Matt Slick Bible Study - 7/12/2017 - Mormonism Pt. 1

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July 12, 2017

Matt Slick Bible Study - 7/19/2017 - Mormonism Pt. 2

00:27: All right, we're live good. All right. What's the date today? It's the 12th of July. We're gonna do Mormonism tonight and It'll probably be two or three weeks.
00:35: We'll be doing Mormonism something going through some stuff. No newbies there. How you doing? all right, and Normally, I would say but they've been rubbing it in now.
00:44: We don't have the radio show here I go. Hey, I don't even listen to me on the radio. Can't say it anymore So anyway, let me pray.
00:51: We'll just jump right in we've got the slides I'm gonna go through the origins of Mormonism and then next week probably do some more of the doctrinal issues since but where it goes stuff in Mormonism because it's
01:03: Not good. All right, let's pray Lord Jesus we thank you for the time and ask
01:09: Lord that you would bless it bless all those who would hear live and taped and that you would just bless the presentation and that Lord people would be
01:23: Edified as they learn about what Mormonism is we know that Lord that the cults are out there
01:28: Mormonism is a big one and Just ask that you would bind the spirit of Mormonism and just loose the
01:34: Holy Spirit upon us that we might bring Bring you glory through his ministry. We ask this
01:40: Jesus in your precious name. Amen All right, so We're doing
01:47: Mormonism tonight and And then probably next week as well, there's a lot to cover in Mormonism and what
01:55: I've got is a manual and I've taught on Mormonism before and the slides are from the manual and we're not gonna get through everything there's a lot of reading to do and so we're gonna do is just make sure that people understand the origins of Mormonism and We'll just see how far we get tonight and then we'll move on next night so this is a brief analysis and response by yours truly match slick
02:18: Mormonism also known as the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter -day Saints worldwide religious organization founded in or its headquarters in Salt Lake City and a lot of people don't know this but it only had six members at one time and that was back in 1830 and reached its first million in 1947 and from 47 to now it's got over 13 million followers now.
02:43: I've heard higher numbers. I've heard 15 million, but Depends on how they count so I don't want to give them too much credit
02:50: It does have like 50 ,000 Missionaries and I've heard 60. I've heard 40. So 50 is right in the middle.
02:57: It kind of varies from year to year Now we'll say this as I'm talking about this if you guys have ever seen the movie with Brandon Frazier Tarzan Brandon Frazier movie and the bad guys get out of the
03:12: Bougainvillea jail and they're walking towards the camera talking how they're gonna get Tarzan and If you look past the bad guys, you'll see two
03:19: Mormon missionaries on bikes riding by and I remember
03:24: My wife's like what you know, cuz she's checking out the bad guys I'm like look Mormons and she's like what and so, you know,
03:31: I'm geared for that and so click click and she's like Oh my goodness. It's just you know, they're all over.
03:37: Okay, like flies You know they get in there anyway, so it claims to be the only true church now it had 130 temples
03:44: But I know it's more than that and we're gonna be having we're gonna be having a temple opening up here pretty soon another one here
03:53: And Mormonism is just so false And I know I'm saying that quickly and early but it is and it really just is disturbing to see
04:01: So many millions of people believe this lie that will lead them to eternal damnation But nevertheless, we'll continue on so it was founded by Joseph Smith and he was born in 1805 and he moved to Palmyra, New York in 1816.
04:18: So The reason Mormonism got started is really kind of interesting and There's different theories about it.
04:28: Now, of course, Joseph Smith said that he had a vision of God No, he didn't and I'll go in and we'll talk about that.
04:34: There's he just lied. There's no possible way but the historical context is
04:41: That there were difficult times economically and There was
04:47: There was rumors also a lot of people don't know this. I think was Captain Kidd's buried treasure was in the area and so There was rumors that you could find this treasure, but there are different ways to find the treasure so the
05:03: Smith's had a farm and they dabbled in folk music and In money digging and money digging was the idea of getting a divining rod or Different ways of doing this a goat slit its throat and wherever it died
05:17: That's where the spirit had buried the treasure and then you supposed to dig down there and find the treasure and of course if anybody had any doubts in the process then the spirit that guarded the treasure would move the treasure and of course, they never found any treasure because someone would have a doubt and Who gets to keep the goat the
05:36: Smith family? That's how they fed themselves now that still was wrong But I can understand them just trying to survive
05:43: I mean, I don't blame them for trying to survive, but they could have done something better, but nevertheless so Magic stones were used and you could see you know pulling a hat over the face looking in the stone
05:54: This is what he did later on when he was translating the Book of Mormon now. I have a book
06:01: Called Mormonism Unveiled printed in 1834 and If I ever want to do a real deep study, you know we would take a half hour going through some of the quotes just in that little tangent of a book in 1834 it's the first anti -mormon book written and it's a collection of affidavits sworn under oath before judges and ministers
06:30: Where people who knew Joseph Smith swore? before God For judges this they took this seriously back then swore under oath about their dealings with the
06:42: Smith family Now let me condense what they basically said they wouldn't trust them as far as I could throw him that's basically what it came down to and they were the family was known for money -digging known for not being honest known for being swindlers and this is the
07:00: The way that they were now when you talk to Mormons about this a lot of them are gonna say well You have a lot of prophets of God were bad in the young days.
07:07: That's true you know, I could see that but we can move on and stuff because There's other stuff
07:13: So according to Joseph Smith in 1820 he went into a wooded area to pray about which church was true
07:19: God the Father and Jesus appeared to him and told him that all the Churches were false. Now.
07:24: He continued to do his money -digging ventures that earned his time now when I was in seminary a gentleman came in and he taught on Mormonism and I Aced that class.
