2022 Luke Abendroth Interview (Part 2)

Welcome to No Compromise Radio, a ministry coming to you from Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston.

No Compromise Radio is a program dedicated to the ongoing proclamation of Jesus Christ based on the theme in Galatians 2, verse 5, where the

Apostle Paul said, But we did not yield in subjection to them for even an hour, so that the truth of the gospel would remain with you.

In short, if you like smooth, watered -down words to make you simply feel good, this show isn't for you.

By purpose, we are first biblical, but we can also be controversial. Stay tuned for the next 25 minutes as we're called by the divine trumpet to summon the troops for the honor and glory of her

King. Here's our host, Pastor Mike Abendroth. Welcome to No Compromise Radio ministry, my name's

Mike Abendroth, and I'm going to mind my manners this show, unlike last show. Luke Abendroth, welcome to the show.

Thank you, Michael Lee. Hey, the way it works in our family, the sons get the dad's first name as their middle name.

So I'm Luke Michael, with the M -I -C -H -E -L, like Michelle. But are you going to carry on? Are you going to carry on? I wonder if your radio show listeners know that your middle name or your first name is spelled without an

A. So we get calls at the house looking for Michelle Abendroth, and I think you need some kind of beret, some kind of French name.

But my middle name's without an A, too. Michael Lee? What kind of Lee? Well, I'm just saying,

I'm just saying. Yeah, well, my last name's without an A. Lee was a tough guy. You'd like Lee. I know. I wish I would have met him. Uh -huh.

He was the hammer. That's toxic masculinity. I don't like that. I never really fought much, but I was wrestling with my friend

Dave Jorgensen once. This is a good story. It's got to be some good sermon illustration. Yeah, seriously, somehow. Yeah, yeah.

And my dad, he was a bouncer, and he was a fighter, and Korean War vet, et cetera. And I just remember those big tattoos with the snake and the

Black Panther thing. Well, I was wrestling Dave, and Dave, I got him in a scissor lock around his stomach with my legs.

And then I had his head in a headlock. We were just friendly wrestling. And dad was standing there, hands on hip, three yards over, watching me.

It was like five o 'clock before dinner. I didn't know what to do. I thought, Dad would want me to probably finish off the job, so I punched him in the nose.

He got a bloody nose. I just let him out of the headlock, walked home, and I thought I was going to get in bad trouble.

Not a word. Luke, he didn't say good job. That's just silent approval. He did not say if you're going to cock it, you're going to throw it.

It was just like, okay, taking care of business. Nice. But why didn't he teach me how to fight? He should have taught me how to fight.

He didn't want you to fight inside, deep down in here. Drinking too many Schlitz. He knew it was, he knew deep down it was, it was wrong to fight.

Falstaffs. All right, so today on the show, after last show bombed,

I think we had - Yeah, I think we had too many. Not many listeners. One or two. You're 25 now, you'd like to go to seminary.

What would, if you could kind of say in the future, I'd like to do this regarding gospel ministry, what would that be?

What would be a hope and desire if the Lord so grants it? I don't know about specifics, but I would love to be a pastor someday, a senior pastor and teach verse by verse and shepherd the people that Lord willing, he would give me.

So that would be probably my ultimate goal. And I don't think I'd want to be at a large church or anything like that.

I think something like what you have going on, you know, like father, like son would be cool. Well, you know, you always have to, your son has to do things better.

So whatever my house is, it has to be bigger. Right. Whatever the church is, it has to be bigger. Yeah. Right. Yeah. That's probably the one thing

I would change is I would probably take some things from your ministry than otherwise. I just want to be much more pragmatic, numbers driven, like just, you know, you've got to bring in some of the growth strategies that we can take, you know, natural law we learned from them.

And we just like a business, like an entrepreneur, that's like a senior pastor is more, it's more in my opinion, less of a shepherd role.

You know, I know that was what they use in the Bible, but it's more of an entrepreneur type thing. I think that's a great word for Episcopal.

Entrepreneur. Yeah. I think one's a French word and one's a Greek word. Yeah. Yeah. They're the same. They're equivalent. How can you be...

It's all a joke, by the way. Yeah. Yeah. They probably don't know. We never joke on No Compromise Radio. We never laugh at our own jokes, right?

