The Intent of the Atonement (Part 1)

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Mike and Steve say everyone limits the atonement. How can that be?

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The Intent of the Atonement (Part 2)

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Welcome to No Compromise Radio, a ministry coming to you from Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston.
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No Compromise Radio is a program dedicated to the ongoing proclamation of Jesus Christ based on the theme in Galatians 2, verse 5, where the
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Apostle Paul said, �But we did not yield in subjection to them for even an hour, so that the truth of the gospel would remain with you.�
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In short, if you like smooth, watered -down words to make you simply feel good, this show isn�t for you.
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By purpose, we are first biblical, but we can also be controversial. Stay tuned for the next 25 minutes as we�re called by the
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Divine Trumpet to summon the troops for the honor and glory of her King. Here�s our host, Pastor Mike Abendroth.
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No Compromise Radio ministry. Hello at NoCompromiseRadio .com. Pastor Steve, welcome.
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Thank you very much. Hello to you. Steve, you don�t know what
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I want to talk about when we record the shows, and yet you�re always game. I�m going to start calling you
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Steve Three -Point Stance Cooley. Well, some people might call it foolish,
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Steve Foolish Cooley. Remember when the three -point stance evolved into the four -point stance and they had nose guards, nose tackles?
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Yeah. That was, you know, a lot of the defenses back in the day were kind of four threes or six twos.
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And then once they did the five -one, and they had a nose guard, a nose tackle. And then the three -four, and it was like crazy talk.
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That was. And remember the fridge, Richard Perry? Sure. Uh -huh. I want to have a
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Richard Perry fridge moment. We have had message moments. We had Burkoff briefings.
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How can we work a fridge frenzy into this whole thing? Is he still alive?
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That I do not know. I�m not on the fridge tracker. Okay.
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I think they have those. There�s maybe a drone even that�s a� That just follows him around?
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Yes. I saw a picture. I don�t know if it was a Photoshop kind of hack job, but of an eagle or a hawk clasping with its talons a drone.
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Didn�t like that drone up by its nest. Well, it�s possible. I mean, drones aren�t all, you know, they�re not always moving super fast, so.
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It�s true. Now, Steve, here�s my conundrum. Here�s my question. Here�s my difficulty this week.
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I�m preaching through Hebrews chapter 2, verse 9. So far, that�s not the difficulty. I was going to say, it sounds brutal.
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But it says, talking about Jesus, the end of the phrase there in Hebrews 2 .9,
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so that by the grace of God, he, Jesus, might taste death for everyone.
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Now there�s a couple different views of the atonement and its extent and its intent.
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But when you first read that, he tasted death for everyone by the grace of God, and this is an idiom used for, the word taste there means to experience to the fullest everything that death had to offer, negatively, of course,
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Jesus experienced it. Unlike the angels, they never experienced death, Jesus experienced death.
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And of course, he could be then our mediator, our substitute, and he tasted death for everyone.
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Now� Petey I mean, when we think about taste, we might think about taking a little bite, but you�re saying that he basically had the entire experience dumped down his throat.
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I mean, he got the full thing, the full menu, not just a nibble.
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Petey That�s right, and he ordered a full course of death. It wasn�t just a little appetizer.
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Pete Give me a full course of death. Pete One of the lexicon says to experience something to the full. And the writer
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Sapphira said, �A man may die in a moment, and then he does not taste death. But all that was in death was concentrated in the cup which the
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Lord Jesus Christ emptied on the cross. He was made a curse for us.�
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Everything that death had to offer Jesus, he wasn�t a spirit being only.
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He was fully God and fully man, and that man really died. That�s the writer�s point.
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Because if you�re thinking about it, these Hebrews, these Hebrew people, I mean, God and a body, and it�s probably pretty hard for them to stomach, don�t you think?