07:35: That's what the only one that was easy to ace in seminary Hmm, and he was the guy who had actually gone back to New York in that area and went through old files from the eight early 1800s and he found documents where Joseph Smith was arrested and what he's arrested for and Given leg bail leg bail is you could just take take your walk get out of the county leg bail
08:01: That's your bail get out of here And so he also joined a church after The angels or they were told he was told all of them were false
08:12: And he actually joined one the way the chronology of everything works. That's how you know
08:18: Apparently he joined it. All right, whatever Now the first vision is very important in Mormonism So you can look down here in this quote in this box.
08:27: He said Joseph Smith He said my object in going to inquire of the Lord was to know Which of all the sects was right that I might know which one to join no sooner
08:36: Therefore did I get possession of myself so as to be able to speak then I asked the personages who stood above me in the light
08:43: Which of all the sects was right? I was answered that I must join none of them.
08:48: Now. He did do that though For they were all wrong and a personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight
08:56: Now that's typically What you'll do if I wanted to start a cult I need to tell people why everybody else is bad
09:04: I need to give a reason why you need to come to me or my Revelation or my prophet or whatever it is in order to believe something new
09:12: Because if you're gonna if I'm gonna say yeah, everybody else is all true Then why come to me so you got to disparage somebody else and of course all of them were false
09:22: And he is a young 17 year old was revealed By the father
09:29: He's gonna be the one who's gonna restore of course now a lot of people don't know this this first vision account There's at least four versions, and it did not surface for 20 years after the effect and there's different versions of it and They change so that really puts this into a very suspicious
09:48: Beginning because if the first vision where he said he saw God the Father which way to get into why it's impossible
09:54: We said he saw God the Father and Jesus Christ and that they communicated to him Well, you'd think that that'd be something he would talk about but there's no record of it for another 20 years
10:04: Why because retroactively he's trying to make his case for the validity of this organization.
10:10: He started now in that book I mentioned that Mormonism unveiled, and I don't have it here. I Don't think
10:16: I do There's an account where a man
10:24: Swore that Joseph Smith stated how Mormonism got started now you can take it or leave it, and I've got it on the karm website and to condense it what he said was that Joseph Smith was drunk at a party and Mormonism was already going and He said that what had happened what he just broke down I mean just forgot start telling people stuff.
10:53: And so this eyewitness said this is what he said that he was coming home after a storm one night and He went through a forest and there was a certain area of a tree on the ground where a tree was where the
11:09: Trunk came down and the roots kind of came down into the ground and the water from the rain had washed this area kind of swirled between the the roots and Swirled and purified this little area of dirt and sand and it kind of just all the sediment just kind of just floated away
11:28: There's this nice little puddle of really nice -looking sand So what he did was he thought he could use this in his money -digging
11:35: Ventures so he took it and put it in his shirt like this Because he needed to keep it didn't have anything with him, and he walked home and When he got home his sister said what's that and just to say it he said it's
11:51: The golden tablets now the golden tablets were rumored to exist
11:57: In that area and had been buried. So not only was there Captain Kidd's treasure, but also just some legend of golden plates and Not that they were a book of Mormon or anything, but that they were just golden plates and some stuff
12:10: Different theories about what was on there So he said they're the golden plates, and he said he was shocked that his sister believed him
12:19: He you know he was he couldn't believe that she who knew him would believe him
12:24: So she said really where'd you get that and so he just kept going and said well
12:30: I you know found it here or whatever and She started telling people they wanted to see the golden plates
12:39: This is how it got started so that they said Want to see the golden plates? Well, he doesn't have any stinking golden plates.
12:46: What's he gonna do so he's got a bag And he puts some heavy things in there And then people come over and they say they saw
12:54: No one ever saw the plates folks. You can go check in the Book of Mormon. It says the eyewitnesses No, they didn't see it.
12:59: Just read what it says they saw with the eye of faith They didn't see it, but they did hold the bag
13:05: Which is interesting because if the plates were as big as they were made of gold it had been like over 200 or 240 pounds or something like that you don't just go like that and lift it up We've got buff boy over here, and he couldn't even do that all right, so It's just not gonna happen and so People wanted to come in and see this so he had to kind of keep this this ruse going because his mental state was
13:28: Using ruse in order to get money to get people to give to a cause so he just kept rolling with it
13:34: And well now he's got to produce something so what he did was he started writing out these this documents that Supposedly with it from the
13:44: Golden Plates and only he could do this. It's called non falsify ability But non falsify ability means you can't have it verified to be true or false
13:52: So he says I'm the only one who can see them, and I'm the only one who can translate them And if you look at stuff you don't see anything
14:01: Okay, oh wow I didn't know that that's so cool Wow Me I'd be like yeah, right
14:07: Swampland in Florida, let's go and So this is the early starting of it
14:14: And he got people to join in and then there's some there's some apocalyptic literature some rumors about people knowing a couple of guys knew that it was a ruse and They wanted to find a way to get make some money, so they went in said yes
14:26: We've seen it, and we don't know if those are verified or not, but there's there's more to this Then simply
14:32: Joseph Smith said he saw the father and and stuff now why Could it is he didn't see the father because Jesus says nothing any men has seen the father except the one who's from God He has seen the father now.
14:44: He has seen his past tense From God, that's the Old Testament That's previous to Jesus has past tense not that any men has seen the father now people say to me
14:54: Well, they've seen God in the Old Testament. Yes, they have Genesis chapter 2 and 3 I'm Pre -incarnate
15:01: Christ walking with Adam and Eve we have Exodus 6 2 & 3 We have Exodus 24 9 to 11
15:07: Genesis 17 1 18 1 numbers 12 6 through 8 We have different places where God is seen
15:13: But it's never the father because no man has seen the father except the one the one who is from God He has its past tense sometimes the
15:24: Mormons will say well this means Joseph Smith is from God No past tense
15:29: Now I don't have it listed here But also Romans 1 18 says no man has seen God at any time the only begotten
15:35: God in the bosom of the father He has explained him and that means no man's seen God is in context of talking about the father because in John 1 1
15:43: We have in the beginning was the word the word was with God the word was God verse 14 The word became flesh and dwelt among us verse 18
15:50: No man has seen God and I did a study on the word God in the Gospel of John a few years ago
15:57: That's all I did was study that word. How's it appear? I discovered that whenever it appears after John 1 14.