So you're doing that. And how long do you think it'll take you to get through seminary? I heard that's a super hard seminary.

I heard so too. I'm ready for, like you say, when you're reading Richard Mueller, I'm ready for another lesson and I am dumb.

That's what I'm ready for. Because I'm not the scholar type. I'm like, I can read it and it takes me a long time and then

I think I can explain it to people, but I'm not Mr. Scholastic. So, but I think it usually takes three years if you're full time.

So Lord willing, something around there, maybe a little bit longer if I can't take classes and you have to work.

Okay. Tell me about what's going to go on with the conference. You have a conference there every year, Westminster Seminary Conference. You're going to spend time with Pat Abendroth of the

Pactom. The Pactom. The Pactom Radio. I think the Pactom's... I've heard a lot about the Pactomverse recently on Twitter.

I have too. Pretty cool. I think somebody from our church came up with that word. From our church?

Uh huh. Yeah. I can't remember who, but I can't remember much with COVID fog these days. Yeah. COVID fog. Everything is COVID fog.

What school are you going to go to again? No, I think, yeah, I'm going to go to the conference. It's going to be, well, at the time that we're recording this, next week, we're going to be meeting a bunch of friends that are actually sitting in this room right now, out visiting from California.

I know they're putting up cards. They just put like a six and a half above your head. I know. Well, Renee is in the back reading

Lewis Sperry Schaefer. That's his favorite theologian. Oh, I did not know that. Ryan, what's he like? He has that tattoo. The LSC on his chest.

Oh. Because he likes LFC, Liverpool Football Club, and then LSC, Lewis Sperry Schaefer, so it's the double.

Oh. LFC, LSC. Okay. And what's Ryan's beef? What's he do? He's from Australia. He grew up in prison.

That's why he loves Galatians, because you're being set free. Prisoners will be set free. I know you know the story.

I'm in New Zealand. They don't know who these people are. They're in the back. I'm in New Zealand, and I was there for a conference, and I'm teaching, and I quoted

John Owen quite a bit, because I've been trying to read him. And we have a little slogan around here, 10 pages of John Owen keeps the

Richard Baxter's away kind of thing. That's good. 10 pages of John Owen a day keeps the Richard Baxter's away. Famous.

Well, a guy came up to me. He looked pretty tough. He looked like a New Zealand, Australian kind of guy, and introduced himself, and started talking about John Owen.

And I said, well, have you read any John Owen? And he said, yes. I said, how much?

He said, every volume. I said, you've read every volume of John Owen? The Green Banner of Truth?

Yes, all 16 volumes. I said, well, how do you have time for that? He said, prison. Nice. That's an

Uncle Dunk. Uncle Dunk is my uncle and my mom's, your wife's brother. He should be on the show sometime.

He'd be fun to have on the show. Yeah, but he just so tough in terms of masculine, but so sweet in terms of empathetic, he'd just cry the whole time probably.

Yeah, but, you know, it would be good. Good tears. I can think about other people who are tough when it comes to defending, and then sweet with the people they love.

Well, that's probably a good thing to do. Yeah, let's go. Okay. So, let's see. What else do we talk about? Anything you've been asking, wanting to ask me on the show?

Because, you know, you're going to be taking it over. NoCo Jr. takes the reins. You know, you've got this book here, and on the back it says John Blanchard is an internationally known

British evangelist, and I think you certainly need to start naming your books like this. He wrote many top -selling

Christian books, including Whatever Happened to Hell. Actually, that's the best book Blanchard wrote. Whatever Happened to Hell.

And the second best book he wrote is his James Commentary, of all things. But how would you rate his book, Pop Goes the

Gospel? I had it, and it was kind of a dud.

Really? Yeah, yeah. It doesn't seem like it'd be a dud. You light it like a firework, and pop goes the gospel. Pop goes the weasel.

That's just a funny name. So Blanchard, he died a couple years ago, didn't he? I have no idea. I just know the ultimate question from when

I was a kid. I think I read that and I got scared. Seriously? I think so. Okay. Well, when we played the

Edward, Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God, were you scared? I was scared. Did you come into this office? This very office, this very study.

