Arguments from Atheists (Part 1)

Welcome to No Compromise Radio, a ministry coming to you from Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston. No Compromise Radio is a program dedicated to the ongoing proclamation of Jesus Christ, based on the theme in Galatians 2, verse 5, where the Apostle Paul said, �But we did not yield in subjection to them for even an hour, so that the truth of the gospel would remain with you.

In short, if you like smooth, watered-down words to make you simply feel good, this show isn�t for you. By purpose, we are first biblical, but we can also be controversial. Stay tuned for the next 25 minutes as we�re called by the Divine Trumpet to summon the troops for the honor and glory of her King.

Here�s our host, Pastor Mike Abendroth.

Welcome to No Compromise Radio, a ministry. My name is Mike Abendroth, and I have here in-house, in-studio, Steve Cooley. Hi. Steve. I don�t want to overstep my bounds. Well, we wouldn�t want to overreact either.

No, we wouldn�t. Steve, the other day I was watching on Hulu a show called The Academy. Not just A Academy or An Academy, it�s The Academy.

It�s about the West Point?

Oh, interesting, but no. The L .A. Sheriff�s Academy, and I think it�s called The Grinder or something and where the men and women who are future L .A. Sheriffs have to go through an 18-week boot camp.

And I thought, I think Pastor Steve, Tuesday guy, has been through that.

Yeah, they put you through the grinder. You come in, you know, whole, and then you leave in little pieces. That�s why they call it The Grinder. What was the hardest part of The Grinder? The hardest part of The Grinder, well, actually, I guess I�d probably say it was making sure I had a suit every single day, you know, before we got into uniforms.

Because I remember one day, well, actually, it was the evening, probably a Thursday evening, and all of a sudden I realized I didn�t have a suit for the next day because I�d forgotten to go pick them up at the cleaners or I�d gotten home too late or whatever.

And so, this is like, what do I do? So I wore, I had a nice shirt and tie and a, what�s the name of the sweater? Oh, an Argyle sweater, you know, V-neck Argyle sweater. I thought it looked pretty good and, you know, I wore it the next day and DI comes up to me and he says, �What are you doing in my formation, Mr. Ivy League

And see, now here you are in New England!

And we�re prophetic! I had a hard time not laughing, you know, and so I was like, you know, sometimes you just have to fake it. That was one of those times where I just had to kind of go with it,. �What are you doing in my formation, Mr. Ivy League

Now, did you ever smirk or did you ever give one of those faces that betrayed your thinking.

In front of a drill instructor? You know, I�m sure I did that morning and, you know, but listen, I know what you were saying the other day about becoming class sergeant. I was never the class sergeant.

I was like, there was only one time when I was even on their radar and they accused me of something and I knew I hadn�t done it, so I just said, �No, I didn�t do that. And they said, �Are you sure

And they were like, �Give me the, you know, the grilling. And I was like, �No, I didn�t do it. And probably after about 15 minutes, they just dropped it all together because they were just trying to see if I would confess or whatever.

Funny. Well, when our dog does something bad, my children go up to her and they say, �Confess And just with the tone of that, then she like shirks down, �Confess Yeah, I wasn�t doing that. No way.

The Atheist Charge That the Bible Is a Human Invention

Steve, we received some free books at the Shepherds Conference this year, the Interagency Conference, and one was Brodman and Holman, In Defense of the Bible, and it�s a compilation of different writers, a comprehensive apologetic for the authority of scripture.

And I read two quotes by two men who say they don�t believe in God, and then I have an article in front of me about how atheists use arguments to say Christianity is false. Here�s the good news, I can pick a topic, you don�t even know the topic, but you can chime right in.

Yes, I can. Chime, chime, chime, chime. Sam Harris. �The Bible, it seems certain, was the work of sand-strewn men and women who thought the earth was flat and for whom a wheelbarrow would have been a breathtaking example of emerging technology of redactors, is to repudiate 2 ,000 years of civilizing insights that the human mind has only just begun to inscribe upon itself through secular politics and scientific culture.

Sam Harris, The End of Faith. Do you want my redaction? I do.

