Importance of Online Apologetics

Hmm, okay, I'm gonna put you on here. I'm having stream yard is doing something weird. So let me Actually jump out of the room if you could jump out of the room and then jump back in by clicking on that link.

We'll see if we can do that. Okay, that sounds good, bro. All right. Sorry about that. That was awkward. All right. All right, it is live. Okay. There we go. That was some technical difficulties there.

Opening and Technical Difficulties on the Livestream

I think it was going live the whole time. All right, well Welcome to another episode of reveals apologetics. I'm your host Eli Ayala. Sorry for that little technical difficulty. Wasn't sure that we were live there.

I'm excited to Be discussing the the topic for today. Which is the importance of online? Apologetics and of course everyone who watches my show and is on YouTube and engaged in apologetics and theology.

All of you guys have to some degree benefited from online apologetics and online theology and things like that. And so I am excited to have Bobby Conway of the one-minute apologist on to talk a little bit about What is the impact of online apologetics how can one get started in doing something like this and what are the minimal things that you need.

I mean, there's you don't need too much to get online. I mean your phone usually can do the trick, you know going live or recording videos and putting them up. But I want to jump into some of the specifics with regards to that and hopefully this discussion will inspire folks to in some way get involved in defending the faith, so Just a couple of things before I invite Bobby on here with me for folks who are interested I will let folks know the date in a little bit, but I'll be speaking at a conference in Virginia.

And I'll be speaking with dr Robert Bowman and Anthony Rogers on the topic of apologetics and I'll be giving two Lectures there and so I will keep folks updated on those dates. So if you're in the area, I'd love to see you and I think that's it.

I thought I had another announcement there, but I think that's all so without further ado. Let me invite Bobby Conway with us and we'll take it from there. How's it going? Bobby? Good, bro. Thanks for having me on AI.

Well, it is a great pleasure to have you on. I remember the first time I ever saw a one-minute apologist video and that was when I was I was on the website Apologetics 315 remember that website. Is it absolutely?

Yeah, you know, I don't know I remember being interviewed by them many years ago and The guy that was doing a lot of the stuff I think he went on to do something else, but the site I think still exists.

But what's his name Brian Brian Auden? I think that's right. That's exactly what it is. Yes. Yeah, so if folks don't know what apologetic 315 is I mean, basically it is every single apologetic resource available on one website.

There's audio there things to read book suggestions. So you definitely want to check out apologetics 315 but that's the first time I ever saw Bobby Conway and is super interesting one minute or so, you know.

But they were super helpful especially when you don't have a lot of time to watch like a 20 minute half hour an hour video so I'd like to talk to you a little bit about how you got that started. But why don't you tell folks a little bit about yourself?

Maybe your background how you became a Christian and then we'll take it from there. Yeah, you bet. So I grew up in, California and Loved playing baseball. It was the one thing that kind of kept me out of more trouble and You know big partier promiscuous struggling in the throes of alcoholism about the age of 21 I mean and even before that I found myself really Bent toward addiction in my life.

So much. So, I mean I was the guy that would be at your parties getting inebriated and my tolerance got so high. Eli I mean I'd slip around a corner stick my finger down my throat gag myself throw up come back to the party Keep drinking and this was this was what was going on?

And so Baseball kept me from absolutely And utterly destroying myself and God by his grace Saved me had a teammate who I played college baseball with who took me to hear an evangelist by the name of Greg Laurie.

Ended up placing my faith in Christ because my life was loaded up with guilt from all the promiscuity sleeping around with girls Partying and just my relationship to my parents was so intense and I was desperately in need of purpose and Figuring out a way to get rid of my guilt and Jesus answered all that which was great.

But I'd say a life of living according to my feelings and being enslaved to my addictions made Becoming a Christian really challenging because now I was really disturbed about my actions I was convicted about them and I found that just because I became a Christian I didn't magically have the ability to turn off the addictions.

So I needed to really Hone in on this so I had several relapses over and over and over again trying to get clean couldn't. Finally, I ended up going to AA and 94 and I did over 400 meetings in that first year of sobriety.

And once I got the alcohol and all the permit that that allowed me to get the promiscuity out of my life. And that really allowed my faith to start taking root and started really wanting to tell Everybody about the freedom that I discovered and so I had a call to ministry and I ended up meeting my wife Heather.