16:05: It's in reference to the father So no man has seen God the father which is consistent and you go to 1st
16:12: Timothy 6 16 Speaking of God the father who alone possesses immortality and dwells an unapproachable light who no man has seen or can see
16:21: It's not talking about Jesus because they've seen Jesus the Holy Spirit not talking about the Holy Spirit here read the context
16:26: The father dwells an unapproachable light who no man has seen or can see when I talk to Mormons about this
16:32: They'll say unless you have the Spirit of God And I just you know, I say well that I missed that in there.
16:38: Can you show me where that is in the text because you are Doing something You're making the text say the opposite of what it says, this is what cults do
16:49: So what they'll say whom no man has seen or can see now clearly what it says is no man has seen the father
16:55: No man can see the father But what the Mormons do is they'll add something to change it unless you're of God Then you can see the father.
17:05: So now the text means the opposite of what it's actually saying Instead of saying no man has seen or can see the father now, it means it can
17:14: That's what they do. They interpret it in a manner. That's that's completely opposite of what it is It's one of the exegetical fallacies accomplished by Mormonism now
17:25: So check this out from Gordon Hinckley He was a 15th LDS president every claim that we make concerning divine authority every truth that we offer concerning the validity of this work all
17:35: Finds its roots in the first vision of the boy prophet That's teachings of Gordon B Hinckley page 226.
17:43: So everything is about the first vision. I very routinely will talk about first Timothy 616
17:49: Romans, I mean, it's gonna be John 118 and John 646 a relationship to the issue of seeing
17:55: God the Father and all these verses that get memorized about seeing God in the Old Testament And I have this argument In fact,
18:00: I was on Sunday night discussing with more a Mormon for an hour And it wasn't till later that night that the light dawned on me
18:08: That I missed an incredible opportunity to nail him. I don't know if you guys saw that.
18:14: Oh Man, because we got in such of this He's very intelligent very competent and we
18:20: I got into this particular area and he was saying Well when you go to John 646, it gives the exception for they get some weird logic some exception of that That's the exception
18:29: But then the one who's from God and Joseph Smith could have seen the father it's weird stuff And we got one thing led to another and we ended up with Adam Adam was able to see
18:39: God the father But I said no man, and he said he said
18:44: Matt what it means is no man could see the father Unless you're unfallen because Adam was not fallen when he was seeing the father and after the fall he couldn't see the father
18:56: Okay, I said well, where's that in the text? So I'm so focused on that little bit and it didn't occur to me till later that night to say
19:05: See I just can't believe I'm so stupid to say Okay, so you can't see
19:10: God the father if you're fallen right? He goes right with Joseph Smith fallen I mean it would it just like it was one of those it's like Why didn't
19:21: I think of that when I was in the middle of this and I hate it when I do something like that Which is so stinking simple and you miss it because you're getting so detailed in some other areas you forget to look
19:31: So I'm hoping that I'm gonna talk to this guy This Sunday night coming up and I'm gonna say by the way and then show it because it would have just buried him, okay, and The doofus boy here didn't come up with a right answer at the right time it happens
19:47: All right, so since Mormonism is based on the first vision And since for the
19:53: Bible it's not possible to have seen the father I've just proved Mormonism is not true Just that simple.
19:59: I have proven it And what the Mormons are gonna do is never give in they're gonna say no, no, no, that's not true there's
20:07: God's the father's is seen in the Old Testament and early verses I quote and And there's ways to deal with them, you know, you can because in Mormon theology
20:18: Elohim is God the father and Jehovah is Jesus So what I'll do is, you know
20:26: In Exodus 2 and 3 it says for example, it says God spoke further to Moses Elohim in the
20:31: Hebrew Elohim spoke further to Moses and said to him I am God Almighty But by my name
20:38: Jehovah, I did not make myself known to them. It doesn't make sense in Mormonism in first Kings 860
20:45: Jehovah is Elohim. The Lord is God is what it's saying and so, you know, there's ways of doing this and of course,
20:52: I'm practiced at it and Don't get too detailed here Maybe sometime I'll just do a series of here's a verse and go through it for five minutes different ways of doing it
21:02: Here's another something. There's another way, you know, you give a bunch of pointers for people and They're out there all right, so like I said, there's no recording of the first vision for 20 years after it supposedly happened and So check out with what
21:17: Spencer W Kimball said Joseph Smith's first vision restored knowledge of God She's of all the great events of the century none compared with the first vision of Joseph Smith now
21:33: Joseph Smith Was a liar Joseph Smith was a false prophet
21:41: We've already shown he couldn't have seen the father. I mean at that point we're done Mormons was just not true but what happens is
21:51: And it's happening in the Christian Church as well Is that feelings are being used as a means of determining truth and not the
22:00: Word of God this is a really critical point and the older I get the more
22:06: I do apologetics the more I realize the necessity of studying the Word of God and When I study it
22:14: I learn things and So I have I'm really surprised that one of my favorite things to do in research is to take a single word or a single couplet of where two words or whatever and See how it occurs in for example the
22:29: New Testament Every single instance of a word to see how it worked
22:34: It might take me all day and I might not write an article on karma because of it, but I learned one of the things
22:41: I've learned about the Word of God is that it is inspired and We can learn a great deal from it
22:51: There's all kinds of word patterns. There's all kinds of things that are there and So as I'm studying presently
22:59: Annihilationism or they call it conditional immortality I've been doing a series of word studies.