Redaction. I just said, �The Bible, it seems certain, was the work of sand-strewn men and women I think it's so, with all due respect, and when you say, �with all due respect. Oh, totally. Here comes the bomb.

With all due respect to Sam Harris, that is ignorant. Well, I mean, first of all, I hear this kind of argumentation all the time. And what it really says is that these simple men, you know, somehow concocted the greatest book of all time, you know, and that doesn't conflict with it, you know, and he probably would say, �Well, that's the redactors, the editors.

Well, okay, well, who were those editors and how were they so brilliant to do all this and, you know, still be consistent with the manuscripts that are, you know, older than the alleged editors? And there is no answer to that.

Listen, it all comes down to this. You either believe in God, you either believe in a sovereign God who is able to preserve his word, or you don't. And for somebody like Sam Harris, he doesn't, and therefore, he takes it a step further and he just starts scoffing, you know, laughing at the idea and anybody who believes that is a rube.

And here's what I would say to Mr. Harris, you know, let's go 4 ,000 years in the future. Not that I think the world will be around in 4 ,000 years, but if it is, they're going to look back at you and they're going to say that you were what?

Some asphalt-strewn rube, you know, who lived in, I mean, they're going to think you're just as dumb as you think those people 2 ,000 years ago were dumb. And the truth is, they weren't. All you have to do is look at, go even further back.

Look at the pyramids, all these things that are built that we can't even explain how they did it. And they were stupid?

No, they weren't. Steve, the verse that comes to my mind in light of what you just said was, the fool has said in his heart, There is no God. There is no God. Now, that's not a, the fool is not a person who's dumb or who has a dunce cap.

Dunce caps were invented for what particular guy? I think it was Dunce. Mr. Dunce. Mr. Dunce. I mean, were you ever given a dunce cap in school?

Some kind of cone of silence? No, I mean, there were maybe a few times where they would have wanted to silence me, but not the dunce cap. Did you ever have to stand in the corner? You know, not that I remember.

I do remember I did get a few swats, you know. Seriously? In public school in Bakersfield? No, sorry, West Covina? Yeah. Yeah, actually in Covina. But yes. Okay. That is amazing to me. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I mean, yeah, I used to get swats for things like not doing my homework in public school.

So, you know, when I went to school in the 20s. So, the fool in the psalm, the fool has said in his heart, there's no God. He's actually could be a very smart person, high IQ. And you know what, Steve?

Maybe he even has a high emotional IQ. Ooh.

Yes. EIQ. I like to come to his emotional rescue. Oh, nice.

Real nice. And so, that was funny. That was worth it. And so, this is moral foolishness, and it means something like this. I know I'm sinful, and I don't like the feeling that my conscience gives me after I sin.

And who wants to think about the wages of sin and eternal death and separation from God's goodness and mercy. And so, I need to reconstruct the world or make a little concoction of my mind so I can live guilt-free.

Isn't this a lot about guilt and how to assuage guilt? Oh, no.

No, no, no. Because when you say that, it's like, no, we don't believe in guilt, and we don't believe, well, I mean, this is all about suppression of the truth and unrighteousness, Romans 1. It's about, you know, Psalm 14, and by the way, one of the best messages I ever heard was from Psalm 14 by Cary Hardy, so a little shout out to North Carolina.

Really? Yeah.

Yeah, I like Cary. Yeah. If I ever have any pharmaceutical questions, I email Cary. He's the man. Yeah, I think he's still certified. All right, here's another quote, and this quote is by Christopher Hitchens, God is Not Great is the name of the book, How Religion Poisons Everything.

I did pick up a copy of this book at one of those book sales for like a buck ninety-eight. I thought you were going to say for full price. Yeah, no. And so, here's what Christopher Hitchens said, the Bible may, indeed does, contain a warrant for trafficking in humans, for ethnic cleansing, for slavery, for bride price, and for indiscriminate massacre.

But we are not bound by any of it because it was put together by crude, uncultured human mammals. Hmm.

I just, you know, it's so depressing to me to hear this kind, I mean, this is the sort of argument that you hear from atheists over and over and over again. Well, doesn't the Bible, you know, command slavery?

And doesn't the Bible do this? And doesn't the Bible do that? And well, the truth is what? You know, that evil men do these things, and they're still doing them today. You know, we're so sophisticated today, really.