We got married. We've been married now 25 years almost with two kids 22 year old daughter who's about to get married in a few months and a 20 year old son and Our life has been focused around Pastoring for the most part and apologetics lots of schooling.

I mean, I literally just finished up Another degree and finally after I don't know 25 30 years. I think I'm done with that. I Threw I threw my attic brain Eli and Studying and so I've been completely OCDing it for you know a long time.

So that's a little bit of it. Where were you going to school? I? Just wrapped up a PhD at the University of Birmingham in England and that philosophy of religion department so I developed an argument from moral guilt and so William Lane Craig studied there and It was just his influence on my life and I wanted to go and Study in that same kind of program and it's actually just phenomenal.

I mean what's happening there? It's number two behind Oxford. It's ahead of Cambridge. I mean, it's just a really prestigious Department and you can even do that PhD program from afar. So I had to fly out there about three times, but I was super stoked that I was able to work with my supervisors.

Like I'm talking to you right now Technology, so so when you got started, did you have more hair and blacker hair? Is the gray is the gray which by the way, which by the way you are wearing very well.

People don't notice here. I have great. I have salt-and-pepper here, but It looks good on you. But when you got started, did you have the blackness and then it kind of the stress? Is that how it went?

Yeah. Yeah for sure, bro. I uh, I It's funny if you look back to when I even started one-minute apologists about 10 11 years ago I had a full set of dark hair, but I would say yeah studies just pastoring Marriage life raising kids.

Everything turns you gray man as you get older. Well, the having three kids of my own that I understand. I understand for sure. All right. Well, that's a super interesting Backstory, I mean you came from a lot of difficulties I mean when I grew up in church, and so I kind of lived the straight arrow life.

But I always was fascinated and always wished I had some dark past that God saved me from you know. My pastor back in the day would invite like a missionary and be like I was in the gutter about to die in Jesus.

You know and here I am like raising church I was always a goody-goody and I was like my story's boring. But it's the reality is God saves us from all different sorts of places. And so that's super interesting to hear.

Yeah, what God saved you from so so how did the transition work then? So you became a Christian? Okay. Was it you fell head over heels in love with Jesus at the moment? How did that process look in terms of actually getting saved and then moving towards a desire to defend the faith?

You know, yeah it for me. It's amazing. It was a clear connection to getting rid of Alcohol in my life now that was a real battle. Especially in the early days. I mean the temptations when you're trying to get off of Alcohol when you are dependent upon it.

I mean, it's incredibly difficult. In fact, I left the state of California. And I moved to Arkansas halfway across the country to change my people places and play things. Just so that I could be in an environment where I wouldn't be bumping in the people that I knew.

And it helped me in order to kind of put my life together at that stage. And yeah, I found myself just deepening in my love for him. I hated reading before I was a Christian but I fell in love with reading because I was falling in love with God and if I wanted to know God I needed to Read and I wanted to know the books of the Bible.

I wanted to under. I was so Thirsty like I was your young believer that literally would ask Mature Christians that I bumped into I I didn't want to talk about everyday life. I wanted to talk about Christ and the Bible and I probably just overwhelmed people with my questions.

But if you were apologetically wired you would have loved having me around because I was so hungry to just draw from learning and so I ended up in Arkansas and the way I got into apologetics wasn't Because I wanted to do apologetics it really was because I was doing evangelism.

I was sharing the gospel on Campuses. I was just going out by myself literally walking up to people cold turkey. Sharing Jesus with 50 to 100 people per week. I was I would I would be calling through the phone book Eli.

I had an I had a work Job that allowed me to work in a booth as a security person and when it wasn't busy. They had what is known as white pages back then yes, I just started calling up the community saying hey.

You might think I'm nuts, but my name is Bobby, and I'm just calling to see if our Community knows Jesus, and I just wanted to ask you a few questions like I was so naive man. Like I was praying through my yearbooks.

I was I was calling people in the white pages I I was going out to campuses. I got thrown out of Walmart. I got thrown off college campuses. I've got people's backyard, so I mean it was really it was it was a lot of fun.

But I was so clueless like I didn't like the method was probably horrible. I just you know walking up cold turkey. I wasn't building relationships, but I wasn't yelling at people. I just so wanted people to know this well.

