Effective Keys to Communication

Revealed Apologetics

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00:00

I mean it. Um, now, one of the things I really appreciate about you, those who are connected to your ministry is your ability to speak with clarity and simplicity in a way that can be, um, multiplied, reproduced and sent out to the masses in a way that the average person can just, you know, glass.

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And I think a very difficult thing is to take these complex topics, because when we're dealing with apologetics, we're very much dealing with, um, philosophy and related topics that can be very, very difficult to wrap your head around.

00:30

Um, so I, I would imagine that when you are doing the videos and you're speaking, there is a strategy that you use to simplify these very complex, uh, concepts.

00:41

What is your process when you're trying to simplify? You know, that's a really fair question. It's a very nice compliment and especially gratifying because, um,

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I, I view our work at Stand to Reason as kind of like translation work. And so we get to rub shoulders with a really smart people, you know, and do our best to understand what they're saying and then translating that.

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And, uh, I don't call it putting the cookies on the bottom shelf because though that's a kind of a favorite metaphor for this kind of thing.

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Frankly, all the cookies can't go on the bottom shelf, you know, can't be reduced, you know, and, but what we can do is some of those cookies, so to speak, that, uh, you know, you got to reach for, we can put them within reach if people are willing to reach.

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And so that's, that's, I think what are one of our, our big virtues are of our organization is that we've done that we, we really work hard at translating.

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And, you know, to be honest, Eli, nobody's ever asked this question of me before, and it's a perceptive question because I, I, it's, it goes to the workings of a person's mind and trying to make information accessible.

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And I'm glad you care about that because you're in the same kind of position. And I wish

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I could to tell, I wish I could tell you, well, here's the secret, here's the strategy. Um, and, and it isn't like I'm following a particular strategy to accomplish things.

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I can tell you a couple of things that will help and will help your listeners too, when they're in the same position, but, um,

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I don't, it is things, you know, that people talk about the muse, people who are creative people, they talk about the muse,

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M -U -S -E. Well, muse is a, like a mythic woman who gives them their inspiration.

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So, you know, Shakespeare had his muse, you know, and Bach has a muse. And all they're really referring to in a metaphoric way is a, is a, is a cape, a native and unusual and unique capability to have things come to mind that, that reflect their talent.

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And then they put those things down and make it visible for people, whether it's words or whether it's music or art or something like that.

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So there is that part of it, I think, is just an uncanny, like odd and hard to explain process of things just coming into one's head.

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So I, I think, and I, I, this is a spiritual, there's certainly a spiritual element, um, the

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Holy Spirit working. There's also a spiritual element in the sense that it's not the immediate working of the

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Holy Spirit, but it's the fact that God made each individual certain capabilities and natural abilities that are native to them, they have them when they're born.

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We don't usually call them spiritual gifts, they're natural gifts, but they're still used for spiritual ends. And a lot of times the spiritual gifts and the natural gifts kind of, kind of blend together.

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And so I've always been, um, as a young adult, I was a little on the talkative side kind of thing.

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And so I think I had some of that native capability, but then becoming a Christian and having the

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Holy Spirit, well, this is just brings in a whole bunch more, in a certain sense, resources. But, um,

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I, when somebody asks me a question about something, um, a lot of times a little outline just appears in my head.

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Now it's because I have done the work, you know, I have the, the, the, the studies and stuff. It isn't like I'm getting new information from God, but you know how

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Jesus told the apostles, he said, um, you know, the Holy Spirit, this is, uh, in Matthew 10, he said, the

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Holy Spirit will, will, will give you the words kind of at the time you're in a stressful circumstance.

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But, you know, he didn't say that like when he first met them, he sold, said that after he'd been training them for about a year and a half, you know, and, um, in neperom discourse, he says something similar.

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He said, the Spirit will bring to remembrance all that I have taught you. So there's two parts of the

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Spirit's involved, but he's not working with nothing. He's not working with new stuff. Like you just open the channels and you get what that Spirit's saying.

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Rather, he's working with the things that you have worked yourself to store up, and we call this knowledge and accurately informed mind,

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I stand to reason. And so, um, so when, when we, and so this is a tip for your, your, your listeners and for you,

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Eli, that, um, when God constructs things with stuff that's there.

05:01

Okay, so if we're not, if we're not somehow a student of our, our interest or our craft, as the case may be, there's not much raw material to work with.

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I'm not saying God can't use somebody who's totally uneducated, but that's not the point. We pursue knowledge, okay?

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It says that in Proverbs, says that through the scripture, whatever. We pursue knowledge, okay? Once we have accurate knowledge, now we've got resources to assemble like Legos in different ways.

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And for some people that got to work harder than others to assemble those things, me, sometimes it comes kind of naturally, you know, certain things come into my head.

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Oh, that goes bang, bang, bang, bang. Even you asking this question of me, you know, I thought, okay, here's a, here's a rhythm.

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Here's a series. Here's, I can, I can talk about this. So to some degree, there's a native capability of that.

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And I can't take any credit for it. It just happens in me. But basically your strategy is just to be naturally gifted.

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Well, yeah, there's more to that. And this is why I, something I can pass on, but I, but part of it is, is native gifting.