You know, you can't even, for the most part, I mean, what's his name, the last guy you were just talking about? Sam Harris. No, no. No, God is not great, Dawkins. He's fairly consistent, he bashes all religions, but there are a lot of them, you know, that only want to bash Christianity and, you know, and kind of give Islam a pass.

Well, look around the world today. You know, what religion is doing what, and it's Islam that's doing all the evil. But this, getting back to this whole idea that the Bible somehow would command, for any of these kind of things, well, I think you have to separate the economy of Israel and the economy of the Old Testament world from the New Testament, and it's apples and oranges.

Dr. John Sanders. Steve, when I listen to people on the internet or radio shows or read something in print, by the way, there's not much print to read these days, is there? You know, I feel really sorry for kids, because silly putty, if it does still exist, and I know it does, there's no newspaper print to kind of press down.

Yeah, Dennis the Menace cartoon, and then you spread out Dennis's face to be super wide.

I mean, it just doesn't happen anymore. We would have hours of entertainment. I know, seriously.

So I don't have any idea what I'm talking about. But Psalm 19, it says of the Word of God, David's view is a little different than Christopher Hitchens or Sam Harris, or who's the football player that was Sam Bam?

Cunningham. Cunningham. And then it was Sam Bam Lacy, the six foot eight center for the Kansas City Kings back in the day.

Yeah, I wasn't a big Kansas City Kings fan.

I actually was on the basketball court with Sam Lacy. And he said, Hey, young man, I was 13. I was a ball boy. And he said, Could you give me some bounce passes? He got out to the court early. No other players were out.

Give me some bounce passes when I do my layup drills. And so I said to Sam Bam Lacy, Yes, sir. Sweet. And then I gave him a couple of good two handed chest bounce passes with some zing on it with a little bit of tang.

And he said, Well, you can do a few layups, too. Nice.

Yeah, that was pretty fun. See, Sam Bam, that automatically means Cunningham for me, USC football, baby. I know.

The law of the Lord is perfect, reviving the soul, the testimony of the Lord is sure, making wise the simple, the precepts of the Lord are right, rejoicing the heart, the commandment of the Lord is pure, enlightening the eyes and the fear of the Lord is clean, enduring forever.

The rules of Lord are true and righteous altogether. I think I'll go with King David. It's a tough call. All right, Pastor Mike here with Pastor Steve. I have a website that is puts all kinds of articles out.

I don't mean I but I went to a website and I went to this article called 12 good arguments atheists advance against Christianity. And so I thought Steve and I would dissect that a little bit. Doubt it.

Doubt it. Number one, there's so much suffering in the world. And so Christianity can't be true because there's a lot of suffering. And Steve, what would your retort be? The problem of evil.

I mean, this is, that is not an argument against Christianity. That is an argument against mankind because it is man that does evil. Man is continuously evil. This is what we have in our hearts. We, you know, universally, no one teaches babies how to sin.

No one has to teach anyone how to sin. We do it naturally. We are fallen in Adam and this is the result. The result is evil happens in the world.

But Steve, if God is all loving and God is all powerful and God is all knowing, maybe then he just isn't as powerful as we thought because he knows about these things and cares but can't do anything about it?

Well, I mean, there are two problems with that. Number one is God will ultimately put an end to it. And when he does, the scoffers will not be scoffing. They will be silent. But the second problem with that is this idea that somehow, you know, there's evil in the world.

God could stop it. And yet he doesn't. Well, here, I would say this, we cannot know what light is unless we have something to contrast it with. So, we have darkness, we have sin. We can't understand perfection unless we have imperfection to compare it with.

And when we get to heaven, when Christians get to heaven, they will marvel at the perfection, the holiness, the goodness of God because we will, in some way, we will be able to understand what we've left, you know, what the sinful world that we've left behind and we won't miss it.

But anyway, all that to say, could God end suffering right now? Yes, he could. But when he does, and he will, he's going to end sin and injustice and imperfection forever.

Steve, sometimes I think we as Christians need to push back a little bit. And so, we answer the question of suffering in terms of what God does in light of suffering, what God does in light of his sovereignty over suffering.