They started Stumping me with all these questions. I had no idea How to answer them and so their questions became my study guide. By which the Holy Spirit began to sanctify me and so you know by the time I would go off to Dallas seminary that's where I really started falling in love with the academic life and wanting to grab a hold of apologetics and stuff like that so Hmm so okay, so I'm curious then so you you walk up to people cold up by the way I'm not sure that's a bad method of course you did you did mention something that I think is a key and that is Forming relationships that is a better method, but you'd be surprised of the power of a cold turkey evangelistic attempt.

Because that can catch people off guard because you don't know where people are in their journey. That what you randomly say to them might sound random and weird. But to a certain person that might be exactly what what they needed so um so why don't you explain?

I mean, I'm curious here when you walked up to a random person. What did it look like what did you say? I mean you just hop out of an alleyway like Jesus loves a little bit. Oh Can you can you see me now there can so you wanted me to explain what it looked like when I walked up to a Random person yes, so so did you jump out of an alley and just be like Jesus loves you or?

What did that look like what did you say to them? Yeah? No? I I mean I typically would just walk up and You know I feel like if there was one thing that I I had I didn't have confidence like in my Bible knowledge.

I had confidence in my people skills. I was very popular like as an athlete and as a partier and so I Was confident that I could walk up to people. And leverage just some people skills and just connect with people so I would try to drop their guards immediately and say hey I know I'm kind of interrupted on on what you guys got going on here, and I know you probably think I'm Absolutely nuts, and I get it and I but I just want you guys know I'm so excited about what I've learned.

And I'm just wondering if I could talk to you guys about your spiritual beliefs and by and large I would end up in some amazing Conversations, and I purposely Eli would use words when I'm talking to the students as I was a students like a bro.

Or a dude or a stoked. Because I wanted to connect you know. Awesome sauce or the you can you faster an awesome sauce man? Precious death fresh. Yeah, so I was so we would connect, but sometimes I would have people say get out of here, bro.

You know like and and that was fine, but I definitely saw several people get converted in that ministry. The problem was as I was sharing the gospel so many people like I wasn't able to really adequately Disciple them and that's where eventually church planting became like a really nice niche because you can do evangelism.

But you really have a place to disciple people as well. And so I'm this oddball like when I'm hanging out with apologists Eli at times I think my critique of the apologists would be there. They're disconnected from the church and They're there and so wanting to see apologists to be churchmen and wanting to see apologists to love.

Love missional living and and not just knowing how to formulate all their arguments when I. When I hang out with my pastor friends, I feel the frustration and tension that Apologetics is minimized and that really frustrates me.

So I kind of feel like this guy that's been wired like I'm left and right brain like the creative type yet the logical type the head guy the heart guy and. So at times I I find that whichever world. And I never feel completely connected because sadly these two worlds have been divorced from one another.

And I would love to see people get the need of pulling these two things together. Like apologists should not be out just doing their things absent from a church and the church should not be Minimizing the beauty of apologetics.

It should come together and that's really my passion. I think Regardless of what folks might think of the individual I'm about to mention, but one thing I did I do appreciate about dr James White is his Connection.

I mean, he's he's a debater. He's debated I don't know. He's like at a hundred and something and you know debate for Formal debates yet. He's also out witnessing to Mormons. I think that that's pretty cool and he does emphasize a lot the importance of staying connected to a church while while doing those Things and I know dr. Craig You know teaches the defenders class and I think and and I think that's that's awesome.

How you have a world-class scholar? Making sure after he does a lecture or a talk somewhere I need to get back to my church so that I can teach the defenders class. I think that's super cool and an awesome example.

You know to set for people. So okay, so that's cool. And and I want to ask you in just a few moments I suppose I could ask it now, but it might change the direction of the discussion. So let me save the question later I really want to know when you are engaging with someone on the street and there is an apologetic clash.

What does that look like? You know just person to person. It's not like we're typing away on a keyboard or whatever. Let me ask you that first and then we'll get to the typing keyboard online stuff. So yeah, when someone says hey, you know, thank you for sharing your thoughts, but I'm not a Christian.

I don't believe this stuff. Where does the conversation go from there? How have you navigated those sorts of things and what are some of the things that people bring up in your interactions with them?

Well so much of evangelism is intuitive. And so we have to have a sense of when people are. You know wanting to get some space and when people are You know wanting more and so I think that good just relational common sense goes a long ways in evangelism.

So if somebody you know. If you push the door open and they open it go in but if they're not wanting to talk about it. Respect that so I think that that can go a long ways for you know. So for example the other day I was out and about Connected with this guy named Seth.