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Pete Yes. So he�s trying to tell them that he has to be God, Jesus has to be God in order to be a sin bearer and have mediation with God the
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Father, but he also has to be human to represent us. That�s the argument. Pete It�s interesting, though, the way it says that too, because taste of death for everyone, he really,
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I guess we would say, he drank the wrath. I mean, he got the full experience of God�s wrath, not just death.
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Right, and what happens in our circles is there�s this debate, did Jesus die for each and every person, or did he die only for the elect?
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Is it a limited atonement, limited to the elect, or unlimited, he dies for each and every person?
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Now, if I only read this verse, I didn�t read the verses after it, especially, I would be more prone to believe in the unlimited view because he died for everyone, every single person.
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Pete Right, right. All means all. World means world. Steve And that�s all all means. Pete And every one means everyone.
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Steve Yeah. Pete Every. I mean, what does every mean except for every? Pete Now, Steve, you have been to seminary, you�ve been to Logos Bible classes probably, you have taught in Bible Institute classes, you�ve been a pastor for 12 years ago and on 13, is that right?
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Steve That is correct. Pete Okay. And there are several hermeneutical principles that are mandatory.
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Like, just give us a couple, no particular order. Steve Number one. Pete Yeah. Steve Context. You know, keep reading. Pete There you go.
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Steve Immediate, I mean, hey, you don�t even have to be in seminary or anything else. You just have to go to one of, you know,
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Pastor Mike�s Bible studies. Keep reading. Pete Keep reading. Well, if we read a blog article, we read a newspaper article, you read a novel, it�s like who, you know, who killed the person in the
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Agatha Christie novel? Well, there�s a way to figure it out. Steve Keep reading. Pete Keep reading. Here, it�s interesting that he goes on, the writer of Hebrews, goes on to explain who the everyone, who the everypersons might be.
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He says in verse 10, �The context will tell you, for it was fitting that he, for whom and by whom all things exist, in bringing many sons to glory.�
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Who are the everyones? They�re the manys in verse 10. Isn�t that interesting?
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So then every wouldn�t be every, it would just mean every son who�s brought to glory.
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Steve Well, and for the Jews, we have to kind of see things through their eyes.
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And even with Jesus, when he talks to Nicodemus and he�s talking about, �For God so loved the world, and who might those people be in the world ?�
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John 4, you�re the one who preaches through John, right, recently. What did the woman at the well say?
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Pete Well, she said a lot of things, you know. Steve In regard to the world, he truly is the savior of the world.
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Pete Right. So not just the Jews only, you know, but also to the
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Samaritans, you know, and to people beyond the nation of Israel. Steve That�s exactly right. So think about it for a second.
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I almost said Paul, I don�t think Paul wrote Hebrews. But the writer of Hebrews is saying Jesus is better than angels.
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Why? Well, he�s God, chapter 1. Chapter 2, he�s human. And guess what humans do?
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Humans make intercession for humans, not just Jews only.
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Paul would go on to say in 1 Timothy chapter 2, there�s one God and one mediator between the man and God, the
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Jew Christ Jesus. The man Christ Jesus. So this whole thing is in this, he�s dying for all kinds of people.
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And even everyone, doesn�t Colossians chapter 1 say, �Him we proclaim, admonishing everyone.�
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Does that mean each and every person? So immediately we say to ourselves, besides any other philosophical, logical, systematic theology categories, verse 10 gives the answer to verse 9, that every one of two nine is defined as many sons as verse 10.
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Verse 11, �For he sanctifies, for he who sanctifies, and those who are sanctified all have one source.
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That is why he is not ashamed to call them brothers.� Those are the sanctified. Those are the brothers.
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And he calls them in verse 13, �The children God has given me.� So did God give the son?
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Everybody or just these particular elect call the children. So I don�t think this is that hard of a verse. Petey And again, you�d know that from John chapter 6, you know, that the
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Father gives a selected group and it�s not everyone because the ones that are given, he raises them all up, you know, at the end at judgment.
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And so, it can�t be every single person or every single person is going to heaven. And so, you would wind up with the same thing here.
