Tim Challies on Gay Christianity Review Part 1 - Why Does Tim Think This Issue is New?

The arrogance displayed by Tim Chalice in this video surpasses

Donald Trump on almost any day. I'm not kidding. Yeah, I'm serious.

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I appreciate it very, very much. Arrogance. Yeah, that's a weird word to use, especially if you've seen this clip.

I did a short video about it yesterday just to kind of introduce people to it. Arrogance is an interesting word because what it really means is that you have an overinflated sort of sense of your self -importance, overinflated sense of your opinion and things like that.

But the thing is, with the word arrogance, there's certainly a connotation of a tone as well. So when you say somebody is being arrogant, usually what you're saying is they kind of have an air of bravado about them, almost like overconfidence.

Like anyone who speaks with any kind of confidence or authority or gravitas can be described as arrogant.

I've been described as arrogant before because of my tone primarily. But to be perfectly honest with you,

I think that really misses the mark of what the real core of arrogance is because what arrogance is is not really so much a tone as it is the content of what you say.

Because when you're speaking arrogantly, really what that's saying is you don't really know what you're talking about, but you're acting as if you know what you're talking about.

You're really not in the position to make the claims that you're making, but you're acting like as if you do.

And there's more than one way to be arrogant. Big Eva and Tim Chalice in this video displays unbelievable levels of arrogance.

There's a couple of ways to be arrogant. Here's what I mean by that. I think that one of the most arrogant things that you can do is to speak for God where He hasn't spoken or to pretend like God hasn't spoken where He has.

And that's really what Tim Chalice does here. Tim Chalice tries to make something very nuanced that's really quite clear.

He tries to say that we need more information. We're not really sure. This is a new issue for the church when it comes to the

LGBT and same -sex attraction and that kind of thing. And to say that is really an arrogant thing to say because the scripture is very, very clear on this issue.

And if you're a pastor or any kind of public Christian, again, what I mean by that is a Christian whose work is popular, it's shared, it's the kind of Christian that will be speaking at an event like this, that'll get asked a question like this.

If you are a Christian in that regard and you're pretending like God's word isn't clear in an area where it is crystal clear, that is the most arrogant kind of thing that you can do.

That's the thing. I always say this and I completely, I believe this with all my heart. We ought to be clear where the scripture is clear and we ought to be nuanced where the scripture is nuanced.

There's nothing wrong with nuance. It's just we can't put nuance in places where there is none in the scripture and vice versa.

We can't be clear and enforceful where the scripture isn't clear and forceful.

And the reality is that Big Eva has succumbed to the pressure of the world to try to make this seem like a more complicated issue than it is.

It simply isn't. And a lot of people will call this limp -wristed and it is. A lot of people will call this kind of answer effeminate and it is, but more than anything, more than limp -wristed, more than effeminate, this answer is arrogance personified.

Now, I don't know Tim Chalice. I don't, I'm not familiar with his work. I don't know if he displays this kind of arrogance a lot, but I do know that in this situation, when he's asked this question, he is arrogant and he knows it and he knows it because at the end of this, we're gonna go, we're gonna talk about this entire thing and I don't know how many parts this video is gonna be, but at the end of this, he says, maybe

I'm being purposely evasive. So he knows that he's being evasive intentionally and he also likewise knows, because he seems like a smart guy, the scripture is not evasive in this area.

And so this is arrogance. Tim Chalice is an arrogant man, at least in this area.

And we need to identify that when it happens. Big Eva is supremely arrogant, especially in this area.

So we're gonna go ahead and listen to this and we're gonna start and stop and there's just so much here. So I don't know if I'll be able to get it all done in this video.

I don't wanna go too long, but let's begin and we will go from there.

Let's see what we got here. We got this, let's change that. All right, here we go. Hey Tim.

Just a question. If we're walking a road with a professing Christian, have a close relationship with them and they identify themselves as say a gay

Christian, what they mean by that is same sex attraction. What does repentance look like biblically for someone who experiences or who has same sex attraction?

Okay, so it's a very simple question. And I said in my last video that this is a question that Christians need to be able to knock out of the park, especially

Christians who are pastors, especially Christians who are leaders and all of that kind of thing.

And the question is, this is important because this is a very specific question. He says, what do we do if we have a friend and they call themselves a

Christian, they're a gay Christian. And what they mean by that, you see this questioner is very careful. He says,

I'm not just gonna play around with this. What they mean when they say I'm a gay Christian is that I experience same sex attractions.