23:04: I think I've got about 20 Where I've got a single Greek word every instance the entire
23:10: New Testament Analyze it in lexicons and dictionaries analyze it in context and then grouped it in according to usage and I'm learning things and You know, so it's important To really understand that the supremacy and the importance of the
23:29: Word of God it is magnificent but if you go to Genesis chapter 3 when in Genesis 3 1 through 5 when
23:40: Satan was talking to Eve. The first thing he did was cast out on God's Word. Did God really say? Now the eighth article the
23:47: Mormon Church says that the Bible is correct insofar as it is correctly translated this is justification for doubting the
23:53: Word of God and Then what happens is the Word of God has changed because Eve said, you know, God says don't eat or touch
24:01: The tree and God didn't say or touch it. She added those words Once the
24:06: Word of God is modified Satan comes in and contradicts you shall not die and so Notice what happened?
24:14: The Word of God is doubted the Word of God has changed Word of God is contradicted So when
24:20: I was talking earlier about first Timothy 6 16 the father whom no man has seen or can see
24:26: Then they modify it so that it could be contradicted It's exactly the exegesis that or the eisegesis that Satan uses and Mormons are guilty of this and the
24:37: Mormon Church is guilty of this to no end it happens constantly and You know,
24:44: I got a good friend Bill McKeever. He's a world -class expert on Mormonism. It's all he studies and We'll talk sometimes about some of the things we'll take a trip together to go do speak or whatever
24:53: And he'll get going on stuff that he's researched and I'm like man I didn't know that and he gets way into it and he will point out all kinds of things that they do wrong and It's amazing
25:07: How many examples there are of their horrible examination of Scripture the hypocrisy
25:14: Their double standard their illogic their alteration of the facts their misuse of the facts their alteration of the
25:23: Book of Mormon It's it's like it's a gigantic organization that Just picture a boat in an ocean and a lot of people are on it and it's slowly sinking and they're doing everything they can
25:36: To keep it afloat and are having the poor people on the boat help them and it's working.
25:42: They're keeping it afloat because Just Mormonism is using lies
25:49: Well, anyway, let's get going Joseph Smith claimed on September 21st 1823 at the age of 17 that the angel
25:56: Moroni appeared to him and Told him that there were golden plates buried nearby and he'd be called to translate them in 1827
26:04: Smith family Smith finally obtained the golden plates and began his translation process.
26:10: I remember I said earlier that he got the sand and that It started out that way
26:16: So what happens is is What happened when I understand what I believe and Bill McKeever and I have talked about this
26:23: And I've read some other stuff about this this beginning of that now. Is it really how it started?
26:29: Don't know but this guy said this is what Joseph Smith said So it's an eyewitness account
26:36: Firsthand account written and sworn to all right, take it or leave it whatever you want to do So he
26:44: Had to have a way to Keep things going and so he invented stuff along the way which is why
26:54: The first vision isn't recorded for 20 years. We had to modify it Now while he supposedly translated the
27:01: Book of Mormon, there's a lot of stuff that's not in here But while he's supposedly doing the translation
27:09: His wife Emma I took some of the pages that he had translated about a hundred pages.
27:15: He'd translated and They're never been found now, maybe the
27:21: Mormon Church has them and I have an anecdotal Story about something.
27:27: I'll tell you here I Suspect they do have them. They actually do have them in their vaults, but whatever
27:34: They're not gonna show them and there's a reason for it So what happened was she hid these these pages and said if you're really a prophet from God you can reproduce them and so of course he couldn't so he had to go on and produce something else and Those pages weren't found
27:50: Now whether or not they have our extent right now. We don't know now there was a
27:56: Minister named Solomon Spaulding in the area in the time and Solomon Spaulding Was a writer he's trying to make ends meet as well, and he's doing it in a godly way, and he wrote a book about people in the
28:14: Americas before Christ and He had this book at a publishing place at a printing office that Joseph Smith had access to Solomon Spaulding died and the manuscript was lost and And Some people swore under oath that who knew
28:37: Spaulding and knew These documents and knew what he had written when they read part of the
28:42: Book of Mormon said this is from Solomon Spaulding's writings They said this is it and they know so there that's documented there as well
28:49: Alright now take this story for what you what you will When Bill and I were living in Southern, California, we drove up to Utah Years ago to to do some stuff ministry work and So we went to a friend's of his house
29:05: Dave leave it at that Dave's house And when I first got to Dave's house, he's a Christian Dave said welcome to Utah.
29:12: This is not the United States and He was telling me how vans would sit across the street for hours at a time and he'd be click here clicks on his phone his mail be open things like this and So, okay now he said that a guy told him this
29:33: Do what you want with it? That there was a secretary to the Prophet and this secretary guy told him
29:41: So that he said this is what the guy told me. Okay This is not admissible in court because it's like a hearsay, but nevertheless this secretary was needed to go to the
29:52: Prophet's office for something and the secretary was a devout Mormon whose
30:00: Hobby happened to be this issue of the Solomon Spaulding manuscript and the Book of Mormon and so he had had some writings of Solomon Spaulding's with new
30:08: Solomon Spaulding's handwriting and the Prophet had gone into the restroom to go to the bathroom and this guy walks in and looks on the
30:18: Prophet's desk and Open is one of the books of Nephi in Solomon Spaulding's handwriting because he can read upside down.
30:28: He's reading it and He he sat there staring figuring it out.
30:33: I think he turned the page or not, I would ever come back and Realized instantly the
30:38: Mormonism was false While he's standing there. It was a just a an astounding thing for him that he saw
30:46: Solomon Spaulding's writing and he was reading and it was part of the Nephi. It was a quote from the
30:52: Book of Mormon the same stuff and he just said, oh my goodness Smith copied it for the book, you know, but just that fast the
30:59: Prophet comes out and sees him looking at it and closes it and says to him and you will say nothing about this and so he says and He said instantly he was afraid for his life
31:18: I said this all happened in like two minutes three minutes just He was afraid for his life.
31:24: He was afraid and he wanted to get out of the building quickly So he said okay.
31:30: No problem Don't worry about it And he turned around went down the elevator went straight down and got out of the building as soon as possibly could
31:38: Never went back true or not. Don't know.