I think so, and I said, I don't think I'm going to go to hell. I mean, it's a good scare. I think, you know, that's the one time that I like quoting

Edwards, is when I've done a couple high school retreat series. You know, I'm doing one coming up sometime soon with three different sermons, and it's kind of like, let's do like basic kind of gospel -centered intro to the

Christian life type of thing. And so I just take the, steal the Heidelberg Catechism structure, guilt, grace, gratitude.

So I do the first one, guilt and God's perfect standard, he better keep the law perfectly, perfect perpetual entire obedience, all that stuff.

And then I do a little thing about what's the judgment for those that don't keep the law. And I always put the one

Edwards quote in there of the, you know, there's the spider hanging over the web and the flames are going to come up at any second.

And so I like some, some of that, I actually like listening to that every once in a while. It's pretty good. Cause you don't hear many sermons on hell these days, do you?

Rare. They're rare. Sadly. Luke, you've done a lot of ministry with younger people, high school ministry for many years.

You and I would talk about how parents need to get more involved, or you would commend the parents that were involved.

If you had to give some friendly advice to parents who had children in high school ministries, to either commend them for what they are doing or give them a little heads up on what their kids need to know are behind the scenes, what their kids are doing, what would you say to the parents?

See, this is what I wanted to do. If I had to take the show over, I was going to do just all parenting shows. Well, not,

I know, the question isn't really how does a parent parent, but yeah, the church, you know, we help each other and sometimes you would tell me things, it's like, what's the dad thinking?

I know. Well, I just think, you know, I know I've been parented well and that's not to, you didn't, you didn't hand me $20 to say that, but you know,

I've been parented well by you and mom and always a good balance of fun, but being involved and strict, but you know, we love being part of the family and, and there's a lot of benefits of that.

But I think a lot of parents that I've encountered over the years, they just, they want the youth group to be the primary spiritual influence on their kids.

So they want your youth leader. Well, I can't break through to this kid, so maybe the youth leader finally will. And you know,

I get, they get the small group questions. That's where they're really going to grow. And I think the Bible is pretty clear that, that fathers are the spiritual leaders of their home.

And so as, as a man and as, and as a woman supporting your husband, the, the, the father and the, and the mother need to be the primary spiritual leaders of the home, not the youth group.

And so I think, you know, I, when I was at Grace Community Church, one of the things that I would say is, was really done well as the emphasis is we're here to come alongside you as parents, as you parent your children, not to be the parents.

Because so often it's like, can you talk to my son about being on his phone too much?

It's like, I don't know. That's just sounds crazy to me. I remember one time I was watching stuff on my computer and it was just some surf videos, but mom came in and I wasn't supposed to be watching.

And she took, I remember I'll never forget goes to the back patio. She takes the laptop and this is probably over dramatized in my mind, but she throws a laptop up and I can see the guy, you know, pulling into the barrel, doing a little turn, spinning through the air, landing on the sidewalk, breaking into a ton of pieces because it wasn't supposed to be on the laptop.

It's like, it's just, it's just so foreign to me that, that there's, there's, it seems like there's a lot of parents that cede spiritual authority to the youth group leaders.

And honestly, there's a lot of youth group leaders that don't know what they're talking about. So you don't, you know, they're good friends for the kids, but you don't want to give them all the authority and leadership over your kids.

Plus, I don't want the youth ministry leaders to simply talk about things that they could learn on Ben Shapiro.

Don't be addicted to your phone. Be careful of social media. It's parenting. Right. That's something completely different.

Cause I got one shot with these young people and it's going to be something from the Bible. And it's going to be about the gospel because most kids,

I mean, how long have they had to be regenerated? Not very long. So it's not a surprise when kids aren't saved when they're 15 years old.

By definition, they're immature at best. Right. And that's, that's, they're 15 years old. So I think that, and also

I think the other thing that I would say is, you know, I think the world is just so different than it was 20 years ago, even, and kids, you know, one of the things that I've seen that's interesting is there's like sometimes an expectation that like these kids will be at 15 years old going to the school, evangelizing and discipling, you know, five unbelievers at once at the public high school and all these things and bringing them all youth group.