I'm attracted sexually to someone of the same sex. Okay, that's what

I am, I'm experiencing that. What does repentance, what does a life of repentance look like for a person like that?

And this is important because repentance, this is a basic idea in the scripture.

When Jesus is preaching the gospel, what does he say? He says, repent for the kingdom of God is at hand.

So we better know what that means, right? We better know when Christ tells us to repent and believe the gospel, we really need to know what that means because that's critical to understanding the gospel of Jesus Christ, the gospel that people from the gospel coalition are supposedly united against, they're coalescing around and that kind of thing.

So this is a critical, critical thing. We all have to think about the answer to this question. That's the question, what does repentance look like for someone who is sexually attracted to people of the same sex?

That's the question, let's continue. So this is another one of those issues that we as a church are working out.

And I think that's okay. We're, if you look across the sweep of 2000 years of church history, this whole idea of same sex attraction or gay

Christian or all these different terms that have come up, these are very, very new.

I'm trying to think of a way to do this as respectfully as possible because what you just heard was arrogance, absolutely arrogant.

And it's hard to see it because he said, I think we're working this out and that's okay.

And he says it in such a wonderful sort of school guidance counselor kind of voice.

And he's clean shaven and he's got a winsome approach to this and he is just spitting out arrogance.

This is arrogant because what he's just got done saying is that we're just working this out.

We're working out what repentance looks like for someone who calls himself a gay Christian. And these ideas of same sex attraction and gay

Christianity and stuff like that, these are new. I mean, we've only been in the church for 2000 years.

I mean, this is new stuff. And you just have to wonder what universe this guy,

James White always says, this is from Frasier. What color is the sky in your world?

Actually, it's not from Frasier, but it's from that actor. I think it's from Cheers. Seriously, Tim Chalice, what color is the sky in your world?

This is a new issue. This is a new issue. Let's read the Bible because that's the important thing here.

And what I pulled up here is the book of Romans written by Paul the Apostle. A lot of people think it was written right around year 57, 58.

So we're talking almost 2000 years ago. Tim Chalice says that the church has been around for 2000 years and we're still working this out.

These are new ideas and that's okay. This is Paul the Apostle.

He's talking about the wrath of God, God's wrath on unrighteousness.

And let's just read this. Let's just read this because I think that this is important for you to hear this in context.

Because again, Tim Chalice is expecting you to accept this idea that same -sex attraction, this is a new thing.

This is brand new. Paul says, starting in verse 18, he says, for the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth.

For what can be known about God is plain to them because God has shown it to them. For his invisible attributes, namely his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived ever since the creation of the world in the things that have been made.

So they are without excuse. For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking and their foolish hearts were darkened.

Claiming to be wise, they became fools and exchanged the glory of the immortal

God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things. Therefore, God gave them up in the lusts of their heart to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies amongst themselves.

Because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creator or the creature rather than the creator who was blessed forever.

Amen. For this reason, God gave them up to dishonorable passions. For their women exchanged natural relations for those that are contrary to nature.

And the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another.

Men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in themselves the due penalty for their error.

And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done.

They were filled with all manner of unrighteousness, covetousness, malice, full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, maliciousness, their gossip, slanderers, haters of God, insolent, haughty, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, foolish, faithless, heartless, ruthless.

Though they know, God's righteous decree, that those who practice such things deserve to die, they not only do them, but they give approval to those who practice them.

See, Paul the Apostle knew about same -sex attraction in year 57. You know what?

I don't think Paul just, this was new back then either. Let's go to a passage that's a little bit further back in history.

This is Leviticus 18. This is the same section of verses where we get, love your neighbor as yourself, don't hate your brother in your heart.

You know, very important verses for Christians. And here's what it says in Leviticus 18.

We already know what it says. I know I'm belaboring the point here. Everybody knows this. Tim Chalice knows this.

Leviticus 18, it says this. It says, you shall not lie with a male as with a woman.

It is an abomination. You shall not lie with a male as with a woman.

It is an abomination. We know from Christ that, you know, the idea of lusting in your heart after a woman, and we can, by analogy,

I mean, this stands for a reason. This isn't complicated. Lusting in your heart after a man is adultery.

It's committing the sin in your heart. We understand that when it comes to women. We should understand this when it comes to men.