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You either believe that everyone�s going to heaven or you believe that he died for the elect.
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What was John Owen�s kind of three people for whom Christ died?
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I don�t have it in front of me. It�s somewhere in my notes. Christ died for whom? It was either for all the sins of all the people, but that would be universalism.
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He died for all of the sins of some of the people. Or he died for some of the sins of some of the people.
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Which you�d be toast. Only the middle one is going to be helpful. And I think
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J .F. Packer said in the intro to The Death of Death and the Death of Christ, John Owen book, I think he said, �No one�s been able to, you know, say anything�
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Trevor Burrus Surpass that logic there, right? That�s exactly right. And so, what do we do? We go to the Bible and we realize that the text says he dies for the sheep.
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We�ll look at John 10 in a little bit. He dies for the many. Jesus gave his life a ransom for many.
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There�s limiting language there. But what�s the first thing we do? We go to 2 Peter 2, verse 1, or Hebrews 2, 9 and say, �See, see, all those other verses about limited atonement can�t be true because God loves the world and he tasted death for everyone.�
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Pete Right. Or we look at the totality of them and we look at verses like Hebrews 2, 9 in context and we understand that it doesn�t mean what an unlimited person would like it to mean.
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Now, Steve, I�m sure I do this. You do this. Our listeners do it. If we�re not careful, we have an agenda and we want the text to say what the agenda � what the text would say, what we want it to say.
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In other words, we kind of preordain our hermeneutic and then we read the text in light of our preordained hermeneutic.
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Pete That�s right. And today, in evangelicalism, most people believe in unlimited atonement. Three hundred years ago in New England, it would be the opposite.
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But today, for whatever reason, Dallas Seminary, evangelicalism, Billy Sunday, Billy Graham, they�re an unlimited group where Jesus dies for each and every person.
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He�s made it possible for you to believe and now you cast the kind of deciding vote type of deal. Steve Because that�s fair and we like fair.
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Pete Right. So the second you read this and you go, �He tasted death for everyone.�
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You say if you�re an unbeliever � it�s all the same. You say, �I see everyone.�
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But the writer of Hebrews is trying to tell these � they�re Jewish people, but there�s
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Gentiles around too. He�s trying to say, �Listen, every person.� You know, we have race wars in our country.
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I think it�s the biggest farce when evangelicals get involved with the race war because it�s a wrong category.
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It�s an unbiblical category. There�s one race, the human race. If you want to think biblically, there�s one race.
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Steve Right. I mean, you could argue for ethnicities, but it�s, you know � Pete Yeah, there, that�s different in Revelation chapter five and out of these different ethnic groups, he saves people.
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But in terms of a race, you�re either in Adam the first one or in Adam the last one. And can you imagine now the writer is saying to these people who are on the run and getting persecuted, �He dies for women and children, for boys and for girls, for Jews and for Gentiles, slave and free.
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He dies for all these kind of people.� That�s what he�s after. He dies for everyone. Steve Well, God is no respecter of persons, right?
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He�s no respecter of ethnicities, you know? He saves across all those lines.
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Pete Yes, but Steve, these Jewish people would understand with the Day of Atonement, you�ve got the one sacrifice and the goat that goes out, forgiveness of sins, they go far away.
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This isn�t for the nation of Israel. This happens to be for every nation in the world, for each and every person.
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We slay the animal. And of course not, they even � the Day of Atonement was limited.
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Steve Very limited. Pete Wasn�t it? Steve Yes. Pete Passover lamb, limited. You and your family, limited.
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Everything about it is limited because it goes back to the intention of the Atonement. Let�s talk about that a little bit, especially in light of John and Jesus being sent, sent, and doing the will that my father sent me to do.
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How do we factor in God�s plan and God�s intention when it comes to the Atonement? Steve Well, I mean, we would have to ask, did
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God ever intend to save every person or did he change his plan at some point?
