Why do Baptists and Presbyterians Differ on Baptism?

What's the difference between the Pado version of baptism and the Credo, the Baptist versus Presbyterian?

Just give me a high level. In the Pado understanding, the covenant of grace was formally established with Abraham.

And the sign of the covenant of grace is circumcision. And that sign of circumcision is administered via households to all of the descendants of Abraham.

The old administration moving it into the new administration in the new covenant. The Lord never repealed that household paradigm.

And so the sign of the covenant of grace in the new administration is baptism. And it should be administered the same way, i .e.

via household, just like circumcision was administered under the old administration. As I understand it, that is the

Pado -Baptistic presentation of why baptism is administered the way that it is given their covenantal framework.

And the reason why there's silence and nowhere in Scripture to say to baptize children is because of that carryover.

They're saying, well, there's no need to create clarity there. Exactly. Because God has always intended the children of believers to be in the covenant, whether it's administrated in the old or the new.

We understand that the covenant of grace, while promised and revealed in the Old Testament, was not formally established until Christ came.

We do not understand, therefore, that circumcision was the sign of the covenant of grace, but rather was the sign of the covenant

God made with Abraham pertaining to his physical offspring. So what this means for us is as the covenant of grace is further revealed in the

Old Testament and we get to the New Testament and the establishment of the covenant of grace in the new covenant with Jesus, there is distinction and discontinuity and baptism is the sign of the covenant of grace, period.

We don't understand that there was any other one, but that baptism is the sign given to those who are a part of the covenant of grace, who have experienced the new covenant reality of regeneration in the indwelling of the

Holy Spirit, professing faith in Christ, repentance toward God in faith. For in one spirit, we were all baptized into one body,

Jews and Greeks, slaves and free, and all were made to drink of one spirit. So it's not that it's a community of believers where you're going to have believers and unbelievers who have received the sign and we're waiting for them to reflect it in their confirmation of the faith.

He is saying the sign of baptism is symbolized in that we are one in body.

They're all a part of, this is important, in one spirit, right? For in one spirit, we were all baptized into one body.

So are you saying, and I know they're not, I know they're not saying this, but this is why we as Baptists have a complication in this.

Are you saying that when you give a child the sign of baptism, that they are one in spirit with us? And they are one in covenant, but they're not one in spirit.

And we were saying the new covenant doesn't have languages of dual membership. They would never say it's dual membership.

I say it's dual membership, that you have some who have half the benefits and you have some who have all the benefits.

So I always ask my paedo friends, what benefits are they lacking? And they have to say that the indwelling of the spirit is not in them.

Therefore, they're not in the body. Therefore, the sign isn't matching how Paul is describing it. Baptism is not the fulfillment of circumcision.

The fulfillment of circumcision is the circumcision of the heart, which is regeneration in the indwelling of the

Holy Spirit, which is what's talked about in Colossians 2. And then it's wild that in three or four verses, you have all of these principles of circumcision, of Christ being buried with him in baptism, raised with him through faith, being made alive together with Jesus, having our sins forgiven through the work of Christ on the cross.

Like all of that is right there in the language about baptism. And this is all couched in being alive in Christ in Colossians 2.

And then talking later, as Paul will, about the old way of life, the old man, and then the new way, the new man, putting off, putting on.

So we have to take all of that into consideration in terms of how the apostle is reasoning in his letter to the