And of course that would be great. But really a lot of kids, you know, now, now you have kids who have

Christian values being bullied because they're not LGBTQ. That's what you see that it's on the news everywhere.

There's, there's people being bullied because they're straight, because they're a boy that likes girls and a girl or a girl that likes boys.

Like these are the kinds of things that they're facing now. You see the stuff that's going on in public schools and even just with sports and people's friends.

I mean, just the, the sexual deviancy and all these things going on with the, with the, with the liberal specifically like woke or LGBTQ agenda, it is, it's a war and Satan is at war with, for the, for the hearts and minds of your kids.

And there needs to be a constant going back to the word of God in the home, Bible reading, family devotional.

Yeah. My mom used to sit with us before we went to public high school in the mornings and read through the Proverbs and talk about what a fool does.

And it's like, this is preparation for you're sending your kids out into a world that is, that is, that is trying to seduce them.

And I think that's kind of been lost because, you know, in the 1980s I wasn't alive then. And I know sin was still sin, but it's a little bit more innocent and it's not this kind of,

I'm going to turn you against your parents. I think that's the other thing. And then, you know, or the accessibility of pornography on the phone or all these different things now that it's just, it's just something that you have to be involved in your kids' lives and not expect the youth group leader to be the one who's solving those problems.

I think you're right, Luke. And I also like it when dads, they don't have to teach the Bible 24 hours a day, but dad's modeling and engendering masculinity.

They have to make sure that's a priority because the world is going to do the exact opposite. And we've got a bunch of soy latte boys running around and we know lots of young ladies, including your sisters,

Luke, two of them. It's hard to find a masculine guy. And we're not talking about toxic masculinity, but we're talking about real good masculinity and that's gone.

But I'm not going to teach that at a church. I might try to model it, but I'm not going to teach it because I got one shot with the kids and it's amazing.

And it's about Jesus Christ and him crucified. Yeah, and I think that's, that's a huge thing because you see now, and then it's even, it's such a big deal in evangelical circles, you know, you've got all these books,

I've never read it, but Jesus and John Wayne and all this stuff about, about how Jesus is so much more, he's so much, you know, we are reinventing the biblical

Jesus and making him way more masculine than he truly is. And you know, maybe there's certain circles that don't want to talk about grace and the gospel.

I don't think we're part of those circles. But who in their right mind thinks that the view of Jesus that we have is too masculine?

I don't think that's the problem in the evangelical world at large, maybe in certain subsets, but I mean, talk about what we just talked about with Uncle Dunk, you know, tenderness towards people convicted over their sin, tenderness towards the outcasts and to those people that he was winning their salvation for.

But at the same time, the, the harsh way that he treated those who were going to spiritually abuse others and point them back to the law.

I mean, Jesus, we can't downplay him turning over tables or, or I even just think about, think about Jesus on the way up.

You know, when I did go to Israel, you go down to Jericho and then there's the, there's the Ascent of Adamim up to Jerusalem, whatever it is,

I don't know, seven miles, 12 miles, whatever. And I always think of Isaiah 50, he set his face like Flint and would not be turned back.

Jesus walking up from Jericho, truly man, knowing what he was going towards in Jerusalem and will not be turned back thinking of each and every one of us.

I mean, there's nothing more manly than that or standing before a pilot, all these false accusations.

Could Jesus have shut those accusations down? Could he have confounded every one of them? Would he be the greatest lawyer of all time exposing their lies?

But instead he's silent before pilot because no matter what, he's going to go to the cross to atone for our sins.

You go, of course you see the grace and love of Jesus Christ. And I think everybody who listens to the show knows that's one of your themes.

But at the same time, you cannot look at the Lord Jesus Christ and not see his resolute firm, fixed, masculine strength in order to save us.

It's just so ridiculous and it's so assaulted and it's really annoying is what it is.

Well, when I hear somebody say something like that about Jesus, I think, well, we need a different definition because Jesus would define it, right?

Who he is, is masculine. And so if our definition of masculinity is something less, completely different subject.

What's our little secret thing that we do around the house with any nativity scene in the house during Christmas time? Oh, well, you know,

I think mom and the girls aren't necessarily... They don't know. They don't. They think they...