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And I mean, I think if we look at, you know, Ephesians chapter 1, we would immediately that his plan is fixed and that he is carrying it out from the beginning to the end, you know, beginning in, let�s see, well,
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I�ll start in verse 3, �Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in Christ with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places.
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Even as he chose us in him, that is to say in Christ, before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him.�
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In other words, God the Father did this before creation, chose us, chose the elect before then.
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And then if you skip down a little bit further down into verse 10, �As a plan for the fullness of time, to unite all things in him, things in heaven and things on earth.
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In him, in Christ, we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose all things according to the counsel of his will.�
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It�s pretty hard to look at Ephesians chapter 1 and to see anything other than God before time began, before any of us were created, determined that he was going to set his affections on some and then in time affected that plan.
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It's impossible to see it any other way. Steve, don't people who believe in unlimited atonement,
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Jesus dies for each and every person, by the way, including Judas and Goliath and Jezebel and Ahab and others.
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All the most horrendous pre -cross biblical characters.
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They think we're limiting the value of the atonement. Let's talk some about how the greatness, the surpassing value of the atonement isn't limited in any way, shape or form for those who believe
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Jesus dies only for the elect. I mean, if God had desired it to be efficient, in other words, to be effective for every man, woman and child to ever appear on the planet earth, it would be.
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But that's not the design of the cross, you know, did or let's just talk about that's it is sufficient.
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In other words, there's this old slogan. Yeah, you know, sufficient for all, efficient for only for the elect, which is true as far as it goes.
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It just neglects the design of the atonement. Did God the Father ever intend for it to be efficient for all?
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And the answer is no. Does God get his man? Yeah, I mean, frustrated deity is
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God's will thwarted by the will of man. Yes, it ultimately comes down to this simple question.
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Who is sovereign? Is it God or is it man? Because if you say, well, it's
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God, but then God is no longer sovereign. It has to be God is sovereign period.
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And if you say, well, God is sovereign, but he sovereignly chose to let man choose whether he was going to be saved or not.
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Well, then God didn't know from before the foundations of the world who was going to be saved. Or at least he didn't ordain it.
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You could say that he knew and then he left it. You know, you could do the whole quarters of time thing. But ultimately, you wind up with God's will being thwarted by man's will.
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Man is sovereign and God just kind of goes along with man's will. Which is evangelicalism today.
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And therefore, that's why unlimited atonement is so popular, I think. It's a man -centered view.
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And it explains a lot of things. It explains why churches are the way they are. It explains why our evangelism is the way it is, where we approach, we appeal to people not on the basis of you're a sinner and you need a savior.
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We say, you know what? God loves you. God wants your life to be better. In fact, he really wants it to be way better than anything you can imagine.
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So why don't you just give him a chance? And God's done everything. Now he's waiting for you. Yeah. I mean effectively,
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I'm surprised they don't go out and have concerts saying, all we are saying is give God a chance.
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I think, Steve, I know you'll agree with me, that the unlimited position, the position that says
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Jesus dies for each and every person who's ever born and will be born and was born, they're actually the ones who limit the atonement.
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That's why I don't like the word limited atonement, even though I use it because it's in the acrostic tulip, limited atonement.
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We say that Jesus died just for the elect, the many, the sheep. He doesn't die for the goats.
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And it's limited in its scope. It's limited in its quantity.
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It's limited in its intent. That's correct. In its design, plan. Those on the unlimited side,
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I think they're really limited. They're limiting the atonement because Jesus ends up dying for people who don't make it to heaven.
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And it limits its effectiveness, its efficaciousness, its power. Can you imagine
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Jesus going to the cross and saying, boy, you know, some of the people that I'm dying for are not going to believe.
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How is that going to, you know, even as I think about what Isaiah says about how he's going to look at his suffering and be satisfied.
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And I'm like, why would he be satisfied for those that he dies for allegedly and who don't believe?
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There's no satisfaction in that. And if you think we are limiting the value of the atonement, the atonement value could not be greater in its power, value, preciousness, because it's the
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Lord Jesus, the God -man who dies on that cross. He could save with that death as many people as God wanted to save.
