclear engineer or a rocket scientist. And he just says, this is what the science shows.

01:21:12

Why haven't we done it? We're Christians. This is what Christians should be doing. And he's assembled the team that's going to make that happen.

01:21:17

I'm really excited about that. And that's a distinctly post -mill business.

01:21:24

Whether it works or not, I don't know, but that's where the risk comes in. And those are the things we should be investing our capital in.

01:21:31

I guess maybe to sum up what we've been talking about, because I'd love to go on forever.

01:21:38

But actually, I have something at home that I have to do as well.

01:21:44

But to sum up, I'm really convicted by this and really feel like you've done a great job of pointing this out, that we have to reintegrate the worlds of science, technology, industry, discovery with biblical mandate of taking dominion of the world.

01:22:05

We have to integrate those two things together. They're not at war with each other. It's technological innovation is not the boogeyman.

01:22:12

And it's not just something that secularists are engaged with.

01:22:18

If we allow that to happen, they're going to babble on it and tower of babble it. They're going to do evil things that God is going to punish.

01:22:26

If we had nuclear energy, if we had with a Christian worldview, if we were in government with a

01:22:32

Christian worldview, if we were starting companies, building economies, if we were doing all of this trying to cure cancer,

01:22:39

I know a Christian who's actually working on that, praying to God that he'll be the one to solve it. But if we were involved in these things to the glory of Christ, that's not a bad thing.

01:22:49

That's actually a commanded essential part of being human. Yeah. We have to get rid of Gnosticism.

01:22:56

We have to realize that we're in the world. We're going to be in the world. We're not going anywhere. And the world's not going anywhere, unlike Elon.

01:23:05

To close, I would tell your listeners is, if you have significant capital, you really should invest that in building capital.

01:23:16

The Bible speaks very clearly. I think the popular lingo is, they like to use wisdom to judge risk adversity.

01:23:29

And I think that's a word for being a coward. To be very clear,

01:23:35

I think the Bible's very clear with the parable of the talents, about burying your talents in the sand. And Jesus rebukes the guy who buried his talents in the sand.

01:23:48

He rebukes him by saying, I could have made more money by setting my money in the bank and gaining interest off of it.

01:23:57

But that's not a positive condemnation from Jesus, that it's okay to set your money in the bank and gain interest on it.

01:24:08

That was the insult. And so a lot of Christian capital right now is just tied up in stock market or IRAs or a bunch of other things that's just gradually gaining interest.

01:24:22

And there's wisdom there in doing that. I'm not opposed to doing that. But when you're putting all your eggs in that basket, and meanwhile, you have entrepreneurs and Christians among you that are just starving for capital to be able to really do amazing things,

01:24:37

I think that's a really big problem in the church. Or if you make a lot of capital and you're only spending that on missionary organizations and not anything anti -Gnostic in the world.

01:24:50

So like actually building things, I think we have to do both. And I think the more you invest in companies and build businesses, you're going to have more money to be able to fund missionaries so that you're,

01:25:05

I was talking to a guy, because basically you're the primary donor. So you build, he works with CEOs to teach them to build businesses in such a way that they can just start their own nonprofit doing whatever they want and never have to raise funds for it.

01:25:22

But it starts with the business and the capital to be able to do those things. And that just takes risk and guts and it's homosexuality and then cowards and revelation that go to hell, right?

01:25:36

They're right beside each other. So I think when we look at our finances and what we're investing in, that's really key.

01:25:43

Yeah, he will rule the world and he will spread his dominion as far as the curse is found. And he didn't snap his fingers like Thanos to accomplish it without us.

01:25:52

He partnered with us. He called us to be a part of it, taking the gospel to all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the

01:25:58

Holy Spirit, teaching them how to obey Christ and transforming this world back into a garden paradise.

01:26:03

And so the paradise will no longer be lost. It will be paradise restored. So wherever you're at, wherever you're listening to this today, be at work.

01:26:13

You got a lot to do. We have a lot to do and praise the Lord for that. Marcus, thank you so much for being on.

01:26:20

I was so excited to hear this and it did not disappoint. I just feel like we have more to talk about now. Good.

01:26:26

All right, man. Thanks for having me. Invest in teleportation companies. Yeah, dude.

01:26:34

We may have to do something on that later because I feel like we just barely, you just, you just, you just missed that little thought and then you were gone.

01:26:42

But God bless you, man. All right. Bye. Bye. Thank you so much for watching another episode of the podcast and thank you so much to Marcus Pittman for making time for a second episode.

01:26:53

And for all the topics that we, that we talked about and thought through, they're not really that far off if you just look at what the scriptures say.

01:27:01

Until next time, God richly bless you. And thank you so much for supporting this show. We could not do it without you now until next time, get out of here.