31:44: I Believe that the Mormon Church has access to those manuscripts. I believe the higher echelon of the
31:51: Mormon Church knows that it's false I do I believe that I can't prove it. This is my opinion and that they're in it for the money
31:59: Their prestige the power they know how to pretend To be spiritual. I just got to say this little story because it's fun when
32:07: Robbie Zacharias a few years ago was speaking in Mormon Temple Square I Went there and Bill and I were there bill it had surgery had a neck brace on it neck surgery
32:19: So I was calling him Frank and all the time Hey, Frank, and there's a lot man and so I was sitting on the seventh row back on the aisle and So the aisles like this wide, you know
32:33: I got the rose and where the tabernacle sings in the whole bit and Ravi is only 30 feet from me and he's doing his thing and Okay, and so Ravi was talking and the 12
32:46: Apostles it's hard for me even say that the 12 Apostles were sitting there and this happened it wasn't a big deal, but so Ravi happened to be talking about a place of Theology and he's trying to blend this through without being offensive because he's on guest
33:06: I can understand that but he was saying Basically, you can't
33:12: Save yourself through your own efforts. He was saying it that that's what he was getting at and the way he was saying it was
33:19: Was cool and I got it I think the Mormons were getting it and he said to this one point he comes up to something like I remember exactly what he
33:27: Said but it was like and it's not possible to do this for those who do that you know, it's not true something like that and Right when he said that this
33:37: Apostle was his eyes were gazing and he happened to look right into my eyes, right? And I'm look
33:42: I go like this and he's looking right at me and right when Robbie goes I don't know. You know, you can't does he can't that I go I Did Happy it was obvious what
33:57: I was saying. That's you and he just kept looking and That's all but you never know, you know, maybe he's had
34:05: I guess see him that night, honey, I can't sleep Why is that? Well, I've got this nightmarish face that I just can't get out of my head.
34:15: It's doofus looking guy And just he won't go away. Well, you know, okay.
34:20: Well, you know pray to Moroni, you know, whatever That wouldn't do that. But so who knows maybe
34:26: I ruined his whole day It was all week because he had a vision of this mug staring at him.
34:32: All right so what's the Book of Mormon Book of Mormon is supposed to have been written by ancient members of the American continents the
34:38: Nephites and the Lamanites who lived from approximately 2 ,000 BC to 400 AD It is a story of their journey from Jerusalem around 600
34:45: BC to the Americas. They traveled in large boats Book of Mormon and the boats were as big as trees.
34:53: I always loved that And the length of the boat shall be the length of a tree That helps and there was a hole in the top and a hole in the bottom
35:05: Now I could just see some guys going hey look Matt, yeah I'm gonna be traveling like across the
35:12: Pacific but no the Atlantic Atlantic. I'll make sure that caution Atlantic. Okay in a boat.
35:18: You want to come? Was a cruise ship. No It it's a boat that I made and it's as big as a tree
35:29: Well, how big is a tree? It's as big as a tree Okay, as big as a tree.
35:35: Okay, and and okay And he says it has a hole in the top and the bottom
35:43: And you go in the ocean in this. Yeah. So what's the hole in the bottom for what? Come on there's a hole in the bottom of the boat
35:55: Now I've had different Mormons explain different things, you know There's a tube that comes up and you can put your refutes in there, but that's just they're just like And then there's other things, you know the
36:05: Book of Mormon you give faith to a ball and it does stuff and Anyway, and silk when it's not there and elephants when it's not there and horses are not there.
36:13: Anyway So within his pages as a history of the people their development battles teachings and eventual decline as well as the appearances by Jesus Who was
36:23: Quetzalcoatl? You've heard of Quetzalcoatl? Some of the Mexican guys have heard of Quetzalcoatl because it's like a
36:28: Mexican hero, dude, you know from the From the I remember talking to a friend of mine once he's like a
36:35: Mexican heritage or whatever Hispanic heritage good guy and So I was just telling about this
36:40: I said and some people think he's Quetzalcoatl. He goes, you know about Quetzalcoatl? He goes you're a white guy, you know
36:47: Quetzalcoatl, of course, I don't know about Quetzalcoatl because he's white So I made a racist thing out of it and that was fun
36:55: But he said Quetzalcoatl supposed to be blonde haired and blue -eyed and all this kind of stuff, which is ridiculous And supposed to do some great things
37:03: So anyway, the last contributor to the Book of Mormon was called Moroni and that's the guy at the right
37:10: He buried the plates near where Joseph Smith was living and returned as an angel and appeared to Smith and revealed the location to him and Man, you know when you see the
37:24: Anti -mormon miracle pageant and you see this I could see you know, Joseph Smith doing this and they don't have him putting his head in a hat but that's what he did and So what he would do to translate the
37:37: Book of Mormon from these golden plates is he had a hat and he had a seer stone He put the seer stone in the hat put it around his face and looked down and then he would interpret well, he would the one letter actually one character at a time would manifest on the stone as a
37:57: Parchment and he would say the letter in all of her cowdery on the other side of a curtain would then write it down one letter at a time and that's how it's supposed to have been done and that is an actual picture of the actual seer stone that Joseph Smith supposed to have used and That's what they say
38:16: Okay So it's look what it says he put the seer stone into a hat Put his face in the hat drawing it closely around his face to exclude the light
38:24: That's interesting. Let's get away from the light. Okay, and in the darkness
38:29: I just think it is so interesting. Who else do you know? Who's in darkness and got revelations from God this guy named
38:36: Muhammad when the darkness of the cave? What did Judah when did you just get possessed?
38:42: When he went out literally into the darkness the Bible says but into the darkness and that's when he was possessed to go betray
38:48: Jesus This is not an accident. I believe that The spiritual forces and God and his sovereignty puts fingerprints allows fingerprints to be put in different places different ways so that we can see things because notice what he says and in The darkness the spiritual light would shine what spiritual light now this never happened.
39:07: He never saw anything, but he's saying this a piece of something resembling parchment would appear and on that Appeared the writing one character at a time would appear and under it.