He just introduced himself. He says what do you do for a living? I said, I'm actually a pastor and He found that interesting and he so he wanted to talk a little bit more and then he said, you know I'm actually a deist.

I said, okay. And so I said, you know, let's just talk about that for a little bit and he said well the my problem with Christianity. He said is the gospel accounts were recorded hundreds of years after the fact.

Now, you know Eli that that's not the case. So for many Christians if they didn't have apologetics, it's it's a conversation stopper and you leave thinking when well. Well, I'm foolish for believing this or I couldn't give the deist anything and early on in my evangelism.

That would have been the case. But you know studying apologetics. Here's how that was a tool. I was able to say well, did you know? Seth that that's not really what is true here. In fact some scholars would put the entire New Testament dated before 8070 at the very latest early 90s.

I said not only that Paul the Apostle in 1st Corinthians 15 He said about Jesus resurrection some 500 saw him many of which were still alive. So we have amazing eyewitness testimony. And so now the conversation was Something that you know, he didn't get saved in the moment, but he was like, oh, okay.

And so we had a great conversation and I ended up inviting him to come to image Church. We're a church that I'm pastoring that I started. So that's just one example of how Apologetics can help you and I think a lot of people unfortunately would have no idea about that kind of detail and We need to be aware of this stuff because people ask questions and their questions should matter.

Apologetics in Face-to-Face Evangelism

Hmm very good. I mean, that's that's something we can go. That's a topic of an entire show. Look, what are the different things that people have said to you on the street? And how do you kind of on the spot come up with a sufficient answer?

That's that's the whole thing about always being ready. I mean we have to be in the word. We have to know the foundations of our faith now. What I find very interesting is folks who want to defend the faith and want to have opportunities to share the gospel.

Their prayer would often be something like this dear Lord. Please provide the opportunity to share your truth to a lost world send people into my path and they'll go Lord I want to be used and all of a sudden the knock on the door comes a Jehovah's Witness and you're like Oh, there's no witness close the windows, but the shades now.

It's like don't open the door. Those are the crazy people and so we pray for opportunities and then when opportunities when opportunities come we kind of run from them. Which I think is interesting now that said Those who are praying for opportunities Live in a time of opportunity and and the reason for that is the internet which now I want to transition into Your shift when you went from sharing and evangelizing which I'm sure you still do.

When did the shift happen from face-to-face? To you know what? I think there's a really interesting opportunity here in the online world. When did that happen? How did that all work out for you? Well, the woman an apologist was birthed out of a local church that I was pastoring, okay, so I Basically had this idea early on when YouTube started that.

Hey, wouldn't it be cool to kind of just do some short videos where I'm answering questions and so My worship pastor at the time was real helpful. He said yeah, I'd be cool if you kind of did like a black-and-white setting make it a kind of creative and I felt like aesthetics is Lacking a lot in the world of apologetics, especially at that time I mean obviously like Cameron Bertuzzi does an amazing job and you know, we think about just some of the different people like Mike at inspiring philosophy Will do really good stuff.

But when I was starting this I was kind of You know one of the early trailblazers like in the whole online Online apologetics and honestly, you know, I didn't know what I was getting into. I'm not a tech savvy guy.

It might look like it only because of the world that people created for me to be in I'm just a talking head. And so I had a friend Who was basically who's now doing movies like producing movies for the Kendrick Brothers so the person who designed the background for this is You know, he's directing the movie that's coming out for the Kendrick Brothers their next big one and so I was fortunate to have this connection and he was so gifted with creativity and He just created this black and white background and he developed the music and some of this stuff I was about to mention the music I mean Even if even if the title of the video didn't interest me if I were to click and it just hear the music.

I'm like Yeah, okay, I'll give it a listen it's very intriguing it's like oh I wonder what they're gonna say. I think it's excellent. I think it's awesome. But but go ahead. Yeah. Thank you. And I'm glad it just kind of looks the same as it always did but You know, our goal is to provide credible answers to curious questions.

So it's kind of like you know, we just want to be the video place that people go to whenever they've got like, you know, like what got questions is. For you know got questions calm for written questions.

We're just trying to do that on video where you can just go and find stuff. So we were at a conference at Southern Evangelical Seminary and we didn't have any idea that it was going to be an interview ministry.

There was just a big conference William Lane Craig Dinesh D'Souza Bill Dempsey Peter Kraft. Lots of people were there Mike Lacona and I started interviewing him and then boom. It's just started taking off.