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That is billions and trillions of people. If there were humans on other planets, it doesn't matter because the death of Christ is so valuable because the person of Christ.
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So if you want to say we limit the quantity, that would be fine.
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But that's better than limit the quality, which the unlimited people do. That's right. And there's no doubt that when
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Jesus went to the cross, every single person that he intended to pay the sins for, he did.
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You know, to the – Mission accomplished. Yes, mission accomplished. It is finished. His work is finished.
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Weren't the Democrats really mad at George Bush, George W. Bush, when he said on the aircraft carrier, mission accomplished?
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Oh, they were furious. Yeah. And you know what? Maybe they were right. They weren't right to be furious, but maybe they were right.
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The whole mission wasn't accomplished or there could have been a larger scope. I don't even know the details. Don't quote me on it.
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But Jesus, when he said it is finished, paid in full, it actually was. Mission accomplished. Nothing left to do in terms of paying the price for sin.
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Dutch Reformed Church, early 1600s, has something called the Senate of Dort. They got together over a period of years and they have a council and they have something called the
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Canons and these beliefs which are helpful. And here's what it says about the precious value of Christ's death.
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The death of the Son of God is the only and most perfect sacrifice and satisfaction for sin and is of infinite worth and value, abundantly sufficient to expiate the sins of the whole world.
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This death derives its infinite value and dignity from these considerations because the person who submitted to it was not only really man and perfectly holy, but also the only begotten
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Son of God. Perfect. I mean, expiate the sins, pay the price, satisfy, propitiate the wrath of God.
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I mean, all these things are all true and have to be fully carried out in the death of Christ.
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Steve, if there were only two people that were going to get saved, let's say it was going to be
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Adam and Eve, Christ's death, he'd still have to undergo the wrath of God.
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He'd have to assuage God's wrath because Adam's sin and Eve's sins were so great.
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Would we say then somehow the power of God is limited, the death of Christ is not so significant?
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The only thing there would have been plan, intention, design, but it still would have been the same dramatic, awful propitiation, which now is wonderful for us.
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Right. We wouldn't say that the pain was any less. We wouldn't say, you know, we certainly, I mean, maybe there's a way that God could quantify the wrath that was poured out and say it was less, but we wouldn't think of it as any less.
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I mean, we couldn't comprehend that. Why? Because what we do so often is we misapprehend, we underestimate how much
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God hates sin. And sinning against an infinitely holy God, right?
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Charles Hodge, quote, all that Christ did and suffered would have been necessary had only one human soul been the object of redemption.
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And nothing different and nothing more would have been required had every child of Adam been saved through his blood.
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Yeah. I mean, whether, and again, if it was God's intent to save every single person, we would see that clearly reflected throughout scripture.
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We do not see that. In fact, what we see is quite the opposite. So, yeah. Do you like definite atonement better than limited atonement, definite atonement, definite redemption?
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Definite redemption, yeah, I do, except it really messes with the acrostic. Two -dip doesn't, I mean, unless, you know, it's little hails when she was three and a half, maybe.
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I like two dips. I can go for a two -dip cone right about now. That would be good.
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I know we've only got a minute to go. But Steve, to me, it just seems like something that was so patently obvious, patently obvious with the
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William Careys and the Adoniram Judsons and the John Calvins and others back in the day, evangelists all alike and preachers.
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Now today, it's the opposite. People recoil. People think you're teaching heresy if you say Jesus died for the bride.
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Well, that's a shame. And when you think about it, going to Ephesians 5, you know, he gave up his life for whom?
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You know, the church. And over and over again, we see this kind of language in Scripture, and it is motivating.
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Why? Because you can tell people for certainty that Christ died for sinners just like you.
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Next time, we're going to ask the question, can you say to an unbeliever on the street, Jesus died for you? That would be a good question.
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That's an excellent question. That's a cliffhanger. You can write us. Heno at NoCompromiseRadio .com.
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