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Mike interviews Phil during Adult Sunday School hour at Bethlehem Bible Church. Tune in for a spicy interview that is sure to encourage.
Welcome to No Compromise Radio Ministry, Pastor Mike Abendroth. I don't go by doctor, don't call me doctor, I go to the doctor. I just went to the doctor today and I got a shot in my knee to give me a little more, I don't know, a little more lube for my arthritis and my surgically repaired knee.
I had ACL replaced a few years ago and meniscus repaired. And speaking of medical things, I even have a chapter in my book, Cancer is Not Your Shepherd, on how to talk to people with cancer. And if you have cancer, how do you talk to people who want to talk to you?
Sometimes they say dumb things. I mean, we all say dumb things, don't we? If you talk enough, you say dumb things. And I noticed on American Gospel Television's Facebook site the other day, as he was, Brandon was promoting the new video series we're doing for him, Cancer is Not Your Shepherd, Guide to Suffering, 17 five to ten minute episodes.
Someone said under there, the comments, speaking of dumb things, I think the person's name was Grace and they said, you know, why listen to this guy when you can just eat these herbs or these keto things and get healed from cancer, you don't need that.
And I just thought, I won't say what I originally thought, it wasn't a swear word or anything like that, but just I don't want to call somebody something that I ought not to. But I just thought, I did respond and said, this person named Grace needs more grace.
I just said, oh, brother. Today on No Compromise Radio, we have, speaking of brothers, my brother in Christ, Pastor Phil Howard, my pastor, I call him. And he, I don't know why I'm putting music on here right now.
I shouldn't be. I could do that. Why do I have music on sometimes? I mean, we could have all kinds of music if we wanted. We can combine those two things together. No-cos intro music? We don't want to do that.
Anyway, this is the Q &A session I did with Pastor Phil during Adult Sunday School. You've heard the merit messages. And now we have the Q &A for our Adult Sunday School class. Phil Howard, No Compromise Radio.
Your morning's going well. If you weren't here yesterday for the conference, we know your name and number. We've taken notes. It should be online. Make sure you listen to the sessions. If you weren't here yesterday, I have the joy this morning of introducing Pastor Phil Howard.
You have a doctorate, don't you? Where'd you get your doctorate?
Oh, Dallas.
Dallas Seminary.
Yes.
Are there any Christians in Dallas Seminary?
Well, there was then. Philistines, Amorites, and Christians.
Can you pull that up just a little bit? Okay. What we thought we would do this morning is just have kind of a pastoral chat. And you can kind of just listen in. And we're going to talk a little bit about the Lord Jesus, a little bit about ministry.
And I just wanted to pick Phil's brain a little bit. He'll be preaching today. Give us a little teaser on your sermon this morning.
In light of doing marriage yesterday, I thought I'd speak today on the romance that became a rut. And speak on revelation and what the Lord Jesus says to his bride. And we'll look at that. And it's easy to be a rut Christian and then a rut in your marriage.
We're still married, but romance died a long time ago. Yeah, I'm a Christian. And my dad asked a guy. He was a construction worker. He said, are you a Christian? He said, hell yes. Isn't everybody? Is that Christianity?
Had no clue. Yeah, there's really supposed to be a romance involved. And we'll be looking at it.
All right.
I was going to say I only wanted a teaser. You were just going to preach the whole message. You're not going to say hell yes from the pulpit today, are you?
I've got to remember I'm in another state in California. I got away with everything.
Phil, maybe we can start off this way. How did the Lord save you and what were the circumstances?
I was scared to death. I went to my grandfather, John Howard, funeral. And it was the first family funeral. I was about 12. And I was just scared to death of dying. And I grew up in California. Richmond is in the Bay Area, San Francisco, Oakland Bay Area.
I was born in 44. World War II was still going. And so my folks were used to a war town environment, rationing. My mom and dad worked in the shipyards. My uncles were shipping out to the Pacific, Okinawa, Iwo Jima.
My wife's father was a radioman at Iwo Jima. So the war, the war. And the Russians are coming. I mean, we're doing fallout shelters, atomic. I was paranoid as a kid. We're going to be having war with Russia any time.
And so out of that conviction began to grow in me. Grow in me until I was afraid to go to sleep at night because they're going to blow us up. I know I'm lost. I grew up in church because my dad was bigger than me.
But I didn't want to go. But I had to go. And kids didn't have a vote in my day. You did what your parents said. Or you just didn't eat for a month. There's different ways to get you to obey. But I remember it was a Tuesday night Bible study.