And at the time I I didn't know any principles about how to make YouTube work. How you're supposed to connect with your audience how often you're supposed to post videos. Why you're supposed to go live with your audience.

I broke every rule and so. That's why I think I don't know. I still don't know any of those things. Yeah, there are there are rules to the game. Apparently, but yeah totally resonate with that there are you look at like my friend John McCrae, what do you mean?

You know his channel. What makes it do so? Well, a lot of times is you know, it's current events. It's posting two three times a week. It's trying to go live with your audience like you're doing right now.

Maybe once a week those are the types of things and so another faux pas that I had is I Went cold for about two years. I ended up going through a really dark night of the soul. Went cold and then all of a sudden when you when you go cold.

Well, I had all this I Had all this momentum, but then I went cold and it was like all these subscribers that I had. They just didn't see me doing anything. So what can happen is you can have a lot of subs that aren't paying attention to what's going on.

So it's just kind of a number. And so thankfully I'm so like happy for the success of Cameron Bertuzzi and Mike at aspiring philosophy and John McCrae, what do you mean the Mike winger? They were able to kind of cut they started their stuff later.

Sure, so they were able to figure out. How do you really do this the right way? So I would have loved to have had that but I was also Serving as a full-time lead pastor of a large church. You know, I was writing books.

This so this was just something I was doing on the side that was growing and I had no idea what I had. You know in the sense of how to maximize. I didn't even know what YouTube really was gonna become sure.

Yeah. Well, I guess nobody really did know. Yeah, so that that's super interesting and and I think it's very encouraging for folks to know That it is difficult you do you do have to step out in faith and say hey I have a passion for this and I'm just gonna do it the best way that I can and I think a lot of things.

When we when we learn about what it takes to do YouTube and to have a platform and to put out quality things. That can be really intimidating for folks and it's kind of like that which intimidates people from sharing their faith.

It's kind of like well, I don't know enough, you know, but we have to learn to trust in life fashion. I don't know about technology. So I'm not going to use this platform. Which I think is something we don't want.

We want more people putting stuff out. What do you think is the value the importance of taking ownership of this whole online community like for apologetics? Why is being online such a vital thing for Christians to do number one and number two?

Why isn't this a good excuse? Okay. Well when you argue on on the internet, it really doesn't get anywhere. So it's useless. You know, you kind of get that other that other extreme. How would you say to that?

I Don't think it's useless at all for online engagement. I do think that we could make ourselves Irrelevant to some people if our tone is off if we're coming across arrogant so I do think that it's important for us to maintain a humble kind Kind of demeanor and tone when we're dialoguing with people.

Hmm. I just listened to something yesterday. Okay, and what and it was talking about marketing and this guy does Helps you to do social media in the church and interestingly enough He before he gets you started with the social media.

He helps you to understand that one of the biggest Objections that people have Against Christianity is they don't want to be a part of it because it has a bad reputation and so he said you could disagree with the things that cause the church to have a bad reputation or You can be aware of that and then that can inform your marketing strategy.

And so I thought that was really wise For us to be aware of that the church is living in a time where it has a bad reputation. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that the the more we have an a neo moral code that has been developed today and no longer.

Is it the LGBTQ that needs to be saved and the person struggling with divorce? The person who had the abortion the person with drugs and alcohol. That material that was once used to convict people of their sin to recognize their guilt to turn to God.

Now the thing that needs to be saved is the Christian from the church now the thing that needs to be redeemed is the old moral code and The old moral code needs to embrace this new moral flow of things.

And so We are outdated. We are irrelevant. We have a horrific Reputation as oppressors and we need to be aware of that. And so when we go online and if we're mean and beating people up and being harsh.

We're just gonna add to people's kind of arsenal so we have to figure out how to be wise as serpents and Harmless as doves and this is gonna require Learning how to be wise Conversationalist with the culture that we live in.

The Church’s Reputation and Wise Online Engagement

Sure that's an excellent explanation there. Now when we are dealing with things online, it's very different than obviously being face-to-face with someone. So, you know when you're face-to-face you have that personal connection people will not say certain things that they would have no problem saying online which is You know all all of that kind of is removed online when you're hiding behind a keyboard.

People are you know, they say all sorts of things. But when we're interacting with online, you know in the online space. The interaction is often very short. How would you give some advice to Christians who are interacting with people on Facebook and kind of short back and forth?