We look to the cross, that answers a lot of questions about what God thinks of sin and must it be punished. But sometimes I think we need to just flip the question back around. Okay, let's say Christianity is false.

So, how do you, the atheist, so-called atheist, explain suffering when it's basically, you're just chemicals, and you have chemical reactions to other beings, and you think they're loved ones, but it's just, it's all, it's a chemical romance.

And so, what's the big deal?

Well, and how does that explain suffering? You know, I mean, if you want to say, well, evolution explains suffering, because there's going to be struggle and that doesn't

I thought we're supposed to be getting better, evolution, you know, we love Devo around here,.

The band, for lots of reasons. But there is no explanation for the evil that man inflicts upon man and for the sheer joy that some men take out of it. I mean, you see the atrocities that are going on in the Middle East right now with ISIS, ISIL, whatever they want to call themselves, you know, severing heads and doing all these things and actually boasting about it.

And you just think, okay, well, explain that, Mr. Evolutionary Man. You have no explanation. I do, which is, man is inherently evil, you know, this is in the heart of all men. And it's God's restraining grace that keeps us from doing it universally.

Pete Steven Malachi, the people there were so fed up with God. The text says they actually were wearing God by saying over and over and over again, where's your justice? You're not just God. Where's the justice?

So, instead of looking at themselves saying, well, we're sinful and we are getting what we deserve, God is chasing us, chasening us. How do you say that? Chasening us. Yeah, there we go. Chasening, yes.

They're looking at everybody else and they're looking at all the suffering in the world, but mainly all the excelling of ungodly people, hey, they're getting blessed, what's going on? And Malachi answers the question with, God answers the question with, Jesus is going to come back.

I'm sending my Messiah. Where's justice? We want justice right away, but that would mean we would get justice. And some of our unbelieving friends would immediately get justice. God is merciful and gracious and patient.

And then one day when Jesus comes back the second time, it'll just be all justice.

People who think they want perfect justice don't really understand sin.

And you know what, Steve? It's like, we want perfect justice for everybody else. That's right. But not for ourselves. And so, it's that self-righteous pride where it's like, you, you, you.

I like to see God end all suffering, except for the suffering I cause.

There's that Hawaiian company, a Christian company, and it's he, and then there's a greater sign, that little arrow that's put on the side, its side. He is greater than I, meaning Jesus is greater than I am.

And you know, we have John the Baptist kind of an echo there, that he must decrease so the Son of God, Jesus, must increase. And so, I think it was Byron Yawn who did the whole Romans 1 and 2 theme that I'm greater than you.

So, I greater than you, and that's basically what it is. Hey, we're better, and you're all the bad ones. We want God's justice, but King's X for us. Yeah, we don't want it. All right, Steve, let's go to the second one.

The Exclusivity of Christ and the Only Way to God

Jesus can be the only way to God. Atheists hate. Can't be. Can't be. Did I say that? What did I say? Can be. Can be. Well, this is, I was using inverse psychology, which is opposite of reverse. Because then if you look at the converse, did you work converse all-stars growing up?

Then you get the u-verse.

I did for a while. White all-stars, yeah.

Canvas all-stars. I switched to pro-keds when they came out. Pro-keds swayed. Because I think Bob McAdoo or somebody was wearing them.

I probably couldn't afford them. I mean, I think I remember paying like, what, 14 bucks for converse all-stars or something like that, and that was probably about all I had.

I found a pair of converse all-stars in the locker room once, and I thought it was a score because we were pretty poor and it was, they were nice, except the left toe of the shoe, it had the scrape because the guy would slide his foot for the layups.

Oh, yeah. You know how that would happen to some of those guys? Yeah.

So I don't know what I did with them. Like, we would have marks on the floor from guys dragging their feet while they were doing a bounce pass, you know, like in a fast break or something like that. So yeah.

All right. So Jesus can't, cannot be the only way to God. Atheists hate that. What was your response to them, or what would it be?

Well, it's what Jesus said, right? I mean, you like Jesus, but you only like some of his saying, so when he says, I am the way, the truth, and the life, I guess you don't like that part, right?

