This atheist gets the TRINITY wrong!

Revealed Apologetics

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I'm saying if you're going to do internal critiquing to show that something's logically incoherent, you didn't show that there's a logical incoherency, my inability to explain, say, the metaphysics of the

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Trinity on every detail, it doesn't prove that it's contradictory. You're making the claim that it's contradictory demonstrate that it's contradictory.

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Sure, it defies the laws of logic. Show me how does it? How does it defy the law of logic? Okay, can you have three beings in one that are distinct and separate from each other that I that absolutely goes against the law of non contradiction?

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It absolutely goes against the law of identity. So, yes, it goes against the laws of logic.

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No, because you just incorrectly define the Trinity. Okay, if you're going to say, husband, father, friend,

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Not what I'm going to say either. Okay, then what? Because I'm going to say that you're a polytheist.

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You said three beings. You said three beings. That's polytheism. We don't believe that God is three beings. We believe that God is one being who exists as three persons and we make a distinction between being and personhood.

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This is the traditional understanding. When we when we understand the Trinity, we have these distinctions that are very important.

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Some people will say in popular sense, God is one what and three who's. He's one being with three centers of consciousness.

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Each center of consciousness has the characteristics of personhood. Cool. That's not a that's not a contradictory statement because I'm not saying three beings.

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And no, it just it just means that you're not a Trinitarian. I am a

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Trinitarian. No, you're not. You just said that you have one being with three persons.

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That one being is not three beings. And by it not being three beings, Eric, you're not a

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Trinitarian at this point, Eric. And I and I and I'm sure if I've misunderstood you, then, yes, you can say the same thing to me.

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Hey, here's my view. Look into this and get a grip on it. Maybe we can come back and talk. Sure, that's fine. Yeah. But the way you've just expressed the

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Trinity, you don't know what the Trinity is. This is the Orthodox view of the Trinity, that God is one being who exists as three persons.

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That's the Orthodox doctrine of the Trinity. I'm not a oneness Pentecostal where we hold to some form of modalism, that God is one being in three manifestations, kind of like a father and a son.

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And that's not what I'm saying, that those are heretical views that Christianity rejects. We never say that God is three beings.

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That's polytheism. He's one being, but he is tripersonal and we make a distinction between being in person.

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So just as a point of correction, that's what the Trinity is. That's the Orthodox. That's not a weird view.

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That's the Orthodox view. No, I understand that. I was I was raised a Christian. I I get it.

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Can you give me an example of something else that has multiple persons? I can't because God is unique in that way.

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OK, so how is that different from special pleading? It's not special pleading because there's nothing that is violated in the laws of logic to say that there is one being that exists as three persons that show me how that violates logical laws.

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I'm not saying God is three beings and one being. That's a logical contradiction. Then show me what's different between a being and a person.

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I'm sorry, then I'm then I'm not understanding what's different between a being and a person. Well, when we explain the

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Trinity, when we talk about the being of God, we're talking about the whatness of God. He is what is God? Well, he's a being.

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The nature of his being is that he has three centers of consciousness. How do I know this? Well, if the

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Bible is true, this is revealed to us in Scripture. Otherwise, we wouldn't be able to know about it. How do we know this is revealed in Scripture?

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Well, if you grant if you grant Scripture, it clearly teaches that there is only one

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God. Right. Deuteronomy six, four, hero, Israel, the Lord, our God is one. Yet there are three persons who are called

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God. The father is called God. And in various places, the son is called God. Jesus claimed deity for himself and the

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Holy Spirit is called God. How do we know there are three persons? Well, the father gives personal attributes.

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You know, he speaks and is described as a person. The son is described as a person. The Holy Spirit is attributed in Scripture having personal attributes.

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And so when we take the idea that there is one God, but then we see how he's revealed himself in these three persons.

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That is how the Trinity is derived. We derive that from a systematic approach of looking at all of what Scripture said and what

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God has said about himself. And we come up later on with some of these philosophical terms to couch these biblical principles.