How do you communicate? Profound Christian truths in such a short span of time without I. Being superficial does that make sense? Absolutely. So that would be one of the things that people could easily criticize about one-minute apologists, but people have to understand that this is just one piece of the polemical pie and so you know, I've interviewed many of the world's most well-known apologists and Had the privilege of introducing people from my platform to their work and so I Obviously would know that, you know, there's more to be said but I think that it's important that there are these commercial Breaks that we give I mean look we all have to know how to say an elevator pitch if you're a CEO of a company if you're a lead pastor of a church if You're the president of reasonable faith and you're William Lane Craig and you have just a few moments to describe it.

That's great. And so a lot of the discussion points that that we have You know We need to need to realize that it's good to have lots of different tiers for people to get into so I look at our ministry, for example is something that is going to appeal to people who are Not quite maybe ready to be Reading philosophical foundations of a Christian worldview, but they're they're kind of over the The the ultra seeker watered-down message.

They want something more. And so I want to wet their appetite. I want to introduce them and I think if people and honestly Anybody that would criticize something. I mean again, I have two doctorate degrees.

I don't say that to puff myself up I have a four-year master's degree that's equivalent to Three master's degrees, you know I mean you can get two ma you can get an MA and STM and an MDiv to equal a THM.

So all that say somebody could show three mastery. It's it's still equivalent to the THM. It's a beast of a master's degree. Sure, so I'm not saying that in a cocky way. I'm saying to go I value depth.

I I've spent my life studying depth, but anybody that would think that You need to put down Ministries or anybody that wants to do a blog because it's not 300 pages or three hours. Sure, they're showing they're showing their own ignorance in some ways because you know, I mean we have we all have to know how to To summarize it's called an abstract, right?

And so if you're doing a PhD thesis You you got to do an abstract of the PhD thesis and before people will often read the PhD thesis they look at the abstract and so I think that people need to realize is that if they have a more brief ministry that they're Abstracting for people with a goal for them to go into more in-depth.

Hmm, and I think that's one of the wonderful things I love about what you've done is every time I watch a video. You make me spend money. Man that person had something really interesting to say now I got to go buy a book.

Thanks a lot Bobby, you know. But that's a mission accomplished. I mean you you've taken a one minute and 30 something seconds however long. The discussion is and you've just you've connected with the audience in a way that's piqued their interest and now have led them To read someone they probably never heard of before or now.

It's like oh this person seems really interesting. I want to hear what they have to say in more depth and I think as Kind of your content is a good gateway drug if I can use that language into some more deeper material.

Which is what we want to encourage people to do especially skeptics who have perhaps very superficial understanding of Christianity. They listen to an interview that you've done and say, you know what?

I'm gonna I'm gonna pick up that Gary Habermas book this evidence for the resurrection. So I think it appeals not only to the Christian but also to the curious skeptic. Which I think is something we could all very much appreciate.

The Value of Short-Form Apologetics

Now, how would you? Encourage someone to Get started. How does someone get started in online apologetics? That's a very broad question because there's so many different things. I mean YouTube isn't for everyone, you know.

There are people they're not very the camera doesn't you know, you know that they get on the camera. They're just like hi. This is my first episode. That's not very you know, they don't they don't connect well on the camera.

Maybe they want to do something behind the scenes or you know have an Instagram account where they're putting out, you know materials brief. Little, you know audio clips. What are some of the options out there for people who want to get involved in in online apologetics ministry?

Well, I do think that I would love for example to see the church at large to value Apologetics and so how great would it be if you know you had? Churches starting to put an Apologetic page with links to the different apologetic ministries that are out there.

That could be a great thing for somebody. That's more behind the scenes. They could use their time helping promote The different ministries that are out there sort of being like the evangelist for the apologist getting the word out because You know, we all appreciate when people share our content or when people Blurb about it or when people write a review about it.

So I think that that could be the role that somebody takes if somebody is got gifts that are more behind the scenes. Maybe they're a researcher so they could help research for the apologists or they could do secretarial stuff or admin stuff for people who are Gifted.

Then they really need to be thinking. You know, what's going to be the vision of their ministry? What's going to be the mission? What's going to be their brand? How are they going to market it? What platforms are they going to be on?

Is it going to be Instagram Facebook? Is it going to be? YouTube is it going to be tick tock? I mean, you're gonna have to really think through what platforms I would advise anybody thinking of starting a kind of a YouTube ministry.