I mean, to me, it's so strange, Steve. Okay, if you are a so-called Christian and you believe in inclusivism, or you believe in universalism, or you believe in transdispensationalism, which isn't dispensationalism, but it's the Tony Evans deal.

If you believe in some of these things, okay, I can see how your heart wants to do that. But what we have to do is to say to ourselves, my heart can't be trusted. I have to go with what the Bible says and put my blinders on to look at the world in light of the Bible, not the Bible in light of the world.

Isn't that a good way to go about it?

It's a great way to go about it. And here's what I would say, you know, Jesus can't be the only way to God. Well, first of all, why? Why, you know, if there is a God, you know, you say that you don't believe in a God, but if there is a God, doesn't it make sense that he makes the rules?

He's the creator, he's the owner of the universe. And you're going to say, no, God, I mean, not only is it not right that you permit evil, but you have to allow that everyone, no matter what they believe, can find their own way to you through whatever system they choose.

It's kind of nice. It's a... It's a... God, let us explain how things are going to be, you know.

You go to a salad bar these days and you get to put on whatever you want. I say no to the red beets and no to the kale. Amen. Yeah, I don't like kale. JJ kale or just... No, just the food kale. Okay. I do want you to know that I went with my wife the other day to a cheese tasting class and it's wine and cheese.

And I don't drink alcohol because, of course, only pagans do that. But anyway, I didn't drink any of the wine. I won't tell you if my wife had any. He doesn't believe that. But I did try some of the cheese.

And so, you know, the ones that I didn't want to eat, oh, Steve, interestingly, they had some goat cheese and they put on the top of the goat cheese from this farm in Vermont, some ashes of vegetables with kind of a symbol.

It was a brand. It was an icon on top of the goat cheese and it kind of looked cool, but made of ashes. Ashes. Yeah. A goat cheese with ashes on the outside. And I called it Ash Wednesday cheese. I don't think that would be very tasty.

Steve, what does it do if there are two gods, two ways of salvation, ten ways of salvation? Would not that mean that we would have to split our devotion and adoration and thanksgiving and praise? Isn't that one of the, I know it's not the main reason to believe in the exclusivity of Christ salvation, because you hit the nail on the head, first of all, Luke, John 14.

But how would we divvy it up?

Well, I think we'd wind up like the Athenians, you know, trying to make sure that we didn't leave any God out. I mean, how many gods are right. And, you know, how many different ways would we have to worship and how many different temples would we have to build?

And, you know, we'd want to make sure we have statues for all the statues, for all the gods who want statues.

But Steve, it's so arrogant. It's so close minded. You're so pompous to think you're the only way. I mean, just think about that.

Well, I, it's not me. I'm not the only way it's, it's what does, what does God say? And again, you know, if there is a creator God, and we obviously believe there is because he says he is, then he has the right to set the rules and the boundaries and, you know, decide what's right and what's wrong.

And the idea that he doesn't have that right, that'd be a news flash for him. Steve, it's simple for me.

I'm just a simpleton. I'm kind of a marine kind of guy. I say to myself, self, if someone can resurrect themselves out of the grave, if they can become alive and they were dead for several days, I'm going to believe that man.

When he says I am the way, the truth, the life, I'll take the life part. That means I've got to take the way part too.

Pete. Well, how do you know he raised himself from the dead? How do you know that? And, you know, here's the easy thing. If you want to disprove Christianity, forget these 12 arguments or whatever there are.

How about this? Just show, display the body. I mean, couldn't the Jews have done that in the first place? If they were really set on extinguishing the sect called the way, Christianity, couldn't they have just produced the body of Christ?

So true. Mike Abendroth here with Pastor Steve. You can write us at info at NoCompromiseRadio .com. Thanks for all the encouraging letters. We've got the new website, NoCompromiseRadio .com. Pastor Steve's on Tuesdays, and we'll do part two next week regarding the atheist top reasons why Christianity's not true.

You must believe in the Lord Jesus Christ to be saved.

No Compromise Radio with Pastor Mike Abendroth is a production of Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston. Bethlehem Bible Church is a Bible teaching church firmly committed to unleashing the life transforming power of God's Word through verse by verse exposition of the sacred text.

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