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That's all I could say, you know, and each person has their own particulars. You know, my wife has a certain sensitivity with people that I don't have, you know, and so sometimes

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I got to ask her how to handle something because she gets it and I don't, you know, but to her, it comes kind of natural.

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So that's kind of her native capability. So people know what I'm talking about, but, but I always tell people to be, be a student of your craft.

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So if you want to be more effective in engaging people, apologetics, however, whatever, learn stuff related to that.

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So you build up your reservoir of information that you can draw from as you have the opportunity.

06:45

Okay. I also, so that's one thing, build up your reservoir. That's something you could do, you know, be a student of your craft.

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Another thing I just mentioned a little while ago is, and this is really important.

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I think this helps the process. Talk slower. All right.

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Talk slower. I was so fast when I first started doing public speaking and stuff.

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I would warn people. I say, I talk 180 miles an hour with gusts up to 200. So sorry about that.

07:19

Here we go. You know, but it was such a flurry of stuff. It's like, you know, when the wind's blowing really hard, nothing sticks on the ground.

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It all blows away. So in the same way, you know, things don't stick if you're moving too fast.

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So the more you can speak more slowly, not only is it easier for people to pick things up.

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Notice how I'm pausing here, even saying this. It's easier for people to pick things up, but it's actually easier for you to articulate without stumbling, which

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I used to do a lot. I'd stammer because I'd try to talk too fast. And it's easier to organize your thoughts.

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You have a little bit more time for these thoughts to come to mind so that you can kind of put them in order.

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I noticed that William Lane Craig does that in the way that he answers. You know, someone will ask him a question.

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He'll be like, well, well, I think if we think of it, he's just very ponderous of each of his points.

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And he speaks with a good, I mean, he's not a quick speaker, but he speaks in such a way that you can follow his line of thinking.

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I mean, the purpose of speaking is communication. If you understand his vocabulary, I listen to Bill because he keeps me sharp.

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That very thing that you're talking about, he has a certain kind of elegance of thinking that is a tutorial for listeners.

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Sometimes clear thinking or capable thinking is not taught, but caught. And so when we listen to somebody like Bill, you know, and I hope when people listen to me, they start to get the rhythm of how this works.

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And they can't even really put their finger on it, but they realize as they expose themselves more frequently to careful thinking, thinkers like Bill or J .P.

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Moreland or even like Dennis Prager, many of your listeners might know Dennis. I think Dennis has magnificent clarity.

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He's not a Christian. He's a Jewish conservative talk show host, but he has a magnificent clarity.

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And I learn from him by listening to him. That's one reason I listen to him. I think he's got a lot of good ideas, too.

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So those are the things that I would recommend. Listen to smart people who communicate clearly, and you'll catch some of it.

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Okay. Study, as Paul says, to show yourself to prove to workmen who does not need to be shamed handling accurately.

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And here he's talking about the word of God to Timothy in 2 Timothy 2. But it's a broad principle that's really good.

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Know your stuff. Make that a lifelong process. And slow down when you're talking to people. I think what you said before is being a student of your craft is very, very important.

09:56

I mean, even in the Bible says, may I hide your word in my heart so that I might not say it to you. God equips us to avoid falling into sinful action, but he brings to remembrance what is already deposited within us.

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That's right. It's not just this ex nihilo. God just produces these thoughts in our minds. Ah, this is the right thing to do.

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I'm glad you put it that way, because this is a tremendous misunderstanding that I think that comes out of pietistic movements of the late 19th century, that it's all of God, none of me, that I'm an empty vessel, that God's just pouring his spirit through me, and I'm just kind of standing aside and not doing anything.

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And there were very godly people who believed that and taught that, but I just don't think that's the biblical model.

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And something that I noticed, Eli, by reading, I've made a commitment now. I've read through the

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Bible a number of times, but I've made a commitment to always be reading through the Bible. So I have a check off boxes.

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You know, I have a chart. And actually, two weeks ago, I finished, after two and a half years, I finished my Bible in a year chart, and I just started again.

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But when you're doing this and getting the full counsel of God over time, instead of just focusing on your favorite passages, some things jump out that you didn't notice before.

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And for me, as I'm reading through the historical parts of the Old Testament, I'm reading through 1

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Samuel, 2 Samuel, the David struggles, etc., and Solomon and 1 Kings and Chronicles.

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I realize that every time God promised something to a people or a person or a group, they had to fight to actually get it.

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Now, this was a huge revelation to me. It wasn't a surprise, because I see—this was a conviction

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I've developed over time, that we are partners with God in these things.

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And God may have an end that he has guaranteed is going to happen, but he has ordained the means as well as the end.

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And so we've got to engage the means in a faithful fashion. And so, you know, things just don't—it's not like pixie dust.

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God just sprinkles his promises, and boom, there we are. It's just the magical world in that sense. No, it's a world of work and hardship and difficulty and training and discipline.

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And these concepts are thick in the New Testament, by the way. It's amazing how many people miss them. So I'm glad you put it that way.

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You know, it is just like, come to you, you know, you work for it. And then God's working with us, both to will and to work, for his good pleasure.