39:18: It was the interpretation in English So that's how it's supposed to have been done all right, so With the completion of the translation of the
39:26: Golden Plates Book of Mormon in 1830 Joseph Smith What then created the Church of Christ in that same year?
39:32: 1834 the name was changed to the Church of Latter -day Saints in 1838. It was changed to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter -day
39:38: Saints So that's what it's known as now The Book of Mormon is supposed to be another testament of Jesus Now I'm 60 and I remember on TV The Book of Mormon The Mormons advertising saying they were different than Christians and then after a while.
39:54: It's another testament of Jesus so they try different things in order to Win people
40:03: So So without the Book of Mormon Mormonism cannot exist it has 239 chapters 6604 verses depending on the edition.
40:13: It's one of the four standard works consisting of the King James Bible the Book of Mormon the
40:19: Doctrine and Covenants the Pearl of Great Price Maybe next week what I'll do is bring in my 3913 changes the
40:28: Book of Mormon my Greek New Testament Bring in some other stuff journal discourses bring in a bunch of things and take some time to show some stuff on camera as well but notice it says the eighth the eighth article of the 13 articles of faith and Mormonism the
40:44: Bible is true only as it as far as it is correctly translated now I'm gonna go out on a limb here
40:51: I think 13 is significant. A lot of people don't know this Friday the 13th.
40:57: Why is it a bad day? Some people think it has to do with the 14th of Nisan when the angel
41:09: You Eighth article 13 number 13.
44:48: Let's kind of continue on. Can you hear me out of this now? 13
45:10: So, what do you call it others a little trivia here, what do you call it when you have a fear of the number 13 What's that phobia called?
45:18: Triska decaphobia Triska decaphobia, what do you call what have a fear of clowns?
45:24: I Don't know But I have clowns. I'm afraid of clowns. I don't like clowns. They scare me.
45:30: They're evil -looking Huh, they're creeping
45:52: All right, ready Okay, we'll just go back in so what they'll do is they will say in the
45:57: Bible could it what the Bible to support what they're Teaching so they'll say in James 1 5 if any of you lack lacks wisdom
46:04: Let a mask of God who gives to all men generously without reproach and it'll be given to him So they'll say see that means you can pray by the
46:12: Book of Mormon and I'll go is that what that says there? You can pray with the Book of Mormon to see if it's true.
46:17: Well, yeah, it says if you lack wisdom Let's see. What's wisdom? What is wisdom
46:24: Wisdom is the proper use of knowledge. Okay, how do you use it properly? now does where do you get the proper knowledge out of the
46:32: Bible and Furthermore, it's already talking to believers not those who are not believers praying about a book
46:41: Third do you pray about the Bible to see if it's true? Hmm No, you don't but you'll use this because what they want to do is pray and get you to get a feeling and It's you know,
46:56: I mentioned every now and then I have Asperger's and we Aspies We we don't need as motion as much as others to me.
47:04: It's a waste of time. Yeah, I love you. Whatever You know, I got things to do, you know,
47:10: I can blow that thing up, you know My wife's good, but don't you love it? Yeah. Yeah, whatever. Yeah.
47:15: Yeah, I said I do 20 30 years ago. I should be good enough, you know too much to fact.
47:20: All right, but I found out That's not a good idea to say that to your wife But so I don't need is as much emotion as a lot of people do and so I think
47:31: I'm a little bit more objective When it comes to discerning things like this, I'm not gonna trust my emotions My wife learned not to after she got married to you.
47:39: That's it But you know, she's you guys know her she comes over and sees you guys all the time
47:46: When I'm there, she's not happy. We're not around. I've noticed She has a bruised forehead.
47:52: What if I think and so What they're doing is essentially doing the same thing
47:58: That Eve did when she saw that the fruit was good for eating and she felt that it was this and that Genesis 3 6
48:04: So what they're doing is putting the the truth of God's Word under the subjection of their own experiences
48:10: It's a sin to do that and they're praying about a false thing to do that now One time
48:17: I've tried this with Mormons before and a few times has worked. I've said look Let me hypothetically let me ask you something.
48:23: I Know you believe Mormonism is true. But let's just say for a minute. That is not just as a thought and if someone's praying to the
48:32: God of Mormonism and It's not true. It'd be praying to the devil ultimately
48:39: If you're praying to the devil and you get a response that this is true
48:45: You'd be in a lot of trouble How would you know you're not praying to the devil? And they'll say well because I feel it
48:53: It's exactly the problem because you feel it. How do you know your feelings correct? Well, the
48:58: Holy Spirit wouldn't deceive me who said this is the Holy Spirit Be and this is what
49:03: I'll do with them. How do you know? Well, I just know Now I say well if we're gonna just say that I just know then
49:10: I can tell you I just know Because I'll give my testimony how I got saved and no
49:15: Mormon not there were my testimony is bigger than your more your testimony It's not like that, but I got an incredibly powerful testimony and I've not heard any
49:23: Mormon beat it So to speak not that that's you know, it's a boasting thing It's just I got a testimony that contradicts yours the very presence of God himself reduced me to a just a pile of weeping
49:35: Repentance and I know for a fact you don't have that Jesus you don't
49:43: So, you know testimonies really don't do much and Anyway beelzebub, okay, so So this is
49:58: Moroni 10 for now, I love using this with Mormons and when ye could for some reason
50:05: Moroni and God when they were working together translating this needed King James English But when ye shall receive these things
50:14: I would exhort that It's hard for me to read it that ye would ask God the
50:19: Eternal Father in the name of Christ If these things are not true, and if you shall ask with his sincere heart with real intent having faith in Christ He will manifest the truth of it unto you by the power of the
50:29: Holy Ghost and by the power of the Holy Ghost He may know the truth of all things So what I'll do is I'll say to Mormons I'll say did you pray this prayer did you do this
50:37: Moroni 10 for yes Are you sure? Well, what was your answer that it was true?