For some reason, this gets to be a complicated, very nuanced issue.

And the reality is that there's a, we have to think about here. We have to think about here is, is why is

Tim Chalice answering in this way? Why is he pretending like this is a more complicated issue than it is?

Because it's just a lie. It's a lie. And let me say this.

It's untrue that this is a new issue for the church, that we're just, you know, we can't expect us to really figure this out now.

I mean, this is brand new, the 2000 year old church. It's not new. People had feelings towards members of the same sex all the way back.

Let's just, at least as far as the book of Genesis, right? So, you know, whenever Sodom and Gomorrah happened, so we know at least that's where it started.

It probably started much earlier than that, but that's a long time, right? And yet we've got

Tim Chalice saying, well, this is a new issue. This is a new issue. What does repentance look like when you desire something in your heart that's evil?

And the reality is that Tim Chalice is a pastor, right? Does he not know what that looks like for someone who desires something evil in your heart?

What we're going to get later, and we're going to go into this in another video, what we're going to get later is this idea, well, you know, some of them might not even really be same sex attracted.

They might just be confused that they, you know, they've got a friend and they really love the friend and people are encouraging them to call it same sex attraction and stuff like that.

So they might be confused. I need more information here. And you don't need more information here.

Whether they're confused and they're actually really same sex attracted or they're not actually has nothing to do with the desires in themselves.

If you're tricked into being a homosexual, there's still repentance that is a very clear kind of repentance for you that any pastor should be able to understand.

Again, in the video yesterday, I said, this is not a very complicated question. It's not more complicated than any kind of sinful desire.

I say, listen, pastor, you know, I really love my girlfriend. I know we're not married yet, but I'd really like to have sex with her.

You know, I want to show her my love physically. And the pastor says, well, I mean, this is a new issue.

I need, I want to hear your heart to know how, what repentance looks like for you who desire to fornicate.

I want to know your heart. Who would say that? Nobody would say that.

And so the question we need to ask ourselves is why is Tim Chalice answering in this way for this issue?

That's an important question. I can't answer it really, but I know essentially what it is.

It's because this is the culture infecting the church. This is the culture making the church bend to its will.

All of a sudden, now we need more nuance here. We need more information. I mean, do we really even understand?

This is a new thing, but this idea of same -sex track, it's new. Where have we heard this before? Well, we hear it from the culture.

They didn't know about what we know now. They didn't know back then. I mean, Paul was walking around.

He was basically a Neanderthal. Like he didn't understand what we understand about gender fluidity and sexual identity and sexual orientation.

That's a concept. It's brand new. These are lies. This isn't true.

If you buy into those lies, I have a hard time understanding what you think about biblical inspiration.

Because if you're saying, well, Paul didn't know about this stuff, so he couldn't have been addressing this stuff. Yeah, Paul wrote the scripture, but he wrote as he was carried along by the

Holy Spirit. Did the Holy Spirit know? When he wrote Leviticus 18, and that was given to Moses, did he know that there were people that had this same -sex attraction?

And it was really an orientation. It wasn't just only lust being inflamed in your heart.

I mean, Paul, I know he's saying that it's just passion. It's a disordered passion. But what he didn't know was that there were actually people that just, they experienced it.

It's not their fault. How can they repent of what they just naturally want?

You know, I'm trying to be as winsome as possible here, but someone who thinks of the

Bible in that way, I just, how can, how do you understand the doctrine of inspiration?

How do you understand the doctrine of inspiration? If Paul wasn't addressing this,

God wasn't addressing this, so now somehow the church needs to figure this out. You know,

I'm kind of at a loss for words here because this is just basic stuff. This is not complicated stuff. This is not complicated stuff.

I've often, you know, said this, but I'm gonna say it again. There are some things in the Bible that are difficult, and they require you to look at the good and necessary consequence, and they require some nuance in your thinking, and they require a lot of care and debate.

There are lots of things in the Bible like that. This is not one of them. This is only complicated if you're accepting a lie that the culture is telling us right now, a lie, and saying, well, this has to inform our understanding of the sacred scriptures because this is obviously true.

I don't even know what to say, but I'm gonna stop this video right there. We barely got through anything. This is gonna be a long one.

We've gotten through like 10 seconds of Tim Chalice, 47 seconds of this three -minute video, but there's just so much here, and I just don't even really know.