I went.
I wore a leather jacket, had a fist load in there, and miserable. And boy, the guy that preached couldn't preach his way out of a paper sack. I don't even know what he said. I went. The baby was due. And it was bursting in my heart.
So I went forward. We always had even Tuesday night Bible study with 40 people. You've got to go to the altar. I was in holiness circles and got saved. Back slid in about four months because I didn't know what to do when I sinned.
Because I grew up in a tradition, you lose your salvation. You can lose it, which is miserable. I was on probation. You're saved until you commit your next sin. And then you start all over. And so I bailed out because I like rock and roll and dances.
And I was playing guitar. And so I went back. But by the summer of 59, I burned all my bridges back and started preaching when I was about 16. And that's all I've done ever since.
Wonderful. Speaking of preaching, what's your analysis of preaching today in evangelicalism?
What's my analysis?
Boring.
A lot of it is boring. And it seems like the better educated, the more boring. It's like hearing a dictionary. Little feeling, little pathos, very non-moving. It's so much that I hear. Or you've got the guys with no content.
And they're just as empty. It's void. And I say often, I've been retired nearly five years from pastoring. I miss Jesus a lot in church. I don't really. You folks look rather handsome. But I didn't come down here to see you.
Ultimately, I'm so wretched, I need to see him. I'm desperate for him. I can't make it without him. And his people are a bonus. But I've got to start with him. I couldn't stand you if it wasn't for him.
Is that New England or California? You know, Christ is what. Because man, I've been in church to some people. I said, I would never be found dead with this guy. He is just. And then all of a sudden, he's a brother.
I said, I'm stuck with this guy for eternity. It's amazing. In our church there that I started in California, we have about seven ethnicities represented in our church. And if you're black or if you're brown in our church, it doesn't mean you're Mexican.
It might mean you're from Guatemala. You might be from El Salvador. You may be Nicaragua. And if you're black, it doesn't mean you grew up in Richmond. You're from, you know, I was thinking of Nigeria.
We have many Nigerians. Ethnicity, because an all-white congregation is boring to me. I want diversity. Why aren't we diverse?
Why aren't we?
And I grew up with Southern whites that came to California and were not welcome. We were considered white trash. You're going to ruin our state. And if you see Ken Burns' documentary on the Dust Bowl, they advertise in California, Okie said here, and my father's from Tulsa, Oklahoma, and was considered white trash, trailer people, dummies, worthless, and not welcome, believe me, not welcome.
And I grew up with that. So I grew up with black people. And we grew up in the projects, in the war effort. So I have an affinity to people of diversity in hard times. I'm not a highbrow. I'm so down-to-earth, it's wretched, because I came from those people.
And, boy, I'll leave that alone.
So we talked a little bit about preaching. As a pastor for nearly 59 years, or 59 years, excuse me, 49 years, 59 years married, what would you tell the congregation regarding listening to sermons?
Well, I think that I'm looking, first of all, do they preach the Bible? Is there any content? You know, content. So I'm always, I don't want no application until I know if the guy can tell me what the text actually said.
So I'm partial to guys that can be expositors, like your pastors, in this tradition. And, of course, John MacArthur, and Swindolls, Pipers, and men of marvelous knowledge. So I'm looking, ignorance doesn't edify me.
You know, I want someone that knows the text, at least. And then I think that, I love what he said in Hebrews 5, that when he gave Israel a priesthood, he gave them men of like passion and of like weakness that they could sympathize with the people.
And it's a real bonus to think that the guy in the pulpit gives a hoot about me. Because Tozer said, preach to broken hearts for there's one on every row. So the bonus is, I don't want book reports on Romans, I want you to preach to my heart.
And if you don't care about my heart, what in the world am I sitting under you for? I could buy commentaries. I could buy commentaries. That's why I grew up, because I commuted to San Francisco for years, from a town about 40 miles out.
All I could get was J. Vernon McGee. I love J. Vernon McGee, because he's down to earth. He was an expositor, and he had such heartwarming stories coming up. And, you know, when you're not real educated, you grow up on oral tradition.
And some of them are true, some of them aren't. But I think a combination of substance with heart, and it's a bonus to hear a powerful preacher that's clothed in humility, because preachers can be an arrogant lot, and it's what destroys us.
And God will arrange enough thorns in your life to keep you dependent, because he doesn't want us to be destroyed by our own pride. So when you see someone, I took my dad to hear an upcoming preacher, he was really kind of becoming the rage in the circles we were in.