50:43: Oh, so you didn't do it and they get really confused. Yeah, I did. I prayed it.
50:48: No, no No, you said it was true. Yeah But you see you've got an affirmation, right?
50:54: Yes that it was true. Yeah, that's not what it says It says I would exhort that you would ask
51:01: God the Eternal Father in the name of Jesus Christ if these things are not true Are they not true that's what it says and you said you got an affirmation so it's an affirmation that it's not true
51:16: I've tripped Mormons up with this left and right know what it means is that it is true Then why does it say they're not true to see if it's not true.
51:22: Are they not true? Not true and notice what it says here And I believe that incidentally the not true thing
51:29: I believe that that's another fingerprint a little thing of revealing the deception that's going on and what's really going on I think it's
51:37: Satan working through Joseph Smith and it's seeking to write this stuff out to see if it's not true a little
51:43: Joke to see if it's not true and they pray and it's not true. And they're following a lie.
51:49: It's And that you shall ask and if you ask with a sincere heart and notice this
51:55: If you ask with a sincere heart, in other words, I prayed I did this once I Actually prayed with sincerity and boy did
52:02: I find out the Mormon that the Book of Mormon is false Well, what they're gonna say is well, you didn't pray with a sincere heart.
52:09: Yes, I did No, you didn't. Yes, I did You couldn't have because you would have found out the
52:15: Book of Mormon is true. Oh So you're saying no matter what I say no matter what happens.
52:21: I'm never sincere unless I believe like you say That's what it is. So there's no way to find out if it's true or not.
52:29: You just believe it This is how cults work All right, so and I've got you know
52:36: I already explained this so to see if these things are not true or Jordan to pray to see if it's not true We're only 10 for try it sometime with Mormons.
52:43: We're gonna ask these guys They're Mormons want to get on after the Q &A Did they pray to see if it's not true or to see if it was true?
52:52: So anyway Now here's something else about the Book of Mormon There are 12.
52:59: There's a list of 12 essential Mormon doctrines not found in the Book of Mormon Church organization plurality of God's plurality of wives doctrine word of wisdom
53:10: God's exalted man celestial marriage men may become God's three degrees of glory baptism for the dead eternal progression the
53:17: Aaronic priesthood Temple works of washings anointing endowments ceilings not in the Book of Mormon.
53:22: Why is that important because look at the bottom left square here? I told the brethren that the
53:28: Book of Mormon was the most correct of any book on earth and The keystone of our religion and a man would get near to God by abiding by its principles than by any other book that means the
53:40: Bible is not nearly as good as the Book of Mormon and the Book of Mormon is what's going to get
53:46: You closest to God and the Book of Mormon is a restoration of the truth and the Book of Mormon doesn't even have Mormon theology in it
53:53: That's a little bit but not much it just doesn't make any sense and look check this out
53:59: We're not 25 23 for we know that is by grace that we are saved after all we can do not to ask the
54:04: Mormons Have you done all you can do? Yes Really all you can possibly do
54:11: Miss arrogance and look at Moroni 1032 and if ye shall deny yourselves of all ungodliness and love
54:18: God with all your might Mind and strength then is his grace sufficient for you more than a 1032
54:24: I asked Mormons have you denied yourself of all ungodliness and love God with all your might I Had Mormons in their arrogance say yes
54:34: It's like some of the Christians I talked to Do you sit anymore? No, I Don't sit anymore.
54:41: Really spend five minutes with me. I'll cure that but So you don't sit anymore, right?
54:49: You ever heard of the thing called pride. I don't have pride I'm just humble before God.
54:56: That's how come I know I can I don't sit. I mean, I'm literally this is what's up I'm getting people Are you kidding me?
55:03: Wow, they have to be Pelagian. That's another theological issue so When we examine the
55:12: Book of Mormon we find that not only does it not contain basic Mormon doctrine It also contradicts a lot of it
55:19: There would be more people saved in the kingdom of God ten thousand times over because of the
55:25: Book of Mormon Then there will be because of the Bible Now that is blasphemy, okay
55:38: Check it out. This is what the Book of Mormon says Following as a comparison of what is found in the Book of Mormon So in Mormonism, there's only one
55:46: God But yet in the Book of Mormon Mosiah 15 1 through 5 Alma 11 28 2nd
55:51: Nephi 31 21 But Mormonism teaches there's many gods There's a documentation right there
55:57: The Trinity is one God and the Trinity is three separate gods God is unchanging in the Book of Mormon, but God is increasing in knowledge and other things check this out
56:09: God is spirit in Alma. Oh God has the form of a man Journal of Discourses eternal hell or hell is not eternal polygamy is condemned in the
56:18: Book of Mormon. The polygamy was taught and practiced So, you know, this is just a small list.
56:25: There's a lot like this But this should be obvious, you know, the Book of Mormon doesn't contain true
56:32: Mormonism Why? Because when Joseph Smith started his religion
56:39: He didn't have all this worked out in his head. He had to make it up as he went So he got the Book of Mormon written quickly and it became codified
56:48: So once it was codified once it was written then the theology started changing to contradicting the
56:53: Book of Mormon Then what they did start redefining terms You redefine terms you get a
57:00: Book of Mormon to say that whatever you wanted to say So You can see the
57:06: Book of Mormon sounds Christian in his teaching and that's because of the It was written before all the aberrant stuff really started going wacko and So The Book of Mormon sounds interesting
57:22: Christian because Joseph Smith still had some basic Christians already already went over this don't jump right ahead to this
57:29: When I tell people about witnessing the Mormons and this will quit it for this this little segment here
57:35: You have to understand Mormon theology or Mormon terminology So Adam father of the physical mankind
57:42: Adam is also known as Michael the Archangel ancient days Doctrine and Covenants 116
57:48: Atonement the sacrifice of Christ that made resurrection possible along with the possibility of earning freedness of sins
57:55: Celestial heaven the highest of the three levels of heaven the church is the LDS Church with its structure and its laws eternal life is exaltation
58:05: Becoming a god, okay And it'll taste in the state of becoming a god, all right
58:12: We have the fall of mankind, which is called a blessing Mosiah 3 a necessary step in the progression of humanity to the level of godhood
58:22: So I was with my wife Years and years ago, and of course I have cart duty
58:29: And so I follow my wife around I got a cart duty being the strong man that I am pushing the cart full of heavy stuff like bread in it and eggs and she's just you know put stuff in there and Like a cart duty, and I'm thinking because it's like I can follow her and I can think okay
58:45: Cuz I'm a guy and so I can do that like okay you follow her I'm thinking and I was thinking about this stuff of Mormonism and how
58:55: They were celebrating the fall I was thinking about that.