Like you, they said they'd listen to all these shows when I'm dead, so... Well, that's true. I mean, that's kind of nice.

You know, I'll have you in the car with me. No, but I think, you know, the girls, they don't like it, but we're always flipping baby

Jesus over or covering it up with different things because, you know, it's a second commandment violation. I really think that's probably true.

I don't like the things. I think kids sleep better on their stomachs, don't they? Is that what the doctors say? Is that what you're doing? I think that was what you were supposed to be doing in the hospital.

That was what I was calling you, telling you to lay on your stomach. Oh, that was the worst thing ever, laying on your stomach prone for COVID pneumonia and your back is killing you.

I will say one thing. This is not the... You know, like I said, you didn't give me any money to say this, but I remember talking to the doctor and it's like, yeah, most people, you know, they're able to lay prone for about an hour because it's very uncomfortable, you know, hour a day kind of thing.

That's what most people do, even though it's better, you know, to breathe. And they're like, yeah, your dad's been on his stomach for like seven hours today.

And I just like, I like that. I'm like, nice dad is, he is not, he's going to do everything in his power to get out of the hospital.

It's so funny because people say, well - That was some good masculinity. That's a good example. See? Uh -huh. I'm like, well - Because you know,

I can't be trusted with taking care of the family yet. So you're like, I got to get out of the hospital because Luke's not ready.

He's not ready to be the leader. I'll talk about that in a second, but you're laying there and people talk about, you know, a fight and will to live.

I think people have a fight and will to live, but they tell me every hour do this spirometer and lay in your stomach.

I mean, how hard is that? So if you don't do it, how much of a fighter really are you? I mean, yeah, that's true. It is kind of like, that is,

I don't think this just was to quote secular comedians, but I won't say his name, but what was that one, the one guy where he's like, he's lost his battle with cancer and it's like this whole thing.

And he just, he's just talking about how annoying that is, that language. Like you, the last thing you did in your life was lose, you lost your battle.

He beat, you were beat. We're all going to lose. And you know, you think about it, we're all going to lose whatever battle that is.

Some poor guys like Lazarus, they had to lose it twice, different people that Jesus raised from the dead. They had to die twice.

Between, I wonder. That's a good question for the pastor, Pastor NoCo. Well, then you could say with some rejoinder, well, what about Enoch and Elijah?

They didn't die. Did Moses ever make it to the promised land? No. He saw

Mount Nebo? No. He was standing there with Jesus on the Mount of Transfiguration in Israel. Good trick question.

Nice. What's the other trick question that I was going to ask, that I was asking somebody the other day? What's the second most referenced city in the

Bible? The first most referenced city is what? Jerusalem. What's the second? Rome. No. Jericho.

No. Bethlehem. No. You got to just, man, four. I will say, not to toot my own horn, but I did get this one first try.

Second most. I wasn't really... Listener, what do you think? Gath. I'm going to say it, and you're going to be bugged.

Want me to say it? Okay, so... One more. One more guess. This is the final guess. What do you mean? It's my show. The final guess?

We have a studio audience today, even. Press the button off. I have a mute button right here. I can mute you right now. Okay. Okay.

Talk mute. Luke's muted. I'm muted. Okay. Okay. What is it? Well, what are the other cities around there?

I didn't say... I just said second most referenced city in the Bible. Nazareth. I'm probably going to be wrong, and then

I'm going to get corrected, but what is it? Babylon. Oh. Isn't that dopey? Doesn't it make sense?

Yeah, but I don't do for the spiritual things about Babylon, like Rome, 1 Peter. We're not in exiles.

No, if it says Babylon, it literally means Babylon. Every time. So you're trying to use the spiritual and the literal. Please forgive me for doing that.

Okay. I like your advice for some of those parents. We talked about the hospital a little bit, and I think

I've said it before on the show, and now that I have a voice to do it, you did step up, take over the Abendroth leadership reins.

Good job. I'm proud of you. Thanks. Well, we talked about that after, and at least

I could do that part, but in the day -to -day life, maybe I'm blowing it. Well, you know what? You think about it.