And after he heard him, and we're coming home, and I said, Well, Dad, what did you think of him? Now, this is a guy that's been through the Depression in the shipyards during World War II, saw uncles go out, come back, shot up, stayed on the beaches of the Pacific fighting.
He said, once he has suffered a while, he'll be worth listening to. But he doesn't know anything about life. And so here I'm a 15-year-old preacher, but I preach to kids, I did youth groups, I did, you know, I was in the right league, and just kept going until the adults could see me.
You don't know what you're in for, do you?
Phil, we talked at home a couple days ago about your style of winning folks over to truths maybe they haven't been exposed to before. So tell them the story about when you met with some leaders at Calvary Chapel movement that would be more Arminian, and they asked you about Calvinism, tulip, and what was your approach to that?
Because I think that was wise, and we could learn from you in that area.
Well, I was at Greg Laurie's church in Southern Cal, which, huge ministry, quite a story. And one of the guys was becoming, or was a Calvinist, and the other guys, you know, you guys around here ought to be drowning in theology.
I mean, Michael's got more books than is lawful. And such a writer and thinker. Outstanding young man. I can't understand him, but he's outstanding.
All right, let's close in prayer.
I love him greatly.
But they asked, you know, what do you think? Are you a Calvinist? Okay. And I grew up at the other end, for sure. I said, well, let's start out this way. I said, were any of you bad enough to need a savior?
If you know anything about Calvary Chapel in Southern Cal, all their boys had converted from the beach, converted out of drugs, converted from sleeping with whoever. And I said, were you really lost? I mean, you had to have someone find you.
Oh, absolutely. I said, well, we agree on that. Were you totally lost? Yeah, I was. Okay. Two, was it your idea to become a Christian or did God track you down? Do you think God looked you up or did you look him up?
I said, no, man. We didn't want God. We wanted to party. We wanted this. We wanted that. I said, well, who actually came up with the idea of saving a punk like you? I said, well, it was God. I said, well, we'll call that unconditional election.
He chose you because he wanted you. You know, you don't get mad at a guy. There's 18 girls on the block, but he picks the girl he wants to take to the prom. I hope the other 16 don't get mad at him. They probably do.
But you can take any girl you want to the prom. God can take anyone he wants to heaven. And he happened to save you. Oh, did Jesus get anybody when he died on the cross or was it all a gamble? I'll die, Father.
I hope somebody gets saved. Or did he know? Did he get a church? Did he get a bride? Did he walk away with the cross with anyone? Did anybody get saved from the cross? Absolutely. He bought a people. He bought a Titus 2 .14.
He bought a people. He redeemed a people. Did he just pay down the money but walked out of the store with nothing in his hand?
No.
He bought some folks. We happen to call those people believers.
Man.
I said, I'm in. I said, how did you do it resisting God? Didn't look like you did too well. You're all believers.
Right.
And I said, and most of you guys are going to backslide and go to hell by next week.
Oh, no.
We're not doing that. Well, will you make it? I said, you will make it. Because God doesn't lose what he chooses. The shepherd, you know, in John 10, the shepherd is the door. The sheep have to get in the foal through him.
And I like to imagine, and to get out of that foal, that sheep at night would have to jump over the shepherd. Because he was the door. I like to just think, I tonight want to get out just midair. The shepherd just said, where are you going?
You're mixed up. You're having a nightmare. You're not going anywhere. And isn't that, instead when I got saved as a kid, because I was with people that believed you could lose your salvation. It's like being on probation all the time.
You hope. You hope. And then all of a sudden, and the men in the denomination that were going to discipline me for believing that my salvation was forever, the man told me, he said, I was only in my 20s and I was a dean of a school.
And he told me, you're making a big mistake believing this security.
You're young.
You don't know what's ahead. If you knew all the preachers we knew that were in moral trouble and that had this problem and that, Nehemiah. I said, I don't trust myself any further than I could throw myself.
I'm not talking about my ability. I'm saying, I am convinced that he that has begun a good work in me will complete it. And for my ordination verse in a Pentecostal denomination, my ordination verse was, Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling and to present you faultless before the throne of grace with exceeding joy and gladness to the only wise God, our Savior, be glory, dominion, and power both now and ever.
June 24, 25. Do you men believe it can keep you? Absolutely. Well, why don't you preach it? End of discussion. I just talked to them and did what they don't know.
That wraps it up for part one, Q &A. Bethlehem Bible Church, Adult Sunday School, Pastor Phil Howard. You can write me, Mike at NOCOradio .com.