59:00: I guess I'm never pushing the cart and I stopped when I said only the ungodly celebrates sin and In Mormonism they celebrated the sin of Adam in the fall so that they can be exalted and they celebrate it
59:17: And I remember that I was in a grocery store, and she's like can you hurry up, okay? She didn't realize that I had some monumental awareness you know in a grocery store getting chips, you know and I Remember that I still remember only the ungodly celebrates sin
59:39: It's exactly the case here So the the fall the great sin that brought all this
59:46: Crap into our world is celebrated in Mormonism because it allows you to become gods So God is one of countless gods in existence.
59:54: He's an exalted man from another world now What do we call that a life form from another planet alien aliens?
01:00:01: So like I say the Mormons that they worship an alien and its mate Now what if I said to you
01:00:07: I want to sort of religion, I've got some gold plates I found in dirt and So what
01:00:15: I'm gonna do is translate them by going into a dark room and putting the plates on my forehead and feeling the words
01:00:26: And I'm gonna teach that there's life out there in other planets and an alien is in our
01:00:34: Atmosphere and that's the real guy we're gonna worship and it has a mate too and they in heaven and So we're gonna be worshipping them and everything else one join up, okay
01:00:49: Do I get underwear? Yes You get some underwear and you have some alien handshakes
01:00:55: They're through special alien handshakes because you and you can deed this stuff Come on, you'd be going like you're a moron
01:01:05: But you see when it is couched in nice words nice terminology, then you go.
01:01:11: Oh, I didn't sound so bad God the father wants us to be like him and since he's divine doesn't it make sense?
01:01:17: He wants us to be divine as well. Wow, that makes sense All depends what spin you put on it, right?
01:01:23: So when the Mormons are at your door what they do is they're spinning it you ever seen those old tops Well, you know when you're back when ancient days like me you had this little, you know
01:01:32: You go like that and if you didn't do it right it went through something behind me, you know, you know my brother
01:01:42: But you know, you just get the thing spinning and I Forgot was gonna say about that What It's fidget spinners now
01:01:55: I lost my train of thought that's a good memory though with the tops. I get that thing going so fast
01:02:00: You drill a hole in something anyway in Mormonism God's is is an office held by three separate gods
01:02:07: God the Father a God Jesus is a God the Holy Ghost is another God and the gospel is the laws and ordinances of the
01:02:14: Mormon Church and heaven divided into three kingdoms celestial terrestrial celestial celestial is for the perfect Mormons those who kept celestial law and The place of exaltation in the celestial heaven the third level in that is called the church of the firstborn
01:02:28: Holy Ghost is a spirit man. He can only be at one place at one time Jesus the literal offspring of God the
01:02:37: Father the literal Now I have got to say this but the goddess mom the goddess wife up there in heaven, you know, okay, honey
01:02:46: I just made a planet and it's everything's working. We got the cows. We got the fishes
01:02:51: We got some birds in there. The clouds are going there. It is good We Got a little more to do here
01:03:00: I could be seeing her going. Hey, hey, right. I mean, come on She's gonna have to have billions of babies
01:03:11: How does that work? Seriously, I'm for talking to some Mormons about that, you know trying to be respectful say so there's a body flesh and bones
01:03:19: Yes, does she have a body flesh and bones? Yes, and they Cuz you're married. That's right.
01:03:24: They produce spirit babies. Yes How many people have lived in the world, you know, maybe eight ten billion.
01:03:30: Let's say ten billion just easy number Does she give birth ten billion times? How does that work?
01:03:40: Ten billion births. Could you imagine him going to her? We're gonna make ten billion babies
01:03:46: Now for a guy Not that big of a deal For a girl, it's a little bit more involved
01:03:52: I mean I get to see her breastfeeding It's gonna be hard.
01:03:59: What are you gonna do? Anyway Sorry could resist that one
01:04:09: So we won't get into that. We'll just stop right there. We've got a lot to talk about The terminology you've got to learn terminology to start talking more
01:04:20: You've got to learn What it is that they teach Because they're going to use the terms
01:04:27: But you have to understand what they mean by them are different to what you mean So if you say Trinity, they mean three gods you say salvation.
01:04:33: They could mean universal resurrection So you mean gospel you mean the death burial resurrection of Christ?
01:04:40: They mean the laws and the ordinances of the church. So you've got to use the terms The terminology the definitions.
01:04:46: That's what I do So I'll say do you believe in one God who exists in all place all times all dimensions?
01:04:51: There was never any other God just the one That's how I do with Mormons. I used to talk like that with them.
01:04:58: Well, no. Oh So that's what I'm doing and I'll quote the scriptures that show that I say 43 10 44 6 44 8 45 5 and I'll show
01:05:07: Them stuff like this So you're gonna witness them that way now We're gonna take a break.
01:05:13: We're gonna have Mormons calling up, right? I've got Mormons who are gonna put me in my place and I'm looking forward to that to be fun
01:05:20: And then we'll just see how that goes. So let me just pray us out We'll move along I hope this is entertaining as well as informative we got more coming next week
01:05:29: Lord Jesus Thank you for the time and ask that you would bless it. Thank you Lord that you've given us the knowledge of truth by which we can compare the lies and Shine the light of truth upon them that people might abandon those lies and come to faith and trust in you