If there's an emergency... Well, this is going to tell me to iron my pants. Well, when there's emergencies and you step up, that's good, but it's hard to maintain that throughout our lives day -to -day when it comes to the mundane, and that's why, you know, if we're not loving the

Lord our God and loving neighbor in the mundane with complete surrender and complete yielding, then...

How do we know if we're a Christian? We're on slippery ice. Yeah, we are. We're on black ice. Thin ice. Just go down to the causeway.

Did you light off any fireworks this year? I would never break the law in that way. Or was it just your friend Renee? Yeah, it was

Renee and Ryan. They were breaking Massachusetts state law. Sparklers are illegal, I heard.

Yeah, yeah, because they're very dangerous. Uh -huh. Yeah. What do they say with fireworks? Lay on ground.

Yeah. Light fuse. What's the last... No, no, no. It's stop, drop, and roll. No, no. It's all law, by the way.

Lay on ground. Yeah, I see. Light fuse. Get away. That's why no one does it, because they have no motivation.

There's no gospel. There's no... No, I know. I want to say, what about enjoy? Indicatives. Yeah. What about enjoy the fireworks? Even though enjoy is a command, it's still, you know, watch.

Yeah, you start with that. Enjoy these fireworks. Observe them. Delight in them. And then you give the commands.

Because then it flows from that. Indicative driving the imperatives. Gospel. That's true. Providing the motivation for the law.

I don't know if you know the answer to this question or not, but we talk about a lot of law gospel, and some people will talk about indicative imperative.

Which one's better to use and why, do we know? Isn't it, law gospel is better because there are statements that seem to be commands, but they're still like gospel statements.

Like gospel imperatives. So like, remember Jesus Christ risen from the dead, right? Is that indicative or imperative?

Well, it's imperative. And is it law or gospel? Well, I guess you could say, if you're taking a very strict definition, you could say it's law.

But really, it's in a sense, you could put it in the category of a gospel statement. Like if you were looking at the passage saying, is this a law or gospel statement?

Well, that would be a gospel statement, probably driving other imperatives in the text. Other law -oriented statements that may even be,

I don't know, I guess, I think that's right. I think I'm right. Okay. In the time, yeah, that's good. In the time we have left, what do you like to listen to for podcast,

Christian -wise? The Pactam verse. Okay. Pactam. No, I like the Pactam. I always promote the Pactam, and I want some love back from the

Pactam. He never says anything. I've been on the Pactam. It was the highest rated show they had. Wow. It was through the roof.

It was almost at Joe Rogan levels. 11 million. Yeah. Or CNN, .87. Hey, we're on Gitter now, NoCoRadio.

Oh, Gitter. A at NoCoRadio. I think we have 12 followers, because we're all about how many people follow.

That's right. What do I like to listen to? I like to listen to Reform Forum sometimes.

I used to listen to Glory Cloud a lot, but they haven't put anything out, because I like the kind of Meredith Cline insight, and Meredith Cline was trying to read

Meredith Cline. Is he Lutheran now? I guess so. I don't know. I think he is. Well, the Meredith Cline thing, trying to read him is, like you said, another lesson in am

I am dumb, so sometimes I like to listen to Glory Cloud. So Glory Cloud, Reform Forum, I like the

Heidelcast, I like Office Hours. Scott's not doing Office Hours anymore. That's why I don't listen anymore.

I know. I'm boycotting. I'm boycotting. Same. Yeah. I'm boycotting that in Patagonia for all the

Uyghur enslavement. 10 seconds. Yeah.

So I think that's kind of it. Luke, thanks for being on the show. It's good to just sit and talk, and I know the listeners like to get to know you a little bit every year.

Yeah. If you need somebody to preach the Gospel to some youth, give some parenting advice, Luke at abendroth .com.

Yeah, and you'll see me on the same website as David Platt, 10 to 20 ,000. No Compromise Radio with Pastor Mike Abendroth is a production of Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston.

Bethlehem Bible Church is a Bible teaching church firmly committed to unleashing the life -transforming power of God's Word through verse -by -verse exposition of the sacred text.

Please come and join us. Our service times are Sunday morning at 1015 and in the evening at 6. We're right on Route 110 in West Boylston.

You can check us out online at bbchurch .org or by phone at 508 -835 -3400.